Gran Turismo 4 Just Got Owned.
Quaunaut
The longest seven days in history... Join Date: 2003-03-21 Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
The longest seven days in history... Join Date: 2003-03-21 Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
in Off-Topic
<div class="IPBDescription">Forza Motorsports.</div> I was skeptical at first when I heard about Forza Motorsport's hope of matching Gran Turismo 4- I mean, how could a game developed in two years even get close to a game being developed by one of the biggest 'genious' minds in gaming today for the last 5 years? Well, this is how.
First off, its less forgiving- you will learn that fast. While in Gran Turismo 4 you could get away with going off the road a bit, and for breaking a little too late, and most of all, hitting a wall at 130 mph, and hoping to recover. The phyiscs in Forza Motorsport's(FM) are wonderful- unforgiving, yet wholly believable and realistic. At times I find myself holding the controller white-knuckled, eyes burning a hole in the TV, praying that I just barely make that turn- and imagine the release when I make it by inches, and fly through a turn that should have slowed me down by 2 mph. Realism at its finest: Unforgiving, yet, not punishing.
Also, its even faster than Gran Turismo 4's 'cheat' way to get to the top, and more involved: You start the career choosing a region, which will determine what starting cars you can get, and how much different cars will cost(from other regions), then go and buy your first car, then get in your first race. Placing first in this race will yield 3,000 credits: Quite a bit. Add in any modifiers(or minus out- everything in the difficulty section can add to or minus away pieces of your overall cash that you win, depending on direction. Wanna get rid of ABS? +15% cash. No guide line? Bam, you don't have any negs against you now!), and it could go all the way up another 1,500 just from that first race! This already can get you a healthy bonus on your performance, but watch out with that- advancing into a higher class with a bad car will only result in a higher chance for you losing- so always get the part that doesn't directly influence horsepower first, THEN go into it.
While the damage models aren't amazingly good(I can't rip my car in 2- but the spoiler WILL come off...and just about anything else), they are a nice addition, and not only add to the experience, but add to the complexities: Wreck the hell out of your car? The price to fix it after the race will automatically be deducted from your winnings. But during the race, they can affect aerodynamics, may drag on the ground, affect suspension- many bad things.
All this talk, and I still haven't even spoken on the wholly cool <a href='http://www.research.microsoft.com/mlp/forza/' target='_blank'>Drivatar</a>: This little feature is in fact the A.I. in this game- in the process, you get to feel like you're racing real people, when in reality its only the A.I. They'll avoid you if you crash, any parts you leave on the ground, take corners differently, all sorts of odd or perfect behaviors, based on who their trained from. And whats better: You can train your own, in the 'Train Drivatar' feature of the game. I first thought this was merely something that took the percentages it gave me after each turn(to tell you how well you took it), and told the computer to do those parts just like that. Oh, how wrong I was. After watching it for a bit, it turned out it had copied even my tendency to wait a little too long to break, then turn really sharp into a hairpin turn- risking having an opponent nail my side very hard. Its an amazing technology, and I've only begun to mess with it.
I reccomend you all try this: It conveys a sense of speed much better than Gran Turismo, and is easily much more realistic(even farther than just the damage models). The only lacking I've found in this game thus far compared to Gran Turismo is the non-holy-crap-awesome soundtrack GT4 has, and graphics that don't measure up. Otherwise, all good, baby!
First off, its less forgiving- you will learn that fast. While in Gran Turismo 4 you could get away with going off the road a bit, and for breaking a little too late, and most of all, hitting a wall at 130 mph, and hoping to recover. The phyiscs in Forza Motorsport's(FM) are wonderful- unforgiving, yet wholly believable and realistic. At times I find myself holding the controller white-knuckled, eyes burning a hole in the TV, praying that I just barely make that turn- and imagine the release when I make it by inches, and fly through a turn that should have slowed me down by 2 mph. Realism at its finest: Unforgiving, yet, not punishing.
Also, its even faster than Gran Turismo 4's 'cheat' way to get to the top, and more involved: You start the career choosing a region, which will determine what starting cars you can get, and how much different cars will cost(from other regions), then go and buy your first car, then get in your first race. Placing first in this race will yield 3,000 credits: Quite a bit. Add in any modifiers(or minus out- everything in the difficulty section can add to or minus away pieces of your overall cash that you win, depending on direction. Wanna get rid of ABS? +15% cash. No guide line? Bam, you don't have any negs against you now!), and it could go all the way up another 1,500 just from that first race! This already can get you a healthy bonus on your performance, but watch out with that- advancing into a higher class with a bad car will only result in a higher chance for you losing- so always get the part that doesn't directly influence horsepower first, THEN go into it.
While the damage models aren't amazingly good(I can't rip my car in 2- but the spoiler WILL come off...and just about anything else), they are a nice addition, and not only add to the experience, but add to the complexities: Wreck the hell out of your car? The price to fix it after the race will automatically be deducted from your winnings. But during the race, they can affect aerodynamics, may drag on the ground, affect suspension- many bad things.
All this talk, and I still haven't even spoken on the wholly cool <a href='http://www.research.microsoft.com/mlp/forza/' target='_blank'>Drivatar</a>: This little feature is in fact the A.I. in this game- in the process, you get to feel like you're racing real people, when in reality its only the A.I. They'll avoid you if you crash, any parts you leave on the ground, take corners differently, all sorts of odd or perfect behaviors, based on who their trained from. And whats better: You can train your own, in the 'Train Drivatar' feature of the game. I first thought this was merely something that took the percentages it gave me after each turn(to tell you how well you took it), and told the computer to do those parts just like that. Oh, how wrong I was. After watching it for a bit, it turned out it had copied even my tendency to wait a little too long to break, then turn really sharp into a hairpin turn- risking having an opponent nail my side very hard. Its an amazing technology, and I've only begun to mess with it.
I reccomend you all try this: It conveys a sense of speed much better than Gran Turismo, and is easily much more realistic(even farther than just the damage models). The only lacking I've found in this game thus far compared to Gran Turismo is the non-holy-crap-awesome soundtrack GT4 has, and graphics that don't measure up. Otherwise, all good, baby!
Comments
Sounds like a good game for sure, but in terms of realism GT4 was tested intensely against real life track scenarios. It IS the better sim.
Sounds like a good game for sure, but in terms of realism GT4 was tested intensely against real life track scenarios. It IS the better sim. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
And this wasn't? Not to mention, one thing GT4 never did(which has been confirmed countless times by Sony folks) is it never conveyed the "tires-losing-traction" aspect of driving. That was one of the main focuses of Forza, as it focused primarily in filling every hole that Gran Turismo 4 seemed to have. Sometimes, it almost seems required, as I've seen many times where the "Suggested Line" is wants me to go at it full green, with no brake- so I'll e-brake it and slide on through right on the line.
This has been tested with every car the game has in it, in most of it's real world tracks, as well as many of Microsoft Research Team's open track courses.
As for the tires-losing-traction aspect, GT4 does a good job... but only replicating competition tires. You'll hear them for a while, but not feel a thing; until they're completely gone. Most passenger tires have a very smooth breakaway pattern, slowly letting go.. and almost no 'daily drivers' (aka: mass market audience) have ever driven on comp rubber.
Honestly though, who's going to use a passenger-tire on a track day, if they really mean to hit good times?
Sorry to disappoint you. I read it, I just didn't agree with some of the analysis.
As for the tires-losing-traction aspect, GT4 does a good job... but only replicating competition tires. You'll hear them for a while, but not feel a thing; until they're completely gone. Most passenger tires have a very smooth breakaway pattern, slowly letting go.. and almost no 'daily drivers' (aka: mass market audience) have ever driven on comp rubber.
Honestly though, who's going to use a passenger-tire on a track day, if they really mean to hit good times? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Those that don't want to wait a damned long time to get the pro tires in GT4.
I never, ever noticed the lack of grip in GT4, except as said, a little bit in the super tires, and even then, it seems they instantly lost traction for no reason at all. Not to mention it didn't even think about loss of rubber- something Forza seems to specialty at(I noticed that I spinned out when doing a light corner in Laguna Seca, taking it exactly the same as I had before).
And Swift, try it before you bash it. This slams it.
I still can't trust microsoft <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
At high speed (relative to a turn), having tires in 'green' means that you're able to follow a shorter line, and correct mid-corner if you go in too hot or turn in too late. Having the standard Sport (or radials if you downgrade), you'll be a LOT more likely to fall completely off-line.
And no. I mean ALL the tires in GT4 react like (RL) competition tires. They don't *start* to let go, they either grip or don't. The only thing differentiating between the slicks and the radials in GT4 is the level at which they just let go, and the speed at which your car will turn. Even Sport tires in GT4 will make the car turn like an absolute pig. Super-soft slicks will make it handle a LOT more like a go-kart. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Also, in GT4.. pay attention to the G-meter (the little white dot that slides back and forth as you turn, to show you how many lateral Gs you're pulling, approximately). The tires let go at certain G-points... very few people who mostly play 'arcade' racing games notice or catch on that it actually serves a purpose, just like the tach or speedometer.
And as to it: I noticed a lot of 'jumps' in my tire performance in GT4.
...
It's a racing game. You have a car, and you drive on a track, usually for several laps. Next version includes: more cars, more realistic physics, better graphics. It doesn't exactly take a genius to figure the genre out. :P
show me a screenshot of a 86 super charged mr2
As a side note for Chrono before I break out my stuff; <a href='http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox/game/920720.html' target='_blank'>Full car list for Forza over here</a>...
[edit] Something fairly cool that I found: <a href='http://www.msxbox-world.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2778&st=0&' target='_blank'>Apparently it's the 'Sephiroth' car</a>.
My question basically revolves around this: Is this game purchase-worthy, instead of rent-worthy? I plan to buy GTA:SA on the 7th (or soon thereafter); and while I have the money to purchase both I'm attempting to save money, so I'm not sure how I should buy them.
The last racing game I truly enjoyed was Gran Turismo 2 (I've played Tokyo Extreme Racer [or something like that; fairly boring game where you flash your headlights and then race people] and Need For Speed Underground [was okay] recently, none of which were really as engaging as Gran Turismo [although I could do without those licenses - despite they were easy to get they wasted my time racing]). The latest 'next generation' racing game I've played that I thoroughly enjoyed was Burnout 3 (but not enough to buy it, but still fun).
I like buying parts and stuff for them, and only moderately know what to do while tuning, but I hear it has descriptions for that stuff...and it looks good in motion, too - damage models, massive car lists (no DeLorean, though <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> ), interesting tracks, Live features and fairly thorough customization. In fact, looking at it makes me want to jump up and go "Damn, I would so run out and buy that...if I didn't need to save money for Germany/if it weren't 6 in the morning." My only real qualm seems to be how it plays and whether or not it will be interesting for ~100 hours or so, like SA will be. So what would you guys recommend for a psuedo-race enthusiast?
Buy GTA:SA, rent FM; or
Buy both.
...now if only my XBox would excet CD-RW discs to rip soundtracks from (not even for P2P downloaded songs, either...stupid Xbox).
In other words, I don't judge a racing game by its realism, I judge it by the amount of fun I can have playing it split-screen with friends. So should I get Forza or GT4 as a "party game?"
Edit:
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGTs.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGT2s.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGT3s.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
The only thing worse than a rabid console fanboy is an equally rabid PC fanboy. Face it, people have different opinions and different likes to your own, live with it, and stop being an elitist ****.
Edit:
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGTs.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGT2s.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<img src='http://www.nordichardware.se/news-pics/VGT3s.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I doubt it. They were given 5 years for GT4 and then fell short to a game made in a year and a half.
Grand Prix legends. 5 years ago.
Get a clue.
Thanks.
Grand Prix legends. 5 years ago.
Get a clue.
Thanks. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gran Prix Legends ftw
Too bad it doesn't have the cars I want <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
You're just full of it, aren't you? Do you have special allowance for posting such garbage?
I'd also like to point out: none of the above posts help me make any decision whatsoever.
I'll take my Project Gotham Racing 2, thank you very much.
Gran Turismo tought me how to balance my gas/brake timing, apexing, the such, in real life.
Forza tought me how to use those skills to their fullest potential, as well as swelling my love for cars to unknown-to-me-before heights.
Forza.