<!--quoteo(post=1820433:date=Dec 31 2010, 12:12 AM:name=NS2HD)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NS2HD @ Dec 31 2010, 12:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820433"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->While I don't for a moment doubt they are generating enough cash to soldier on to completion, this is simultaneously my greatest end-game hope and fear. The hope: UWE all get to keep jobs, pay their bills and live on. These are real people, remember. The fear: Activision sits down with the directors and says something along the lines of 'Look, we love what you've done here. We will finance completion. We're just going to bring in a few of our XboX and PS3 marketing people to help you fine tune the gameplay. We've got to make the game more accessible, you understand. Please sign here.'<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sir I do enjoy scary games, books or movies, and I usually do not get nightmares from them because they are fantasy.
However that fact you specifically mentioned Activision of all companies frightens me to the core. You didn't say "faceless company", you named them, giving credence to the possibility that such a deal would take place.
So I beg of you, please keep the scary stuff in fantasyland, I don't want nightmares.
Activision don't make 'bad' games. They make mainstream games which are pretty popular and sell very well, even if their practices and staff treatment has been reported in the media to be quite unusual and harsh to certain development staff in the past year.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It'd kinda be liked...defeating the purpose. But yeah man, If I hit the lotto for like 50 million, like 30 million after taxes, I'd donate them probably 250,000-500,000.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't know what the laws are in the US, but here in Australia any money won on a gameshow, lotto, competition etc is TAX FREE 8-D. Now all I have to do is win something, lol.
Activision likes to sell stripped down games, NS wouldn't interest them unless it was very basic.
I still think Valve would easily buy them up; it's part of their routes as a HL mod, it'd be profitable for Valve and UWE, and Valve is already helping them. Getting a little funding from Valve to top off the job, along with technical help, could only benefit UWE.
From the studios that were absorbed by Valve, they've said they're allowed to retain their identity, not the name, of course, they're Valve now, but they said nothing changed but their budget and access to tech.
Valve bought Turtle Rock and that started financially losing money. Instead of pumping money in to it and improving it they released Turtle Rock. You may notice L4D 1 is made by Turtle Rock, L4D 2 was solely Valve ;)
<!--quoteo(post=1820433:date=Dec 30 2010, 10:12 PM:name=NS2HD)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NS2HD @ Dec 30 2010, 10:12 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820433"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->While I don't for a moment doubt they are generating enough cash to soldier on to completion, this is simultaneously my greatest end-game hope and fear. The hope: UWE all get to keep jobs, pay their bills and live on. These are real people, remember. The fear: Activision sits down with the directors and says something along the lines of 'Look, we love what you've done here. We will finance completion. We're just going to bring in a few of our XboX and PS3 marketing people to help you fine tune the gameplay. We've got to make the game more accessible, you understand. Please sign here.'<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think if it came to something like that it would more than likely be Valve absorbing UWE and finishing the game. The downside to that is the devs wouldn't make as much $$$ and would lose some creative control.
To clarify, I said Activision because they are the publishers of CoD - For reasons that might be obvious to many, given the fantasy qoute that succeded it. I've got no opinion on the probable identity of suitors, I don't think there ever will be any suitors, and because of that I think it's unproductive to speculate on suitors. UWE is going to finish this game.
If a tree runs out of water, does it die? It drops it's leaves first, one by one, until there's nothing left. Only then, without anymore water, does it die. But that tree can grow again, right from out of the ashes.
UWE won't stop making NS2 as long as max is chained up to his development box :P maybe once he gets skinny enough from malnourishment, he can slip out of the manacles and escape ;)
I'm just hoping it won't take like another 2 years or so to get the game finally out. I have been keeping NS2 on my radar since we got the email from Flayra that NS2 was finally official. I have also tried to "forget" NS2 so that the wait wouldn't be so tiresome. Now after the game went beta I was powerless and my hopes jumped up again. Got all my old buddies hyped up too.
Don't think the finance will be a problem. But if problems occure UWE will surely send a distress beacon or some public call for help before it's too late. :)
<!--quoteo(post=1820366:date=Dec 31 2010, 07:13 AM:name=Mkilbride)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mkilbride @ Dec 31 2010, 07:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820366"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If DI gets shelved, then I will be shocked, because in 2006, their whole reasoning for making their own Engine was Source couldn't do DI, hence they wanted their own Engine so it could do what they wanted, easier.
It'd kinda be liked...defeating the purpose. But yeah man, If I hit the lotto for like 50 million, like 30 million after taxes, I'd donate them probably 250,000-500,000. Why so little compared to how much I'd get? Well, there are alot of Indie devs I like, and Mod devs I like, that I'd want to give money too, also, but of course I'd keep the majority for myself.(I'm no saint.)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Your lotto isn't tax-free? ###### that.
What kind of budget is necessary, from this point on, for the development of a game? From this point on, isn't it "time is money"? Do they have to license anything, buy any tools?
<!--quoteo(post=1820454:date=Dec 31 2010, 07:24 AM:name=Warmonger)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Warmonger @ Dec 31 2010, 07:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820454"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think if it came to something like that it would more than likely be Valve absorbing UWE and finishing the game. The downside to that is the devs wouldn't make as much $$$ and would lose some creative control.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What? They've loose money, and creative control? This simply isn't true. They've have more funding, and I kid you not when I saw they'd make probably 5x the sales they'll make normally. Valve can work magic like that.
L4D was just an indie project, absorbed, and they got to make an epic game that is insanely popular. I had never heard of L4D until Valve picked up Turtle Rock Studios. And no, Turtle Rock was not let go because of money; they were let go because they had the idea for L4D2 so soon after L4D1. You can even find interviews of Gabe moaning over how it was a bad idea, and not Valves style, to release sequels to suddenly. So that caused alot of ######.
By the fact that NS1 was a HL1 mod and they have their routes, and mainly, all of their fans come from the HL community, I think a Partnership from Valve could only help them out.
I have several friends who aren't willing to commit because the game has been delayed pretty much two years, the talk about how big a task it was and they didn't know, and how short they are on money. IT scares them the game will come out broken, and the community for the game will be small. Another nitpick is the 35$.
35$ seems alot for the game, even when fully made. Most Indie games with MP only go for 15-25$. 35$ is approaching the SP + MP + High production value section. Only reason I got it, was cause the two for one deal, and we could go half in on it, I wouldn't have got it other-wise. @ 35$, it's too much. They'll make more per sale, but if they lowered the cost, they'd sell more in Volume to make up for it.
Not alot of people are willing to buy a Indie game from little known developers, and every site that posts about it saying how it's late, and the devs are struggling. Makes putting down 35$ really tough for people, I think alot of negative PR is going out about stuff like this.
And then to learn that DI, the reason they made their own Engine, isn't in, in 2011(In like 14 hours), when it should have been in, in like 2008 / 2009...and that every fansite for the game posts this information, it scares people away.
Now like I said, the two for one deal...should never go away. That, or half the price on the game normally, or just put it for 20$, and sell in volume.(How it was originally, 35$ is crazy to ask for this) Think Killing Floor, successful Indie game based on a mod made around the same time as yours, small player-base, but nicely reviewed and fun...but it was 20$. And it has more weapons, and more enemy types. Sure, the gameplay is nowhere near as complex, but most people don't look at that.
I just think they need a major re-write of their practices, because as you can see by this situation, their current aren't working.
It is a shame that the social networking PR isn't as positive and information filled as possible; something I've mentioned on these boards before which helped Notch out with Minecraft a great deal was spending time on Twitter.
It is a shame as the information released on FB, Twitter seems a bit cold and informative. I think we need a friendly voice to help, everyone is impressed by the girl that smiles at the checkout, not the girl that looks at you like you're dirt.
Yes, NS2HD showing everything running perfectly when game plays horribly most of the time. :> I like that kind of PR especially when they see current state on their own.
Mkilbride said mostly what I wanted to say: from what you can see (even from carefully directed videos) there is not enough value done to buy it for $35 (assuming totally new person that wasn't a fan of NS1). I hope that adding it into the game will go smoothly (for instance Onos).
I'm happy to have pitched in my $35, even though I wouldn't have if not for the sale. Unknown Worlds should look into doing the half-price preorder deal. This game needs to pick up all the steam it can get.
This is why "behind closed doors" is usually behind closed doors :/ As someone that's been through the venture and development process- there is never enough money and there is never enough time in these projects. Half Life was published after they ran out of money. NS2 is infact a reasonably well financed project, particularly if you include the PR/Advertising bump from the popularity of the first game, steam and Gabe Newell already knowing of and liking this project.
90% of the hardstuff is done. Everything is in place. Stop worrying. They have to make it good now. Fun and accessible.
<!--quoteo(post=1820598:date=Dec 31 2010, 07:35 PM:name=t1337Dude)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (t1337Dude @ Dec 31 2010, 07:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820598"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm happy to have pitched in my $35, even though I wouldn't have if not for the sale. Unknown Worlds should look into doing the half-price preorder deal. This game needs to pick up all the steam it can get.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> i see what you did there.
<!--quoteo(post=1820583:date=Jan 1 2011, 04:59 AM:name=PaiSand)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PaiSand @ Jan 1 2011, 04:59 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820583"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You're wrong.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Made me lol. Well played, sir.
<!--quoteo(post=1820585:date=Jan 1 2011, 05:50 AM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Jan 1 2011, 05:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820585"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It is a shame as the information released on FB, Twitter seems a bit cold and informative. I think we need a friendly voice to help, everyone is impressed by the girl that smiles at the checkout, not the girl that looks at you like you're dirt.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think I'd feel uncomfortable if Flayra or Max smiled at me, but you know...
<!--quoteo(post=1820604:date=Jan 1 2011, 08:51 AM:name=_Thresh_)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (_Thresh_ @ Jan 1 2011, 08:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820604"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->90% of the hardstuff is done. Everything is in place. Stop worrying. They have to make it good now. Fun and accessible.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think 90% is optimistic (they're still working on the hard stuff now), but otherwise, I agree.
What's with all this "It's barely worth the money?"
I went in half and half with a friend because of the deal but to be honest the reason I pre-ordered is that I got access to beta. Even if the sale hadn't been going, it would have been instant pre-order.
Talking about value, NS2 seems to have much more value than any of the CoD clones. When you factor in that there are 4 different ways to play the game. Marine commander, marine FPS, alien commander, and alien FPS all offer unique experiences versus what? Play barbie with your soldier on CoD?
And if they were to be absorbed it would best to be absorbed by Valve as the game would have little to nothing altered, that's part of what makes Valve great. They see a great game, a struggling developer and help them out and put out a great game.
And I'm pretty sure alot of the L4D1 staff worked on L4D2.
InsaneAnomalyJoin Date: 2002-05-13Member: 605Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
<!--quoteo(post=1820366:date=Dec 30 2010, 11:13 PM:name=Mkilbride)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mkilbride @ Dec 30 2010, 11:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820366"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If DI gets shelved, then I will be shocked, because in 2006, their whole reasoning for making their own Engine was Source couldn't do DI, hence they wanted their own Engine so it could do what they wanted, easier.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The decision to move to a new engine was made for a lot of reasons, not one particular one, and as far as I'm aware, DI wasn't a dealbreaker (it was originally set up to work over BSP geometry after all).
The main reason for the switch was far more centred around development processes than anything else. Areas like level design or the model pipeline are so much more streamlined than they would have been otherwise. There are always hitches, but I think everyone's finding development to be a more straightforward affair now that we have complete control over how the game works. For myself, I've never come across a level design tool that was more easy and fun to use than the Spark editor. Of course there are bugs, but because it's in-house these things can be fixed so much more easily.
Can we lock this thread already? I think many people forgot charlie's level of dedication to his project. This is his monastic mona lisa. He's not gonna give up.
<!--quoteo(post=1820633:date=Jan 1 2011, 03:34 AM:name=Tig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tig @ Jan 1 2011, 03:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820633"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Can we lock this thread already? I think many people forgot charlie's level of dedication to his project. This is his monastic mona lisa. He's not gonna give up.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I actually enjoy that this thread is floating around. Most forums I go to, a thread like this would be locked at an instant - it's nice to have free speculation.
<!--quoteo(post=1820631:date=Jan 1 2011, 03:31 AM:name=Insane)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Insane @ Jan 1 2011, 03:31 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820631"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've never come across a level design tool that was more easy and fun to use than the Spark editor<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He's actually right. It's pretty damn simple and really easy to go back to as opposed to Unity, UT3/UDK & Source.
@Mkilbride: I'm not sure why you are raving about the cost of NS2. Personally I didn't pay a cent for NS2. I gladly payed 40$ for the countless hours I played NS1 and UWE was nice enough to send me a key for NS2 and some black marine armour. Frankly I don't care what other Indie developers charge for their games as long as there are non-indie games out there charging 60$ for a game that isn't worth DVD its pressed on.
Any spelling and/or grammar mistakes you find are your's to keep. It's 4:30 am, I'm pretty drunk and happy new year to everyone.
<!--quoteo(post=1820671:date=Jan 1 2011, 06:29 AM:name=Shiriki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shiriki @ Jan 1 2011, 06:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820671"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->@Mkilbride: I'm not sure why you are raving about the cost of NS2. Personally I didn't pay a cent for NS2. I gladly payed 40$ for the countless hours I played NS1 and UWE was nice enough to send me a key for NS2 and some black marine armour. Frankly I don't care what other Indie developers charge for their games as long as there are non-indie games out there charging 60$ for a game that isn't worth DVD its pressed on.
Any spelling and/or grammar mistakes you find are your's to keep. It's 4:30 am, I'm pretty drunk and happy new year to everyone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know, but I'm saying the general public is not going to pay 35$ for an Indie game that only has MP. It doesn't matter if it's varied or not. I agree CoD sucks and is not worth the discs it's printed on.(It used to be, before COD4).
And I'm sorry, but I honestly do not think NS2 has enough value to warrant 35$. Even with everything you're supposed to put in-game, it's still not alot. Less weapons than NS1, less buildings, the same Aliens, infact, with removed abilities.(Onos consume).
20$ is a great price for NS2, but 35$ is breaking onto the high tier bracket. You're not offering alot of variety for 35$. Can't compare it's value to COD, COD sells based off it's popularity.
NS2 has to sell off it's features, at current, the planned features included aren't worth 35$. Yes, I know that sounds offensive, but I honestly believe that it is not a 35$ game, at most, 25$. Half the average game.
It's a Indie game by an Indie studio, but they're trying to out-put a AAA title. Admirable, but from information released, it seems to not be working out that well for them.(Push backs, broken game, technical issues, low funding.)
NS2 needs to have something that really makes it a great value for it's money. The default gameplay it has right now is like a 1:1 copy of NS1, and while I get this is NS2, you need to innovate a little bit. Keep the core obviously, but add on to it with new features.
Also, the maps are SO small for a modern day Engine, and I get it's supposed to be like that, but still ,we need more open, more dynamic areas. Good thing about the Map Editor though, the community can hopefully fix that. (Hopefully the Engine can handle large, open areas)
The main problem right now is every NS2 game is alike. No variety, there are no changing moments. You play one match, the next will be the same, the only thing that changes is either you win or loose. There aren't any breath-taking moments, or intense "Oh ######, lmao!" moments, or any "I'm badass" moments.
I dunno, 35$ is alot, I get that they're hurt for money, and have put alot into this, their hearts and creative minds. That it's all riding on this, but still. The content is not equal to the cost.
I am having alot of fun playing the beta, yeah, I log an hour or so in every day and it's great, but every game just progress the same; you have a great Marine commander and stomp the Aliens, or you have a ###### Marine commander and get owned.
Natural Selection was unique, and innovative when it first came out. Way back when, it's 2010(almost 2011), and it's innovations have been done time and time again and are no longer so "unique", as they were, so the game needs more selling points.
Comments
Sir I do enjoy scary games, books or movies, and I usually do not get nightmares from them because they are fantasy.
However that fact you specifically mentioned Activision of all companies frightens me to the core. You didn't say "faceless company", you named them, giving credence to the possibility that such a deal would take place.
So I beg of you, please keep the scary stuff in fantasyland, I don't want nightmares.
Activision don't make 'bad' games. They make mainstream games which are pretty popular and sell very well, even if their practices and staff treatment has been reported in the media to be quite unusual and harsh to certain development staff in the past year.
Don't know what the laws are in the US, but here in Australia any money won on a gameshow, lotto, competition etc is TAX FREE 8-D. Now all I have to do is win something, lol.
I still think Valve would easily buy them up; it's part of their routes as a HL mod, it'd be profitable for Valve and UWE, and Valve is already helping them. Getting a little funding from Valve to top off the job, along with technical help, could only benefit UWE.
From the studios that were absorbed by Valve, they've said they're allowed to retain their identity, not the name, of course, they're Valve now, but they said nothing changed but their budget and access to tech.
I think if it came to something like that it would more than likely be Valve absorbing UWE and finishing the game. The downside to that is the devs wouldn't make as much $$$ and would lose some creative control.
Derp.
Don't think the finance will be a problem. But if problems occure UWE will surely send a distress beacon or some public call for help before it's too late. :)
It'd kinda be liked...defeating the purpose. But yeah man, If I hit the lotto for like 50 million, like 30 million after taxes, I'd donate them probably 250,000-500,000. Why so little compared to how much I'd get? Well, there are alot of Indie devs I like, and Mod devs I like, that I'd want to give money too, also, but of course I'd keep the majority for myself.(I'm no saint.)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your lotto isn't tax-free? ###### that.
What kind of budget is necessary, from this point on, for the development of a game? From this point on, isn't it "time is money"? Do they have to license anything, buy any tools?
What? They've loose money, and creative control? This simply isn't true. They've have more funding, and I kid you not when I saw they'd make probably 5x the sales they'll make normally. Valve can work magic like that.
L4D was just an indie project, absorbed, and they got to make an epic game that is insanely popular. I had never heard of L4D until Valve picked up Turtle Rock Studios. And no, Turtle Rock was not let go because of money; they were let go because they had the idea for L4D2 so soon after L4D1. You can even find interviews of Gabe moaning over how it was a bad idea, and not Valves style, to release sequels to suddenly. So that caused alot of ######.
By the fact that NS1 was a HL1 mod and they have their routes, and mainly, all of their fans come from the HL community, I think a Partnership from Valve could only help them out.
I have several friends who aren't willing to commit because the game has been delayed pretty much two years, the talk about how big a task it was and they didn't know, and how short they are on money. IT scares them the game will come out broken, and the community for the game will be small. Another nitpick is the 35$.
35$ seems alot for the game, even when fully made. Most Indie games with MP only go for 15-25$. 35$ is approaching the SP + MP + High production value section. Only reason I got it, was cause the two for one deal, and we could go half in on it, I wouldn't have got it other-wise. @ 35$, it's too much. They'll make more per sale, but if they lowered the cost, they'd sell more in Volume to make up for it.
Not alot of people are willing to buy a Indie game from little known developers, and every site that posts about it saying how it's late, and the devs are struggling. Makes putting down 35$ really tough for people, I think alot of negative PR is going out about stuff like this.
And then to learn that DI, the reason they made their own Engine, isn't in, in 2011(In like 14 hours), when it should have been in, in like 2008 / 2009...and that every fansite for the game posts this information, it scares people away.
Now like I said, the two for one deal...should never go away. That, or half the price on the game normally, or just put it for 20$, and sell in volume.(How it was originally, 35$ is crazy to ask for this) Think Killing Floor, successful Indie game based on a mod made around the same time as yours, small player-base, but nicely reviewed and fun...but it was 20$. And it has more weapons, and more enemy types. Sure, the gameplay is nowhere near as complex, but most people don't look at that.
I just think they need a major re-write of their practices, because as you can see by this situation, their current aren't working.
It is a shame that the social networking PR isn't as positive and information filled as possible; something I've mentioned on these boards before which helped Notch out with Minecraft a great deal was spending time on Twitter.
It is a shame as the information released on FB, Twitter seems a bit cold and informative. I think we need a friendly voice to help, everyone is impressed by the girl that smiles at the checkout, not the girl that looks at you like you're dirt.
Mkilbride said mostly what I wanted to say: from what you can see (even from carefully directed videos) there is not enough value done to buy it for $35 (assuming totally new person that wasn't a fan of NS1). I hope that adding it into the game will go smoothly (for instance Onos).
90% of the hardstuff is done. Everything is in place. Stop worrying. They have to make it good now. Fun and accessible.
i see what you did there.
Made me lol. Well played, sir.
<!--quoteo(post=1820585:date=Jan 1 2011, 05:50 AM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Jan 1 2011, 05:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820585"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It is a shame as the information released on FB, Twitter seems a bit cold and informative. I think we need a friendly voice to help, everyone is impressed by the girl that smiles at the checkout, not the girl that looks at you like you're dirt.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think I'd feel uncomfortable if Flayra or Max smiled at me, but you know...
<!--quoteo(post=1820604:date=Jan 1 2011, 08:51 AM:name=_Thresh_)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (_Thresh_ @ Jan 1 2011, 08:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1820604"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->90% of the hardstuff is done. Everything is in place. Stop worrying. They have to make it good now. Fun and accessible.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think 90% is optimistic (they're still working on the hard stuff now), but otherwise, I agree.
I went in half and half with a friend because of the deal but to be honest the reason I pre-ordered is that I got access to beta. Even if the sale hadn't been going, it would have been instant pre-order.
Talking about value, NS2 seems to have much more value than any of the CoD clones. When you factor in that there are 4 different ways to play the game. Marine commander, marine FPS, alien commander, and alien FPS all offer unique experiences versus what? Play barbie with your soldier on CoD?
And if they were to be absorbed it would best to be absorbed by Valve as the game would have little to nothing altered, that's part of what makes Valve great. They see a great game, a struggling developer and help them out and put out a great game.
And I'm pretty sure alot of the L4D1 staff worked on L4D2.
The decision to move to a new engine was made for a lot of reasons, not one particular one, and as far as I'm aware, DI wasn't a dealbreaker (it was originally set up to work over BSP geometry after all).
The main reason for the switch was far more centred around development processes than anything else. Areas like level design or the model pipeline are so much more streamlined than they would have been otherwise. There are always hitches, but I think everyone's finding development to be a more straightforward affair now that we have complete control over how the game works. For myself, I've never come across a level design tool that was more easy and fun to use than the Spark editor. Of course there are bugs, but because it's in-house these things can be fixed so much more easily.
I actually enjoy that this thread is floating around. Most forums I go to, a thread like this would be locked at an instant - it's nice to have free speculation.
He's actually right. It's pretty damn simple and really easy to go back to as opposed to Unity, UT3/UDK & Source.
I'm not sure why you are raving about the cost of NS2. Personally I didn't pay a cent for NS2. I gladly payed 40$ for the countless hours I played NS1 and UWE was nice enough to send me a key for NS2 and some black marine armour. Frankly I don't care what other Indie developers charge for their games as long as there are non-indie games out there charging 60$ for a game that isn't worth DVD its pressed on.
Any spelling and/or grammar mistakes you find are your's to keep. It's 4:30 am, I'm pretty drunk and happy new year to everyone.
I'm not sure why you are raving about the cost of NS2. Personally I didn't pay a cent for NS2. I gladly payed 40$ for the countless hours I played NS1 and UWE was nice enough to send me a key for NS2 and some black marine armour. Frankly I don't care what other Indie developers charge for their games as long as there are non-indie games out there charging 60$ for a game that isn't worth DVD its pressed on.
Any spelling and/or grammar mistakes you find are your's to keep. It's 4:30 am, I'm pretty drunk and happy new year to everyone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know, but I'm saying the general public is not going to pay 35$ for an Indie game that only has MP. It doesn't matter if it's varied or not. I agree CoD sucks and is not worth the discs it's printed on.(It used to be, before COD4).
And I'm sorry, but I honestly do not think NS2 has enough value to warrant 35$. Even with everything you're supposed to put in-game, it's still not alot. Less weapons than NS1, less buildings, the same Aliens, infact, with removed abilities.(Onos consume).
20$ is a great price for NS2, but 35$ is breaking onto the high tier bracket. You're not offering alot of variety for 35$. Can't compare it's value to COD, COD sells based off it's popularity.
NS2 has to sell off it's features, at current, the planned features included aren't worth 35$. Yes, I know that sounds offensive, but I honestly believe that it is not a 35$ game, at most, 25$. Half the average game.
It's a Indie game by an Indie studio, but they're trying to out-put a AAA title. Admirable, but from information released, it seems to not be working out that well for them.(Push backs, broken game, technical issues, low funding.)
NS2 needs to have something that really makes it a great value for it's money. The default gameplay it has right now is like a 1:1 copy of NS1, and while I get this is NS2, you need to innovate a little bit. Keep the core obviously, but add on to it with new features.
Also, the maps are SO small for a modern day Engine, and I get it's supposed to be like that, but still ,we need more open, more dynamic areas. Good thing about the Map Editor though, the community can hopefully fix that. (Hopefully the Engine can handle large, open areas)
The main problem right now is every NS2 game is alike. No variety, there are no changing moments. You play one match, the next will be the same, the only thing that changes is either you win or loose. There aren't any breath-taking moments, or intense "Oh ######, lmao!" moments, or any "I'm badass" moments.
I dunno, 35$ is alot, I get that they're hurt for money, and have put alot into this, their hearts and creative minds. That it's all riding on this, but still. The content is not equal to the cost.
I am having alot of fun playing the beta, yeah, I log an hour or so in every day and it's great, but every game just progress the same; you have a great Marine commander and stomp the Aliens, or you have a ###### Marine commander and get owned.
Natural Selection was unique, and innovative when it first came out. Way back when, it's 2010(almost 2011), and it's innovations have been done time and time again and are no longer so "unique", as they were, so the game needs more selling points.