Level and skill number

MoFoMoFo Join Date: 2013-09-09 Member: 188047Members
Ok, I'm guessing these are for the Hive/ELO rankings or whatever, but is there somewhere that says exactly what they mean?

Like how does a lvl 2 skill 100 player match up against a lvl 4 skill 300 player? What causes your level and skill to go up/down?

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Comments

  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts
    edited December 2013
    LVL is just how much experimenced you are, skill should be how much skilled you are but yeah there are some issues about the hive system.

    Some server already got a rookie protection rdy :D
  • Racer1Racer1 Join Date: 2002-11-22 Member: 9615Members
    The skill system was only introduced recently, and is (in my opinion) still in alpha stage. UW has indicated they are still tweaking it.
  • ezekelezekel Join Date: 2012-11-29 Member: 173589Members, NS2 Map Tester
    People in russia/sweden are boosting the stats as well, but that much is obvious.. can't believe people even bother
  • current1ycurrent1y Join Date: 2003-12-08 Member: 24150Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    Racer1 wrote: »
    The skill system was only introduced recently, and is (in my opinion) still in alpha stage. UW has indicated they are still tweaking it.

    Agreed but why put a system clearly in the alpha stages on the main menu for every one who purchases the game to see?

  • OtsOts Join Date: 2003-07-30 Member: 18577Members, Constellation
    level is pretty straight forward to how much you play, skill is your k/d/win ratio calculated into a number, in short. It's pretty clear it's there in preparation for the matchmaking system, whenever it is to come out. But these numbers arent new anyways, it's just a display from hive.naturalselection2.com
  • current1ycurrent1y Join Date: 2003-12-08 Member: 24150Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    ^^ this

    or you'll have the skilled pub stompers who's skill is 800+ join a team with "less skilled" players with a skill of 450 who all happen to be premier divison players against a team made up of your average pubber with scores of 600. Should be quite a fair game.... =/
  • OtsOts Join Date: 2003-07-30 Member: 18577Members, Constellation
    don't really care, as long as it's better than pub.
  • joohoo_n3djoohoo_n3d Join Date: 2012-10-30 Member: 164703Members, Reinforced - Onos, WC 2013 - Supporter
    what if you mostly command? does it compensate for lack of kills?
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    joohoo_n3d wrote: »
    what if you mostly command? does it compensate for lack of kills?

    No.
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts
    edited December 2013
    Roobubba wrote: »
    joohoo_n3d wrote: »
    what if you mostly command? does it compensate for lack of kills?

    No.

    Commanders are marked as such and don't seem to get a skill rating for that round.

    I fact we can't say how exactly the hive system is working because we have no access to the web code. All things we know are based on the lua part and what we noticed by looking at our own profil page.
  • _INTER__INTER_ Join Date: 2009-08-08 Member: 68392Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited December 2013
    I wonder how they want to make the matchmaking work. Can you join some sort of "ranked" game and it puts you into a team with +- same skilled people? Wouldn't that kill off some private servers? Or would you be able to join any server you wan't as is and then the teams are randomized based on skill from hive? That wouldn't get rid of the pupstomp though.
  • DarkATiDarkATi Revelation 22:17 Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17532Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    I'm glad UWE included this in the game. It's a start toward something greater (I hope).

    I would like to see rank names and patches (fun pictures basically, to go along with the numbers) included also. For example, "Lieutenant," "Major," "Captain," etc.

    Or, you could go a more sci-fi route and use terms like, "I Eschelon," "II Eschelon," etc.

    Although, come to think of it, I'm not sure how you would incorporate names and patches in a way that accomodates Marines and Aliens.

    Anyway, I for one am glad they implemented this. It means they are listening and working on what so many have been asking for recently.
  • RapGodRapGod Not entirely sure... Join Date: 2013-11-12 Member: 189322Members
    my lvl is leet and my skill number is sauce.
  • BobRossTheBossBobRossTheBoss Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176824Members
    edited December 2013
    I feel like rankings only work if there is some sort of even matchmaking system, so why they implemented this first is odd.

    These numbers just make it easier for people to mass stack teams since they have another number that somewhat describes skill alongside K/D.
  • KamamuraKamamura Join Date: 2013-03-06 Member: 183736Members, Reinforced - Gold
    I have been playing this game for a year now, 350 hours on Steam, yet only 20 rounds on Hive with 100 - something skill, level 1. Fail.
  • MestaritonttuMestaritonttu Join Date: 2004-07-29 Member: 30229Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold
    Kamamura wrote: »
    I have been playing this game for a year now, 350 hours on Steam, yet only 20 rounds on Hive with 100 - something skill, level 1. Fail.


    Omg plz turrets are imba l2p level 1 nooob! xD
  • MephillesMephilles Germany Join Date: 2013-08-07 Member: 186634Members, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    Kamamura wrote: »
    I have been playing this game for a year now, 350 hours on Steam, yet only 20 rounds on Hive with 100 - something skill, level 1. Fail.

    only servers without mods or whitelisted servers are shown on hive. so server running NS2Stats who are not whitelisted won't show up on hive

  • [AwE]Sentinel[AwE]Sentinel Join Date: 2012-06-05 Member: 152949Members
    Since I don't play a lot on ranking servers, my stats will never represent my "skill" - beside the obvious problem to concentrate skill into a simple number.
    That means if I use matchmaking, I won't get together with ppl with the same skill anyways. And if Im placed in a team, it might as well place me very wrong.

    You think they will add even more ingame icons for the matchmaking system? I want to be a Sergeant of the Mastersergeants Most important Person of extreme Sergeants to the MAX!

    But as long as it doesn't replace the normal browser and as long as I can play on my favorite servers...I don't really care ;)
  • Racer1Racer1 Join Date: 2002-11-22 Member: 9615Members
    Most advanced skill system base skill attained on your skill level vs skill level of your opponent(s). So if you have a 500 skill level, and the average level of the opposing team is 250, you wouldn't get much (and they wouldn't loose as much if they loose). I expect NS2 to eventually implement something like this. Also, UW has stated that there may be an official set of servers and/or mods that are only allowed if the server wishes to participate.
  • SamusDroidSamusDroid Colorado Join Date: 2013-05-13 Member: 185219Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    edited December 2013
    Well, that's your fault then if you think that way, and spreading the word is just a way to get it to happen more often. And it was me who implemented it, because it's aimed at making you want to get better, as well as more implementation of Hive, not just a system you have to go to another site to view. Stacking and "farming" would have already happened, and no one can stop that happening. Numbers or not, it still happens, and you farming just for skill is their fault, not having numbers won't stop you from doing that.
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    @samusdroid it is not my fault if other people feel that way and act that way. Which they do. The truth of the matter is that some people will pay attention to this and use the hive skill as their benchmark. That will have - and indeed is already having - the effect of ruining the rookie friendly servers and turning new players off the game, which is the very thing the matchmaking is meant to be alleviating.

    Please for the love of Cl0rf keep the skill stats hidden! By all means include the rank publicly as this has no direct bearing on game play.
  • SamusDroidSamusDroid Colorado Join Date: 2013-05-13 Member: 185219Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    edited December 2013
    You as in (their) and you mean level? I for one love this being added(not because I added it) but because it makes me want to get better at the game, as well as others. "stacking and farming" is something you cannot easily control.
  • CrushaKCrushaK Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167195Members, NS2 Playtester
    I wonder if servers are able to deliberately opt out of submitting any stats to the Hive system, without having to purposely run mods that would disqualify it. It would seem like a good thing to do at this point, since you could then tell your resident players that pub stomping on that server won't help them at all.


    Any system that can show players that they are getting worse is bad and drives people away or causes them to create situations where a loss is rather unlikely.
    SMNC had a visible counter of Wins/Losses/Leaves and Kills/Deaths/Assists in the main menu at one point. It really had a bad psychological effect on players. Eventually they changed it so that it would only show Wins/Leaves and Kills/Assists. Basically just a continuous progress counter that is nice to look at the longer you play, but without actually coining it down to a "how good are you per match" base.


    NS2's system encourages stacking teams and leaving the match as soon as you notice that things will likely go down the river (since it doesn't submit any stats for you if you only participated briefly in the match), rewards stomps (more kills = better rating) and punishes those who are getting stomped (they surely had fun getting killed 30 times in a row, so let's shove that down their throat afterwards).

    It likely doesn't take the different roles into account either:
    Skulks are just way more likely to die than an average marine, since they are cannon fodder and don't scale as well into the lategame as a rifle marine. Xenocide Skulks ruin their K/D ratio.
    Umbra Lerks don't get any points for their vital help.
    An Onos can help its team a lot just by being a meat (bone) shield and a distraction, for which it is not rewarded by the game.

    In general, having deaths as part of the equation seems like a bad choice to me. Dying in this game is not necessarily a bad thing. The punishment is already that you can score less kills and other points. But there are more than enough situations where it is totally worth to die somewhere to achieve something else. And that should not be discouraged. In the same way should you not get punished for your deaths by getting killed a bazillion times by a stacked team that doesn't want to end the game. The formula should just discard deaths, imho.
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    When i say keep it hidden I'm referring to the skill score, which is a function of k:d and win/lose.

    By rank I meant level, yes that was a typo sorry. That is fine to leave public as it's essentially a meaningless function of time played on participating servers.
  • OnosFactoryOnosFactory New Zealand Join Date: 2008-07-16 Member: 64637Members
    Wow =- behind the times here in NZ, where is this HIVE thing we look at ??

    I am interested to see how many of my excessive number of deaths have boosted peoples stats!
  • SamusDroidSamusDroid Colorado Join Date: 2013-05-13 Member: 185219Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    edited December 2013
    CrushaK wrote: »
    I wonder if servers are able to deliberately opt out of submitting any stats to the Hive system, without having to purposely run mods that would disqualify it. It would seem like a good thing to do at this point, since you could then tell your resident players that pub stomping on that server won't help them at all.

    It's called ns2_stats/Shine
    Wow =- behind the times here in NZ, where is this HIVE thing we look at ??

    I am interested to see how many of my excessive number of deaths have boosted peoples stats!

    It's in the menu...

    I will discuss with devs what to do, but IMO I think people are making a bigger deal about it than there should be.
  • OnosFactoryOnosFactory New Zealand Join Date: 2008-07-16 Member: 64637Members
    Ta, I think I found the same thing here: http://hive.naturalselection2.com/

    So, is this based on your Steam ID or just the in game handle?
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