What I would like aswell would be some logic in the infestion system.
For instance, how does a lifeform evolving in a vent get the dna-sequence supplied by a shell at the other side of the map? It shoudn't. The was I see it, the infestation (and some... stuff... wich allows independant hive- and cystdrops) keep the Khamm together. An extractor feeds on the whatever the nozzle supplies and then gives that energy into the infestation, granting the com access to it.
What I'm saying? Make every teamwide thing on aliens infestation-bound (with the exeption of cysts and hives aswell as evolutions). You can't get upgrades if you're not on infestation, unconnected harvesters don't supply res, unconnected veils, spurs and shells don't grad access to the upgrade. While you're on it, let fire damage (flamers and welders) attack infestation directly, meaning they increase the speed at wich infestation receeds.
After seeing multiple threads on this yesterday, I went and played 4 games as a marine. The marine team won 3 of 4. I will say it again, the balance problem is noob driven. If the marine team can shoot and work together, it is easy to run over the alien team. We had one to two guys defending the bases at all times. Everyone else pushed the alien hives. It made it so aliens were always on tje defensive and never got much of a chance to hit our bases/extractors. It is very hard to get close to a small group of marines who can aim.
I also played on aliens a few matches and the marine win rate was about .500 total. I am not seeing a balance problem. It is always coming down to which team has the better players. Marines just take longer to understand than aliens. Once people figure out what they should be doing, the win rates will even out a lot more. Stop trying to play defense all game as a marine! Take the time to learn how to hit targets that jump around and run on walls.
<!--quoteo(post=2066424:date=Jan 25 2013, 10:50 AM:name=lumina)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lumina @ Jan 25 2013, 10:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2066424"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->After seeing multiple threads on this yesterday, I went and played 4 games as a marine. The marine team won 3 of 4. I will say it again, the balance problem is noob driven. If the marine team can shoot and work together, it is easy to run over the alien team. We had one to two guys defending the bases at all times. Everyone else pushed the alien hives. It made it so aliens were always on tje defensive and never got much of a chance to hit our bases/extractors. It is very hard to get close to a small group of marines who can aim.
I also played on aliens a few matches and the marine win rate was about .500 total. I am not seeing a balance problem. It is always coming down to which team has the better players. Marines just take longer to understand than aliens. Once people figure out what they should be doing, the win rates will even out a lot more. Stop trying to play defense all game as a marine! Take the time to learn how to hit targets that jump around and run on walls.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> anecdote gonna anecdote
For me yesterday, I played an equal spread of 12 games. I played 6 as alien and 6 as rine. I won 5/6 of 5/6 on both. My point is, you're kind of right and kind of wrong, you're right that if a team is smart, has aim, and coordinates they can overcome and win. that does not mean the game is balanced. If anyone's good enough you can overcome most obstacles in a games design flaws. There are still glaring problems with marine balance that need to be changed.
For me yesterday, I played an equal spread of 12 games. I played 6 as alien and 6 as rine. I won 5/6 of 5/6 on both. My point is, you're kind of right and kind of wrong, you're right that if a team is smart, has aim, and coordinates they can overcome and win. that does not mean the game is balanced. If anyone's good enough you can overcome most obstacles in a games design flaws. There are still glaring problems with marine balance that need to be changed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that is my typical experience. The team with the better player = the winning team. That is exactly how a balanced game works. If it wasn't balanced, the better team would always win one side, while winning less on the underpowered side.
Marines are harder to get good at. That isn't a balance issue though. If you nerf one side based on a noobs experience, the game will be unbalanced in the servers where people know how to play. It will be unbalanced for those new players as they become veterans.
In my experience, this game is pretty balanced when both sides are being played correctly.
Let's anecdote some more. I played 8 matches yesterday, all used randomized teams. Marines didn't win a single time, regardless of which players were around. Even if we had really organized marines who knew how to shoot, there were still two guys on aliens who were just wrecking the team with 20-3 K/Ds and carried the entire team. If you want to win as marines, you need to have the entire team full of pros, otherwise a few pros on the alien side are enough to counter you.
Or in other words: if the marine team consists about 20% of people that you can't count on, marines lose the game. This is not true for the alien side.
<!--quoteo(post=2066458:date=Jan 25 2013, 11:25 AM:name=CrushaK)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CrushaK @ Jan 25 2013, 11:25 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2066458"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Let's anecdote some more. I played 8 matches yesterday, all used randomized teams. Marines didn't win a single time, regardless of which players were around. Even if we had really organized marines who knew how to shoot, there were still two guys on aliens who were just wrecking the team with 20-3 K/Ds and carried the entire team. If you want to win as marines, you need to have the entire team full of pros, otherwise a few pros on the alien side are enough to counter you.
Or in other words: if the marine team consists about 20% of people that you can't count on, marines lose the game. This is not true for the alien side.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry, but that is wrong. There is no way your marine teams knew how to shoot, and were organized, while letting multiple aliens go 20-3. Shotguns + range make that almost impossible. Get off the rookie servers.
Those aliens were either far better players or the marines didn't work together/aim well.
Those two alien players were from the same clan. They just knew their stuff. The rest of the alien team had way more deaths than kills, but those two guys really carried them to victory.
Comments
For instance, how does a lifeform evolving in a vent get the dna-sequence supplied by a shell at the other side of the map? It shoudn't.
The was I see it, the infestation (and some... stuff... wich allows independant hive- and cystdrops) keep the Khamm together.
An extractor feeds on the whatever the nozzle supplies and then gives that energy into the infestation, granting the com access to it.
What I'm saying?
Make every teamwide thing on aliens infestation-bound (with the exeption of cysts and hives aswell as evolutions).
You can't get upgrades if you're not on infestation, unconnected harvesters don't supply res, unconnected veils, spurs and shells don't grad access to the upgrade.
While you're on it, let fire damage (flamers and welders) attack infestation directly, meaning they increase the speed at wich infestation receeds.
I also played on aliens a few matches and the marine win rate was about .500 total. I am not seeing a balance problem. It is always coming down to which team has the better players. Marines just take longer to understand than aliens. Once people figure out what they should be doing, the win rates will even out a lot more. Stop trying to play defense all game as a marine! Take the time to learn how to hit targets that jump around and run on walls.
I also played on aliens a few matches and the marine win rate was about .500 total. I am not seeing a balance problem. It is always coming down to which team has the better players. Marines just take longer to understand than aliens. Once people figure out what they should be doing, the win rates will even out a lot more. Stop trying to play defense all game as a marine! Take the time to learn how to hit targets that jump around and run on walls.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
anecdote gonna anecdote
For me yesterday, I played an equal spread of 12 games. I played 6 as alien and 6 as rine. I won 5/6 of 5/6 on both. My point is, you're kind of right and kind of wrong, you're right that if a team is smart, has aim, and coordinates they can overcome and win. that does not mean the game is balanced. If anyone's good enough you can overcome most obstacles in a games design flaws. There are still glaring problems with marine balance that need to be changed.
For me yesterday, I played an equal spread of 12 games. I played 6 as alien and 6 as rine. I won 5/6 of 5/6 on both. My point is, you're kind of right and kind of wrong, you're right that if a team is smart, has aim, and coordinates they can overcome and win. that does not mean the game is balanced. If anyone's good enough you can overcome most obstacles in a games design flaws. There are still glaring problems with marine balance that need to be changed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But that is my typical experience. The team with the better player = the winning team. That is exactly how a balanced game works. If it wasn't balanced, the better team would always win one side, while winning less on the underpowered side.
Marines are harder to get good at. That isn't a balance issue though. If you nerf one side based on a noobs experience, the game will be unbalanced in the servers where people know how to play. It will be unbalanced for those new players as they become veterans.
In my experience, this game is pretty balanced when both sides are being played correctly.
If you want to win as marines, you need to have the entire team full of pros, otherwise a few pros on the alien side are enough to counter you.
Or in other words: if the marine team consists about 20% of people that you can't count on, marines lose the game. This is not true for the alien side.
If you want to win as marines, you need to have the entire team full of pros, otherwise a few pros on the alien side are enough to counter you.
Or in other words: if the marine team consists about 20% of people that you can't count on, marines lose the game. This is not true for the alien side.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry, but that is wrong. There is no way your marine teams knew how to shoot, and were organized, while letting multiple aliens go 20-3. Shotguns + range make that almost impossible. Get off the rookie servers.
Those aliens were either far better players or the marines didn't work together/aim well.
The rest of the alien team had way more deaths than kills, but those two guys really carried them to victory.
And who plays on rookie servers nowadays?