Does the bio 9 ability contaminate have any effect on the lighting?
I know this isn't what you were asking, but that's an interesting idea:
Make Biomass Level affect the light change?
The gradiation to darkness would increase gradually to it's current state as a hive's level increased. This could also be matched up with maturity, but I like the intentionality of biomass. Perhaps it could even be per-hive. So the rooms connected to a Bio3 hive would be darker than the rooms connected to a Bio1 hive. I think the darkest should be slightly lighter than the current darkest, and then three distinct steps before that for each level.
This would slightly decrease the effect while marines are still weaker, and increase the effect as aliens grew stronger, which hopefully is when marines are getting stronger too. Additionally, if the hive-specific idea goes in, it would be a way for Marines to tell whether they're encroaching on a higher level hive or a lower one, while simultaneously making it easier for aliens to defend a higher level hive.
We could use a performance log of your FPS issues with the new lighting, such as the scenario in those screenshots you posted.
Please type p_logall in the console and then after you've captured the low fps (and back to high fps once again) type p_endlog.
You'll find the *.plog file in the same place as your log.txt : %appdata%/Natural selection 2/
... please zip up the file and link it here or PM @McGlaspie or myself.
Thanks!
While I think this change won't have much negative outcome, I fail to see the positive outcomes vs time invested. (unless this didn't take much work at all)
Blah blah standard me feedback basically saying why u no work on something more impactful
Fixing the awful hissing/feedback in the tutorial voice would go a long way in making it seem more professional imo.
Yeah, i can't really see this as anything but an alien buff unfortunately, however slight. Unless AV was changed significantly to where it really only works in the dark, even then it wouldn't affect aliens any more than pressing one button when crossing certain thresholds.
I guess the best way to approach this is to leave it as simple as it is now, just with a slightly reduced effect, and chalk it up to atmosphere change with a slight balance effect.
You ask that, but I've seen marine's perfomance increase rapidly once they research exosuits. I think they are currently quite underappreciated, and pretty scary to a lonely onos.
Of course you gotta have someone to actually weld you...
With my terrible eyesight, I'm having a lot of trouble seeing skulks in darkened areas. But I don't care - the changes look cool, and I'm a sucker for cool-looking stuff. Good work.
With my terrible eyesight, I'm having a lot of trouble seeing skulks in darkened areas. But I don't care - the changes look cool, and I'm a sucker for cool-looking stuff. Good work.
Did you try upping your gamma in the graphics settings?
With my terrible eyesight, I'm having a lot of trouble seeing skulks in darkened areas. But I don't care - the changes look cool, and I'm a sucker for cool-looking stuff. Good work.
Did you try upping your gamma in the graphics settings?
Yeah it's all the way up using the ns2 settings, but I can still mess around with my graphics card settings. Maybe that will do it.
great job! lighting looks sick imo, hopped into a 70 min game and speccd the map out with alien on 3 hive to marine 2 tech point on summit so i got to see how the lighting varies in map control and it looks very cool, cant wait to see how dark it looks on some other rooms like in mineshaft/eclipse
Shitty dark room, I need mroe light, oh cysts provide light, i dont want to kill cysts in rooms any more because it actually makes the game harder on marines by darkening the room.
So you make things harder to see anyway and then it makes me not want to play the game properly and decyst rooms because it actually makes the room better for marines to fight in because it's well lit?
But I'll get ignored because it makes rookies happy who don't understand the gameplay of ns2 anyway. Lets not spend time developing changes for the competitive community. Probably because they get annoyed at the hard work. Yet you force every change upon us without even thinking about it from the long term player pov.
Mendasp and Dragon are done seemingly fixing shit things in this game so if UWE doesn't step up they'll lose both their long-term players and the rookies they cant keep playing anyway.
Shitty dark room, I need mroe light, oh cysts provide light, i dont want to kill cysts in rooms any more because it actually makes the game harder on marines by darkening the room.
So you make things harder to see anyway and then it makes me not want to play the game properly and decyst rooms because it actually makes the room better for marines to fight in because it's well lit?
But I'll get ignored because it makes rookies happy who don't understand the gameplay of ns2 anyway. Lets not spend time developing changes for the competitive community. Probably because they get annoyed at the hard work. Yet you force every change upon us without even thinking about it from the long term player pov.
Mendasp and Dragon are done seemingly fixing shit things in this game so if UWE doesn't step up they'll lose both their long-term players and the rookies they cant keep playing anyway.
If you're having such a hissy fit about not being able to see, Turn on your flashlight, build the power node, decyst the room, have the commander scan the room for you, and bring an Exo and have him turn on his UNENDING BEAM OF HOLY GLORY.
@Cr4zyb4st4rd Dude, right click your desktop. Graphics Properties. Display. Color. Find the slider labeled 'Gamma' and crank it up to 1.5 or so. It takes literally 5 clicks to fix this issue, which is far less time than it probably took you type up that enormous wall of negative vibes.
i dont want to kill cysts in rooms any more because it actually makes the game harder on marines by darkening the room.
What?
Killing the cysts in the room actually brightens the room, not darkens it?
If you're killing just one cyst then you're doing it wrong and if there's more cysts in the room still then it's still alien territory soooo... working as intended?
Also, you can build a powernode or use your improved flashlight?
I use default brightness and gamma for both my monitor and in game and Haven't had an issue yet.
Makes me wonder how it's too dark for some people, (esp those jacking up their settings) or if it's just hyperbole; is it really pitch darkness to you, or are you able to see still but it's just more difficult now?
twilitebluebug stalkerJoin Date: 2003-02-04Member: 13116Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Some of the maps like Kodiak will need significant lighting reworks. There are ugly stripes of black shadows mixed with bright environmental lights when power goes out.
So mst linked some screenshots of this change. While I like the IDEA behind the change, I don't like how it's implemented. It's wrong.
Rooms are defined by power node grids. Your change utilizes that for this affect. As you can see in mst's screenshot, we placed ONE cyst on the VERY edge of computer lab at flight control. This caused ALL of computer labs to go dark, all the way back to comp lab. Some rooms are VERY big, and one cyst can "claim" a LARGE swathe of territory (depending on the map).
I don't think that making this mechanic so dependent on map layout is the 'right' way to go.
Sure, you can counter argue by saying "all you have to do is build the power" or "find the cyst and kill it!". But you have to again think from the new player perspective, or other players who don't know that this mechanic works the way I just pointed out - they're going to be really confused about why a room is dark. It's going to take someone who knows to tell them "oh, well there's an alien structure somewhere in this room" and "oh a room is defined by a grid that defines where the room is powered and where it's not powered.
It's an unnecessarily long thing to explain and it's not intuitive like users would expect (which is that only NEAR the alien structures does it get dark).
I imagine this was the EASIEST way to do it, and on most maps or situations, it works, but there are many cases that its going to create a negative AND confusing experience for your consumers (playerbase).
i dont want to kill cysts in rooms any more because it actually makes the game harder on marines by darkening the room.
What?
Killing the cysts in the room actually brightens the room, not darkens it?
If you're killing just one cyst then you're doing it wrong and if there's more cysts in the room still then it's still alien territory soooo... working as intended?
Also, you can build a powernode or use your improved flashlight?
I use default brightness and gamma for both my monitor and in game and Haven't had an issue yet.
Makes me wonder how it's too dark for some people, (esp those jacking up their settings) or if it's just hyperbole; is it really pitch darkness to you, or are you able to see still but it's just more difficult now?
So am I supposed to clear an entire room of 5+ cysts before I do anything at all now? If an alien comes along i'll just keep killing cysts so I can see it better eventually.
Flashlights are specific use and even then aren't great.
NS2 has always been dark, more so than other games, people have been gamma boosting before the lackluster gamma option was in the menu, the game is even darker now, which makes no sense.
NS2 has always been dark, more so than other games, people have been gamma boosting before the lackluster gamma option was in the menu, the game is even darker now, which makes no sense.
People who value getting competitive advantages (or if you prefer: avoiding competitive disadvantages) over immersion have always jacked up their gamma and turned down the graphics detail to reduce any possible distraction, and they'll continue doing so. Don't act like those changes are more cumberstome to a competitive player than moving the gamma slider by one or two pixels while ignoring all other aspects of what they have already customized and turned off, making the way they play and see the game frankly quite different to what the average rookie with default settings is used to.
Immersion and competitive gaming are not compatible imho., but they don't have to be. This is targeted at casuals, and from an immersion perspective, I think the changes are awesome. If those changes really affect gameplay in a noticeable way... NSL mod will revert them pretty soon.
Thing is... most comp players already have high gamma. Much higher than default. Boosting it even more doesn't do much at all.
This is similar to rich infestation. It's really cool. It's pretty to look at but as far as a gameplay aspect, it doesn't do much for people who want to be competitive. Like the infestation setting, this atmospheric lighting should have an on/off toggle so everyone can be happy.
P.S. This would stop Cr4zy's whining as well. Everyone would be happy.
=If those changes really affect gameplay in a noticeable way... NSL mod will revert them pretty soon.
Pretty sure people are done fixing UWE's shit for no thanks.
As josh says, why it cant just be a simple toggle is beyond me, like EVERY new feature it's instantly forced on everyone and a lot of people don't care for it.
Comments
I know this isn't what you were asking, but that's an interesting idea:
Make Biomass Level affect the light change?
The gradiation to darkness would increase gradually to it's current state as a hive's level increased. This could also be matched up with maturity, but I like the intentionality of biomass. Perhaps it could even be per-hive. So the rooms connected to a Bio3 hive would be darker than the rooms connected to a Bio1 hive. I think the darkest should be slightly lighter than the current darkest, and then three distinct steps before that for each level.
This would slightly decrease the effect while marines are still weaker, and increase the effect as aliens grew stronger, which hopefully is when marines are getting stronger too. Additionally, if the hive-specific idea goes in, it would be a way for Marines to tell whether they're encroaching on a higher level hive or a lower one, while simultaneously making it easier for aliens to defend a higher level hive.
It'll be impossible to see what's going on throughout the alien half of the map!
Makes alien vision more useful.
Looks better, especially with alien structures producing their own light.
Adds a whole new atmosphere and mood.
Its just.. excellent
We could use a performance log of your FPS issues with the new lighting, such as the scenario in those screenshots you posted.
Please type p_logall in the console and then after you've captured the low fps (and back to high fps once again) type p_endlog.
You'll find the *.plog file in the same place as your log.txt : %appdata%/Natural selection 2/
... please zip up the file and link it here or PM @McGlaspie or myself.
Thanks!
Blah blah standard me feedback basically saying why u no work on something more impactful
Fixing the awful hissing/feedback in the tutorial voice would go a long way in making it seem more professional imo.
Yeah, i can't really see this as anything but an alien buff unfortunately, however slight. Unless AV was changed significantly to where it really only works in the dark, even then it wouldn't affect aliens any more than pressing one button when crossing certain thresholds.
I guess the best way to approach this is to leave it as simple as it is now, just with a slightly reduced effect, and chalk it up to atmosphere change with a slight balance effect.
What's an Exosuit?
You ask that, but I've seen marine's perfomance increase rapidly once they research exosuits. I think they are currently quite underappreciated, and pretty scary to a lonely onos.
Of course you gotta have someone to actually weld you...
Yeah it's all the way up using the ns2 settings, but I can still mess around with my graphics card settings. Maybe that will do it.
So you make things harder to see anyway and then it makes me not want to play the game properly and decyst rooms because it actually makes the room better for marines to fight in because it's well lit?
But I'll get ignored because it makes rookies happy who don't understand the gameplay of ns2 anyway. Lets not spend time developing changes for the competitive community. Probably because they get annoyed at the hard work. Yet you force every change upon us without even thinking about it from the long term player pov.
Mendasp and Dragon are done seemingly fixing shit things in this game so if UWE doesn't step up they'll lose both their long-term players and the rookies they cant keep playing anyway.
If you're having such a hissy fit about not being able to see, Turn on your flashlight, build the power node, decyst the room, have the commander scan the room for you, and bring an Exo and have him turn on his UNENDING BEAM OF HOLY GLORY.
edit: grammarz
Killing the cysts in the room actually brightens the room, not darkens it?
If you're killing just one cyst then you're doing it wrong and if there's more cysts in the room still then it's still alien territory soooo... working as intended?
Also, you can build a powernode or use your improved flashlight?
I use default brightness and gamma for both my monitor and in game and Haven't had an issue yet.
Makes me wonder how it's too dark for some people, (esp those jacking up their settings) or if it's just hyperbole; is it really pitch darkness to you, or are you able to see still but it's just more difficult now?
So mst linked some screenshots of this change. While I like the IDEA behind the change, I don't like how it's implemented. It's wrong.
Rooms are defined by power node grids. Your change utilizes that for this affect. As you can see in mst's screenshot, we placed ONE cyst on the VERY edge of computer lab at flight control. This caused ALL of computer labs to go dark, all the way back to comp lab. Some rooms are VERY big, and one cyst can "claim" a LARGE swathe of territory (depending on the map).
I don't think that making this mechanic so dependent on map layout is the 'right' way to go.
Sure, you can counter argue by saying "all you have to do is build the power" or "find the cyst and kill it!". But you have to again think from the new player perspective, or other players who don't know that this mechanic works the way I just pointed out - they're going to be really confused about why a room is dark. It's going to take someone who knows to tell them "oh, well there's an alien structure somewhere in this room" and "oh a room is defined by a grid that defines where the room is powered and where it's not powered.
It's an unnecessarily long thing to explain and it's not intuitive like users would expect (which is that only NEAR the alien structures does it get dark).
I imagine this was the EASIEST way to do it, and on most maps or situations, it works, but there are many cases that its going to create a negative AND confusing experience for your consumers (playerbase).
It's a cool idea for a mod, but it's insane to go and put it in the main build. Please make it an opt-in.
So am I supposed to clear an entire room of 5+ cysts before I do anything at all now? If an alien comes along i'll just keep killing cysts so I can see it better eventually.
Flashlights are specific use and even then aren't great.
NS2 has always been dark, more so than other games, people have been gamma boosting before the lackluster gamma option was in the menu, the game is even darker now, which makes no sense.
People who value getting competitive advantages (or if you prefer: avoiding competitive disadvantages) over immersion have always jacked up their gamma and turned down the graphics detail to reduce any possible distraction, and they'll continue doing so. Don't act like those changes are more cumberstome to a competitive player than moving the gamma slider by one or two pixels while ignoring all other aspects of what they have already customized and turned off, making the way they play and see the game frankly quite different to what the average rookie with default settings is used to.
Immersion and competitive gaming are not compatible imho., but they don't have to be. This is targeted at casuals, and from an immersion perspective, I think the changes are awesome. If those changes really affect gameplay in a noticeable way... NSL mod will revert them pretty soon.
This is similar to rich infestation. It's really cool. It's pretty to look at but as far as a gameplay aspect, it doesn't do much for people who want to be competitive. Like the infestation setting, this atmospheric lighting should have an on/off toggle so everyone can be happy.
P.S. This would stop Cr4zy's whining as well. Everyone would be happy.
Pretty sure people are done fixing UWE's shit for no thanks.
As josh says, why it cant just be a simple toggle is beyond me, like EVERY new feature it's instantly forced on everyone and a lot of people don't care for it.