Just to clarify sieges have always been dealing 330 damage. This was then increased to 380, followed by an increase to 400.
AT NO POINT IN TIME HAS SIEGE DAMAGE BEEN DOUBLED. This confusion could be due to the fact that siege dealt 175? damage to lifeforms, were given blast damage to deal double to structures.
Up until 3.02? 22 shots were needed to kill a hive. This then dropped to 19. Which then dropped to 18.
Gorges in the old days were usually splattered by siege splash, meaning barely any healing was done.
imo the obs changes have improved sieges more than siege damage. In the past, if you had a fully charged obs and quickly dropped a new one for more energy, you would only have 5 scans.
Now, you have 7.
This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has.
<!--QuoteBegin-coris+Jul 16 2005, 09:51 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (coris @ Jul 16 2005, 09:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> NOW what am I missing? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The point is you can't just balance out seiges by lowering their damage. They also need other attributes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good point.
Move seiges back to the way they were (buggy but much more balanced), and make the obs the way it was before as well.
EDIT:
The increase in scan times are probably why sensory chambers are much harder to use as well.
<!--QuoteBegin-MistenTH+Jul 16 2005, 10:54 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MistenTH @ Jul 16 2005, 10:54 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just to clarify sieges have always been dealing 330 damage. This was then increased to 380, followed by an increase to 400.
AT NO POINT IN TIME HAS SIEGE DAMAGE BEEN DOUBLED. This confusion could be due to the fact that siege dealt 175? damage to lifeforms, were given blast damage to deal double to structures.
Up until 3.02? 22 shots were needed to kill a hive. This then dropped to 19. Which then dropped to 18.
Gorges in the old days were usually splattered by siege splash, meaning barely any healing was done.
imo the obs changes have improved sieges more than siege damage. In the past, if you had a fully charged obs and quickly dropped a new one for more energy, you would only have 5 scans.
Now, you have 7.
This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Agreed, increased obs time is the biggest buff to seiges. I like cwags alternitive of higher priced sieges, most teams recycle them after the deed is done anyways.
<!--QuoteBegin-puzl+Jul 15 2005, 09:20 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (puzl @ Jul 15 2005, 09:20 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Adding back in siege damage vs player is not on the agenda at the moment, but we never say never. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Except when it comes to letting players select the starting hive.
Perhaps if damage was to be done, it could just be done to things stood on top of structures. It would be good if you could just damage things standing right on top of an entity hit by a siege cannon. However, what you'd get is gorges pretending they had skipping ropes, trying to jump so they were in the air each time a siege hit the structure. A better solution would be to take the coordinates of the extents of the structure, then run through the linked list of players and see if they lie within that range of coordinates, and within a certain distance of the top of the hive.(Stuctures are already taking damage from sieges, and anything else that could take damage, well, gets skipped, is never destroyed by sieges).
For example, if the hive measured 2 x 2 x 2, and was at (4,2,1), you'd check to see if any player was in the range (3 1 2) and (5 3 3). That would give you a cuboid 1 unit high and 2 x 2 square, and anybody with an origin in that range would be damaged. The cuboid wouldn't be an exact match to the chamber/hive, but it wouldn't be bad either. A vertical cylinder would be about as easy to do, and would probably be a better match. This would always ignore obstrucing surfaces/bits of map/other players, but that's what sieges are for, right? It would be consistant, at least. You might have to make the radius a little larger than the actual extent of the structure to make sure they couldn't sit on the edge and take no damage, since you're checking the origin not the bounding box, but that's just a detail to be tweaked.
The advantage would be getting back to the situation where gorges couldn't heal a hive safely from on top, but if you stay away from the top of a structure then you'd be assured of not taking damage the way the old, less reliable damage radius would. Gorges could still heal from below the hive without being killed by sieges, but then they'd be vulnerable to marines attacking.
You guys all need to quit bitching about little individual things. Sure sieges are overpowered, but aliens are overpowered mid-late game. <span style='color:gray'>*snip*</span> Let the marines have the one advantage that they have (because we all know when hive 2 goes up, it's just about gg, so marines' only chance to win is getting hive 2 down before it goes up) and enjoy the most balanced NS version in a long while. I can't understand you people who have such an inability to see the big picture.
PS. You lose these sieges and we go back to ramboing being the only way to take down a hive.
Edit: What I mean is: First you complain about SG too powerful, then about sieges,athen about HMG, then about HA. Common. Just because it's a challenge to work against these doesn't mean they need to be nerfed. There are the ONLY things marines have going for them. You want all alien wins with no rine hope??? End rant. <span style='color:gray'>Chill down, mmk?</span>
<!--QuoteBegin-Router Box+Jul 15 2005, 02:02 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Router Box @ Jul 15 2005, 02:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> GOOD SIR WHAT ARE YOUR CALCULATIONS FOR 32 GORGES HEALING THE HIVE WITH 1 MC AGAINST 4 SIEGES THAT DO 367 DAMAGE EACH?! <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Calculations? Those guys? Laf. None of course. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-NGE+Jul 16 2005, 02:53 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (NGE @ Jul 16 2005, 02:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Zephor+Jul 15 2005, 12:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zephor @ Jul 15 2005, 12:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Couldn't you just make gorges evolve faster and this entire problem would be solved? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Or, instead of changing yet another factor to the game with the chance of screwing things up more, we can just go back to the old seiges that damaged structures at a reasonable rate and kept gorges at bay, because we know from 2 years of this model that it works. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> well, as others already said...
im at least not part of your "WE" perhaps siege need some work, but for gods sake please dont change them back <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
MistenTH has a point the obs has changed it, not the sieges really
Well, if 3.1 fixes the healing cones of heal spray (the area where you heal ) , so you can actually heal the hive properly then im one happy gorge <!--emo&::hive::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/hive5.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='hive5.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Nobody has mentioned what I thought would be the most obvious way of balancing sieges. Even before this most recent buff if a marine team was able to get their sieges up the hive was going down, in most cases. The big fight over the siege spot occurs between when the marines enter the area and when the siege cannons finish building. If you want to give aliens a better chance of saving the hive vs a siege, increase that time. The easiest way to do that would be to increase the research time on the turret factory.
I don't know why people think that "the old model" is superior to "the new model," when in both cases gorges are irrelevant. I think sieges with no player damage and 400 structure damage is, from a purely theoretical perspective, better because they're more consistant and reasonable. Try considering a realistic gun that does half damage to people and whole damage to non-people (not even considering the fact that, in NS, alien structures and aliens are both made of the same compounds -- hives and DCs are just as much alive as skulks and gorges).
Ok, even if you don't buy that argument my first point still holds water. The battle for a siege spot has always been decided before the siege cannons are up and firing. In fact, the only cases I can think of where this hasn't held are on gigantic servers like SCHamptons where the aliens can afford to have 5 gorges on top the hive healing continuously. This certainly wouldn't happen in a 6v6 competitive where you could barely afford to have one or two gorges, let alone expect them to live healing the hive when marines know that their best chance comes when the last gorge dies.
<!--QuoteBegin-meep+Jul 19 2005, 12:59 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (meep @ Jul 19 2005, 12:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> let alone expect them to live healing the hive when marines know that their best chance comes when the last gorge dies. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> gorge on the hive k? <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Shadow+Jul 19 2005, 01:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shadow @ Jul 19 2005, 01:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-meep+Jul 19 2005, 12:59 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (meep @ Jul 19 2005, 12:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> let alone expect them to live healing the hive when marines know that their best chance comes when the last gorge dies. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> gorge on the hive k? <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Get this stunning revelation to the competitive community immediately.
<!--QuoteBegin-Cloud King+Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cloud King @ Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Aliens are overpowered so who cares. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons.
<!--QuoteBegin-NGE+Jul 19 2005, 02:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (NGE @ Jul 19 2005, 02:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Cloud King+Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cloud King @ Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Aliens are overpowered so who cares. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> NGE, we just siege now, but if they don't work, all we are going to do is play around with the SG.
if u give rines enough time to set up sieges next door to your hive ...YOU DID SOMETHING WRONG.
i dont think they really need to be changed, they cost a lot of res and rines have a more of a chance, its not an alien beatdown 95% of the time anymore.
<!--QuoteBegin-mmcmike+Jul 20 2005, 05:41 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (mmcmike @ Jul 20 2005, 05:41 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> if u give rines enough time to set up sieges next door to your hive ...YOU DID SOMETHING WRONG.
i dont think they really need to be changed, they cost a lot of res and rines have a more of a chance, its not an alien beatdown 95% of the time anymore. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> if commander do a cc block(U.S. clans speciality) you really can't do anything, you can't chew sieges/ you can't defend your hive well.
<!--QuoteBegin-NGE+Jul 19 2005, 08:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (NGE @ Jul 19 2005, 08:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Cloud King+Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cloud King @ Jul 19 2005, 12:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Aliens are overpowered so who cares. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The tactics are already stale, they just tech to HA at armour 1, and move to siege.
A solution to this problem is to make SC's cut down on how long the scan sweep reveals everything. Such that more SC's mean the faster it all recloaks.
Why do this solve the problem so easily? Simple the hive has a 15% regen rate (on 7000HP) and then you combine that with the DC's and/or gorges doing the heal-dance and the hive takes much longer to kill. (ie: while it really only has 7000 actual HP with all the healing it can have an apparent HP of far more)
SC's, alien units, and never letting the enemy set them up in the first place are the counters to seiges. Besides having an onos to stomp spam while a fade goes and kills the rines or pounds the TF until it breaks isn't too hard. If gorges can bile bomb then they can spam that and healspray.
The simple truth is that seiges are not grossly overpowered but it requires cunning strategy made from teamwork and communication to get the job done.
Are a seiges slightly overpowered? Seems probable, thus two solutions I see: weaken seige damage (or the number of seiges you can drop in a radius) or you can make the SC's a better counter to the scan.
<!--QuoteBegin-Cloud King+Jul 20 2005, 05:14 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cloud King @ Jul 20 2005, 05:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Good idea guys, lets nerf the one why to kill a 2nd hive vs a good team. Good idea! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Cloud, seiges in scrims commonly take down the second hive before it goes up. Just because its fair against two hives doesn't balance it out for the rest of the time.
Comments
AT NO POINT IN TIME HAS SIEGE DAMAGE BEEN DOUBLED. This confusion could be due to the fact that siege dealt 175? damage to lifeforms, were given blast damage to deal double to structures.
Up until 3.02? 22 shots were needed to kill a hive.
This then dropped to 19.
Which then dropped to 18.
Gorges in the old days were usually splattered by siege splash, meaning barely any healing was done.
imo the obs changes have improved sieges more than siege damage. In the past, if you had a fully charged obs and quickly dropped a new one for more energy, you would only have 5 scans.
Now, you have 7.
This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has.
The point is you can't just balance out seiges by lowering their damage. They also need other attributes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good point.
Move seiges back to the way they were (buggy but much more balanced), and make the obs the way it was before as well.
EDIT:
The increase in scan times are probably why sensory chambers are much harder to use as well.
thought we are talking about competitive stuff ( clanwars ) :o| <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He was using his sarcasm to call you out. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think he was being sarcastic lorn
AT NO POINT IN TIME HAS SIEGE DAMAGE BEEN DOUBLED. This confusion could be due to the fact that siege dealt 175? damage to lifeforms, were given blast damage to deal double to structures.
Up until 3.02? 22 shots were needed to kill a hive.
This then dropped to 19.
Which then dropped to 18.
Gorges in the old days were usually splattered by siege splash, meaning barely any healing was done.
imo the obs changes have improved sieges more than siege damage. In the past, if you had a fully charged obs and quickly dropped a new one for more energy, you would only have 5 scans.
Now, you have 7.
This 40% increase in siege time probably has helped marines more than siege damage has. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed, increased obs time is the biggest buff to seiges. I like cwags alternitive of higher priced sieges, most teams recycle them after the deed is done anyways.
Except when it comes to letting players select the starting hive.
For example, if the hive measured 2 x 2 x 2, and was at (4,2,1), you'd check to see if any player was in the range (3 1 2) and (5 3 3). That would give you a cuboid 1 unit high and 2 x 2 square, and anybody with an origin in that range would be damaged.
The cuboid wouldn't be an exact match to the chamber/hive, but it wouldn't be bad either. A vertical cylinder would be about as easy to do, and would probably be a better match. This would always ignore obstrucing surfaces/bits of map/other players, but that's what sieges are for, right? It would be consistant, at least. You might have to make the radius a little larger than the actual extent of the structure to make sure they couldn't sit on the edge and take no damage, since you're checking the origin not the bounding box, but that's just a detail to be tweaked.
The advantage would be getting back to the situation where gorges couldn't heal a hive safely from on top, but if you stay away from the top of a structure then you'd be assured of not taking damage the way the old, less reliable damage radius would. Gorges could still heal from below the hive without being killed by sieges, but then they'd be vulnerable to marines attacking.
PS. You lose these sieges and we go back to ramboing being the only way to take down a hive.
Edit: What I mean is: First you complain about SG too powerful, then about sieges,athen about HMG, then about HA. Common. Just because it's a challenge to work against these doesn't mean they need to be nerfed. There are the ONLY things marines have going for them. You want all alien wins with no rine hope??? End rant.
<span style='color:gray'>Chill down, mmk?</span>
Calculations? Those guys? Laf. None of course. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Or, instead of changing yet another factor to the game with the chance of screwing things up more, we can just go back to the old seiges that damaged structures at a reasonable rate and kept gorges at bay, because we know from 2 years of this model that it works. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
well, as others already said...
im at least not part of your "WE"
perhaps siege need some work, but for gods sake please dont change them back
<!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Well, if 3.1 fixes the healing cones of heal spray (the area where you heal ) , so you can actually heal the hive properly then im one happy gorge <!--emo&::hive::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/hive5.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='hive5.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I don't know why people think that "the old model" is superior to "the new model," when in both cases gorges are irrelevant. I think sieges with no player damage and 400 structure damage is, from a purely theoretical perspective, better because they're more consistant and reasonable. Try considering a realistic gun that does half damage to people and whole damage to non-people (not even considering the fact that, in NS, alien structures and aliens are both made of the same compounds -- hives and DCs are just as much alive as skulks and gorges).
Ok, even if you don't buy that argument my first point still holds water. The battle for a siege spot has always been decided before the siege cannons are up and firing. In fact, the only cases I can think of where this hasn't held are on gigantic servers like SCHamptons where the aliens can afford to have 5 gorges on top the hive healing continuously. This certainly wouldn't happen in a 6v6 competitive where you could barely afford to have one or two gorges, let alone expect them to live healing the hive when marines know that their best chance comes when the last gorge dies.
gorge on the hive k? <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo-->
gorge on the hive k? <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Get this stunning revelation to the competitive community immediately.
Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons.
Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
NGE, we just siege now, but if they don't work, all we are going to do is play around with the SG.
i dont think they really need to be changed, they cost a lot of res and rines have a more of a chance, its not an alien beatdown 95% of the time anymore.
i dont think they really need to be changed, they cost a lot of res and rines have a more of a chance, its not an alien beatdown 95% of the time anymore. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
if commander do a cc block(U.S. clans speciality) you really can't do anything, you can't chew sieges/ you can't defend your hive well.
Not so much anymore. I see plenty of marine wins. They all revolve around the seige.
Tactics are gonna become real stale soon when people just play around the damn seige cannons. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The tactics are already stale, they just tech to HA at armour 1, and move to siege.
Oh wait, thats just levitacus.
Why do this solve the problem so easily? Simple the hive has a 15% regen rate (on 7000HP) and then you combine that with the DC's and/or gorges doing the heal-dance and the hive takes much longer to kill. (ie: while it really only has 7000 actual HP with all the healing it can have an apparent HP of far more)
SC's, alien units, and never letting the enemy set them up in the first place are the counters to seiges. Besides having an onos to stomp spam while a fade goes and kills the rines or pounds the TF until it breaks isn't too hard. If gorges can bile bomb then they can spam that and healspray.
The simple truth is that seiges are not grossly overpowered but it requires cunning strategy made from teamwork and communication to get the job done.
Are a seiges slightly overpowered? Seems probable, thus two solutions I see: weaken seige damage (or the number of seiges you can drop in a radius) or you can make the SC's a better counter to the scan.
Regardless, the choice is not up to us.
Cloud, seiges in scrims commonly take down the second hive before it goes up. Just because its fair against two hives doesn't balance it out for the rest of the time.