9v9 and up Marines get 2 IP's
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Oregon Join Date: 2013-11-20 Member: 189469Members, Reinforced - Silver
Oregon Join Date: 2013-11-20 Member: 189469Members, Reinforced - Silver
Title says it all. I think that when there are 9 or more players on a team, the marines should have two infantry portals by default
Comments
EDIT: Hm I misread the OP. I thought this was yet another thread where someone was telling people to build 2 IPs on high populous servers.
I also pay attention to marine macro positioning near the start and if I see a gap where skulks could have skulked through to come and bite IPs I'll ask a team member or spawner to remain vigilant to protect the single IP. If experience leads me to believe marine positioning is going to be terrible, I'll build a 2nd IP no matter what
The trouble is for both of those by the time you see the problem it's too late. If you have 5 people in a spawn queue near the beginning of the game you are going to quickly end up WAY behind. If a large group of skulks have found a way through to your base then by the time anyone gets back it will be too late (usually skulk rush means no dead marines or engagements of any kind).
The point of having only 1 IP is to balance the game--to add a much greater element of risk to marine pressure.
A marine, in nearly every situation, has the advantage versus a skulk. To balance this, they have queued spawns via IPs rather than simultaneous spawns via eggs. Skulks die much easier, ergo they must spawn quicker (and in greater number, if necessary). Marines are more durable, though the wait-time to spawn balances this out; thus, marines must risk backing-up the spawn queue if too many of them want to be Rambo and fail (which is normally the case in pubs).
TL;DR: Multiple IPs are only necessary if your marines cannot stay alive.
Actually, you could recycle your starting IP and still win the game if none of your marines die the entire game...
You're misunderstanding- I anticipate the eventual need for a 2nd IP and react accordingly before it becomes a problem. 5 people in the spawn queue would be way too many so I don't understand why you suddenly bumped up the number I gave originally?
3 people dead is within the realms of possibility for a 6v6 let alone a 10v10. If I see more than that dying I stick a second IP down. It's not too late unless everyone else dies in the time it takes to build an IP which is a) unlikely and b) if your whole team dies you were probably going to lose even with 10 IPs.
You're making a lot of assumptions in your post and ignoring what you could be taking as helpful advice to better your own game.
For e.g.
"If a large group of skulks have found a way through to your base then by the time anyone gets back it will be too late"
This is why you dont send your whole team miles away from base at the start of the game. See casanovax's post above about marine pressure tradeoff.
If 4 people are waiting to spawn for 10 seconds it would mean there is at least a 5th blocking them by currently spawning. Tends to happen when your team splits in half at the start and then one side encounters virtually the entire enemy team. Nearly instantly goes from no one dead to oh shit game over.
You're still misquoting me. Stop with the straw men already.
4 people showing as dead in the scoreboard = 4 people dead, of which one will be currently spawning.
Why are you still posting as if base rush = instant win with no counter? And still ignoring the rest of my post?
You clearly don't want to make reasonable concessions to your issues so this will be my last post addressed to you.
If you dont send your team to the other side of the map there's almost always more than enough time to get back to base and shoot the skulks off of your IP/CC. Again, read post above regarding aggression/security tradeoff.
12 skulks can kill a CC in 3 seconds. Obviously it would only be 11 skulks at most but that's still really really fast. Marines wouldn't even make it back from your natural extractor in time to save the base if the enemy team managed to bypass them on the way there. A beacon wouldn't work either even assuming you built an obs already. Oh, I also didn't say anything about a base rush in my second post.
Respawns take 8 seconds, so I'll say again if 4 people have been dead for 10 seconds then there MUST have been a 5th. Even 4 is going to set you back a ways. You can't anticipate needing an IP if this is happening in the first engagement of the game, all you can do is guess and maybe make some assumptions based on players in the game you've met before or greens.
So yeah that's pretty much where it comes down to. All you can really do is gamble one way or the other and either choice is going to cost you dearly (20 res at round start for something you may not need...) Not that an IP will do much good if you get base rushed, that's more about putting your marines in the right positions and getting lucky about which way the aliens come from.
I try to get a second IP up just after we have phase gates built, which is when people normally start dying. If your players are weaker and all die at once before 2 IPs there's not much you can do but accept the penalty and drop the IP earlier, putting you further behind.
OR if I see one side has completely died. (Which usually results in 4 or more dead).
Because with 20 res. That's armor1 or weapon1 a couple minutes earlier. Or 2/3 of the cost to get phase tech (armory/obs)
Okay, so in this scenario 11 skulks went up one side of the map, wiped your entire expansion team (4 to 5 marines) without taking a single casualty. Where is the rest of your team? This is when you call your marines (at least a few) back to base, I mean you have 6-7 marines pressuring the other side. They should be at least on their way back if not in base well before the 11 skulks start biting the CC or IP. And if they can clear your whole team without taking casualties... then you were going to lose anyway.
You defend a rush by anticipating it, not reacting to it.
Alternativally, they could aim. At weapons zero a marine has enough ammunition to kill five and a half fresh skulks if they land all their shots on the assualt rifle, and then they have a pistol.
So aliens never win any games?
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U 2 need to discus aggression.
0n topic, i think marines have right to try base rush at no cost just like skulks
So over 9 players 2 ip are must anyway . So mine vote is YES !
Yeah , becuze spawn killing take lot skill, lol , and it is fair lol. It is cheap way to win , few sculks , spawn killing for win early in game. U really need to think out side of box (this game)
if u want new ideas and beter game.
What Nexus said isn't really logical in this game. Even in comp, a second IP is almost always a must early game. This is part of the tech path for marines though. No matter how many players you have on a server, you should still need to be able to spend team res to build a second or third IP.