Build 250 is now live on Steam! - Natural Selection 2

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  • Blarney_StoneBlarney_Stone Join Date: 2013-03-08 Member: 183808Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    IronHorse wrote: »
    When marine areas are cleared out, aliens can build instantly.

    Except they need to have infestation there first, and infestation spreads extremely slowly.

  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
    Then that specifically needs to be addressed, and i agree its an issue.

    What about Gorge healing cysts makes them build in 2 seconds? So if he got there late (they're half built) he could run and spray to build em?
  • current1ycurrent1y Join Date: 2003-12-08 Member: 24150Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    edited July 2013
    A gorge can heal cysts. It doesn't speed up infestation spreading though. It just shortens the total time for it to begin spreading.
  • EmooEmoo Ibasa Join Date: 2002-12-20 Member: 11198Members
    IronHorse wrote: »
    I love the speed infestation recedes.. I've been wanting that change for years now.

    I see very little reason to revert this.. Made no sense waiting for ages to build an area you just re claimed with a whole team of players. When marine areas are cleared out, aliens can build instantly.
    The asymmetry card does not apply when it comes to equal access to tech and resources

    Except now that marines can build on it you don't have to wait. You can start building before you even kill the cysts.

    Also when a marine area is cleared out the aliens can't build instantly, they have to cyst up to and into the room and wait for the infestation to spread.

    I see no reason to make infestation so punishing to the aliens with such little drawbacks to the marines. If the issue slow infestation is trying to solve is the speed of alien expansion and life form explosion just (as you have said yourself @IronHorse) make it so only gorges can speed up structures. That forces a trade off between expansion speed and lifeforms without making infestation annoying to work with.
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    IronHorse wrote: »
    Then that specifically needs to be addressed, and i agree its an issue.

    What about Gorge healing cysts makes them build in 2 seconds? So if he got there late (they're half built) he could run and spray to build em?

    Sorry but why add more confusion ?

    How about leaving a faster recedes but NOT allows marine to build on infestation huh ?

    And how come both were implemented here making cyst chain management just a complete pain for alien with 0 reward ?
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts
    @wake while I agree marines shouldn't be able to build on infestation, especially considering receding rates, the growth rate is too slow.

    The gorge speeds up building of everything, including things the khamm drops.. So i dont find the idea to be confusing or unintuitive.
    I think it's incredibly unintuitive that drifters build, though.

    Idk why gorge /kham coordination was desired to be lessened.. I always thought it was a good thing.
    Teamwork, lessening life form explosions, gives gorge more to do and feeling of importance to his team and easier to find since he'd be at the front lines building for his kham.
    *shrug *

    Make gorges spraying cysts speed up infestation growing, and remove marines building on infestation - fixed! ;-)
  • WakeWake Join Date: 2003-03-05 Member: 14351Members, Constellation
    IronHorse wrote: »
    The gorge speeds up building of everything, including things the khamm drops.. So i dont find the idea to be confusing or unintuitive.
    Ok. BUt it ain't gonna be fun running down these corridors spraying cysts like a sex-mad fish
    IronHorse wrote: »
    I think it's incredibly unintuitive that drifters build, though.
    It's unintuitive and it £$*&!!!!!
    IronHorse wrote: »
    Make gorges spraying cysts speed up infestation growing, and remove marines building on infestation - fixed! ;-)
    Please !
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    I don't think abusing the gorge as brainless build-machine is a gain. Forcing a player to stare at buildings and holding mouse 1 in mostly secured territory should never be the solution.

    Yeah I know: Marines do the same. I don't know why it doesn't bother me there. Maybe because it happens mostly in endangered territory or because you aren't a gimped player when it comes to fighting. Building as gorge is just a damn lot more boring as marine.

    I rather have a fade-splosion than relying on such a boring mechanic again. If anything, the gorge should also have some responsibility. You can't just give him a boring job. You also need to create an incentive for him, besides "its good for the team". An example would be to shift cyst building from the kham to the gorges. The kham can do enough now to justify this. The unit-support with drifters is a full time job already and this is good.

    Sure, gorges would be mandatory than. But it would also be much more fun to play them.
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Anyone know what the point of the alien structure limit is?

    It's irritating. Particularly because aliens don't have any way to recycle structures; which means that once you hit the limit, there's nothing you can do about it.
  • JektJekt Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143714Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited July 2013
    Why does not allowing marines to build on infestation fix alien pres sync again?
  • B3rTB3rT Join Date: 2013-02-14 Member: 183058Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Mouse wrote: »
    Anyone know what the point of the alien structure limit is?

    It's irritating. Particularly because aliens don't have any way to recycle structures; which means that once you hit the limit, there's nothing you can do about it.

    Every building that counts on the limit is able to walk. So just walk them to the position you need them .. or into enemy territory if you want to get rid of them (yeah, I know, it takes a while if you are not able to echo. But you _can_ get rid of buildings you don't want anymore)
  • MMZ_TorakMMZ_Torak Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 3770Members
    B3rT wrote: »
    Mouse wrote: »
    Anyone know what the point of the alien structure limit is?

    It's irritating. Particularly because aliens don't have any way to recycle structures; which means that once you hit the limit, there's nothing you can do about it.

    Every building that counts on the limit is able to walk. So just walk them to the position you need them .. or into enemy territory if you want to get rid of them (yeah, I know, it takes a while if you are not able to echo. But you _can_ get rid of buildings you don't want anymore)

    That's kinda silly to have to march a structure off to it's death to "recycle" it. If asymmetry/balance requires Aliens to not recycle, how about an ability to simply kill a structure with no recovery of res? Otherwise, smart marine teams will simply not kill the suicidal structures. Making it stand in the corner, off infestation, Blair Witch Style until it's dead is also kinda silly.
  • B3rTB3rT Join Date: 2013-02-14 Member: 183058Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    A kill button for structures would be nice, yes. But how UWE designed the com UI in the past, its default keybinding would be 'C' *g*
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    edited July 2013
    Mouse wrote: »
    Anyone know what the point of the alien structure limit is?

    It's irritating. Particularly because aliens don't have any way to recycle structures; which means that once you hit the limit, there's nothing you can do about it.

    Agree that it's frustrating. As walking is SO SLOW, you can echo your shift around so that you can then echo your other structures around instead of walking them. The echo cost is fairly low, and could be viewed as the res you would have lost through recycling... It's a short-term way around the problem, I hope...
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