Cardinal's Plea: Don't Read 'da Vinci Code'
reasa
Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Members, Constellation
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">Fool.</div> <a href='http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7205300/?GT1=6305' target='_blank'>http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7205300/?GT1=6305</a>
I'm sorry but this man is a fool, the epitome of what most rational people despise the church for. This medieval mindset that The Church is always right and even opening yourself up to new ideas is a sin...the fruit comment he repeatedly makes is an obvious reference to Adam and Eve, a scare tactic for the devout if you will.
Poor Cardinal, all this is going to do is keep the book on the best sellers list longer.
Someone who had never read the book will see this as say "hey something good must be in there if this guy is so mad and doesn’t want me to read it."
I do indeed hope it back fires on him and the books sales spike, I don't even want to get into the content, just condemning a book and telling people not to read it pisses me off to no end.
I'm sorry but this man is a fool, the epitome of what most rational people despise the church for. This medieval mindset that The Church is always right and even opening yourself up to new ideas is a sin...the fruit comment he repeatedly makes is an obvious reference to Adam and Eve, a scare tactic for the devout if you will.
Poor Cardinal, all this is going to do is keep the book on the best sellers list longer.
Someone who had never read the book will see this as say "hey something good must be in there if this guy is so mad and doesn’t want me to read it."
I do indeed hope it back fires on him and the books sales spike, I don't even want to get into the content, just condemning a book and telling people not to read it pisses me off to no end.
Comments
I read Angels and Demons, which was a completely average thriller, in every single way, so I have no desire to read The Da Vinci Code.
Also, reasa, what are we supposed to be discussing here?
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"You can find that book everywhere and the risk is that many people who read it believe that those fairy tales are real," he said. "I think I have the
responsibility to clear things up to unmask the cheap lies contained in books like that."<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Irony, my friends, is officially dead. And its corpse has been violated.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->He rejected the assertion, saying: “The role of women in the Church is a primary one, starting from Mary, the mother of God.”<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And there was me thinking that Mary was the mother of Jesus...
Before anyone asks me, I'm an aethist.
I read Angels and Demons, which was a completely average thriller, in every single way, so I have no desire to read The Da Vinci Code.
Also, reasa, what are we supposed to be discussing here? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...What do you think...honestly if you can't find something worthwhile to add, let alone not even comprehend the topic for discussion, why even bother posting?
Anyway, I thought Angles and Demons was an OK book, but I wouldn't judge the Da Vinci Code by it. It’s a much better book then its prequel.
Also I too would like to hear what someone religious has to say about this.
As for this church crap, It just makes me all the more glad I don't give a flying testicle about the opinions of these antiquated bigots. I know that churches do a lot of help for the needy and deprived the world over, but their motivation disgusts me.
--Scythe--
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"You can find that book everywhere and the risk is that many people who read it believe that those fairy tales are real," he said. "I think I have the
responsibility to clear things up to unmask the cheap lies contained in books like that."<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Irony, my friends, is officially dead. And its corpse has been violated. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
AYE SAW! I think we struck gold!
It reminds me of how Madonna's "Justify my love" was banned from MTV, so she released it on Video and made millions off of that just because some major body said it was "too evil." Good game RCC :-)
Well, we'll have to wait on the "devout" Catholic bit, as I think I'm the only Catholic on the boards that frequents the Discussion forum, but if you want the opinion of an average Catholic.....I am currently utilizing my "Bang Head Here" mousepad to its full potential. <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And there was me thinking that Mary was the mother of Jesus...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well since Jesus, God, and the Holy Spirit are, in Catholicism, more joined than separated, the statement that Mary is the mother of God is not technically wrong. Possibly confusing, but not wrong. Jesus is God, therefore Mary is both the mother of Jesus and God. Of course, Jesus is at the same time God's son, but it's quite probable that the original writers of the Bible meant "Son" figuratively, as in God sent a small part of himself down to Earth as Jesus. Suffice it to say that the Cardinal's comment is fine.
I've been meaning to read DVC for quite some time, actually since I first heard about it, and this Cardinal's plea will have exactly zero effect on my decision if and when I get around to reading it.
Oh and for the record, I found BathroomMonkey's comment funny. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"You can find that book everywhere and the risk is that many people who read it believe that those fairy tales are real," he said. "I think I have the
responsibility to clear things up to unmask the cheap lies contained in books like that."<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Irony, my friends, is officially dead. And its corpse has been violated. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
rofl
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"You can find that book everywhere and the risk is that many people who read it believe that those fairy tales are real," he said. "I think I have the
responsibility to clear things up to unmask the cheap lies contained in books like that."<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Irony, my friends, is officially dead. And its corpse has been violated. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
touchdown
The Church has to say SOMETHING. What the Vatican is buzzing about is the fact that the book says, fiction or not, that Jesus had relations - and children - with Mary Magdalene. For those of you confused, this is NOT the same Mary that gave birth to Jesus. This is a Mary he met in Sumaria at a well. She was a heathan, basically, with something like 4 husbands before the man she was currently with unmarried.
So you see, while we preach her as an important and respectable figure in the sense that she turned her life around and the thing about accepting anyone (accept homosexuals and people who like abortion, I know, but we're not going to go there... contradictions contradictions). To say that Jesus had sex with anyone simply shakes the footings of our whole religion. Because he's supposed to be perfect. And since he never got married... there's no WAY he had sex.
Our beliefs are supposed to tell us that even entertaining such fiction is a sin. But not many of us are quite that hardcore. Nevertheless, the point is that the church needed to say something, if only to preserve face with those of us that ARE that hardcore.
-edit- damnable swear filter -/edit-
-edit 2-
We ran into nearly this same debate years ago when someone made a big time movie about the passion (crusifixion) of Christ in which, in Jesus' last moments on the cross, he's tempted and merely entertains the thought of using his power to escape and lead a happily married life with Mary Magdalene. What the movie was <i>trying</i> to show was what we already preach: Jesus was both human and God. We do this by preaching about how he was tempted by satan in the desert. But, alas , it was travisty to ensinuate that Jesus EVER thought about sex. Again, some thing. The Church has to protect its position until such time that the members become fed up with that position and the Church has to change to avoid loosing members.
You don't think Jesus was riding down the streets of Jerusalem on Palm Sunday on top of his pimped out donkey and didn't once look at a girl and think "hmm nice rack"? <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'm sorry but sexual thoughts make up a large part of the human thought process, consciously or unconsciously, for me to consider Jesus a true human that dirty word The Church hates, sex, has to be a factor at least in his thought processes.
Jesus experiences a wide range of emotions in the scripture I don’t think it’s a leap to assume that he at least had some sexual thoughts.
Something like
"Da Vinci Code is not based in reality." said by the pope would have more effective.
You don't think Jesus was riding down the streets of Jerusalem on Palm Sunday on top of his pimped out donkey and didn't once look at a girl and think "hmm nice rack"? <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'm sorry but sexual thoughts make up a large part of the human thought process, consciously or unconsciously, for me to consider Jesus a true human that dirty word The Church hates, sex, has to be a factor at least in his thought processes.
Jesus experiences a wide range of emotions in the scripture I don’t think it’s a leap to assume that he at least had some sexual thoughts. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The issue has to do with Jesus and his inablility to sin - thinking about sex is a side issue. For what it matters, the issue could have been thinking about killing the people who nailed him to a cross - or exacting retribution on them.
So yeah - I bet he thought about sex. I bet he thought about it purely.
I believe God created everything - including sex - and gave us the ability to enjoy it. God couldn't possibly have done that without putting at least a little thought into it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Context means a lot when approaching these issues.
You don't think Jesus was riding down the streets of Jerusalem on Palm Sunday on top of his pimped out donkey and didn't once look at a girl and think "hmm nice rack"? <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'm sorry but sexual thoughts make up a large part of the human thought process, consciously or unconsciously, for me to consider Jesus a true human that dirty word The Church hates, sex, has to be a factor at least in his thought processes.
Jesus experiences a wide range of emotions in the scripture I don’t think it’s a leap to assume that he at least had some sexual thoughts. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't expect you to believe anything. I expect me to believe what I believe... but beyond that I have no opinion.
As for the church, it's their stance. If they intend to recruit new members, they need to stick by their stance, and that means making statements every once in a while. Now, sure, they could have handled it more subtly, but no church in the history of Christianity has ever heard of the word "subtle."
When it boils right down to it, any threat from any religion about consequences for your actions, or rewards for other actions is nothing but a recruiting tactic, even if those doing the shouting whole-heartedly believe it and are attempting in their own way to save lives and souls. Heh- listen to me talk my way straight to hell!
Anyway, no, I don't agree with my own church on this, nor many other points. But I do agree with it on some very fine ones, and those have nothing to do with the future of my own soul.
Like Rob said, the Catholic Church is full of contradictions. They hate sex, but want you to get married and have atleast five children. They also consider the use of contraception to be a sin. Contradictions, contradictions.
Like Rob said, the Catholic Church is full of contradictions. They hate sex, but want you to get married and have atleast five children. They also consider the use of contraception to be a sin. Contradictions, contradictions. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't forget how they said that condoms won't prevent AIDS or pregnancies to their African Catholics. Instead of just being downright contradictory, they can sometimes be downright evil.
About this, from his point of view I totally agree, you can't have your followers question you or your ideals, thats just bad tactics.
Like Rob said, the Catholic Church is full of contradictions. They hate sex, but want you to get married and have atleast five children. They also consider the use of contraception to be a sin. Contradictions, contradictions. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't forget how they said that condoms won't prevent AIDS or pregnancies to their African Catholics. Instead of just being downright contradictory, they can sometimes be downright evil. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
theclam = worst catholic evar
first of all, im not RCC - but I will stand up for them when such a blatant display of ignorance is being posted.
The church does not / never has / never will hate sex. To say so displays a complete lack of knowledge on the subject - it would have been better to not have said anything so uninformed was that comment.
Rather - the church wants its memebers to abstain from sinning - and that includes extra-marital relations, impure thoughts, etc. etc.
Furthermore - the use of contraceptives is considered to be killing people - (the morning after pill is a great example). Regardless of what you might think of the position, it is not inconsistant. It is your lack of understanding that leads you to the conclusion that it is inconsistant (when dealing with religious matters that seems to be the norm around here).
As to their african catholics - I can't speak to what they may or may not have said. However, their message still stands - they argue for a pure form of sex - that between a man and a woman and with only your spouse. Under those circumstances, getting AIDS is relatively hard to do - and pregnanacy isn't viewed as a negative thing. Their stance is against people who get pregnant / have abortions and those who have multiple partners assuming that condoms will protect them.
I apologize theclam, I do not mean to lay into you particularily, and after the 1st line it is directed at the rest of the forum as well.
The catholic church does hate sex, untill you get married and have seven kids, not five. :-)
I had to put up with their teachings untill I was in seventh grade.
The catholic church does hate sex, untill you get married and have seven kids, not five. :-)
I had to put up with their teachings untill I was in seventh grade. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's pretty much what Pepe just say.
Except for having to "put up" with our "teachings," that is. I don't mean to sound angry, but I kinda am, so it's hard.
Listen, some bits of my religion I take, some bits I don't. That's my choice, and yours, too. However, it DOESN'T mean that said bits are wrong in any way, shape or form. So don't imply that it was some kind of torture for you to go to church till you were 7! It must have been horrible for you, only remembering two years of "putting up" with my religion.
You assume that my mentality at the time of this wonderful education was the same of any child. That is very amusing in and of itself, having early self awareness really did not add anything to the situation.
Sounds a bit more outlandish if you were complaining about being Catholic till you were seven...
Well anyway, another thing we preach is forgiveness <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->