Wooza's playground needs to die a horrible death in fire. Should not be visible to rookies, lest they get an absolutely appauling first impression of the game. I played a couple of games and it is my personal opinion that whoever is allowing this travesty to exist should be hogtied and lowered into a volcano shot.
Pros
- Lots of players so your individual efforts have less effect on the overall outcome of the game
Cons
- Lots of players so your individual efforts have less effect on the overall outcome of the game
- Terrible network performance
- Terrible local performance
- Too many players to possibly med/ammo even half the people who need it
- Nobody seems to have sound, or a brain
- Game balance is obviously completely fucked
- See above posts
I played this server a while ago, commed and played on the ground for both sides. It's an unholy turd on the face of Ns2.
The scary thing was, when I did manage to get some verbal reactions from people regarding their experience on the server, they didn't seem to have any clue that NS2 is not intended to run 40 players from a performance or balance aspect.
I pointed out the terrible early game tick rate to wooza when I tried his server out, his response was 'what do you expect? I'm running 42 slots'
if you know it gives an awful experience because it is way beyond your hardware's capability, then you also know that what you're doing is falsely advertising bad game performance to the many people who don't know this is a hacked, unofficial game mode.
If this is true, I feel personally insulted. Shocking lack of integrity.
Server is a disaster. When late game comes, it's literally like watching a slideshow. Huge freezes every 15-20 seconds, horrible rubber banding, micro stuttering, etc. I don't understand how people enjoy that.
While I also have mixed feelings about 20v20 gameplay and performance, I think that blaming those couple servers of taking players from normal 6v6 / 8v8 servers and thus destroying NS2 is just dumb.
If people keep joining those servers despite the bad fps and balance, the normal servers simply lack somewhere. The market is all about demand and supply and whoever is not up to the competition and fails to supply, will fall behind.
I also wouldn't suggest that 'many people understand that it's a modded version of the game.' Sure, people who hang around here will know that, but average joe pubber doesn't - also judging by the sheer number of 'WTF lag?!' comments I saw when I played on Wooza's server, I contest that the vast majority of people who play there have NO CLUE that the performance isn't meant to be like that.
Of course it doesn't help that the 18 slot official multiplay servers have godawful performance as well
I'm not saying that people don't enjoy playing on high player count servers, but I am suggesting that they don't appreciate just how drastic the effect of high player counts is upon both server and client performance.
Otherwise why do they constantly spam 'omg lag' 'WTF' 'what is this red plug?' 'AARGH' in chat - which I see ALL THE TIME in larger servers?
My one major complaint about servers this big, is that it takes from other servers. You could have two 20 players servers full.
Sorry but this is flawed logic. There are already plenty of 20 player servers also available at the same time. Yet people are choosing to go to Wooza's 42 player server. Nothing is stopping them from going to 20 player servers. Here, for these players at least, the crowd has chosen.
While I understand the attraction of large servers (casual atmosphere, low individual player value, sheer mayhem), I still think the sweet spot for public games is 18-20 players. Its a perfect balance of mayhem and casual fun, while still allowing for some tactics and strategy
This is also a bit of a misnomer, but only a bit The comparison earlier that it's like Combat is fair -- I used to like Combat in NS1, but I much preferred a normal game on a larger server. This gives purpose to the fighthing and allows for much more dynamic games, as opposed to Combat which was just a frag-fest.
And that's what some people may be missing here, and perhaps I'm at fault in my OP describing the fights -- Wooza's provides both intese fighting experiences, but it's still a stragegic game to win. Early game is just like on small servers where using your head will get you ahead on the field or as a comm, and late-game I've played many games where hives and come and go and been re-taken again as both teams try to outwit the other.
Lots of players != less strategy. It gives rise to new strategies in addition to old ones. Though you still have to deal with pub mentality and having not everyone listening to the comm.
Wooza's playground needs to die a horrible death in fire. Should not be visible to rookies, lest they get an absolutely appauling first impression of the game. I played a couple of games and it is my personal opinion that whoever is allowing this travesty to exist should be hogtied and lowered into a volcano.
Weeeellll I think that's a bit over the top, but as you said it's your opinion. Have you considered that if the rookies find Wooza's immensely fun that this is encouraging to NS2? I've been getting a friend into NS2 recently using Woozas. He's not a professional player, and just wants to play for fun. Your own comment about the volume of players having less of an impact overall is probably one of the reasons this works in his favour.
I do think it's interesting the level of vitriol so far in response to the topic, though. If you read this you'd think no one would be on Woozas, but that's clearly not the case given there's frequently queues to get on.
Actually there is a human psychology element to server population that you're not considering - it does give weight to the argument that large servers are taking players away from smaller servers. It's not a popular argument, because to some degree it suggests that we humans are creatures of habit rather than completely free will
I would add in that I do sometimes join these silly servers, but absolutely not for any interest in playing the game at any strategic level. Like combat servers, I use them occasionally to warm up my aim and movement. They offer me zero enjoyment on any 'strategic' level, but do offer the opportunity to practice how to react when being swarmed (on either team) - provided the server hardware can handle the playercount (which on wooza's is absolutely not the case). I certainly wouldn't bother trying to do any kind of teamwork on these servers, and most of my friends say the same thing to me: it's fine for a frag fest, but it's not really NS2
If people keep joining those servers despite the bad fps and balance, the normal servers simply lack somewhere. The market is all about demand and supply and whoever is not up to the competition and fails to supply, will fall behind.
Following on from my last post, this probably sums it up nicely. There is clerly a demand for the type of gameplay Wooza's provides.
Otherwise why do they constantly spam 'omg lag' 'WTF' 'what is this red plug?' 'AARGH' in chat - which I see ALL THE TIME in larger servers?
I won't lie I've seen that on Wooza's too, usually when the game ends and everyone is dumped into the ready room. Also sometimes in the most intense firefights, but I think it depends on map. I've not seen this on any other server though, maybe the AU 20 players ones are just beefier
I pointed out the terrible early game tick rate to wooza when I tried his server out, his response was 'what do you expect? I'm running 42 slots'
if you know it gives an awful experience because it is way beyond your hardware's capability, then you also know that what you're doing is falsely advertising bad game performance to the many people who don't know this is a hacked, unofficial game mode.
I think you are not getting the point. You look at this from a competitive player's point of view. For you it's horrible.
That's fine. It's your opinion and you have the right to have this opinion.
But just because you think it's not an enjoyable experience, doesn't mean it can't be for others.
So, please, stop telling other people what to do based on your very personal preferences.
UWE is never gonna put 24+ servers up becouse they dont want to give bad publicity for their own engine by revealing the allknown fact that the engine cannot handle 24+ players without ticrate drops or lag and overall bad performance. Thats why UWE shut down Onos Bar 32 slot server and took legal action or whatever they did to make him take it down.
@Benson oh no!! Why did you go and bring KKG into this... As if there wasn't going to be enough larger sever flaming. Oh well it's like combat, it's fun to run around and kill without a care.
Like it or not, KKG servers are almost always populated, and rarely have performance issues. (and Ive never seen evidence of abuse, like some people clam is rampant).
My first impression on the server was on veil. We (alien team) got overrun and isolated by dozens of gl spamming rines. And there was no way to stop them in the small corridors. That let me miss all the awesome ns1 alien weaponry and I was admittedly a bit angry. But players kept defending the situation vehemently and explained that the w/l rate on the server is very balanced. I gave the big server a few more chances and they were right. You have to think differently and use different tactics on such a big server. But I never had so much fun playing my map And I am grateful for that.
The server seems to be full all the time. My favorite 18-24 player servers are full as well, so I don't see a problem here. It is like saying: I like ns1 siege maps in this forum. Then the same guys will pop up and tell you how wrong you are in likeing them You are wrong and I am awesome. That's the spirit of nowadays internet users. Be happy that others have fun playing on a 42 player server. That's better then all the complaining.
IeptBarakatThe most difficult name to speak ingame.Join Date: 2009-07-10Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
edited March 2014
I had fun on the server, not that fun matters anymore. My favorite experiences in ns1 were in 32 player servers and siege maps, yet people will say this is the wrong way to play the game.
Besides, if the netcode wasn't so awful in the first place the server performance wouldn't be as bad as it is.
He's not a professional player, and just wants to play for fun. Your own comment about the volume of players having less of an impact overall is probably one of the reasons this works in his favour.
Thats exactly the point why it's always full. There are a lot of players that don't want the deep strategic component of NS2 and just like to shoot/bite stuff all day. It doesn't have anything to do with being a competitive player. Me personally, I have never played even a PUG/Gather but still avoid servers bigger then 18 slots for all the mentioned reasons. Aside from the obvious performance and balance problems, it is simply impossible to do any real strategy/teamwork. The reason is not that the game mechanics wont allow for that, but that these servers primarily attract people whose idea of the game is running around as a marine with a GL/Flamer shooting at random stuff while disabling voice chat and listening to music. The mentioned "strategy" mainly consists of beaconing 20 players close to a hive and have them rush it, or making a huge xeno/onos crazyhouse out of marine start and lagging around randomly pressing their mouse key.
I'm just glad a big portion of these players stay away from smaller servers and have their random laggy crapfests with themselves, so I think it's a good thing these servers exist and hope more people operate one. I'm running my public server on 14 slots with 2 reserved additional ones, and I'm very happy when these kind of players stay away .
The significant portion of the issue is that higher player counts totally break the standard game mode.
I wouldn't even care if it was a combat server, seige, or something. I'd probably even play it if the lag wasn't so damned awful and if the server wasn't full of newbies.
I think you are not getting the point. You look at this from a competitive player's point of view. For you it's horrible..
I Pub exclusively and it is my opinion that knowingly providing broken, laggy, rubber banding gameplay to new NS2 players is doing a disservice to player retention
I wouldn't care half as much about any hacked playercount servers and the horrid imbalance that ensues ... as long as the server hardware could handle it. (which it can't, in this case)
I Pub exclusively and it is my opinion that knowingly providing broken, laggy, rubber banding gameplay to new NS2 players is doing a disservice to player retention
I wouldn't care half as much about any hacked playercount servers and the horrid imbalance that ensues ... as long as the server hardware could handle it. (which it can't, in this case)
This, a million times this. I get rather frustrated that people would continue to play on laggy servers (+20 slots/Bad hardware) as it keeps the genuinely decent servers from being filled. I figure they are either misinformed and keep going to the server just because they believe the game is suppose to lag, or because they don't care.
However, both of these scenarios are terrible. People should care about performance, people should be informed on bad performance. It gives really bad impressions and frustration to other players because they don't have a choice in servers to pick from. "Let's see, should I join this 23/24 server that red plugs every 5s... or sit in their 0/18 UWE Official and hope it fills?".
I think playing on Wooza's server is like playing Reverse Chess (aka Antichess). No doubt, the game is meant to be played differently, and that variant has neither the tactical depth nor the unique "gameplay feel" as the original version. Clearly, the original version has to be preferred.
However, who plays Reverse Chess?
A) Players who enjoy it more than usual chess, maybe because it's too hard or because it's too complex; they either play Reverse or not at all Players who attempted chess but lack the skill to play it; however, they still play Reverse Chess because they can and because they think it's fun
C) Chess Players with the skill and motivation to play normal chess, but who enjoy the occasional party of Reverse Chess just for fun
Player types A and B are unlikely to ever play real chess. If you'd force them to stop playing Reverse Chess, they would drop chess as a whole. Player type C however is not likely to play too much of Reverse Chess in the first place.
Now, this analogy is (of course) not perfect, but I think it gets my point across: Oversized servers like Wooza's are unlikely to seriously harm NS2: The players there either wouldn't enhance your standard pub game (A&B), or know what they are doing, anyway, and are all but lost to the NS2 community forever (C).
This is different, however, with 24 player servers, for two reasons:
1) They trick you into thinking you are "playing real chess", while actually their balancing AND performance are considerably worse than what is acceptable
2a) Assuming that the sweet spot in public play is 18 players (personal preference), they drain 6 players/server from other servers; meaning that you'd only have to scale down 3 full 24 players servers to get 4 full 18 player servers - that's a 25% increase
2b) There's hella lot of 24p servers, worsening the effect considerably. Compared to that, a single 40p server is insignificant, and at the same time so ludicrously oversized that I can't be taken as seriously (even by less experienced players; please, don't underestimate the intelligence of an individual).
By this logic, 3 - 4 24p servers are actually worse than 1 40p server. (Note that a lost player from a 24p server is actually slightly worse than one from a 40p server, because he thinks he's "playing real chess").
Now, tell me, how many 24p servers and how many 40p servers are there in your list, and how often and long are they populated?
So let's go back to bashing 24p servers, and let some people have fun on 40. It's not like you are forced to play with them, either
This post got way more elaborated than I originally intended...
Official servers are multiplay servers that can't even hold 30 ticks late game, how would it ever run with 42 people.
I think this is just that the Multiplay servers are well below par more than anything else ..
I should know .. I've been running one for a while now .. also a bluefangsolutions one .. and bluefang > multiplay
UWE servers being multiplay is probably down to the interface and profiling options .. and less about their performance Even though their servers report consistent tick rates of 30 .. but if you're actually ingame .. it's different .. the red plug and have issues with hitreg in my experience
if you know it gives an awful experience because it is way beyond your hardware's capability, then you also know that what you're doing is falsely advertising bad game performance to the many people who don't know this is a hacked, unofficial game mode.
I'm sorry but I can't condone that sort of behaviour: it does more harm than good to the community as a whole.
The reason these servers get populated ..
1. is they can sustain lose of players .. an entire team can ragequit and there's still enough to play another game ..
2. they appear at the top of the list if you sort by players (to throw empty servers down to the bottom)
3. new players seek refuge in the anonymity of large servers
4. ppl assume that since the server has so many players, it must be good ...
5. the other servers are empty :P
My one major complaint about servers this big, is that it takes from other servers. You could have two 20 players servers full.
Sorry but this is flawed logic. There are already plenty of 20 player servers also available at the same time. Yet people are choosing to go to Wooza's 42 player server. Nothing is stopping them from going to 20 player servers. Here, for these players at least, the crowd has chosen.
Not really.
Besides the reasons Balmark just mentioned, I have one more that happens to me often. I prefer servers with 20 player count, but I only like 18 players playing. I open ns2, I look for a server. I see only one server with a slot open. It happens to be usually a 24p slot. I have the choice to either seed an empty server or join the 24p server because I would rather play than seed. In the case of this 42 player server, now there is even less servers with players. Now all I would see is a few full 24p servers and a slot open on the 42p server.
I know a good many people personally, at least enough to fill that 42p server would rather play on a smaller player count but don't do to laziness and would rather just play the game regardless of quality. Other join out of ignorance. Regardless a 42p server is a cancer.
I may also dislike 24p servers and wish they would all drop down to 18-20p. They do have a decent reason I do believe, that is rage quits wont kill the server. This 42p server is so overkill it can't claim that distinction.
One thing in favour of larger servers is the statistical likelihood of having a player prepared to command on each team. In my experience, delays at the start of a game waiting for 2 commanders are the primary reason that smaller servers do sometimes empty out more than larger ones.
But it's still possible to kill a large server in prime time by stacking (I've *ahem* seen it done *ahem* on KKG before)
dePARAJoin Date: 2011-04-29Member: 96321Members, Squad Five Blue
@ UWE (Andi)
Please introduce upcoming server- client- and movementrate changes without any serveroptimations.
The result would be:
If serveradmins of >24 slot servers want to change the rates, the server would end rubberbanding from hell or hopefully exploding cause the higher serverload.
I'm sure people remember playing on BF3 64 player operation metro. Complete chaos and stupidity and that is exactly what you should expect from a 42 player server. I play there every now and then just to chill out and turn off my brain and I would assume I am with the majority. When I play SC2, I prefer 4v4s and custom games rather than 1v1 from time to time. Having that luxury of choosing what type of server and experience you want is beneficial in my eyes.
But trying to get any sort of empathy or understanding from people on these forums or in this community in general is impossible considering how much of a superiority complex competitive players and vets (rightfully so in some respects) have regarding 24+ servers. More often that not, in the eyes of a vet, if you play on 24 player or more then you're scum. That's the impression I get on these forums.
Servers like this have value, people seem to like them, keeps them playing and provides a nice alternative to the strategic aspect of the game considering how dead combat is now. The server also never dies during peak hours, it's always up and even if half leave you can still get a game going. Also, they don't lag as much as you would think, sometimes it gets bad but it's usually consistent. Obviously not as smooth as a lower count server but it runs much better than I thought it would initially.
Most new players that join see 1 42 player server and dozens of 24 or less, safe to assume that the majority of rookies can identify that it's usually not the norm. Can't say that this server is good for the game at the moment considering how low the playercount is, maybe if we could retain players and average 2k players @ peak then having a server like this as a potential option can be a lot better for the game than another 24 player server.
But trying to get any sort of empathy or understanding from people on these forums or in this community in general is impossible considering how much of a superiority complex competitive players and vets (rightfully so in some respects) have regarding 24+ servers. More often that not, in the eyes of a vet, if you play on 24 player or more then you're scum. That's the impression I get on these forums.
I think that pretty much nails it.
Finally, there's only one other thing that need be said:
Every server starts out empty. Ever server requires at least one player to join to seed it. As many of you have confirmed, larger servers get seeded over small ones. And that's everything you need to know -- that's what the majority of the NS2 community is doing, choosing to seed larger servers. You think these servers are killing the community, but what you don't see is that they're saving it. Without them, right now, there would be less players playing.
So if anything, much though the elite among you may hate to think about it, you should be thanking Wooza. New players join, and stay, for servers like this.
Comments
Pros
- Lots of players so your individual efforts have less effect on the overall outcome of the game
Cons
- Lots of players so your individual efforts have less effect on the overall outcome of the game
- Terrible network performance
- Terrible local performance
- Too many players to possibly med/ammo even half the people who need it
- Nobody seems to have sound, or a brain
- Game balance is obviously completely fucked
- See above posts
I played this server a while ago, commed and played on the ground for both sides. It's an unholy turd on the face of Ns2.
The scary thing was, when I did manage to get some verbal reactions from people regarding their experience on the server, they didn't seem to have any clue that NS2 is not intended to run 40 players from a performance or balance aspect.
If this is true, I feel personally insulted. Shocking lack of integrity.
If people keep joining those servers despite the bad fps and balance, the normal servers simply lack somewhere. The market is all about demand and supply and whoever is not up to the competition and fails to supply, will fall behind.
Of course it doesn't help that the 18 slot official multiplay servers have godawful performance as well
I'm not saying that people don't enjoy playing on high player count servers, but I am suggesting that they don't appreciate just how drastic the effect of high player counts is upon both server and client performance.
Otherwise why do they constantly spam 'omg lag' 'WTF' 'what is this red plug?' 'AARGH' in chat - which I see ALL THE TIME in larger servers?
This is also a bit of a misnomer, but only a bit
And that's what some people may be missing here, and perhaps I'm at fault in my OP describing the fights -- Wooza's provides both intese fighting experiences, but it's still a stragegic game to win. Early game is just like on small servers where using your head will get you ahead on the field or as a comm, and late-game I've played many games where hives and come and go and been re-taken again as both teams try to outwit the other.
Lots of players != less strategy. It gives rise to new strategies in addition to old ones. Though you still have to deal with pub mentality and having not everyone listening to the comm.
Lol. How does it play over satellite?
Weeeellll I think that's a bit over the top, but as you said it's your opinion. Have you considered that if the rookies find Wooza's immensely fun that this is encouraging to NS2? I've been getting a friend into NS2 recently using Woozas. He's not a professional player, and just wants to play for fun. Your own comment about the volume of players having less of an impact overall is probably one of the reasons this works in his favour.
I do think it's interesting the level of vitriol so far in response to the topic, though. If you read this you'd think no one would be on Woozas, but that's clearly not the case given there's frequently queues to get on.
I would add in that I do sometimes join these silly servers, but absolutely not for any interest in playing the game at any strategic level. Like combat servers, I use them occasionally to warm up my aim and movement. They offer me zero enjoyment on any 'strategic' level, but do offer the opportunity to practice how to react when being swarmed (on either team) - provided the server hardware can handle the playercount (which on wooza's is absolutely not the case). I certainly wouldn't bother trying to do any kind of teamwork on these servers, and most of my friends say the same thing to me: it's fine for a frag fest, but it's not really NS2
I won't lie I've seen that on Wooza's too, usually when the game ends and everyone is dumped into the ready room. Also sometimes in the most intense firefights, but I think it depends on map. I've not seen this on any other server though, maybe the AU 20 players ones are just beefier
I think you are not getting the point. You look at this from a competitive player's point of view. For you it's horrible.
That's fine. It's your opinion and you have the right to have this opinion.
But just because you think it's not an enjoyable experience, doesn't mean it can't be for others.
So, please, stop telling other people what to do based on your very personal preferences.
Thank you.
Like it or not, KKG servers are almost always populated, and rarely have performance issues. (and Ive never seen evidence of abuse, like some people clam is rampant).
They must be doing something that the people want
My first impression on the server was on veil. We (alien team) got overrun and isolated by dozens of gl spamming rines. And there was no way to stop them in the small corridors. That let me miss all the awesome ns1 alien weaponry and I was admittedly a bit angry. But players kept defending the situation vehemently and explained that the w/l rate on the server is very balanced. I gave the big server a few more chances and they were right. You have to think differently and use different tactics on such a big server. But I never had so much fun playing my map
The server seems to be full all the time. My favorite 18-24 player servers are full as well, so I don't see a problem here. It is like saying: I like ns1 siege maps in this forum. Then the same guys will pop up and tell you how wrong you are in likeing them
Besides, if the netcode wasn't so awful in the first place the server performance wouldn't be as bad as it is.
I'm just glad a big portion of these players stay away from smaller servers and have their random laggy crapfests with themselves, so I think it's a good thing these servers exist and hope more people operate one. I'm running my public server on 14 slots with 2 reserved additional ones, and I'm very happy when these kind of players stay away
I wouldn't even care if it was a combat server, seige, or something. I'd probably even play it if the lag wasn't so damned awful and if the server wasn't full of newbies.
I wouldn't care half as much about any hacked playercount servers and the horrid imbalance that ensues ... as long as the server hardware could handle it. (which it can't, in this case)
Are you spreading misinformation again? Please provide your source
This, a million times this. I get rather frustrated that people would continue to play on laggy servers (+20 slots/Bad hardware) as it keeps the genuinely decent servers from being filled. I figure they are either misinformed and keep going to the server just because they believe the game is suppose to lag, or because they don't care.
However, both of these scenarios are terrible. People should care about performance, people should be informed on bad performance. It gives really bad impressions and frustration to other players because they don't have a choice in servers to pick from. "Let's see, should I join this 23/24 server that red plugs every 5s... or sit in their 0/18 UWE Official and hope it fills?".
However, who plays Reverse Chess?
A) Players who enjoy it more than usual chess, maybe because it's too hard or because it's too complex; they either play Reverse or not at all
C) Chess Players with the skill and motivation to play normal chess, but who enjoy the occasional party of Reverse Chess just for fun
Player types A and B are unlikely to ever play real chess. If you'd force them to stop playing Reverse Chess, they would drop chess as a whole. Player type C however is not likely to play too much of Reverse Chess in the first place.
Now, this analogy is (of course) not perfect, but I think it gets my point across: Oversized servers like Wooza's are unlikely to seriously harm NS2: The players there either wouldn't enhance your standard pub game (A&B), or know what they are doing, anyway, and are all but lost to the NS2 community forever (C).
This is different, however, with 24 player servers, for two reasons:
1) They trick you into thinking you are "playing real chess", while actually their balancing AND performance are considerably worse than what is acceptable
2a) Assuming that the sweet spot in public play is 18 players (personal preference), they drain 6 players/server from other servers; meaning that you'd only have to scale down 3 full 24 players servers to get 4 full 18 player servers - that's a 25% increase
2b) There's hella lot of 24p servers, worsening the effect considerably. Compared to that, a single 40p server is insignificant, and at the same time so ludicrously oversized that I can't be taken as seriously (even by less experienced players; please, don't underestimate the intelligence of an individual).
By this logic, 3 - 4 24p servers are actually worse than 1 40p server. (Note that a lost player from a 24p server is actually slightly worse than one from a 40p server, because he thinks he's "playing real chess").
Now, tell me, how many 24p servers and how many 40p servers are there in your list, and how often and long are they populated?
So let's go back to bashing 24p servers, and let some people have fun on 40. It's not like you are forced to play with them, either
This post got way more elaborated than I originally intended...
I should know .. I've been running one for a while now .. also a bluefangsolutions one .. and bluefang > multiplay
UWE servers being multiplay is probably down to the interface and profiling options .. and less about their performance
so true ..
1. is they can sustain lose of players .. an entire team can ragequit and there's still enough to play another game ..
2. they appear at the top of the list if you sort by players (to throw empty servers down to the bottom)
3. new players seek refuge in the anonymity of large servers
4. ppl assume that since the server has so many players, it must be good ...
5. the other servers are empty :P
Not really.
Besides the reasons Balmark just mentioned, I have one more that happens to me often. I prefer servers with 20 player count, but I only like 18 players playing. I open ns2, I look for a server. I see only one server with a slot open. It happens to be usually a 24p slot. I have the choice to either seed an empty server or join the 24p server because I would rather play than seed. In the case of this 42 player server, now there is even less servers with players. Now all I would see is a few full 24p servers and a slot open on the 42p server.
I know a good many people personally, at least enough to fill that 42p server would rather play on a smaller player count but don't do to laziness and would rather just play the game regardless of quality. Other join out of ignorance. Regardless a 42p server is a cancer.
I may also dislike 24p servers and wish they would all drop down to 18-20p. They do have a decent reason I do believe, that is rage quits wont kill the server. This 42p server is so overkill it can't claim that distinction.
But it's still possible to kill a large server in prime time by stacking (I've *ahem* seen it done *ahem* on KKG before)
Please introduce upcoming server- client- and movementrate changes without any serveroptimations.
The result would be:
If serveradmins of >24 slot servers want to change the rates, the server would end rubberbanding from hell or hopefully exploding cause the higher serverload.
@RadimaX dead thread alert:
Pretty sure it was their own decision to shut it down.
OP-wise anyways, I've never seen it w/ a slot open, so I've never been able to play on it. But hey, kinda points to the obvious popularity of it.
But trying to get any sort of empathy or understanding from people on these forums or in this community in general is impossible considering how much of a superiority complex competitive players and vets (rightfully so in some respects) have regarding 24+ servers. More often that not, in the eyes of a vet, if you play on 24 player or more then you're scum. That's the impression I get on these forums.
Servers like this have value, people seem to like them, keeps them playing and provides a nice alternative to the strategic aspect of the game considering how dead combat is now. The server also never dies during peak hours, it's always up and even if half leave you can still get a game going. Also, they don't lag as much as you would think, sometimes it gets bad but it's usually consistent. Obviously not as smooth as a lower count server but it runs much better than I thought it would initially.
Most new players that join see 1 42 player server and dozens of 24 or less, safe to assume that the majority of rookies can identify that it's usually not the norm. Can't say that this server is good for the game at the moment considering how low the playercount is, maybe if we could retain players and average 2k players @ peak then having a server like this as a potential option can be a lot better for the game than another 24 player server.
And if I've had a change of perspective, so can you
I think that pretty much nails it.
Finally, there's only one other thing that need be said:
Every server starts out empty. Ever server requires at least one player to join to seed it. As many of you have confirmed, larger servers get seeded over small ones. And that's everything you need to know -- that's what the majority of the NS2 community is doing, choosing to seed larger servers. You think these servers are killing the community, but what you don't see is that they're saving it. Without them, right now, there would be less players playing.
So if anything, much though the elite among you may hate to think about it, you should be thanking Wooza. New players join, and stay, for servers like this.
Including me.