Question about the resource system

Nemesis_Zero · March 2002

<div class="IPBDescription">Smack me if it's written down somewhere</div>I just started implementing func_resources in Eniant, and wondered how the relations are: Are the predefined 200 RP much? Are they a minimum? I'm aware that the definate res costs won't be settled until about 2 hours before the actual release, but some hints would be nice.

Jedisar · March 2002

dood, Jack those RP's Up! I doubt 200 will cover what needs to be done! That's a 200 RP max gained from the resource spot..dooder...MORE RP...I'd say a good amount would be 5,000-10,000.

realityisdead · March 2002

It depends on how much 1 RP can get you, Jedisar... You might be right, but I woudn't be so sure this early...

Yamazaki · March 2002

If the default is 200, I think sticking to around that value would be best. I'm assuming Charlie set that default and knows what he's doing, considering he sets the guidelines <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

Here's an example: In NS_Penumbra there is 1 resource nozzle close to each start point, so that each side can easily hold on to at least one supply of resource points. These func_resources are set to 100, only half of the default, to ensure that the team can't win the game using just that resource nozzle alone. The resource nozzles near the middle of the map, which is where most of the fighting will be, are set to 400, which is double the default. This makes them a prize worth fighting for.

So each side can get resources right away from the local nozzle, but in order to win they'll have to expand and capture the middle nozzles. Think of how RTS maps like warcraft/starcraft/C&C are laid out when placing the nozzles and setting their values. <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

Nemesis_Zero · March 2002

Yeah, I'm currently looking through my Star Craft directory to get a feeling of it.

BTW, I think it might be a good idea to put a func_resource near but not in the marines base - using that one will force them to break their defenses up a bit, so burry-in tactics won't be all that common.

MonsieurEvil · March 2002

The RP value is very, very map specific. A larger map will need more, where as a smaller map will probably need fewer. The idea is to get your RP values to last about as long as you want a 'round' of the map to last. So basically, I wouldn't worry about the actual value in the slightest until you are at the playtest stage, and can actually use it.

Remember that when the resources run out, so does the game, as the team with no RP's will be unable to reinforce or buy weapons and ammo. That's why it's so critical to control as many nozzles as possible.

Nemesis_Zero · March 2002

Sure, but I'd really hate to recompile a map just because I had to add some zeroes (no pun intended).

Besides, an actual playtest will be very hard if the mapper didn't get the resources right, so please give us some relations:

Are 100 RP worth a LMG?
A turret?
A hot puff of oxygen?

Relic25 · March 2002

Once your map is completed and compiled, if you only want to change the values of the resources, you can do a quick -onlyents compile. As I understand it, any entity values can be changed and you won't have to do a full compile all over again, provided that you just dont <i>move</i> the entities in any way.

I speak of course from complete inexperience, as I've never been able to successfully do this, but then again I've never tried very hard.

Flayra · March 2002

Nope, this hasn't been written up anywhere.

I'm of the mind to keep all the numbers as small as possible, and no smaller. I think ammo should be around the cheapest thing around, probably a couple points. Most alien structures cost in the area of 15 points, and upgrading to a different alien lifeform costs anywhere from around 5 (level 1, assuming you're morphing down) to around 40 for a level 5.

I think most func_resources should have around 100-200 points each. It costs around 10-20 points to build a tower on top of one, and then the marines are encourated to upgrade the towers repeatedly, which each upgrade causing it to harvest faster.

One thing to keep in mind, is that a map should have no more then about 7 func_resources or so. Any more then that gets to be overwhelming and harder to keep straight (most people can keep 5-9 objects in their head). Smaller numbers of things are easier to think about.

Also, don't place the func_resources under things are too close to walls. The resource tower needs to fit on top of it easily.

These numbers are definitely subject to change of course and are just guesstimates right now.

ChromeAngel · March 2002

If an alien builder constructs a resource gatherer on a source does the whole alien team get a share of the resources gathered or just the alien that built it?

If it's just the builder why should any of the others bother gaurding it?

Yamazaki · March 2002

The -onlyents option works only if you:

1. Only change the properties of brush/point entities
2. Only change the type of a brush or point entity
3. Only change the position of non-light point entities
4. Only add/remove non-light point entities

So you can change the values on a func_resource without a problem, and you can move it since it's just a point entity. You can also add them later, or remove them.

Scythe · March 2002

You know what would be really sweet? Instead of a resource tower for the aliens, the builder would have to be near a hive, then he/she/it would choose to make a "Feed pipe". The builder would then walk (Slowly) over to the resource nozzle and select "End Feed pipe" when he/she/it is standing on it. The result is a pulsating, yellowish tube leading from the resource nozzle to the hive. It could make a sucking sound at the resource nozzle end. The marines could destroy the pipe to cut off the nano-stuff supply. This would be fair on the aliens because they also get RPs from killing marines (I think).

Comments? Sugestions? Baseless abuse?

--Scythe--
<a href="mailto:the_only_scythe@yahoo.co.uk">the_only_scythe@yahoo.co.uk</a>

Moleculor · March 2002

Only problem is for func_resources on the other side of the map, that's gonna be one LOOOOOOONG tube. Especially with the size of maps that are being made.

Black_Wolf · March 2002

anyway, that would be extremely difficult to code, without it going through walls etc, wouldnt really work