<!--quoteo(post=1950998:date=Jul 12 2012, 10:26 AM:name=Death_by_bullets)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Death_by_bullets @ Jul 12 2012, 10:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1950998"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's another big change in NS2 I'm not really comfortable with is the fact that the commander drops the hive. Essentially the Aliens are guaranteed a second hive, but marines are not guaranteed a second CC. I think the hive should go back to gorges, because that way you at least have a risk of not getting a second hive.
My $.02<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope you are joking. Marines can easily get a second base, just they have never needed to in the past. Marines even sometimes drop second CC's seconds into the game to relocate.
Now I admit its hard to defend two baes until phase tech, but phase tech is a pretty early game research.
Yeah, Marine 2nd Base is cheaper also. 15 Tres. I like this change. It will definitely influence teams' gameplay to want to control more map and not sit on 3 RT's until they get tech out.
<!--quoteo(post=1950913:date=Jul 12 2012, 02:08 AM:name=_Necro_)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (_Necro_ @ Jul 12 2012, 02:08 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1950913"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I tone in with the masses of energy-for-AV-is-bad. The other points I'm looking forward to test them. The change-log sounds nice but I'm a bit worried, that the 2nd hive will be too much of a game decider again.
Woah, nice. Is hive-sight visible with this? And can you please make a screenshot with spores and a marine behind?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Necro:
Made a thread here: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=119407" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=119407</a>
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I tone in with the masses of energy-for-AV-is-bad. The other points I'm looking forward to test them. The change-log sounds nice but I'm a bit worried, that the <b>2nd hive will be too much of a game decider again</b>.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is. Simply due to the fact that fades and skulks both lose blink/leap to counter jetpackers, and gorges with the bilebomb to counter the inevitable skillful use of ARC trains.
It's also even more problematic because there is still zero scaling for aliens (and tying scaling to hive just forces more 2nd hive dependency), and ARCs still take zero skill to use.
Not having focus while fighting jet packs as a fade makes watching paint dry fun. 4 swipes to kill an a3 marine is asinine when fades are considered the "anti-marine" lifeform.
Thx Ryne. This looks really good. Would love to have this instead of the normal AV. It didn't even need trade-offs.
@MisterNubs: I haven't played enough games until now to say this for sure. Lets wait a bit longer before blaming it. If Focus would come back, it should be at least a Hive-2 Ability. It is a counter to A3 and must not be available to early.
<!--quoteo(post=1951144:date=Jul 12 2012, 08:45 PM:name=MisterNubs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MisterNubs @ Jul 12 2012, 08:45 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951144"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It is. Simply due to the fact that fades and skulks both lose blink/leap to counter jetpackers, and gorges with the bilebomb to counter the inevitable skillful use of ARC trains.
It's also even more problematic because there is still zero scaling for aliens (and tying scaling to hive just forces more 2nd hive dependency), and ARCs still take zero skill to use.
Not having focus while fighting jet packs as a fade makes watching paint dry fun. 4 swipes to kill an a3 marine is asinine when fades are considered the "anti-marine" lifeform.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
U are supposed to loose, when marines have jp and all uprades and u ve only one hive left. So dont bother about your jetpack counter, when the second hive is gone. Fast JP is nearly impossible right now. And ... marines with JP and all upgrades shouldnt be easy to kill... even as a fade. Adrenalin makes the fade much more effectice against JP.
<!--quoteo(post=1951262:date=Jul 13 2012, 07:00 AM:name=Kasperle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kasperle @ Jul 13 2012, 07:00 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951262"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><b>U are supposed to loose, when marines have jp and all uprades and u ve only one hive left.</b> So dont bother about your jetpack counter, when the second hive is gone. Fast JP is nearly impossible right now. And ... marines with JP and all upgrades shouldnt be easy to kill... even as a fade. Adrenalin makes the fade much more effectice against JP.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry but I disagree, if that was the case then the game should just end right there instead of drawing out a long boring finish for the aliens.
So what if you lose your 2nd hive, why should that be the deciding factor in who wins the game? That's what was so great about NS1, it didn't matter if you had 3 hives, lost 2 of them, you were still able to make a comeback and win with the right strategy.
I also don't think Marines should lose just because Aliens have 3 hives and full upgrades either. I think the winner should be who plays the best and if that means falling behind for most of the game but making a game winning come back then so be it.
<!--quoteo(post=1951313:date=Jul 13 2012, 10:39 AM:name=MiniH0wie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MiniH0wie @ Jul 13 2012, 10:39 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951313"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm sorry but I disagree, if that was the case then the game should just end right there instead of drawing out a long boring finish for the aliens.
So what if you lose your 2nd hive, why should that be the deciding factor in who wins the game? That's what was so great about NS1, it didn't matter if you had 3 hives, lost 2 of them, you were still able to make a comeback and win with the right strategy.
I also don't think Marines should lose just because Aliens have 3 hives and full upgrades either. I think the winner should be who plays the best and if that means falling behind for most of the game but making a game winning come back then so be it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your last paragraph about comeback wins can still happen even if you lose your 2nd hive.
I dunno, I liked it ~10 builds ago back when lifeforms were tied to hives. Not necessarily the fact that lifeforms were tied to hives, but really the whole marine game focused on 2nd hive denial and I found that to be a lot of fun.
<!--quoteo(post=1951317:date=Jul 13 2012, 10:10 AM:name=GORGEous)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GORGEous @ Jul 13 2012, 10:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951317"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Your last paragraph about comeback wins can still happen even if you lose your 2nd hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know that and that's what I was trying to say.
I was just explaining why I didn't feel that the game should end once you lost your 2nd hive like Kasperle indicated.
I just came back for some games after two or three weeks away. didn't have any fum. I still have performance problems that make aiming almost impossible, the old frustrating mechancis are still in place, I have a hard time in combat with aliens without alien vision and, not a fault of the game, I still can't find a game where poeple doesn't stack teams to facepalming levels. I think I'll stay away until 1.0.
Comments
My $.02<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope you are joking. Marines can easily get a second base, just they have never needed to in the past. Marines even sometimes drop second CC's seconds into the game to relocate.
Now I admit its hard to defend two baes until phase tech, but phase tech is a pretty early game research.
Woah, nice. Is hive-sight visible with this? And can you please make a screenshot with spores and a marine behind?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Necro:
Made a thread here: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=119407" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=119407</a>
It is. Simply due to the fact that fades and skulks both lose blink/leap to counter jetpackers, and gorges with the bilebomb to counter the inevitable skillful use of ARC trains.
It's also even more problematic because there is still zero scaling for aliens (and tying scaling to hive just forces more 2nd hive dependency), and ARCs still take zero skill to use.
Not having focus while fighting jet packs as a fade makes watching paint dry fun. 4 swipes to kill an a3 marine is asinine when fades are considered the "anti-marine" lifeform.
@MisterNubs: I haven't played enough games until now to say this for sure. Lets wait a bit longer before blaming it.
If Focus would come back, it should be at least a Hive-2 Ability. It is a counter to A3 and must not be available to early.
It's also even more problematic because there is still zero scaling for aliens (and tying scaling to hive just forces more 2nd hive dependency), and ARCs still take zero skill to use.
Not having focus while fighting jet packs as a fade makes watching paint dry fun. 4 swipes to kill an a3 marine is asinine when fades are considered the "anti-marine" lifeform.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
U are supposed to loose, when marines have jp and all uprades and u ve only one hive left. So dont bother about your jetpack counter, when the second hive is gone. Fast JP is nearly impossible right now.
And ... marines with JP and all upgrades shouldnt be easy to kill... even as a fade. Adrenalin makes the fade much more effectice against JP.
And ... marines with JP and all upgrades shouldnt be easy to kill... even as a fade. Adrenalin makes the fade much more effectice against JP.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry but I disagree, if that was the case then the game should just end right there instead of drawing out a long boring finish for the aliens.
So what if you lose your 2nd hive, why should that be the deciding factor in who wins the game? That's what was so great about NS1, it didn't matter if you had 3 hives, lost 2 of them, you were still able to make a comeback and win with the right strategy.
I also don't think Marines should lose just because Aliens have 3 hives and full upgrades either. I think the winner should be who plays the best and if that means falling behind for most of the game but making a game winning come back then so be it.
+1
So what if you lose your 2nd hive, why should that be the deciding factor in who wins the game? That's what was so great about NS1, it didn't matter if you had 3 hives, lost 2 of them, you were still able to make a comeback and win with the right strategy.
I also don't think Marines should lose just because Aliens have 3 hives and full upgrades either. I think the winner should be who plays the best and if that means falling behind for most of the game but making a game winning come back then so be it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your last paragraph about comeback wins can still happen even if you lose your 2nd hive.
I know that and that's what I was trying to say.
I was just explaining why I didn't feel that the game should end once you lost your 2nd hive like Kasperle indicated.