Top 5 Exploits...
Savant
Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
<div class="IPBDescription">List 5 exploits you'd like to see fixed</div> The idea behind this thread is NOT to debate whether you agree or disagree with what a person considers an exploit. Instead of rudely hijacking this thread, <b>please</b> start your own thread debating what you do/don't think are exploits. Otherwise, I'm interested to hear what exploits people would like to see fixed. Here are mine in no particular order.
Top 5 exploits that I feel need fixing:
<b>Aliens:</b>
<b>Resource donation</b> - While some see this as a feature, it really shouldn't be allowed since it does imbalance the game. However, instead of forfeiting resources from players who leave the game, perhaps an alternate method could be used. EG, if any player leaves, their resources are placed into a 'virtual resource node' which will meter out the resources to the team much like a regular resource node does. That way the team isn't penalized by a player dropping, but they will not gain an unfair advantage from it.
<b>RR resource exploit</b> - This exploit has Aliens using a specific manner to allow them to start the game with move than 10 resources. As you can imagine, this can cause the Aliens to get a hive much sooner.
<b>Chambers blocking doors/lifts</b> - This isn't necessary, and really should be curtailed. Most locations where a gorge feels the need to block an elevator could still be defended with a good tower of chambers. Chambers should not be able to disable any part of a map in a way that makes it impossible for Marines to advance without sieging continuously.
<b>Drawviewmodel exploit</b> - While this was acknowledged as an exploit by the developers, a fix has yet to been seen. I'm not sure if they intend to fix it, but I believe it should be disabled as it can give an unfair advantage to any player, but moreso to alien skulks.
<b>Open welded vents</b> - This doesn't happen with all vents, but there are some vents that can be 'forced' open in a certain manner by the aliens. This basically makes welding the vent pretty pointless. If aliens are allowed to open vents then marines should be able to seal them again.
<b>Marines:</b>
<b>Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop</b> - This exploit allows marines to move at a speed that can EXCEED that of a skulk AND be able to fire. The reverse exploit has a Marine do a 180 and then bunny hop backwards at a speed far in excess of the backwards moving speed, at the same while firing away with no decrease in accuracy. Given the developers made it so that Marines would move at a set speed, AND there are no Marine speed upgrades AND certain things make the Marines go slower (like HMGs) Marines should not be bunny hopping to gain speed. Also, most mods have some restriction on bunny hopping which causes accuracy to diminish, but the simple method is to make it so that Marine can only fire their weapons when their feet are on ground. (with exceptions made for jetpacks) Let's not turn NS into a TFC clone with mindless bunny hopping.
<b>Invulnerable Marines</b> - With a little 'assistance' from the commander a Marine can becomes nearly invulnerable to Alien attack. I'm speaking about medpacks of course. The 'medpack shower' can provide a marine with an inexhaustible supply of health, and it is not uncommon for a marine to go through 500 health before being killed as a result. This provides an unfair advantage to the Marines. (the Alien defence chambers and such can't even come close) A simple time limit on the drop of medpacks (one per 2 seconds) would provide the potential of 1500 health points in a minute, and could replenish an entire team of 15 Marines up to full health in that time.
<b>Crouching Marine hitbox</b> - This is a nasty exploit that is used by Marines mainly in vents, but I am now seeing it more in open places as well. Basically the crouching Marine will take little or no damage by skulks, and as such this gives them an unfair advantage. The hitbox is messed up, and by the time a skulk adjusts their tactics to try and kill them, they end up dead. This needs fixing.
<b>Top of hive kill</b> - There is nothing wrong with jetpacks, but Marines were never supposed to get on TOP of the hives. This is evident by the design of many hives which make a Marine on top of the hive invulnerable since Aliens can't reach it. Hives should be redesigned so that Marines take heavy damage when in contact with the hive. They are PLENTY of other ways to kill a hive by gun/grenade/welder etc., not to mention siege cannons, so this isn't a big loss.
<b>Recycle during attack</b> This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.
Regards,
Savant
Top 5 exploits that I feel need fixing:
<b>Aliens:</b>
<b>Resource donation</b> - While some see this as a feature, it really shouldn't be allowed since it does imbalance the game. However, instead of forfeiting resources from players who leave the game, perhaps an alternate method could be used. EG, if any player leaves, their resources are placed into a 'virtual resource node' which will meter out the resources to the team much like a regular resource node does. That way the team isn't penalized by a player dropping, but they will not gain an unfair advantage from it.
<b>RR resource exploit</b> - This exploit has Aliens using a specific manner to allow them to start the game with move than 10 resources. As you can imagine, this can cause the Aliens to get a hive much sooner.
<b>Chambers blocking doors/lifts</b> - This isn't necessary, and really should be curtailed. Most locations where a gorge feels the need to block an elevator could still be defended with a good tower of chambers. Chambers should not be able to disable any part of a map in a way that makes it impossible for Marines to advance without sieging continuously.
<b>Drawviewmodel exploit</b> - While this was acknowledged as an exploit by the developers, a fix has yet to been seen. I'm not sure if they intend to fix it, but I believe it should be disabled as it can give an unfair advantage to any player, but moreso to alien skulks.
<b>Open welded vents</b> - This doesn't happen with all vents, but there are some vents that can be 'forced' open in a certain manner by the aliens. This basically makes welding the vent pretty pointless. If aliens are allowed to open vents then marines should be able to seal them again.
<b>Marines:</b>
<b>Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop</b> - This exploit allows marines to move at a speed that can EXCEED that of a skulk AND be able to fire. The reverse exploit has a Marine do a 180 and then bunny hop backwards at a speed far in excess of the backwards moving speed, at the same while firing away with no decrease in accuracy. Given the developers made it so that Marines would move at a set speed, AND there are no Marine speed upgrades AND certain things make the Marines go slower (like HMGs) Marines should not be bunny hopping to gain speed. Also, most mods have some restriction on bunny hopping which causes accuracy to diminish, but the simple method is to make it so that Marine can only fire their weapons when their feet are on ground. (with exceptions made for jetpacks) Let's not turn NS into a TFC clone with mindless bunny hopping.
<b>Invulnerable Marines</b> - With a little 'assistance' from the commander a Marine can becomes nearly invulnerable to Alien attack. I'm speaking about medpacks of course. The 'medpack shower' can provide a marine with an inexhaustible supply of health, and it is not uncommon for a marine to go through 500 health before being killed as a result. This provides an unfair advantage to the Marines. (the Alien defence chambers and such can't even come close) A simple time limit on the drop of medpacks (one per 2 seconds) would provide the potential of 1500 health points in a minute, and could replenish an entire team of 15 Marines up to full health in that time.
<b>Crouching Marine hitbox</b> - This is a nasty exploit that is used by Marines mainly in vents, but I am now seeing it more in open places as well. Basically the crouching Marine will take little or no damage by skulks, and as such this gives them an unfair advantage. The hitbox is messed up, and by the time a skulk adjusts their tactics to try and kill them, they end up dead. This needs fixing.
<b>Top of hive kill</b> - There is nothing wrong with jetpacks, but Marines were never supposed to get on TOP of the hives. This is evident by the design of many hives which make a Marine on top of the hive invulnerable since Aliens can't reach it. Hives should be redesigned so that Marines take heavy damage when in contact with the hive. They are PLENTY of other ways to kill a hive by gun/grenade/welder etc., not to mention siege cannons, so this isn't a big loss.
<b>Recycle during attack</b> This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.
Regards,
Savant
Comments
If Marines can weld vents i really feel this should be left in
even if the marines cant weld the vents this is something that
can really save an alien team even if it is last ditch
...
<b>Recycle during attack</b> This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If a commander is going to focus on one guy, and spend the resources to heal him, then I fail to see the 'exploit'. I mean, all aliens (with the exception of gorge, but a gorge shouldn't be alone anyways) can move faster than marines, and can run away to heal. And if the commander is focused on this one guy, then he isn't paying any attention to anywhere else on the map.
And buildings take a while (30 secs maybe?) after the commander clicks the recycle button before the building actually recycles and the RPs are regained. More often than not, the building is destroyed before it's recycled.
RR resource exploit - This exploit has Aliens using a specific manner to allow them to start the game with move than 10 resources. As you can imagine, this can cause the Aliens to get a hive much sooner.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't know that this was something that anyone could make happen. I thought it just did sometimes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Chambers blocking doors/lifts - This isn't necessary, and really should be curtailed. Most ...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not an exploit.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Drawviewmodel exploit - While this was acknowledged as an exploit by the developers, a fix ...
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Is this still do-able in 1.04? I never have tested it.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Open welded vents - This doesn't happen with all vents, but there are some vents that can be 'forced' open in a certain manner by the aliens. This basically makes welding the vent pretty pointless. If aliens are allowed to open vents then marines should be able to seal them again.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not an exploit. Map makers can make them this way if they want. They are supposed to reset however AFAIK.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop - This exploit allows marines to move at a speed that can
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bunny hopping to gain speed is not supposed to happen. Marines jumping around is allowed.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Invulnerable Marines - With a little 'assistance' from the commander a Marine can becomes nearly invulnerable to Alien attack. I'm speaking about medpacks of course. The 'medpack shower' can provide a marine with an inexhaustible supply of health, and it is not uncommon
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not an exploit. This costs marines valuable resources.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Recycle during attack This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not an exploit. Marines still lose some resources and they have to rebuild the structure if they want it again.
Eclipse command.
The walls don't allow skulks to get to the top of the hive.
jumping around is allowed for marines but not if it makes them faster and not if they can jump constantly
blocking doors and lifts is not an exploit.
breaking welded vents is not an exploit.
btw something i don't like is the air control in NS from half-life. it causes really bizarre behavior like people stopping completely in midair and dropping straight down or curving to the side in mid-air. btw skulks can fly much better than lerks can. a lot of the physics stuff needs to change. for example lerks and jetpackers can fly at ridiculous speeds through vents when logically the marine would leave a streak of blood all the way down the vent and the lerk would break his wings banging them against the side of the vents while flapping. some friction when in contact with a surface other than just the floor needs to be implemented and air friction too. i think in general the lerk and jetpacker need to more maneoverable but not be able to kill all their inertia instantaneously like they do now and there should be friction damage and bump damage from crashing into things too fast and too straight on.
and if u dont let someone give out 20 jump commands in 1 second, then it will stop most bunny hoppers
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Recycle during attack This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If that is a exploit.....then u prolly dont know the definition of a exploit.........
Eclipse command.
The walls don't allow skulks to get to the top of the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
correction: it doesnt allow inexperienced skulks to get on top ;P
<b>Aliens:</b>
<b>Resource donation</b> - While some see this as a feature, it really shouldn't be allowed since it does imbalance the game. However, instead of forfeiting resources from players who leave the game, perhaps an alternate method could be used. EG, if any player leaves, their resources are placed into a 'virtual resource node' which will meter out the resources to the team much like a regular resource node does. That way the team isn't penalized by a player dropping, but they will not gain an unfair advantage from it.
<b>RR resource exploit</b> - This exploit has Aliens using a specific manner to allow them to start the game with move than 10 resources. As you can imagine, this can cause the Aliens to get a hive much sooner.
<b>Chambers blocking doors/lifts</b> - This isn't necessary, and really should be curtailed. Most locations where a gorge feels the need to block an elevator could still be defended with a good tower of chambers. Chambers should not be able to disable any part of a map in a way that makes it impossible for Marines to advance without sieging continuously.
<b>Drawviewmodel exploit</b> - While this was acknowledged as an exploit by the developers, a fix has yet to been seen. I'm not sure if they intend to fix it, but I believe it should be disabled as it can give an unfair advantage to any player, but moreso to alien skulks.
<b>Open welded vents</b> - This doesn't happen with all vents, but there are some vents that can be 'forced' open in a certain manner by the aliens. This basically makes welding the vent pretty pointless. If aliens are allowed to open vents then marines should be able to seal them again.
<b>Marines:</b>
<b>Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop</b> - This exploit allows marines to move at a speed that can EXCEED that of a skulk AND be able to fire. The reverse exploit has a Marine do a 180 and then bunny hop backwards at a speed far in excess of the backwards moving speed, at the same while firing away with no decrease in accuracy. Given the developers made it so that Marines would move at a set speed, AND there are no Marine speed upgrades AND certain things make the Marines go slower (like HMGs) Marines should not be bunny hopping to gain speed. Also, most mods have some restriction on bunny hopping which causes accuracy to diminish, but the simple method is to make it so that Marine can only fire their weapons when their feet are on ground. (with exceptions made for jetpacks) Let's not turn NS into a TFC clone with mindless bunny hopping.
<b>Invulnerable Marines</b> - With a little 'assistance' from the commander a Marine can becomes nearly invulnerable to Alien attack. I'm speaking about medpacks of course. The 'medpack shower' can provide a marine with an inexhaustible supply of health, and it is not uncommon for a marine to go through 500 health before being killed as a result. This provides an unfair advantage to the Marines. (the Alien defence chambers and such can't even come close) A simple time limit on the drop of medpacks (one per 2 seconds) would provide the potential of 1500 health points in a minute, and could replenish an entire team of 15 Marines up to full health in that time.
<b>Crouching Marine hitbox</b> - This is a nasty exploit that is used by Marines mainly in vents, but I am now seeing it more in open places as well. Basically the crouching Marine will take little or no damage by skulks, and as such this gives them an unfair advantage. The hitbox is messed up, and by the time a skulk adjusts their tactics to try and kill them, they end up dead. This needs fixing.
<b>Top of hive kill</b> - There is nothing wrong with jetpacks, but Marines were never supposed to get on TOP of the hives. This is evident by the design of many hives which make a Marine on top of the hive invulnerable since Aliens can't reach it. Hives should be redesigned so that Marines take heavy damage when in contact with the hive. They are PLENTY of other ways to kill a hive by gun/grenade/welder etc., not to mention siege cannons, so this isn't a big loss.
<b>Recycle during attack</b> This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Resource donation</b>: apparently this was in the betas and playtesters loved it. Since the community at large hasn't been able to use this feature we can't tell whether it is "good" or "bad". Voogru's mod shows at least that it is probably not as bad as people who have never used it make it out to be.
<b>RR resource exploit</b>: Solution - don't give aliens a default amount of start resources, or only give it once, or set a limit on the number of times you can rejoin from RR.
<b>Chambers blocking doors/lifts</b>: No, it's a nice example of "alien infestation", and at least one dev has said it's creative. I don't see why this should be removed.
<b>Drawviewmodel exploit</b>: this will probably always be possible, and while hurting the feelings of the devs, and being irritating to those who like to play the game correctly it's not as big a deal as people make it out to be (either way - good or bad)
<b>Open welded vents</b>: dont' know what you are talking about here, but yes, if aliens can forcefully open a vent marines should be able to reclose it. In fact, I think vents should just have an initial open/closed state, and be able to be opened/closed repeatedly. Would be nice if the same can be done to doors, but I'll be realistic with the limitations of half life.
<b>Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop</b>: bunny hopping to illegally move faster makes no sense, serves no game purpose, and is simply an "exploit". Hopping in general makes no sense, serves little game purpose, and detracts from the believable environment. A CS-like deterrent to hopping would be nice.
<b>Invulnerable Marines</b>: Huh? No, this provides a *fair* advantage. Aliens get regeneration, and healed by gorges, D chambers, and hives. Medpack is a *feature*.
<b>Crouching Marine hitbox</b>: highly annoying, needs to be fixed. Along with all the other hitboxes, if they are indeed incorrect as that recent thread exposed.
<b>Top of hive kill</b>: who says marines where never supposed to get on top of hives?
<b>Recycle during attack</b>: ok, how about you just get the a percentage of the points back based on health. If it is at 50% health, you only get 50% of the initial cost back.
Eg. "Bunny-hopping is not an exploit, it is a valuable skill and anyone who can master the complex techniques to do it should be allowed to bunny hop."
Translation: I am a bunny-hopper.
Eg. "Aliens going back to the Ready Room to abuse resources and get 2 hives in under 17 seconds is not an exploit, it is a valid tactic because some alien players liked it during testing."
Translation: "I recycle resources like they were soda cans with a 25 cent deposit."
No one is ever going to admit that the "thing they like to do" is an exploit. Which is the problem with threads like this - everyone has used one or more of these "exploits" in the past, and to those who don't like them, they're exploits whether or not they're really meant to be a part of the game.
"Well, when you use towers to block the elevator it makes me cry because I have to walk all the way around. So that's an exploit."
"Well, when you jet pack on top of the hive and I can't get to you, it's an exploit because you can win that way."
"Well, when you build defense towers in the vents so your fades can heal and be invulnerable, I want to tell my mommy it's an exploit because it's hard."
"Well, when you build your siege base above Viaduct in ns_nothing, it's an exploit because you can blow up our hive."
And on and on and on.
The only judge of what's an exploit or not has to be:
1) The game developers
2) The map designers
3) The server admins
In that order. Server admins least important because some of them (who shall remain nameless) like to influence gameplay by using resource exploits and such to unfairly give their team an advantage. So they're hardly unbiased in this regard. Oft times, if you're on the admin's team, you can do all the exploiting you want and get away with it. But if you're on the opposing team, you'd better not even look like you were thinking about bunny-hopping, or it's a kick-ban.
I really wish someone in a position of some import (Flayra?) would just post a list of the things the dev team considers "exploits" so we could cease the endless bickering.
NS_CAGED vent, with the introduction of siege by sight only it will be VERY hard to keep the vent clear of def chambers, the aliens can fit 6! def chambers in the vent and still have enough space to climb up, if you are willing to sacrifice the climbing up through the vent (which may well be the case if the marines have wealded it you can fit 9 def chambers (not sure if the limits allow 9 but you can definatly have 8).
This basically means that the starting base for marines is a death trap the second the aliens have two hives. The possible abuses of that vent are endless even when its wealded.
As when its wealded all that is required is one skulk to run through the base and into the vent and you're hardwork is un-done.
At the bottom end of the scale you get one regen fade up there who spams acid rockets onto anyone who trys to run out, not so bad as you can just nip through the phase which should be not in view of the vent but devistating for the newbs who acctually try and kill the fade.
Moving up we get to the skulk who hides in the vent and parasites anyone running out of base, completly removes the stealth nina sneakyness of the vents.
And finally our star peformer! the 2 hive gorge in the vent!
Evolve gorge up top of vent, spam 8 def chambers evolve carapice evolve adren.
Now wait till you have a good 100 res.
Poke ya noise over the lip of the vent and start webbing, thats right! web the whole damn base! web it fast and furious. Web it far and wide spread the webs out so you've got the intirety of their base plasterd in webs.
Now wait for it to go quiet or for a fade to attack in the front better yet call in lurk support.
Finally drop down spam 3 offy chambers build them up the chances of the marines getting over the web and killing you (considering the 8 def chambers behind you) is very very minimul. Build up a good pile of offence chambers in their base making sure to totally block them off from their res tower.
The problem with this is it makes caged a map on which one good enemy player can decimate you if they get 2 hives.. Which means the marine stratagy has to be to take and hold 2 hives and ignore everything else which if I understand 1.04 correctly is what the devs are trying to stop.
I mean why is the vent into the base there anyway? The marine base is still a swine to defend without it.
BlueGhost
To allow the alien team to do all of the things you just mentioned.
Eclipse command.
The walls don't allow skulks to get to the top of the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
also note that marines can't get on top of the hive in eclipse command either <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
However, what is an exploit is the slulk being able to be a marine and use marine weapons. That's an exploit and a bad one.
I found the next one rather funny and annoying to the Kharaa, but it s pretty lame to do.
Building outside the spacecraft in (cant remember name). We only managed to get a IP up outthere, so we kept respawning on the spot where the Kharaa couldn't reach us (WITH MELEE ATTACKS). We died tho because of spores and healing spray.
Nasty bug, should be zapped.
Eclipse command.
The walls don't allow skulks to get to the top of the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
also note that marines can't get on top of the hive in eclipse command either <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah they can. I've seen them. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.planetannihilation.com/taec/tenp/eclipse.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
A) Dips in the cieling mean skulks fall off at this point.
B) Area B appears to be a big hole. It's black on the map. Even if you could get past A (which I've never been able to) I don't believe there's anywhere you can wallwalk on to get near enough to drop onto hive.
Jetpackers don't have to face either off these problems.
EDIT: I'd be sorry for going off subject, but since most of these listed aren't exploits (even jp-ing marines, they're just really annoying) I will.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Resource donation</b> - While some see this as a feature, it really shouldn't be allowed since it does imbalance the game. However, instead of forfeiting resources from players who leave the game, perhaps an alternate method could be used. EG, if any player leaves, their resources are placed into a 'virtual resource node' which will meter out the resources to the team much like a regular resource node does. That way the team isn't penalized by a player dropping, but they will not gain an unfair advantage from it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This has been proven and backed up multiple times that, while it may allow for one or more fades earlier, it reduces the number of fades available until even later in the game. In many ways, it weakens the aliens if the Marines are willing to do something other than scream for Mommy Commander in a corner on the first sight of a fade or Umbra. For God's sake, people, rush out there and chase down the damn fade, don't let him walk off and regenerate.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>RR resource exploit</b> - This exploit has Aliens using a specific manner to allow them to start the game with move than 10 resources. As you can imagine, this can cause the Aliens to get a hive much sooner.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is a verified, certifiable exploit. It is <b>the</b> resource exploit, far and beyond any complaints about skulks or fades with too much res. Hell, I've had 66/66 res when I died as a fade, and recycled that because I frankly knew I had no use for it compared to letting the gorge get one more chamber up.
And yes, that's the real 'exploit' of simple recycling. One extra chamber, 13 resources, the cost to evolve to Gorge yourself. Natch 13 resources from the amount returned, boom, that's gone. Hell, it'd overkill the '10 res to start' bug as well right out the window.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Chambers blocking doors/lifts</b> - This isn't necessary, and really should be curtailed. Most locations where a gorge feels the need to block an elevator could still be defended with a good tower of chambers. Chambers should not be able to disable any part of a map in a way that makes it impossible for Marines to advance without sieging continuously.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Flayra himself has stated repeatedly, as have all other playtesters and many forum admins, that being able to block elevators and doors and doorways with chambers is a design decision, not a bug or exploit. Get a GL, or Siege, and blast them apart if they're that big a problem for you.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Drawviewmodel exploit</b> - While this was acknowledged as an exploit by the developers, a fix has yet to been seen. I'm not sure if they intend to fix it, but I believe it should be disabled as it can give an unfair advantage to any player, but moreso to alien skulks.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
AdminMod plugins fix it, and the next client patch will permenantly fix it. Not an active issue.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Open welded vents</b> - This doesn't happen with all vents, but there are some vents that can be 'forced' open in a certain manner by the aliens. This basically makes welding the vent pretty pointless. If aliens are allowed to open vents then marines should be able to seal them again.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mappers need to fix it, generally. It's not a coding issue, but a mapping issue, and some maps can't be modified to support any further changes, or even repairs. Some of those maps are being rebuilt from scratch in fact to try to address these problems.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Bunny hop & reverse bunny hop</b> - This exploit allows marines to move at a speed that can EXCEED that of a skulk AND be able to fire. The reverse exploit has a Marine do a 180 and then bunny hop backwards at a speed far in excess of the backwards moving speed, at the same while firing away with no decrease in accuracy. Given the developers made it so that Marines would move at a set speed, AND there are no Marine speed upgrades AND certain things make the Marines go slower (like HMGs) Marines should not be bunny hopping to gain speed. Also, most mods have some restriction on bunny hopping which causes accuracy to diminish, but the simple method is to make it so that Marine can only fire their weapons when their feet are on ground. (with exceptions made for jetpacks) Let's not turn NS into a TFC clone with mindless bunny hopping.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bunny hopping breaks both the restriction on anything but forward movement going fast for marines, and allows a marine with the <i>skill</i> to outpace an untrained skulk using leap and adrenaline 3 in some cases.
It is possible to use it for extended periods on many maps along certain, specific routes, and if nothing else the simple rapid-jumping, even if not used to gain ungodly speed, allows for marines to retain full normal speed regardless of movement direction, in direct opposition to the fact that a walking marine slows down when moving backwards or sideways.
Using rounding errors in the extremities of the movement code to break the designed rules for player movement when compared between classes is an exploit, same as building a building underground but still buildable but not attackable is. It's a glitch that can be exploited to gain an overly large advantage over the enemy unless they know about that exact same secret. It changes the game from one of true skill and no lack of knowledge to one of who knows all the secrets and tricks.
In short, just make it so a player can't 'buffer' a jump, but has to actually press jump <b>after</b> landing to jump again, and bunny-hopping pretty much dies on the spot.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Invulnerable Marines</b> - With a little 'assistance' from the commander a Marine can becomes nearly invulnerable to Alien attack. I'm speaking about medpacks of course. The 'medpack shower' can provide a marine with an inexhaustible supply of health, and it is not uncommon for a marine to go through 500 health before being killed as a result. This provides an unfair advantage to the Marines. (the Alien defence chambers and such can't even come close) A simple time limit on the drop of medpacks (one per 2 seconds) would provide the potential of 1500 health points in a minute, and could replenish an entire team of 15 Marines up to full health in that time.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
2 res and 50hp/medpack, usually less... that's about 5 res per 'extra life' the Commander just spent. He gives the guy 25 medpacks... would have been cheaper to build a pair of phase gates nearby and let everyone respawn and just go back there. It's a valid, and very costly, tactic. Most professional clans don't use medpacks except for HA's or JP's.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Crouching Marine hitbox</b> - This is a nasty exploit that is used by Marines mainly in vents, but I am now seeing it more in open places as well. Basically the crouching Marine will take little or no damage by skulks, and as such this gives them an unfair advantage. The hitbox is messed up, and by the time a skulk adjusts their tactics to try and kill them, they end up dead. This needs fixing.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Known problem, fix uncertain as it may be an intrinsic HL-engine bug that places the ball in Valve's court, not Flayra's.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Top of hive kill</b> - There is nothing wrong with jetpacks, but Marines were never supposed to get on TOP of the hives. This is evident by the design of many hives which make a Marine on top of the hive invulnerable since Aliens can't reach it. Hives should be redesigned so that Marines take heavy damage when in contact with the hive. They are PLENTY of other ways to kill a hive by gun/grenade/welder etc., not to mention siege cannons, so this isn't a big loss.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Same as stacking and blocking of elevators, it's a known situation that occured repeatedly in playtesting, and just means the Aliens have to actually watch their hives for sneak attacks, same as Marines have to watch their CC for sneak attacks. There are no hives a skulk can't crawl too, and once they get leap, it's a moot point.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Recycle during attack</b> This is where a commander will recycle a building that is under attack in order to weasel out of losing the resources of that building. This should be prevented by making it so that only a building with 100% health can be recycled. If it has less than that the Marines can break out a welder to rectify it.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Reduce 'recycled' amount to a percentage based on HP left when recycled, problem goes away. Recycling on the fly has also been stated to be a valid tactic, and is one very common in the RTS genre on-line among the higher-end players.
ROFLOL
how about lets not try make this a CS clone mr cs, im sure sending it down the tfc path would indeed have the benfit of stopping cs aspects to be copied into it willy nilly.
If aliens can, marines can
There r certain elevators/doors that will just crush your chambers
Crochet is a skill as well but it has nothing to do with a rts/fps game and so should not decide over win and loss in one.
Eclipse command.
The walls don't allow skulks to get to the top of the hive.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
also note that marines can't get on top of the hive in eclipse command either <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah they can. I've seen them. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.planetannihilation.com/taec/tenp/eclipse.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
A) Dips in the cieling mean skulks fall off at this point.
B) Area B appears to be a big hole. It's black on the map. Even if you could get past A (which I've never been able to) I don't believe there's anywhere you can wallwalk on to get near enough to drop onto hive.
Jetpackers don't have to face either off these problems.
EDIT: I'd be sorry for going off subject, but since most of these listed aren't exploits (even jp-ing marines, they're just really annoying) I will.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
its VERY easy to get past the dip. and if you've noticed you can walk on the black area. think about it. the marines are larger, how would they be able to get in and skulks not? it makes no sense.
<b>the amount of res recycled by structures would be equal to the percent of its health times its build cost</b>
I would post that a few more times but I know they aren't blind!