Humanity's Ultimate Doom?
BaconTheory
Join Date: 2003-09-06 Member: 20615Members
Join Date: 2003-09-06 Member: 20615Members
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">Is it inevitable?</div> I was thinking the other day about something as I was reading something of Ray Bradbury's. Ray Bradbury has some philosophies about science and warnings of the future. Here are his philosophies:
<i>Elements of our personalities will destroy us.</i>
<i>Humans will become victims of technology</i>
<i>We must examine possible consequences of our present actions.</i>
I must agree with all of those. Respectively, all of those come together to support my idea.
My idea is that humanity is ultimately doomed and that there is nothing we can do about it. Many films, including <i>Terminator</i> have dealt with this. A lot of Ray Bradbury's stories deal with this to. I have come up with three things that could cause the end of humanity.
1. Armagedon. A large asteroid (or many small ones) will hit the earth and cause hundreds (or one huge) Thermo-Nuclear explosion, killing us all in a single sweep.
2.The world will just simply end. God will have intended it to be so, and it will happen. I'm not getting in to that as its another forum all together.
3. The superpowers of the world will engage in a World-Wide Superwar in which the world will fall into absolute chaos. Rioting, Genocide, Famine and more will ensue.
So in conclusion, I believe that the ultimate doom of humanity is inevitable. I think that there is nothing that we can do about it, and that we should take a hard look at our current society and how we will destroy ourselves.
What do you think?
<i>Elements of our personalities will destroy us.</i>
<i>Humans will become victims of technology</i>
<i>We must examine possible consequences of our present actions.</i>
I must agree with all of those. Respectively, all of those come together to support my idea.
My idea is that humanity is ultimately doomed and that there is nothing we can do about it. Many films, including <i>Terminator</i> have dealt with this. A lot of Ray Bradbury's stories deal with this to. I have come up with three things that could cause the end of humanity.
1. Armagedon. A large asteroid (or many small ones) will hit the earth and cause hundreds (or one huge) Thermo-Nuclear explosion, killing us all in a single sweep.
2.The world will just simply end. God will have intended it to be so, and it will happen. I'm not getting in to that as its another forum all together.
3. The superpowers of the world will engage in a World-Wide Superwar in which the world will fall into absolute chaos. Rioting, Genocide, Famine and more will ensue.
So in conclusion, I believe that the ultimate doom of humanity is inevitable. I think that there is nothing that we can do about it, and that we should take a hard look at our current society and how we will destroy ourselves.
What do you think?
Comments
At least at a glance Biblically, you have some patriarchs living 900 years. It didn't last long, but at least at that time sin was starting to slowly destroy us. Look at us now.
Yes, Humanity's destruction is inevitable.
Everything which was once born died at one point except 2 things: the universe and time. This is simply because if the universe and/or time had died, we would not be here discussing this topic.
Everything else has had a beginning and an end.
Thusly, humanity has a beginning and an end.
It is really this simple. To be saying otherwise is counterintuitive to everything we've ever known.
Thinking about things like this makes me glad I believe in a God and don't find such things troubling at all.
technically, I doubt humanity will continue forever.
that is unless we create a time machine before the universe becomes 2 blackholes...
( And don't come up with this story about how we can use waterpowered cells. It is a way to store and use energy, not a way to produce it).
If we survive the 200 years, then we survive until the universe ends (big crunch).
BUT. If the amount of time left before the big crunch is anywhere over a million years away (which I think is such a sure thing that it's just a given). Then we WILL find a way to prevent the big crunch from taking place on at least some scale.
Maybe the entirety of humanity will end up on a moon orbiting the mother of all black holes. But we can make it work. At that point it comes down to making NO mistakes. Mistakes cost lives.
And hell, if there's a way for nature to create a big bang, then there's a way to simulate it.
So yes, I believe that humanity possibly has an end, but that end is farther away than even nature intended. But I also believe that it's possible for mankind to never end.
( And don't come up with this story about how we can use waterpowered cells. It is a way to store and use energy, not a way to produce it). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hmm... Floods, hungers, draught, and energy crises... How is this in any way different from the last 3000 years again? Yes, I suppose you mean there will be MORE of it, but that depends on which computer model you use to predict things, and which assumptions you put in those models.
Of COURSE theres more disease famine and whatnot, THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE!
In biblical times I doubt the population world wide was greater then 100 Million, today we have 6 BILLION people. The chances of bad things happening generally increases with more people. So, even though you see all these bad things happening, the ratio of bad things : People is probably about the same as it was ages ago.
Asteroid: Though there is a chance, it is small. If a large one happens to hit, then not only we are screwed then all life on earth is screwed. Even so, the ecosystems existing around volcanic vents will continue to thrive provided the entire sea dosent freeze over, or boil away.
Super Powers: Been there. Done that. The USSR is dead. China may be up and coming, but I hardly think they would be stupid enough to screw everyone over for the sake of proving how big their geopolitical balls are. Judging by their past actions, I would think that China is far more likely to match and surpass the USA's past achievments, namely going on to forming colonies in space, something I have yet to see the US do.
In the short term, as long as about 10,000 to 100,000 people can take shelter off world or in nuclear bunkers with sufficient ecology/supplies to sustain them, humanity and to a lesser degree, life, will continue to exist.
In the long term, who knows. Our descendents will discover things that we can only dream of. Though Technology can be viewed as our downfall, it is our ultimate strength. If technology can screw us, it can save us as well.
To para-quote Assimov... <i>"It is a poor blaster that cannot point both ways..."</i>
So far, so good. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Assuming for a moment that mankind has a future living among the stars, once we leave our planet we've got PLENTY of time to work on how our race is gonna survive whatever end the universe is coming to. I and all my contemporaries will certainly die. Individual humans may well never reach immortality. But the human <i>race</i> might. I'm optimistic.
Why do we exist? We exist because if we didn't, we wouldn't be here to ponder that we exist.
How has humanity survived this long? Because if we didn't, we wouldn't be here to ponder that we have survived.
In essence, the reason we are here to be so cocky about our existance is because nobody will be alive to prove us wrong.
This ties into probability and quantum mechanics, so I won't get into all of that. The point is the same though. Nobody will ever be able to say "I told you humanity was going to end!" for the simple reasons that to be able to say that is a contradiction in itself.
It doesn't mean the world isn't going to end. It just means as long as the universe holds a solar system which holds a planet earth which holds a continent which holds a building which holds a server which holds the data of this thread, everyone who argues that the world will live forever will be correct in this thread.
lol
In biblical times I doubt the population world wide was greater then 100 Million, today we have 6 BILLION people. The chances of bad things happening generally increases with more people. So, even though you see all these bad things happening, the ratio of bad things : People is probably about the same as it was ages ago. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'd just like to take issue with this specific point. There were more likely in the range of 5-17 billion people pre-flood, if you accept the bible as accurate. Mathematical discussion available <a href='http://www.ldolphin.org/pickett.html' target='_blank'>> HERE <</a>
It's a fascinating read regardless. Did you know Methusulah was alive while Adam was still alive, for example?
If you look at on the infinite scale of the universe, than humanity has an end. On an infinite scale, something has to happen. If the odds are a million to one of an asteroid hitting the earth, than in an infinite time scale, those are pretty good odds. That is, humanity on earth. Now, if we start colonizing other planets and spread to the far reaches of the universe, than who knows, maybe humanity could prosper forever...
I personally don't plan to live forever, but I would suffice for a good 400-500 years, give or take a century or two...
Hmm... Floods, hungers, draught, and energy crises... How is this in any way different from the last 3000 years again? Yes, I suppose you mean there will be MORE of it, but that depends on which computer model you use to predict things, and which assumptions you put in those models. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well for one thing, there were less energy crises. There was one at the end of the Roman Empire ( lack of slaves) <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
Well, it is a fact that global temperature and sealevel are both rising dramatically rising. This will cause more floods and more draught. fact. The global oil reserve will be depleted within the next fifty years. fact. The world population is rising more rapidly than the capability to produce food. fact.
Yes, there are technological developments that could be used to replace oil, thus reducing ecological disasters, but there is too few implementation of these inventions ( producing wenergy from wind, water, sunlight, and biomass.
At least at a glance Biblically, you have some patriarchs living 900 years. It didn't last long, but at least at that time sin was starting to slowly destroy us. Look at us now.
Yes, Humanity's destruction is inevitable. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Eh?
The average life span is twice what it was 200 years ago. Only a few thousand years ago more than half of Europe was killed off by a plague we still dont understand today. European settlers brought with them diseases that sometimes killed off entire native peoples where they landed. We dont actually know how long AIDS has been around, its still under heavy debate. chances are, its not new.
As far as biblical figures living hundreds of years, iirc the hebrews used thier own calander and the romans another, and neither were very precise, combined with a bit of "mis" inturpretation, Id say a 900 year life span is up for argument. But phorensic paleontology has yet to find any evidence to support that notion.
Keep in mind that the world has a few billion more people in it than it did during any other era. I think the percentage of "immoral" people is the same as ever. Only theres a few million more, and they sell more commercials than others so were saturated by them because they are overly sensationalized. But "entertainment" has always been on the edges of immorality all throughout history.
Im not too worried about humans in general. Were really not going about things any differently than we always have. Immorality isnt growing, only the population.
If we are actually on the verge of some great change in humanity, I think it will be a reniassance, not a catyclysm. In any case, there is no changing the world.
Yes, there are technological developments that could be used to replace oil, thus reducing ecological disasters, but there is too few implementation of these inventions ( producing wenergy from wind, water, sunlight, and biomass.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Global temperature and sealevel are not rising dramatically. The sea level has not risen perceivably yet, and as for temperature, there have been far greater natural changes thoughout history, changes that the ecosystem has always been able to cope with. The trend is troubling, but it's not going to kill us off. Not yet.
The global oil reserve is less important than the oil industry wants us to believe. Once fuel cells become viable, there are countless sources of energy just waiting to be tapped (geothermal anyone? Iceland will be rich!). That'll easily give us a few more centuries to work out how to harness solar power efficiently enough (or just build fusion reactors).
Current global food production exceeds current global food requirement. Famine is not caused by a lack of food, but by a lack of distribution. While the third world is starving, grain is rotting away unused in the silos of the EU. Tens of thousands of gallons of milk are poured into the drain each day because the EU produces more milk than the EU consumes (and governmental support means that the farmers are still paid for the surplus). Food production grows more and more efficient with each passing year, while the problem of overpopulation is viewed as a serious problem worldwide. And even if the population should grow too big to sustain itself, famine will only reduce population to a point where food production is once again sufficient. Catastrophic? Yes, certainly. Extinction? No way.
The global oil reserve is less important than the oil industry wants us to believe. Once fuel cells become viable, there are countless sources of energy just waiting to be tapped (geothermal anyone? Iceland will be rich!). That'll easily give us a few more centuries to work out how to harness solar power efficiently enough (or just build fusion reactors).
Current global food production exceeds current global food requirement. Famine is not caused by a lack of food, but by a lack of distribution. While the third world is starving, grain is rotting away unused in the silos of the EU. Tens of thousands of gallons of milk are poured into the drain each day because the EU produces more milk than the EU consumes (and governmental support means that the farmers are still paid for the surplus). Food production grows more and more efficient with each passing year, while the problem of overpopulation is viewed as a serious problem worldwide. And even if the population should grow too big to sustain itself, famine will only reduce population to a point where food production is once again sufficient. Catastrophic? Yes, certainly. Extinction? No way. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, during this century, a global warming of 2,2 - 10 degrees Fahrenheit will occur. That IS dramatic. Less places to produce grain/ rice/ potatoes. Extinction of thousands of species.
During the twentieth century, sea level rose by 20-30 centimeters (8-12 inches). The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change projects a rise of up to 1 meter during this century. That IS dramatic.
True, more dramatic changes have occured during history, but then you are talking about geological timescales. And then, they had huge impacts on life too. We will survive it, but it will cause our economy to collapse, draughts, hungers, etc etc.
Fact is, it is already possible to tap energy from nature. The problem is not storing the energy, but reluctance to investing in these new techniques, and lack of encouragements from the government to do so.
True, there is currently a excess of food and lack of redistribution. But there will not be one in the future. (and yea I hate the EU aggricultural policies too ( just like the american ones).
Well, mankind might survive the next centuries, but it sure is the most important problem the world is facing.
§1 Dont waste the resources
§2 Choose a good commander
§3 Team work
We all know to well what happens if any of these paragraphs are not fulfilled.
I'm not saying that Natural Selection will make us live forever, just how it is possible to live as long as possible. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
§1 Dont waste the resources
§2 Choose a good commander
§3 Team work
We all know to well what happens if any of these paragraphs are not fulfilled.
I'm not saying that Natural Selection will make us live forever, just how it is possible to live as long as possible. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Team Stackage!! Humanity vs the Universe.... l4m3 - F4 F4 F4!!!!
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
But seriously, like someone said - the next century or two are really critical. If we make it through that, Chances are we've resolved our current energy, population and pollution crises and possibly (but not necessarily) made the planet more stable politically, as an abundance of energy and resources for the earth's population would finally bring the third world countries onto par with the rest of the world.
Once humanity can expand beyond our solar system, it will be basically impossible to totally destroy the species (by natural causes like asteroids and plaques or human caused events such as warfare) as the distances involved limit the impact of any single event.
As to whether we can outlive the universe or if we're in fact "doomed" in some necessary way -- that's just speculation.
<!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, talk to Xearo Darkness (if you know him) he would prolly know about the F4 thing... <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->