Ns_eon
Olmy
Join Date: 2003-05-08 Member: 16142Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, NS2 Developer, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond
Join Date: 2003-05-08 Member: 16142Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, NS2 Developer, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond
<div class="IPBDescription">feedback please</div> Using KFDM's post about Altair as a template... i thought i'd do the same for eon.
I’m looking for some feedback on the current version of Eon (the one included in 3.0) so that I can begin improving the next version. I already have several items on my agenda but I wanted feedback to see if there were other things that needed to be fixed. I only have two rules.
1) You respect me, I’ll respect you.
2) If you’re not going to give me specifics to work with, then don’t post.
Thanks
So yeah, if you do have any criticisms, please be specific, and i don't appreciate snide remarks. I do however appreciate comments that could help me improve eon.
I’m looking for some feedback on the current version of Eon (the one included in 3.0) so that I can begin improving the next version. I already have several items on my agenda but I wanted feedback to see if there were other things that needed to be fixed. I only have two rules.
1) You respect me, I’ll respect you.
2) If you’re not going to give me specifics to work with, then don’t post.
Thanks
So yeah, if you do have any criticisms, please be specific, and i don't appreciate snide remarks. I do however appreciate comments that could help me improve eon.
Comments
Ive heard a number of really good comm's complain about the hassle it is just to get to the 1st node.
I found core in general pretty hard to actually take down (especially when its the second hive). Rines get slaughtered pretty easy by skulks when they enter it cause it is rather cramped. Add in a lerk, that constantly spores from the vent and chances are that you can take the hive down before it goes up rather slim.
Repositioning the vent from core hive to core monitoring so that either the core-monitoring pg cant be spored or rines that enter the hive cant be spored from said vent would be appreciated. Maybe even widening core hive a little would grant good rines the space they need to effectifly dodge skulks.
--This is a commanders oppinion out of about 8 commanded games on eon.
I havent play much alien/rine on eon yet. Just enough to notice, that it has great visuals <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
bridge isnt so bad because there is that wall there but engineering is really bad. to siege you have to almost have the tf inside the hive room.
i think to fix this you should move that northern hallway a little bit closer to core hive, then possibly rework engineering a little. i have a small idea that might work, but i would need a picture of the layout to draw on. if someone could post that ill put my idea up.
Great, <i>great</i> work with the map. Fantastic job.
Haze, yeah sleeping quarters really bugs me, i can't find any bed textures <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->.
Thanks for the comments so far everone.
And for 6john:
But I never saw rines win on it ever, not in constie tests, not in the final. And I saw good teams, really I did.
just saying this to ask if anyone agrees and if anyone does know why this is.
Top of the big engine in core is an awesome siege spot if you can get to it. Elec tfac on the top, few turrets, nothing can really touch it.
More as I find them.
<b>edit</b> maybe a vent going from engine hallway to living area too?.
Frankly, it was really hard to evaluate this map during the beta, and now, because it really depends so much on whether aliens truly are too powerful or not. Put simply, aliens seem to be able to dominate this map pretty darn well, especially with sensory. But is it the map? I don't know. It is a big spread out map that's hard for marines to control. It might help to have a few more longer, larger cooridors that give marines a bit more dominance in some areas.
I really like this map though: lots of neat chokepoints and different areas, with a good vent system that I don't think people have fully appreciated yet. Marine start is a little drab at the moment, but the hives are a great mix of different designs.
Too bad you can't bilebomb MS from in the ceiling anymore <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
That might make my brain explode but i'll look into it. Waterboy, i'll be trying Necrosis's suggestion of flipping the wall/rt combo in gunpods around, sounds like a great idea, and yes i might be moving the rt in engine walkway back to its original location, living area.
I think it may work better if it were to be moved to the Living Area, but that's just me.
Also, I think the Core Hive is currently the hardest out of the 3 to attack effectively for marines, especially with seige. But as far as being invincible, not at all, I've seen many alien teams fall.
It's a very good and detailed map, with only a few quirks that annoy(but not hinder) some people, but better than anything I could ever make.
But I never saw rines win on it ever, not in constie tests, not in the final. And I saw good teams, really I did.
just saying this to ask if anyone agrees and if anyone does know why this is. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just last night, we won eon as marines on LM in a 6v6, no less. If you exert early map control and go all out for their RTs, you can take them down. This strat works in any map, however.
It is somewhat alien biased, because there are so many alcoves everywhere, there are no close RTs, and it's hard to siege.
These are the things we have to change, but making the <i>right</i> changes are more important.
IE- not to knock 6john, but i dont think simply adding a boxed room on the side of the hive for the purpose of seiging would be a good idea, simply because that room would IMO A) Look out of place and B)Will be hard to balance out (a room created for marines will be very hard to balance for aliens, since its created for one side.)
Just my opinions. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo-->
just saying this to ask if anyone agrees and if anyone does know why this is. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've never seen aliens win on it. What I've seen so far is an alien stomping, aliens can't even get the second hive up.
As for needed changes to the map, I'd suggest adding <i>something</i> that can break the marines if they turtle in base. It's very hard for aliens to kill the marines once they turtle in marine start, there are only two entrances, and both are pretty long and marines can kill the aliens before they get close. Perhaps re-add that vent going into marine start from the top? Or maybe make it so that it goes into marine start on the side, so it doesn't block the commander from placing structures.
By the way, I'm saying this because I played a 140 minute game during the constellation testing on this map, and marines were turtled more then half of that time.
Maybe changing the Maintenance Corridor too have some cover for Aliens would be good too.
Very good point. Didn't think of that.
lack of space for marines , and that's why it might be part of the cause for marines losing.
let me break it down, altair and eon are both new but share a similarity, anywhere i go it's small. whenever i travel it feels so small, the hallways are 10feet high and are good for 2 marines to run side-by-side. sure there are a couple of big rooms but their filled with junk that it dosen't help, everything seems so cramped.
that's why marines lose, the hallways and rooms are smaller than places like
NS_Bast -refinery,former double,
NS_Hera - holo room, hives
the map eon is not small itself, it's huge. if they were to combine some hallways they would be the same sized as others and would be better. this small amount of space gives a lesser chance to kill an alien when it pops out
too small!
Marines can be extremely hard to dislodge from the Bridge (top) hive, if they decide to relocate by the res node...either side can defend vs. multiple onos easily with some HMGs...
I suggest moving the vent from briefing room to come out closer to the RT so that gorges can bile from the vent (dont know if that's enough but it may help, and would be an easy change)
<img src='http://xs20.xs.to/pics/05112/customeon.JPG' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
I flipped The Hub and used it to create a room with a new node. It does NOT enter into the hive, so aliens have to walk a bit to get to it. I'm concerned it might end up siege heaven, so perhaps more distance is needed. I lengthened some corridors to make it fit a bit better.
Flipped Gun Pod as per my earlier suggestion. If this still doesnt work, I'd suggest moving the "wall" to the RIGHT, blocking the "alien" side of the room, and allowing anyone from MS a clear shot to the RT.
Shoved RT into repair bay, seemed logical.
End result, marines get 2 hives nearish to base, one of which (Gun Pod) is easy enough to hold if scouted. I slapped another RT close to Bridge so that aliens don't *have* to fight over Gun Pod.
These are mostly just basic room shifting and node adding, so any change in play should be restricted to node control. Once this has been tested, I'd consider adding a more intensive vent system to engine, or moving the bridge/briefing vent to bridge/coolant, which should bypass any sieges and allow some sort of realistic escape route (Note that core already has several "safe" vents, as does engineering).
Anyhow, just for your consideration.
EDIT - Purposefully did not mention crates for MS, because marines are currently having a hard enough time on this map. I just want to see how badly res is affecting the game. If marines do better, then I'd worry about cluttering MS, etc.