NS:S Flame Thrower
WorthyRival
Black Armor Division Join Date: 2006-11-07 Member: 58470Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
Black Armor Division Join Date: 2006-11-07 Member: 58470Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
<div class="IPBDescription">you know like fire and ****</div>I know this idea is not mine originally but it is a hot topic, and i thought no one has bought it up as its own thread in NS2 Ideas and suggestions, so.........
Welcome to NS:S Flame Thrower
There are so many arguments as to why there should and why there shouldnt be a flamethrower in NS2.
So here is a thread to thrash out this Idea once and for all.
My Personal opinion I would love to see a flame thrower in NS2.
Here are some of my thoughts.
NS is set on a space ship !
Whats the most valuable thing on a space ship ? Oxygen !
Whats does a fire consume ? Oxygen !
We all know a flame thrower is all about Fire or does it have to be.
Maybe a flamethrower doesn't have to just directly touch you to effect you or to do damage to you, you just need to be in the room, everyone in the room would have the oxygen meter like when your underwater, when depleted both aliens and marines took damage.
Light armor marines can black out or their view can be distorted from loss of oxygen. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wow.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":0" border="0" alt="wow.gif" /> hahahaha making it a very team based weapon that needs to be used carefully.
Unless used by heavy armors as they already have gas masks and breathing aparatus. so flame throwers would be more promenent as an end game weapon and not very effective without Heavy Armor.
Maybe flame throwers could only be used for a limited time across an entire room. oxygen had to be replenished. no oxygen no fire, like a cool down feature.
( Thanks go to glimmerman and TerRaKanE who helped hammer out this idea in another thread they were good suggestions.)
Don't get me wrong the idea can do with some work, but its feasible and different, a gun effecting the players environment
So Lads drop in your ideas and suggestions on this weapon and let the Flame begin !
This Post has been edited for the colour blind. !
Welcome to NS:S Flame Thrower
There are so many arguments as to why there should and why there shouldnt be a flamethrower in NS2.
So here is a thread to thrash out this Idea once and for all.
My Personal opinion I would love to see a flame thrower in NS2.
Here are some of my thoughts.
NS is set on a space ship !
Whats the most valuable thing on a space ship ? Oxygen !
Whats does a fire consume ? Oxygen !
We all know a flame thrower is all about Fire or does it have to be.
Maybe a flamethrower doesn't have to just directly touch you to effect you or to do damage to you, you just need to be in the room, everyone in the room would have the oxygen meter like when your underwater, when depleted both aliens and marines took damage.
Light armor marines can black out or their view can be distorted from loss of oxygen. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wow.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":0" border="0" alt="wow.gif" /> hahahaha making it a very team based weapon that needs to be used carefully.
Unless used by heavy armors as they already have gas masks and breathing aparatus. so flame throwers would be more promenent as an end game weapon and not very effective without Heavy Armor.
Maybe flame throwers could only be used for a limited time across an entire room. oxygen had to be replenished. no oxygen no fire, like a cool down feature.
( Thanks go to glimmerman and TerRaKanE who helped hammer out this idea in another thread they were good suggestions.)
Don't get me wrong the idea can do with some work, but its feasible and different, a gun effecting the players environment
So Lads drop in your ideas and suggestions on this weapon and let the Flame begin !
This Post has been edited for the colour blind. !
Comments
<!--quoteo(post=1581267:date=Nov 27 2006, 02:50 PM:name=TerRaKanE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TerRaKanE @ Nov 27 2006, 02:50 PM) [snapback]1581267[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
nice idea... but it should be room-based not for the whole map
if you enter a room with fire, there could appear a oxygen bar. If its at 0 the fire goes out. And the marine takes damage (like underwater). But only for a few seconds, because the sustainment systems will start provinding fresh oxygen to the room immediatly, after the fire extinguished.
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I stopped reading when i saw all the colors
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Quoted for absolute truth.
Anyway, keep ponsting, thats an realy interesting suggestion for NS with much potential.
crosses off
clowns
hot air ballon rides
bokects of wyld flowers
bubbles
swirly lollie pops
from my valentines day list of things to get the guy
and no x mas, saint patrics day, international womans week and easter for terokane calender
As far as I know though, the only reason why we don't already have a flamethrower in NS1 is:
=- A flamethrower that looks good lags too much.
=- A flamethrower that is lag friendly looks unacceptably terrible.
Note: This post assumes TF2 will come outwhen Valve say it next will.
as far as the lag issue when NS2 comes out PC's will be much more powerful, HL2s netcode will be better and the HL2 Engine will be old. I dont think this will really be an issue when the game is complete. unless your running a dumpster dived junkyard machine.
How about this idea:
Each room/area has a supply of oxygen that slowly replenishes. A player only sees the oxygen meter on his screen if the oxygen in the area is already below normal (or hes underwater), otherwise his oxygen meter fades out so it doesnt take too much screen space. Any fires in a room steadily consume the oxygen.
When oxygen falls below a set number (say 20% of normal?), both marines and aliens in the area are affected. Marines vision gets blurry, and if they stay too long they experience the drowning effect. Heavy Marines are not affected, because of the respirators. Aliens stop regaining adrenaline, and slowly lose hp at the same speed they normally gain hp (2% every 2 seconds).
The HP loss isnt crippling, but if they don't get out of the area soon, they will run out of adrenaline and be unable to fight. The Adrenaline upgrade would be countered, although the effects of a Movement Chamber could allow them to continue fighting. Regeneration should also probably be countered, but again the effects of a DC could allow them to regain health.
So using a flamethrower wouldn't be enough to drive aliens out of a fortified area, and also hinders the marines advance unless they have Heavy Armor. But it does effectively deny the aliens ability to attack through an area. And once Marines can pair Flamethrowers with Heavy Armor, it becomes a downright devastating tool.
I would not like to see it have a cool down period...........since the flame is generated outside of the weapon barrel or one that eats up oxygen in a room that would have been ventilated in the first place.
I do not think it would or should be an end game weapon, it should be less costly or equal to a SG simply because while it may offer a devastating close range effect.......it offers no range thus exposing the person using the flame thrower to extreme danger.
It would act more as a deterrent and hive killer than anything else.
And if a jp'er has a flamethrower he should run the chance of zipping into his own flame while firing.
And to close........
Just to correct dumbmarine (not knocking you)as to why the flame thrower wasn't included into NS was because:
It was to be a volumetric weapon, if it was fired into a vent the flame would expand upon exiting into a room, which couldn't be done.
If fired into a vent that had a 90 degree turn some where along the way, the flame would follow the 90 degree turn in kind. This too couldn't be done.
It had nothing to do with lag, it had to do with the fact that if the weapon couldn't be done the way flayra wanted it to be then it wasn't going into the game. What he wanted to do was one thing and the 1/2life engine dictated it to be otherwise.
As far as I know though, the only reason why we don't already have a flamethrower in NS1 is:
=- A flamethrower that looks good lags too much.
=- A flamethrower that is lag friendly looks unacceptably terrible.
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<!--quoteo(post=1582175:date=Nov 29 2006, 07:32 PM:name=TheOriginal10Round)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TheOriginal10Round @ Nov 29 2006, 07:32 PM) [snapback]1582175[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Just to correct dumbmarine (not knocking you)as to why the flame thrower wasn't included into NS was because:
It was to be a volumetric weapon, if it was fired into a vent the flame would expand upon exiting into a room, which couldn't be done.
If fired into a vent that had a 90 degree turn some where along the way, the flame would follow the 90 degree turn in kind. This too couldn't be done.
It had nothing to do with lag, it had to do with the fact that if the weapon couldn't be done the way flayra wanted it to be then it wasn't going into the game. What he wanted to do was one thing and the 1/2life engine dictated it to be otherwise.
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I'm pretty sure the correct answer is a combination of both of your posts. Flayra wanted the Flamethrower to do 3 things:
--Not look terrible
--Not lag
--Be volumetric
His programmers could get any TWO of the three (yes, they could make it be volumetric), but not all three at the same time. And until they could get all three together, they werent going to put it in.
I like the ideas about how it effects aliens, they don't black out. but halts their adrinaline recharge, would be great for mopping up dazed marines but not too many. Its a really nice touch.
I Like the idea for the JPer catching fire that would be damn funny.
Should JPers be able to carry flame throwers, as the flame thrower needs a fuel pack itself ?
Maybe it could use the JP fuel if you have both ?
Should the flame thrower only be avalible after the advanced armory upgraded like the HMG and GL ? I think it should.
I dont want to see the Flame Thrower as an end game weapon either, but as a strategy racing for this gun early should have some draw backs especially if its powerful.
Some Other thoughts:
How Powerful should it be ?
If it is powerfull, it has to have a cool down feature like the reload delay the HMG and GL. would love to see this as an environmental element like the oxygen feature but im bias.
I would like it powerful against structures maybe not so much against life forms should do damage to life forms over time as they burn, if lifeforms catch fire it should be hard for them to see, through the flames. Making catching fire a real *******.
The Map could have a water feature like a man made water fall, a flaming fade could blink through it to extinguish the flames burning it, It would come out the other side smoking or steaming that would look cool.
Would it need its own ammo ? or would it just recharge like a JP ?
I think it would be cool if flamethrower was forced to do damage in general (ie always FF and self damage no matter what).
*imagines flaming down a vent into which a skulk recently retreated*
A flamethrower that chokes the aliens isn't a flamethrower.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No it would be a tool for alternate strategies.
The commander could vent atmosphere. from certains rooms ( e.g. the cargo hold ) if a console in the room is welded by marines, to hand over control of this feature to the commander.
Aliens could chomp/destroy a console to open air locks, for ambushes or to nurf a train of flame throwers.
Rooms that where against the outta hull could spring leaks from bullet holes and acid rockets and the room would start to vent atmosphere at a slow rate, the more holes the faster the rate. Air tight doors would close sealing the room, locking people in for an alien ambush.
A nanite cloud could automaticlly be released by the ships AI to seal up the holes, but the nanites would take time e.g. 10 seconds to repair. maybe another 5 seconds to restore a breatheable atmosphere.
LA marines and lower life form aliens maybe even boxes would be dragged towards the outta hull breach till sealed.
Wouldn't effect HA or Higher alien life forms.
Would create drag a JPers and Lerks flight Path might use more fuel but they could still fly.
Obviously not the entire map would have these features maybe just the pathways against the hull could have these effects, middle pathways through the belly of the ship would be safer.
This all i can think of at the moment im sure there would be others.
Im getting way off topic but I thought it would raise some interesting ideas if Atmosphere was a useable factor in the game.
i especaly like the idea of how nannites would repair damage, or bactria depending on the nearst closest teams structures
Ok, back to the flamethrower idea.
It's cool!
Primary function, destroying the alien creep/bacteria that's all over the place which gives benifits to aliens when near it. Gorges can use res to create this creep or place structures.
Just some ideas.
yes creeped blocked doors would be interesting, normal creep blocking doors would be a bad thing i would imagien but a gorge consistantly hsoting a weld spot cool
With this 'Dynamic Infestation' being developed, maybe it's an idea to give the Marines a flame thrower to burn away the infestation.
This is what Flayra had to say about 'Dynamic Infestation' at the blog:
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In addition to being an atmospheric visual effect, having dynamic infestation gives us opportunities to develop some interesting game play elements. High on our list is having map entities which are triggered when an area becomes infested or uninfested. For example, you could have a computer console that shuts down when overrun by infestation and causes the lights in the room to go out. If the marines clear out the room and fight back the infestation, the system comes back online and the lights flicker on to fill the room. What about abilities and technology which only function when players are on their home turf?
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I immediately pictured myself trying to burn away infestation to reach certain control panels and stuff like that.
Maybe the flame thrower could be designed to only be used to burn away infestation, or give it a very limited amount of fuel, to keep it from being overused.
What do you guys think?
I don't think the flame thrower will be weapon that a commander will hand out to everyone just like the grenade launcher a team of GL's is a feast for skulks. It will be a weapon that when used with a squad of mixed weapons will be very effective.
Stops a large group of flamethrowers going out as they will just own each other with crossfire.
I came up with another idea for the flame thrower.
With this 'Dynamic Infestation' being developed, maybe it's an idea to give the Marines a flame thrower to burn away the infestation.
This is what Flayra had to say about 'Dynamic Infestation' at the blog:
I immediately pictured myself trying to burn away infestation to reach certain control panels and stuff like that.
Maybe the flame thrower could be designed to only be used to burn away infestation, or give it a very limited amount of fuel, to keep it from being overused.
What do you guys think?
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By Flayra regarding Dynamic Infestation:
( at least I read this quote on another forum <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/nerd-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::nerdy::" border="0" alt="nerd-fix.gif" /> )
" - ...and yes, of course we plan to have something to burn it all away. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> "
Instead of inflicting massive damage, the napalm could be more of an "over time" damager. It could do perhaps 15 damage per second upon lighting a target on fire for four seconds. This would discourage alien players from running through fire, but would not make it impossible to run through it. A flamethrower similar to the one in AVP2 would work well in my opinion. Not overly hindering, mobile, compact, at the price of not being that powerful. Would be useful for it to do double damage to structures.
Also could be used to counter dynamic infestation.
By Flayra regarding Dynamic Infestation:
( at least I read this quote on another forum <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/nerd-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::nerdy::" border="0" alt="nerd-fix.gif" /> )
" - ...and yes, of course we plan to have something to burn it all away. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> "
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Alright, that's settled then <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
On a more serious note: FLAMETHROWER DO WANT