Skill, Level, and official and nonofficial servers.

NeemhNeemh Lithuania Join Date: 2013-12-31 Member: 191180Members, Reinforced - Shadow
in NS2 General Discussion
1) Is skill level update exactly after match or after some time?
2)I need to play for both marines and aliens to update skill level? Or i can just play one match as marine and grow up?
3)Is ALL servers in list allow me to gain Xp to increase skill level? If not - how to understand where is OFFicial servers???

Just a question... I done my best with 46/11 K/D ratio as marine and winner. But no update on Hive...
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Comments

  • Infinity_XInfinity_X USA Join Date: 2013-12-17 Member: 190195Members
    It needs to be taken out ASAP if it's not finished, then.
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  • RockyMarcRockyMarc Join Date: 2009-11-24 Member: 69519Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Never have liked ranking systems o_O
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  • SamusDroidSamusDroid Colorado Join Date: 2013-05-13 Member: 185219Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    Actually, it is "finished" but just needs tweaks.
    Off Topic 10Disagree 1Agree Awesome
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts
    edited January 2014
    1,2,3:
    GhoulofGSG9 wrote: »

    To give a start, i'll just list some facts about hive to clear things up:

    1. By default all servers with 1+ mods enabled are not sending any datas to hive
    2. There are mods like "[Shine] Ns2Stats" enabling Hive back again.
    2.1 [Shine] NS2Stats allow you to easily opt out of any stats logging (either add a bot or just unload the plugin)
    3. Servers get whitelisted by uwe if there are enought round datas (~50) and will then show up at hive website.

    4. LVL represent how experiment a player is as it is based on the sum of scores.
    5. Skill is the avg Skill rating reached in all rounds played . The exact current formula for the skill rating is unknown but it's based on w/l + k/d/a + score

    6. If you find a server used by players to manipulate hive stats report it, it will then get off the whitelist.

    After each round playerstats will be send to hive if player played more than 5 min of a round.
    Exact datas are printed into the server log and look like this:
    {assists = 5,nickname = "Ghoul",marineTime = 0,kills = 7,playTime = 483.76455432456,alienTime = 483.76455432456,deaths = 5,steamId = 49071975,isCommander = "false",isWinner = "true",score = 52,}

    + See here for the whitelist: http://hive.naturalselection2.com/servers/whitelist
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  • Infinity_XInfinity_X USA Join Date: 2013-12-17 Member: 190195Members
    edited January 2014
    GORGEous wrote: »
    SamusDroid wrote: »
    Actually, it is "finished" but just needs tweaks.

    How could it possibly be finished.... You get more points farming rookie servers than you do beating Godar or Snails. If that doesn't qualify as "unfinished," then I don't think anything does.
    This. Exactly this. The system also gives no reward for commanding well, which causes more pub games to wait several minutes while people hop around not wanting to command.
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  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members
    Infinity_X wrote: »
    GORGEous wrote: »
    SamusDroid wrote: »
    Actually, it is "finished" but just needs tweaks.

    How could it possibly be finished.... You get more points farming rookie servers than you do beating Godar or Snails. If that doesn't qualify as "unfinished," then I don't think anything does.
    This. Exactly this. The system also gives no reward for commanding well, which causes more pub games to wait several minutes while people hop around not wanting to command.

    I really wouldn't blame that on the scoring system. scoring is kinda pointless. ths community isn't that big, play enough, and you know where you fall in it... generally speaking of course.
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  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    As mentioned in another thread, the next patch wont show the numbers in the menu. They might come back when the system is more stable
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  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Please hide stats by default!
    Just look at this thread. Ridiculous and avoidable (not blaming the op here).
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  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    You did read what i just wrote right?
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  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Rofl, Zinkey has it :D

    But moving it from the menu is still only half the story. Frankly I don't think the website should show any players who haven't logged into hive and checked a box to say 'make me visible.' That way, anyone who cares about stats can see their stats, so no-one loses out, but it completely gets around the whole rookie farming issue.
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  • joshhhjoshhh Milwaukee, WI Join Date: 2011-06-21 Member: 105717Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    edited January 2014
    Hey @Golden, did you know the skill system isn't weighted?

    *trollface

    But anyway, what gorgeous said is my take on the matter.
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  • rantologyrantology Join Date: 2012-02-05 Member: 143750Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold
    also as a secondary note (aside from the weights), it would be nice to see matches using the ready command (competitive) segregated from the "pub" stats.
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  • NeemhNeemh Lithuania Join Date: 2013-12-31 Member: 191180Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    ok, thx all) Now i will try to forget about stat systems and will try just to play and get fun XD :-??
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  • CCTEECCTEE Join Date: 2013-06-20 Member: 185634Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Neemh wrote: »
    ok, thx all) Now i will try to forget about stat systems and will try just to play and get fun XD :-??

    Your skill factor is now 231.02 Neemh.
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver
    Wait... hive isn't meant as a source of humour for us to laugh at when we read our scores?


    (yes sarcasm)
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  • NeemhNeemh Lithuania Join Date: 2013-12-31 Member: 191180Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    CCTEE wrote: »
    Neemh wrote: »
    ok, thx all) Now i will try to forget about stat systems and will try just to play and get fun XD :-??

    Your skill factor is now 231.02 Neemh.

    And?) I know) It should be different coz for example i win game as marine in *Russia 5* server 1 day ago (and did it good with highest k/d and score ratio from all my previous games.). For example http://hive.naturalselection2.com/profile/6359948 this player have got experience from Russia 5 server. Why i am not?) I am dissapointed.. T__T"
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  • joshhhjoshhh Milwaukee, WI Join Date: 2011-06-21 Member: 105717Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    rantology wrote: »
    also as a secondary note (aside from the weights), it would be nice to see matches using the ready command (competitive) segregated from the "pub" stats.

    Rant's just mad her 800 skill dropped 300 points after scrimming so many times over the last week. :P
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  • GORGEousGORGEous Join Date: 2012-02-19 Member: 146762Members, NS2 Map Tester
    @Golden is really knowledgeable about this subject and can explain in greater detail than posted here.
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  • AnzestralAnzestral Join Date: 2013-05-21 Member: 185327Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester
    edited January 2014
    Funny to see that a lot of top level comp players are now gone from the top 20 because of the WC ^^
    It's hilarious anyway that a lot of the players in the top20 play on UWE Officials most of the time.
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  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Top players rarely play public games anyway (and non public aren't often counted). Related note, passworded servers need to not submit stats again.
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  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members
    Mendasp wrote: »
    Considering the stats ignore your opponent's skill they are not indicative of anything except how much you play (pub?). The skill rating certainly doesn't track skill.

    eh, let's give it a little credit, if you pub at all, it can probably be counted on to get you in the right quartile?
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  • OnosFactoryOnosFactory New Zealand Join Date: 2008-07-16 Member: 64637Members
    I went down 82 points in 2 1/2 days, I take it as a compliment.
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  • GORGEousGORGEous Join Date: 2012-02-19 Member: 146762Members, NS2 Map Tester
    edited January 2014
    @Golden could explain this better, but I think it is actually inversely proportional to the skill of your opponents. The higher your skill rating is, the lower the people you play against are.
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  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    amoral wrote: »
    Mendasp wrote: »
    Considering the stats ignore your opponent's skill they are not indicative of anything except how much you play (pub?). The skill rating certainly doesn't track skill.

    eh, let's give it a little credit, if you pub at all, it can probably be counted on to get you in the right quartile?

    Nope, because it only uses your last 20 games in the calculation. If you play a lot of comp games and don't put some pub stomps in between them, your score will go through the floor. The ONLY way to get high 'skill' at the minute is to pub stomp.
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  • N1ckN1ck Germany Join Date: 2014-01-09 Member: 192865Members
    Hey everyone,

    I just wanted to say that the actual skill system is indeed tracking skill but probably not the kind of skill that most people would think of.
    It's basically not too much about the KD ratio but more about how much kills or score you can make per minute. And ist NOT easy to get scores like 1300, 1400 or above. Actually that was more easy a few weeks ago where I was getting scores with 2000 etc. I think 2800 was the top. But I guess something in the system was changed. So go ahead and try to stomp pubs like you say and get high scores. You probably wont succeed because you need like 3 kills per minute to get such scores. And indeed to get those kills you better not lose you lifeform or shotgun.
    The skill tracks how efficient you kill and of course its easier to kill rookies. Also the skill system plays quite in my hand as I do not play competitive but only pub.
    A few days ago I played my first gather and as the server was whitelisted ( didn't know :D ) I lost alot of skill rating. So you can see that the skill rating rewards the best but stomper ( which does not mean its easy, go and try). Competitive players wont have a chance to get to the top as the servers they play on might be whitelisted.
    I myself would love a skillsystem that gives you points based on opponents so you can really compare your skill and don't have to stomp pubs. I don't think thats gonna happen as it's not easy to implement it. You will always have problems distinguishing public and competitive.

    Maybe one should be able to decide if the round gets tracked at the start of it. Dunno if that would help though.

    Greetings Nick

    P.S. My nick was already taken in this Forum :(
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  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members
    Roobubba wrote: »
    amoral wrote: »
    Mendasp wrote: »
    Considering the stats ignore your opponent's skill they are not indicative of anything except how much you play (pub?). The skill rating certainly doesn't track skill.

    eh, let's give it a little credit, if you pub at all, it can probably be counted on to get you in the right quartile?

    Nope, because it only uses your last 20 games in the calculation. If you play a lot of comp games and don't put some pub stomps in between them, your score will go through the floor. The ONLY way to get high 'skill' at the minute is to pub stomp.

    :) but quartiles are pretty big. so 50 percent + or - 25. im also assuming the majority floats under 200, because new players are fodder. me for example, I float 550, soI think it put me in the right place. 75 percent plus or minus 25.
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