<!--quoteo(post=1997687:date=Oct 26 2012, 06:46 AM:name=nSidia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (nSidia @ Oct 26 2012, 06:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1997687"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well the way i understand it is there is res for killing. Plus once you get hives you get the abilities right away. So hypermutation would allow for some extreme versatility.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1999067:date=Oct 28 2012, 03:08 PM:name=Daphisto)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Daphisto @ Oct 28 2012, 03:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999067"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Makese sense! I would like to test this for sure.
When is the next NS2:C release due?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The patch will probably be released shortly after 1.0.
Dragon has been working on some major movement changes, I really can't wait to try them out in a real game :).
<!--quoteo(post=1999792:date=Oct 29 2012, 06:17 AM:name=Grissi)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Grissi @ Oct 29 2012, 06:17 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999792"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The patch will probably be released shortly after 1.0.
Dragon has been working on some major movement changes, I really can't wait to try them out in a real game :).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I am hoping to have a new version somewhat soon, both 224 and 225 have broken many things and really complicated the movement changes, which while almost there still have some serious bugs.
I also need to kick my sound guy to get him to do some changes.
<!--quoteo(post=2000024:date=Oct 29 2012, 11:30 AM:name=xDragon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xDragon @ Oct 29 2012, 11:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2000024"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yea I am hoping to have a new version somewhat soon, both 224 and 225 have broken many things and really complicated the movement changes, which while almost there still have some serious bugs.
I also need to kick my sound guy to get him to do some changes.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--coloro:#aadd00--><span style="color:#aadd00"><!--/coloro-->It's good just to hear what's going on, thanks. Speaking of which, have you had many offers to get more model work in? Or animation for that matter.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I might have a look into the map editor see if I can get working on recreations. I did alot of it a few years back (UT 2003/4 days) might be fun to get back into it
JektJoin Date: 2012-02-05Member: 143714Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yea I am hoping to have a new version somewhat soon<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i downloaded the ns2 classic mod from steam workshop. opened up game / mods / installed and activated the classic mod but i keep getting the "MOD ERROR"!!!!
anyone know how to resolve this issue please... i would be eternally grateful.
also is anyone else having the mod error message too???
Name: ArmoryChamber #2 Classic Test IP: 5.9.76.109:27025
I agree, this mod needs a custom game name, like "classic", so that you can easily filter them in the browser. To do this, simply include game_setup.xml in the mod root dir and change it to this:
Ive added and removed a custom gamesetup.xml like 100 times lol, there was alot of trouble with it in previous incarnations of workshop, i should test it again now to see if those are all resolved (i think they are).
JektJoin Date: 2012-02-05Member: 143714Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
edited November 2012
Not seeing any servers by sorting by game. If support for custom game tags is up to scratch I think it would be worthwhile to update the mod with the xml file.
Yea atm my servers do not show the classic tag instead of NS2 because DAK overrides the tag, something I need to find a solution to there.
Regarding the gameplay overall I am a little worried by the state of the hit registration since the moverate change, it is dramatically worse then the B223 builds of NS2c, and the faster movement speeds are showing the issues even worse (plus some strange animations lol lerk).
I will keep trying to populate servers to test what i can, but with lack of people and not being able to filter the game mode servers are hard to find!
I'm assuming you're aware of this, but current air control isn't remotely right - most of all accelerating forward requires you to hold w (under GoldSrc this causes you to stop accelerating forward) and doing it any other way doesn't even mimic air accel (strafe+turn works a bit for flying backwards but will take you mostly sideways if you try to accelerate forward by matching directions).
Haven't had a chance to play this on a populated server, but getting an fps-independent copy of GoldSrc movement running is probably pretty key to making anything feel like NS1.
My intent is not to recreate NS1 movement exactly, not holding W to bhop was one of the most confusing part of learning HL1's movement, and removing that restriction doesnt in anyway lower the skill ceiling. Same can be said for not having a queued jump system to remove the need for a +3jump script/mwheel. Not sure why people would want to recreate the flawed parts of gldsrc movement along with the good parts...
<!--quoteo(post=2013331:date=Nov 6 2012, 03:37 PM:name=xDragon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xDragon @ Nov 6 2012, 03:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2013331"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My intent is not to recreate NS1 movement exactly, not holding W to bhop was one of the most confusing part of learning HL1's movement, and removing that restriction doesnt in anyway lower the skill ceiling. Same can be said for not having a queued jump system to remove the need for a +3jump script/mwheel. Not sure why people would want to recreate the flawed parts of gldsrc movement along with the good parts...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The jumping is fine and sensible, that's a user interface matter - something like an inbuilt 5 jump would actually be a bit easier to use even.
But having to hold w (right now it is not an option at all) is not 'addressing a flaw' it's making it miles worse. With the fps and turn-rate finicky-ness of original GoldSrc movement almost completely eliminated, it's impossible to not pick up on how to air accelerate in the first place, you might as well have the real(-ish) thing in instead of some mess that makes nobody all that happy.
Not holding w is not exactly a flaw, it's more or less the core idea behind it. Creating a set of special rules with exceptions all over the place like "different air control activates if you strafe and hold forward, other rules apply in every other circumstance" is even less intuitive than the original and doesn't help folks in any way. The beauty of the real deal is that it's not one trick pony about just moving forwards faster - it is what you end up intuitively using for every single movement you make. It accelerates in whatever ###### way you can dream up on the basis of a very simple ruleset with no real exceptions.
I dont agree that not holding w makes it better, its move intuitive to use w and strafe/move your mouse to build speed, and provides a smoother learning curve. If you play the game as a walker skulk using w for forward, then have to learn to not use w, and use strafe and mouse movement to build your forward speed its quite a change, one that most people seemed to get hung up that I talked to, until they were explicitly told not to use forward.
Now I do think that how all the inputs blend together in NS2c is not as smooth as gldsrc, nor does it allow as much creative use of movement. I will admit however that movement code is not exactly my specialty so re-creating the movement has proved difficult.
<!--quoteo(post=2013473:date=Nov 6 2012, 05:43 PM:name=xDragon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xDragon @ Nov 6 2012, 05:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2013473"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I dont agree that not holding w makes it better, its move intuitive to use w and strafe/move your mouse to build speed, and provides a smoother learning curve. If you play the game as a walker skulk using w for forward, then have to learn to not use w, and use strafe and mouse movement to build your forward speed its quite a change, one that most people seemed to get hung up that I talked to, until they were explicitly told not to use forward.
Now I do think that how all the inputs blend together in NS2c is not as smooth as gldsrc, nor does it allow as much creative use of movement. I will admit however that movement code is not exactly my specialty so re-creating the movement has proved difficult.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The first part is simply not terribly true. Unless you literally have years of practice being bad at NS1 and holding +forward a lot, then sure - but starting from scratch or something close to it both systems seem equally arbitrary, but a full implementation of movement allows for a very long, smooth skillcurve and lots of things to pick up on while not jeopardizing entry-level at all. It literally takes 10 seconds of explaining one way or another.
Also, the biggest demographic for NS2C is folks who liked and were probably good at gldsrc - as in old competitive gamers (the real kind, who've all through beta & now already expressed their discontent with base NS2 - and who ironically still dominate ###### NS2) and providing a clumsier, watered down version pretty much alienates the most enthusiastic proponents of the idea of a classic mod. It's a niche thing that has potential to grow anyway - you're not going to magically attract every super-casual to a mod of a niche game by saying that a nearly-extinct movement mechanic is slightly different and easier if you're used to holding w a lot. There are a lot of folks that don't spend a ton of time posting (because by now most have moved on to compete in other games :/) that would love to see a good remake.
Why not just replicate goldsrc in more or less it's entirety, and then add a toggle/option for w presses to be ignored while in the air? Like I said, I'm all for accessibility, but movement is such an incredibly core thing and a huge selling point for a classic-remake, it would be a shame to skimp on it.
Comments
Makese sense! I would like to test this for sure.
When is the next NS2:C release due?
When is the next NS2:C release due?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The patch will probably be released shortly after 1.0.
Dragon has been working on some major movement changes, I really can't wait to try them out in a real game :).
Dragon has been working on some major movement changes, I really can't wait to try them out in a real game :).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
yeah i really wanna play again.
I also need to kick my sound guy to get him to do some changes.
I also need to kick my sound guy to get him to do some changes.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--coloro:#aadd00--><span style="color:#aadd00"><!--/coloro-->It's good just to hear what's going on, thanks. Speaking of which, have you had many offers to get more model work in? Or animation for that matter.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
:D!
opened up game / mods / installed and activated the classic mod but i keep getting the "MOD ERROR"!!!!
anyone know how to resolve this issue please... i would be eternally grateful.
also is anyone else having the mod error message too???
ty in advance.
least i know what it is then thx again
I posted the changelog here - <a href="http://www.ns2cmod.com/blog/" target="_blank">http://www.ns2cmod.com/blog/</a>
Hope to see more people playing now.
best ns1 ability ever
Name: ArmoryChamber #2 Classic Test
IP: 5.9.76.109:27025
I agree, this mod needs a custom game name, like "classic", so that you can easily filter them in the browser.
To do this, simply include game_setup.xml in the mod root dir and change it to this:
<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1--><game>
<name>classic</name>
<description>Natural Selection 2 Classic</description>
<client>lua/Client.lua</client>
<server>lua/Server.lua</server>
<loading>lua/Loading.lua</loading>
<soundinfo>sound/NS2.soundinfo</soundinfo>
</game><!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
(but I guess you know this already)
Also it seems like the whole workshop architecture has matured and it's very easy to keep stuff updated automatically especially on the server.
Regarding the gameplay overall I am a little worried by the state of the hit registration since the moverate change, it is dramatically worse then the B223 builds of NS2c, and the faster movement speeds are showing the issues even worse (plus some strange animations lol lerk).
Haven't had a chance to play this on a populated server, but getting an fps-independent copy of GoldSrc movement running is probably pretty key to making anything feel like NS1.
The jumping is fine and sensible, that's a user interface matter - something like an inbuilt 5 jump would actually be a bit easier to use even.
But having to hold w (right now it is not an option at all) is not 'addressing a flaw' it's making it miles worse. With the fps and turn-rate finicky-ness of original GoldSrc movement almost completely eliminated, it's impossible to not pick up on how to air accelerate in the first place, you might as well have the real(-ish) thing in instead of some mess that makes nobody all that happy.
Not holding w is not exactly a flaw, it's more or less the core idea behind it. Creating a set of special rules with exceptions all over the place like "different air control activates if you strafe and hold forward, other rules apply in every other circumstance" is even less intuitive than the original and doesn't help folks in any way. The beauty of the real deal is that it's not one trick pony about just moving forwards faster - it is what you end up intuitively using for every single movement you make. It accelerates in whatever ###### way you can dream up on the basis of a very simple ruleset with no real exceptions.
Now I do think that how all the inputs blend together in NS2c is not as smooth as gldsrc, nor does it allow as much creative use of movement. I will admit however that movement code is not exactly my specialty so re-creating the movement has proved difficult.
I didn't notice any hitreg issues, then again I had 300 ping.
Now I do think that how all the inputs blend together in NS2c is not as smooth as gldsrc, nor does it allow as much creative use of movement. I will admit however that movement code is not exactly my specialty so re-creating the movement has proved difficult.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The first part is simply not terribly true. Unless you literally have years of practice being bad at NS1 and holding +forward a lot, then sure - but starting from scratch or something close to it both systems seem equally arbitrary, but a full implementation of movement allows for a very long, smooth skillcurve and lots of things to pick up on while not jeopardizing entry-level at all. It literally takes 10 seconds of explaining one way or another.
Also, the biggest demographic for NS2C is folks who liked and were probably good at gldsrc - as in old competitive gamers (the real kind, who've all through beta & now already expressed their discontent with base NS2 - and who ironically still dominate ###### NS2) and providing a clumsier, watered down version pretty much alienates the most enthusiastic proponents of the idea of a classic mod. It's a niche thing that has potential to grow anyway - you're not going to magically attract every super-casual to a mod of a niche game by saying that a nearly-extinct movement mechanic is slightly different and easier if you're used to holding w a lot. There are a lot of folks that don't spend a ton of time posting (because by now most have moved on to compete in other games :/) that would love to see a good remake.
Why not just replicate goldsrc in more or less it's entirety, and then add a toggle/option for w presses to be ignored while in the air? Like I said, I'm all for accessibility, but movement is such an incredibly core thing and a huge selling point for a classic-remake, it would be a shame to skimp on it.