<!--QuoteBegin-Armageddon+Jan 9 2005, 10:46 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Armageddon @ Jan 9 2005, 10:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 1) a 2) a 3) b 4) c 5) b 6) b 7) b 8) a 9) c 10) a <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think it was a rhetorical quiz...
As for my thoughts on the topic, there’s nothing wrong with porn or many other things, in moderation, however if you can't control your urges you need to find a way to deal with that.
Studies are now finding genetics are a major factor in development of personality, mainly based on experiments and observations of identical twins. This study seems completely ignore that, almost suggesting the effects are 100% caused by the environment, or porn in this case.
It should also be pointed out, which I do believe is done in the Wired article, that the event described only invited the opinions of those that already believe that porn is bad. This was not a legitimate discussion that the Wired article describes... Its outcome was predetermined, with only the degree remaining to be decided.
And reasa is correct... My previous post was rhetorical in nature... One question ( 10 ) was just for laughs... All the other questions though... You figure it out. My questions ( excluding 10 ), were meant to show the similarities between video games and pornography... And the accusations against them.
Exactly. Lets consider how many cases there are of people doing something illegal because of pornography. I doubt its much more then a couple hundred. So, lets start making up statistics here.
Assume 200 cases. Now, divide that by the number of people who regularly view pornography (i.e., the number of men in the United States). As of July 2004, the population of the United States was 293,655,404. While dividing it in half doesn't give a perfect figure, it'll do for the sake of arguement.
200 divided by 146,827,702 yields 1.3621407764047141458630493852856^-4 %.
fanaticThis post has been edited.Join Date: 2003-07-23Member: 18377Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
edited January 2005
I think you've been missing an important part of this discussion, which is <b>why</b> pornography has grown so popular, and even more important: why there are so many objections toward it.
The information based society we live in today has a development cycle and progress rate that far exceeds anything ever witnessed in human evolution. Things are changing more rapidly than ever, and this rapid change is accelerating. This leads to the break up of previously accepted social conventions and norms at a much faster rate than humans seem to be able to percieve it at the moment. Especially book based religions such as Christianity and Islam are facing huge problems with this, and all the influence these religions have on what's normal and what's not in a society is being altered rapidly. Humans, while adaptive to change in many forms, have problems adapting to deep mental changes like these, and there is one question that is quintessential in any discussion on a subject such as this:
Is the resistance toward this claimed issue -- in this case pornography -- legitimate, or is it simply a product of us not being able to adapt quickly enough to the new social enviroments we so heavily depend on and surround ourselves with?
(although pornography has been around for centuries in some form or another, the recent availability and spread is the key here, no?)
<!--QuoteBegin-fanatic+Jan 10 2005, 08:29 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (fanatic @ Jan 10 2005, 08:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think you've been missing an important part of this discussion, which is <b>why</b> pornography has grown so popular <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Simple, people are not getting laid as often as they should be and thus we have porn.
Some arguments for pornography (crappy english translation by me <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> )
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>Churchill, W. (1967): Homosexual behaviour among males. New York</b> Sexual offenders have seldom dissenting moral values, contrary often they are rigid moralists.
<b>Kant, Harold S. und Goldstein, Michael J. (1970): Pornography. Psychology Today, Dezember.</b> Rapists are consuming lesser pornography as non-rapists. That applies also especially to criticised SM pornography. Rapists are often less sexual educated; sometimes even don’t know how babies get borne. Often they are out of a sexual restrictive parental home.
<b>Geiser, R. L. (1979): Hidden victims - the sexual abuse of children, Boston: Beacon Press.</b> Rapists have seen 3 years later pictures of sexual intercourse than the control group; first own sexual intercourse happed later and afterwards lesser frequent
<b>Eysenck, H.J. (1976): Sex and Personality, Open Books, London.</b> Sex is considered by aggressive criminal’s primary as reproduction; they are against pornography and felling themselves more likely disgusted by imagery of sexual intercourse. Viginity is seen by them as great virtue.
<b>Delin 1980.</b> Rapists were more often rigid religious indoctrinated and have an insufficient sexual education.
<b>Padgett, V. R. et al. (1989): Pornography, Erotica, and Attitudes Toward Women: The Effects of Repeated Exposure. The Journal of Sex Research, Bd. 26, Nr. 4, S. 479-491. November.</b> Visitors of an erotic-cinema had a more positive alignment to woman and feminism than female college-students (!)
<b>Ertel, Henner (1990): Erotika und Pornographie. Repräsentative Befragung und psychophysiologische Langzeitstudie zu Konsum und Wirkung. München, Psychologie-Verlags-Union</b> There is no escalation spiral from softer material to more extreme (S. 475). “Consume of photography generate no tries for re-production and there are no direct effects on sexual behaviour; especially no initialisation of paraphil behaviour, sexual violence or sexual pressure, if there were not already a predisposition.” “Also here are no general negative effects on sexual scripts, partnership or sexual view of the partner. Astonishingly there are many similarities between non-consumer and heavy user of erotica and pornography like in the tendency towards “fastfood sex behaviour”.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Jeffrey Satinover, a psychiatrist and advisor to the <b><u>National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality</b></u> echoed ... .<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> here i started laughing.
"Everything, even the lie, serves the truth; shadows dont erease the sun." Franz Kafka
PS. and yeah … masturbation helps to avoid prostate cancer <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I really do not think the availability matters until one has a problem with porn, then the availability is a bad thing. Porn may be rather easy to get ahold of, but it is something that you usually must make an effort to get.
Besides, why should something that is completely legal be hard to get? Especially when there is no real/substantial proof that it is bad?
It is far more likely that something like alcohol is more of a danger to us and our society than porn.
Damn Victorians ruining everything for those of us that came after them!!!
fanaticThis post has been edited.Join Date: 2003-07-23Member: 18377Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
edited January 2005
I'm not arguing for or against pornography, I'll leave that discussion to the rest of you. I was trying to point to the slightly superficial approach you've had toward discussion the question so far. Instead of just listing reasons for pornography being good or bad, depending on your view, it's more pertinent to understand why it's such a big taboo among many humans today.
If pornography is the new addiction, then pop-ups are the new cure <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> .
I'll have to say:
Pornography from the internet doesn't really increase the amount of porn, it just gives the porn a graphical representation. [I was going to say 'I had a sexual drive before I had seen porn, and then my imagination was the basis of the pornography, and while I wouldn't know exactly what female sex organs looked like, I didn't really need to....but then I realized I'd seen them in health class in 6th grade (between 10-12 years old, depending on school enrollment). Well before seeing any porn (and in-fact, well before we had proper internet access).
Despite all that, I've become bored with actual internet porn rather quickly. I'd suppose it's because of my vision, that I don't have a very visual memory (that generally ends up in me not being able to visualize people I've met in my head). So, generally, I find that reading or just imagining porn works just as well (and occasionally better) for me as videos and pictures. Something I can just as easily do without the internet.
There's also the whole 'masturbating's not going to have you killing people to get money to pay for your addiction like crack' and 'as long as you don't start doing it in public (which would end up as a disruption of the perceptions of minors)' I'm not seeing how it's really effecting anyone. My principle is: If it doesn't affect anyone but the person doing it - why do you care? (as long as you're not taking it to extremes like suicide - which does in fact affect other people). Sure you could say something like "you could be hogging the computer time" but that's a poor argument. The only real problem would be indecent exposure to people who aren't really ready for it.
Considering the fact that porn and sexual equivalents have been in existence since the beginning of human existence; and that procreation is a fundamental aspect of life - porn is nothing like crack...unless you want to say taking a dump is an addiction, eating food is an addiction, or sleeping is an addiction.
[I'm not suggesting you 'need' pornography, I mean the sexual drive is inherent in human nature and to claim it as an addiction is just a misinterpretation of instincts. Especially since people have been masturbating well before the internet and printed media.]
Talking from experience I can talk about both subjects, yes that does mean I have used Crack Cocaine, among a lot of other drugs.
Porn... I am into my porn I have a large collection of images and a larger collection on movies, I am, however, not a porn addict, I have a fiancee and have been with her for almost 2 years, in the whole time we have been together I have watched porn as well. Me and my fiancee have a good sex life, we have romantic sex (you could say we make love, but I hate that termanology), far from any of the porn I have, although sometimes our sex does turn to be more like the porn I watch, we are both fine with this, and enjoy it. My finacee know about my collection and doesn't have a problem with it even though she doesn't watch it. I think we would both prefer that if I need a release it be over a series of images than some girl on the street.
I realise the boundary between porn and a real relationship. Porn is more of a fetish it allows you to explore a side that you might not feel comfortable with others knowing, but that doesn't mean you can't still have a regular relationship.
In short, porn is hardly a bad thing, it can help people understand more about their sexuality without making, what they later feel as, bad mistakes in experimenting their sexual preferences and also allows a release when it might be needed.
Now to the subject it seems people have less experience with, Crack. I'm pretty sure most of you haven't even dabbled with drugs, but I have, for many years I experimented with, and took regularly, a whole range of drugs, ranging from Cannabis (which i still am a regular user) to Ectasy to Crack (both of which i know only take occasionally). I don't see myself as being a bad person for any of this, but I am fully aware of how society treats these and, although I don't actively try and hide it, I don't flaunt it.
Crack is, and probably always will be, my drug of choice and many of the stigmas associated with it are unfounded and false, although many still are true. A lot of people see it as totally different from Cocaine and much, much worse, few realise that it is actually Cocaine mixed with bicarbinate of soda then heated to form crystals. It is more the lifestyle that is the bad side of Crack, one can, like I did, take Crack as an occasionally 'treat'.
Bringing these both together now to be relevant to this thread.
Many people have said you can get Crack out of your system and therefore you can get over it but Porn stays in your head... I haven't had Crack in over a year, so it is definatly out of my system, although the memories of Crack still make me smile from time to time, my want for it is still there, I can say right now that if there was a Crack pipe infront of me I would smoke it. The feeling of being high on Crack is indescribable and is something I will never forget and always want to experience again.
However if someone was watching porn next to me right now, yes I might glance at it, but I wouldn't say I would definatly watch it as right now i'm not in need of that 'special release'.
How anyone can say Porn is worse than Crack has never experienced the two side, and besides Porn is just 2 or more people doing a natural thing, although on camera and maybe more aggressively =].
I believe the best part of the article, and the thing that through me off, is when they mentioned that porn causes masturbation, which leads to all of the problems they associate with porn. I don't need porn to masturbate. Porn is a stimulant that can enhance a session, act as entertainment, or even (god forbid) teach.
The fundamental assumption of the article is that porn is the central cause of all of these problems, something that is laughable, at best. Masturbation is usually discovered before pornography is, which puts a big dent in what they're talking about. It's like the old saying "masturbation causes pimples;" it's not true, and it comes down to people not liking the idea of their children (or other's children) engaging in any kind of sexual acts before marriage.
They do make a few good points. Porn is definitely addictive, particularly for younger teens. Also, porn, particularly older porn, really did propogate an unrealistic view of how a woman should look. These days, some of the biggest porn sites are all about amateur average girls, a strange turn from the days of DDD 110 lbs women with too much make up and fake faces.
All in all though, I love porn. It's brought me alot maturity wise, including showing me the best and worst sides of sex.
<!--QuoteBegin-Shloom+Jan 10 2005, 06:01 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shloom @ Jan 10 2005, 06:01 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-fanatic+Jan 10 2005, 08:29 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (fanatic @ Jan 10 2005, 08:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think you've been missing an important part of this discussion, which is <b>why</b> pornography has grown so popular <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Simple, people are not getting laid as often as they should be and thus we have porn. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Education is the best form of contraceptive..... however frustrating that may be from my point of view.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Simple, people are not getting laid as often as they should be and thus we have porn.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Everything (with a few exceptions maybe) is bad in too much amounts, it should not nessacerly be banned due to that. After all if you drink too much water you die.
<!--QuoteBegin-aonomus+Jan 9 2005, 02:47 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (aonomus @ Jan 9 2005, 02:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think porn is worse because crack only damages your body... every time you look at porn you are giving away part of your soul and eventually you'll be so corrupted that when you find a woman you like, you will treat her like porn. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Do you have any proof that watching porn leads to abusive treatment of women?
What is this 'soul' you talk about? Where does it exist? Do you have any proof of it existing?
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
Yeah, aonuomus, put it down in some tangible words would be good <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
More addictive? Maybe. But damaging? No. Sexual urges are normal, but people look down on it as some kind of inhuman act. In some cultures, nudity is acceptable. People don't see some sign with a topless person and think 'oh my god, this is horrible'. Society in America (and other countries) makes it look like only idiots with no life have these urges.
GrendelAll that is fear...Join Date: 2002-07-19Member: 970Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, NS2 Playtester
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>Othell for President</span>
In related news:
<a href='http://newyorkmetro.com/nymetro/news/trends/n_9437/index.html' target='_blank'>Porn makes normal women look minging.</a> Funny how the media can only latch on to one thing at once.
As for the actual topic "at hand"...
My 2 cents? Well, the most addictive things I've encountered (with major reasons) in my entire life are:
<!--QuoteBegin-Grendel+Jan 14 2005, 11:53 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Grendel @ Jan 14 2005, 11:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->My 2 cents? Well, the most addictive things I've encountered (with major reasons) in my entire life are:
1) Alcohol (Social availablility) 2) Gambling (Poverty Driven) 3) Counterstrike (Escapism) 4) Dope (Rage control)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I like how Counter Strike is there along with all the stuff that people would normally consider bad <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->, like you were a Counter Strikeaholic.
However, I think... if you can get addicted to porn then you either have incredibly poor self control, or are obsessive-compulsive >_>. Getting addicted to something that doesn't actually enter your system like alcohol or dope must take a considerable effort :I.
<!--QuoteBegin-Grendel+Jan 14 2005, 04:53 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Grendel @ Jan 14 2005, 04:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If you spend more than 5 minutes looking at porn a day, then you have <i>serious</i> issues with technique.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> you know it takes longer than 5 minutes for some guys to take care of that sort of thing.
<!--QuoteBegin-Grendel+Jan 14 2005, 10:53 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Grendel @ Jan 14 2005, 10:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If you spend more than 5 minutes looking at porn a day, then you have <i>serious</i> issues with technique. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> What if we spend 5 minutes 6 or 7 times?
Comments
2) a
3) b
4) c
5) b
6) b
7) b
8) a
9) c
10) a <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think it was a rhetorical quiz...
As for my thoughts on the topic, there’s nothing wrong with porn or many other things, in moderation, however if you can't control your urges you need to find a way to deal with that.
And reasa is correct... My previous post was rhetorical in nature... One question ( 10 ) was just for laughs... All the other questions though... You figure it out. My questions ( excluding 10 ), were meant to show the similarities between video games and pornography... And the accusations against them.
Assume 200 cases. Now, divide that by the number of people who regularly view pornography (i.e., the number of men in the United States). As of July 2004, the population of the United States was 293,655,404. While dividing it in half doesn't give a perfect figure, it'll do for the sake of arguement.
200 divided by 146,827,702 yields 1.3621407764047141458630493852856^-4 %.
Shocking.
The information based society we live in today has a development cycle and progress rate that far exceeds anything ever witnessed in human evolution. Things are changing more rapidly than ever, and this rapid change is accelerating. This leads to the break up of previously accepted social conventions and norms at a much faster rate than humans seem to be able to percieve it at the moment. Especially book based religions such as Christianity and Islam are facing huge problems with this, and all the influence these religions have on what's normal and what's not in a society is being altered rapidly. Humans, while adaptive to change in many forms, have problems adapting to deep mental changes like these, and there is one question that is quintessential in any discussion on a subject such as this:
Is the resistance toward this claimed issue -- in this case pornography -- legitimate, or is it simply a product of us not being able to adapt quickly enough to the new social enviroments we so heavily depend on and surround ourselves with?
(although pornography has been around for centuries in some form or another, the recent availability and spread is the key here, no?)
Simple, people are not getting laid as often as they should be and thus we have porn.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
<b>Churchill, W. (1967): Homosexual behaviour among males. New York</b>
Sexual offenders have seldom dissenting moral values, contrary often they are rigid moralists.
<b>Kant, Harold S. und Goldstein, Michael J. (1970): Pornography. Psychology Today, Dezember.</b>
Rapists are consuming lesser pornography as non-rapists. That applies also especially to criticised SM pornography. Rapists are often less sexual educated; sometimes even don’t know how babies get borne. Often they are out of a sexual restrictive parental home.
<b>Geiser, R. L. (1979): Hidden victims - the sexual abuse of children, Boston: Beacon Press.</b>
Rapists have seen 3 years later pictures of sexual intercourse than the control group; first own sexual intercourse happed later and afterwards lesser frequent
<b>Eysenck, H.J. (1976): Sex and Personality, Open Books, London.</b>
Sex is considered by aggressive criminal’s primary as reproduction; they are against pornography and felling themselves more likely disgusted by imagery of sexual intercourse. Viginity is seen by them as great virtue.
<b>Delin 1980.</b>
Rapists were more often rigid religious indoctrinated and have an insufficient sexual education.
<b>Padgett, V. R. et al. (1989): Pornography, Erotica, and Attitudes Toward Women: The Effects of Repeated Exposure. The Journal of Sex Research, Bd. 26, Nr. 4, S. 479-491. November.</b>
Visitors of an erotic-cinema had a more positive alignment to woman and feminism than female college-students (!)
<b>Ertel, Henner (1990): Erotika und Pornographie. Repräsentative Befragung und psychophysiologische Langzeitstudie zu Konsum und Wirkung. München, Psychologie-Verlags-Union</b>
There is no escalation spiral from softer material to more extreme (S. 475).
“Consume of photography generate no tries for re-production and there are no direct effects on sexual behaviour; especially no initialisation of paraphil behaviour, sexual violence or sexual pressure, if there were not already a predisposition.”
“Also here are no general negative effects on sexual scripts, partnership or sexual view of the partner. Astonishingly there are many similarities between non-consumer and heavy user of erotica and pornography like in the tendency towards “fastfood sex behaviour”.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Jeffrey Satinover, a psychiatrist and advisor to the <b><u>National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality</b></u> echoed ... .<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
here i started laughing.
"Everything, even the lie, serves the truth; shadows dont erease the sun." Franz Kafka
PS. and yeah … masturbation helps to avoid prostate cancer <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I really do not think the availability matters until one has a problem with porn, then the availability is a bad thing. Porn may be rather easy to get ahold of, but it is something that you usually must make an effort to get.
Besides, why should something that is completely legal be hard to get? Especially when there is no real/substantial proof that it is bad?
It is far more likely that something like alcohol is more of a danger to us and our society than porn.
Damn Victorians ruining everything for those of us that came after them!!!
It seems like its a safe, healthy sexual release for young people, and so there really isn't an issue with them obtaining it.
And you'll also notice a nice piece of Newspeak here: conservatives always say we need to "protect" children from pornography.
Yes, children should be protected from pronography... From being used in it that is.
I'll have to say:
Pornography from the internet doesn't really increase the amount of porn, it just gives the porn a graphical representation. [I was going to say 'I had a sexual drive before I had seen porn, and then my imagination was the basis of the pornography, and while I wouldn't know exactly what female sex organs looked like, I didn't really need to....but then I realized I'd seen them in health class in 6th grade (between 10-12 years old, depending on school enrollment). Well before seeing any porn (and in-fact, well before we had proper internet access).
Despite all that, I've become bored with actual internet porn rather quickly. I'd suppose it's because of my vision, that I don't have a very visual memory (that generally ends up in me not being able to visualize people I've met in my head). So, generally, I find that reading or just imagining porn works just as well (and occasionally better) for me as videos and pictures. Something I can just as easily do without the internet.
There's also the whole 'masturbating's not going to have you killing people to get money to pay for your addiction like crack' and 'as long as you don't start doing it in public (which would end up as a disruption of the perceptions of minors)' I'm not seeing how it's really effecting anyone. My principle is: If it doesn't affect anyone but the person doing it - why do you care? (as long as you're not taking it to extremes like suicide - which does in fact affect other people). Sure you could say something like "you could be hogging the computer time" but that's a poor argument. The only real problem would be indecent exposure to people who aren't really ready for it.
Considering the fact that porn and sexual equivalents have been in existence since the beginning of human existence; and that procreation is a fundamental aspect of life - porn is nothing like crack...unless you want to say taking a dump is an addiction, eating food is an addiction, or sleeping is an addiction.
[I'm not suggesting you 'need' pornography, I mean the sexual drive is inherent in human nature and to claim it as an addiction is just a misinterpretation of instincts. Especially since people have been masturbating well before the internet and printed media.]
Porn... I am into my porn I have a large collection of images and a larger collection on movies, I am, however, not a porn addict, I have a fiancee and have been with her for almost 2 years, in the whole time we have been together I have watched porn as well. Me and my fiancee have a good sex life, we have romantic sex (you could say we make love, but I hate that termanology), far from any of the porn I have, although sometimes our sex does turn to be more like the porn I watch, we are both fine with this, and enjoy it. My finacee know about my collection and doesn't have a problem with it even though she doesn't watch it. I think we would both prefer that if I need a release it be over a series of images than some girl on the street.
I realise the boundary between porn and a real relationship. Porn is more of a fetish it allows you to explore a side that you might not feel comfortable with others knowing, but that doesn't mean you can't still have a regular relationship.
In short, porn is hardly a bad thing, it can help people understand more about their sexuality without making, what they later feel as, bad mistakes in experimenting their sexual preferences and also allows a release when it might be needed.
Now to the subject it seems people have less experience with, Crack. I'm pretty sure most of you haven't even dabbled with drugs, but I have, for many years I experimented with, and took regularly, a whole range of drugs, ranging from Cannabis (which i still am a regular user) to Ectasy to Crack (both of which i know only take occasionally). I don't see myself as being a bad person for any of this, but I am fully aware of how society treats these and, although I don't actively try and hide it, I don't flaunt it.
Crack is, and probably always will be, my drug of choice and many of the stigmas associated with it are unfounded and false, although many still are true. A lot of people see it as totally different from Cocaine and much, much worse, few realise that it is actually Cocaine mixed with bicarbinate of soda then heated to form crystals. It is more the lifestyle that is the bad side of Crack, one can, like I did, take Crack as an occasionally 'treat'.
Bringing these both together now to be relevant to this thread.
Many people have said you can get Crack out of your system and therefore you can get over it but Porn stays in your head... I haven't had Crack in over a year, so it is definatly out of my system, although the memories of Crack still make me smile from time to time, my want for it is still there, I can say right now that if there was a Crack pipe infront of me I would smoke it. The feeling of being high on Crack is indescribable and is something I will never forget and always want to experience again.
However if someone was watching porn next to me right now, yes I might glance at it, but I wouldn't say I would definatly watch it as right now i'm not in need of that 'special release'.
How anyone can say Porn is worse than Crack has never experienced the two side, and besides Porn is just 2 or more people doing a natural thing, although on camera and maybe more aggressively =].
The fundamental assumption of the article is that porn is the central cause of all of these problems, something that is laughable, at best. Masturbation is usually discovered before pornography is, which puts a big dent in what they're talking about. It's like the old saying "masturbation causes pimples;" it's not true, and it comes down to people not liking the idea of their children (or other's children) engaging in any kind of sexual acts before marriage.
They do make a few good points. Porn is definitely addictive, particularly for younger teens. Also, porn, particularly older porn, really did propogate an unrealistic view of how a woman should look. These days, some of the biggest porn sites are all about amateur average girls, a strange turn from the days of DDD 110 lbs women with too much make up and fake faces.
All in all though, I love porn. It's brought me alot maturity wise, including showing me the best and worst sides of sex.
Simple, people are not getting laid as often as they should be and thus we have porn. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Education is the best form of contraceptive..... however frustrating that may be from my point of view.
that's not necessarily true.
Do you have any proof that watching porn leads to abusive treatment of women?
What is this 'soul' you talk about? Where does it exist? Do you have any proof of it existing?
In related news:
<a href='http://newyorkmetro.com/nymetro/news/trends/n_9437/index.html' target='_blank'>Porn makes normal women look minging.</a> Funny how the media can only latch on to one thing at once.
As for the actual topic "at hand"...
My 2 cents? Well, the most addictive things I've encountered (with major reasons) in my entire life are:
1) Alcohol (Social availablility)
2) Gambling (Poverty Driven)
3) Counterstrike (Escapism)
4) Dope (Rage control)
Porn doesn't even register. If you spend more than 5 minutes looking at porn a day, then you have <i>serious</i> issues with technique.
1) Alcohol (Social availablility)
2) Gambling (Poverty Driven)
3) Counterstrike (Escapism)
4) Dope (Rage control)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like how Counter Strike is there along with all the stuff that people would normally consider bad <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->, like you were a Counter Strikeaholic.
However, I think... if you can get addicted to porn then you either have incredibly poor self control, or are obsessive-compulsive >_>. Getting addicted to something that doesn't actually enter your system like alcohol or dope must take a considerable effort :I.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
you know it takes longer than 5 minutes for some guys to take care of that sort of thing.
What if we spend 5 minutes 6 or 7 times?