Legal Age For Alcohol Consumption
RyoOhki
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12789Members
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12789Members
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">You can fight and die, but no drinking!</div> I was struck by this topic during the recent Iraq conflict. There was a picture of a young American servicewoman, serving in Iraq, and the caption indicated that whilst she was old enough to fight and die for her country, in her home state she couldn't buy alcohol.
Anyone else see this as a bit strange? If a nation determines that a person is of a mature enough age to serve and possibly die in the service of her/his country, shouldn't that person be allowed to drink?
Anyone else see this as a bit strange? If a nation determines that a person is of a mature enough age to serve and possibly die in the service of her/his country, shouldn't that person be allowed to drink?
Comments
I agree with you 100% on the original topic though. If a person is old enough to fight and die in a war. Old enough to help decide the future leader of their country. Old enough to look at pornography <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->...then they should be old enough to slam back a bottle of Jagermiester and puke all over the lawn.
I'm in Quebec. It's 18 here.
In Finland for example that age is 18.
As for the legal age, I beleive that education plays a big part in this. In the UK, you are allowed to drink when you have just finished college and (maybe) start uni for 3+ years. In some American states I beleive this to be true and that's why it is illegal to consume alcohol until you're 21.
Drinking ages are probably based around the year at your school/uni/college exam time so you aren't out drinking away your future.
That said, it could be because you're more responsible (usually not) when you are 18+ years old.
The solution seems obvious to me. Let us drink at 14, don't let us drive till 18. If you've had 4 years in which to learn how to drink, drunk driving shouldn't be as much of an issue.
The solution seems obvious to me. Let us drink at 14, don't let us drive till 18. If you've had 4 years in which to learn how to drink, drunk driving shouldn't be as much of an issue. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope that's a joke.
Midway through school life and most of your class will come in drunk from being out the night before?
Most 14 year olds probably aren't able to handle a lot of alcohol at that age, but try to keep up with older people, which will cause a lot of problems. At 18+ you're probably with more mature friends who will drink sensibly and not just to prove a point (not always true.)
I do, however, see no problem giving somebody 16+ alcohol if they are trustworthy and with their parent's consent. Like in England where 16/17 year olds can have a drink if their parents buy a bar meal.
Edit: Also, "learn to drink?" How can you learn to drink... Maybe teach people some sense.
Simple. Learn what the effects of alcohol are on your body. Lots of teen drunk drivers get where they are because they haven't learned to drink responsibly, and they have no idea how debilitating alcohol can be.
I started drinking (illegally, of course, due to ridiculous drinking laws) about two years before I began driving, and it gave me a healthy respect for the effects of alcohol. I occasionally need to drive after I've been drinking, but I always know when I've had too much and need to sober up (or, in one extreme case, take a cab). Never once have I been tempted to drive while over the legal limit.
If you allow 14 year olds to drink, they'll only come to class drunk if their parents let them stay out all night drinking - which, let's face it, if your parents are that incompetent, you'll be out drinking illegally anyway. Making it legal at least makes it so you can have a glass of wine when you're out with your parents at a restaurant (as it stands now, you can't legally have a drink in a restaurant even if your parent buys it for you), and increases the odds that you'll learn to drink responsibly before you start driving.
As it stands now, if you were following the letter of the law, the first time you had a drink would be in most cases at a point when you have a car AND no parental guidance. Fortunately, most people seem to ignore the letter of the law.
Simple. Learn what the effects of alcohol are on your body. Lots of teen drunk drivers get where they are because they haven't learned to drink responsibly, and they have no idea how debilitating alcohol can be.
I started drinking (illegally, of course, due to ridiculous drinking laws) about two years before I began driving, and it gave me a healthy respect for the effects of alcohol. I occasionally need to drive after I've been drinking, but I always know when I've had too much and need to sober up (or, in one extreme case, take a cab). Never once have I been tempted to drive while over the legal limit.
If you allow 14 year olds to drink, they'll only come to class drunk if their parents let them stay out all night drinking - which, let's face it, if your parents are that incompetent, you'll be out drinking illegally anyway. Making it legal at least makes it so you can have a glass of wine when you're out with your parents at a restaurant (as it stands now, you can't legally have a drink in a restaurant even if your parent buys it for you), and increases the odds that you'll learn to drink responsibly before you start driving.
As it stands now, if you were following the letter of the law, the first time you had a drink would be in most cases at a point when you have a car AND no parental guidance. Fortunately, most people seem to ignore the letter of the law. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is what ive always believed.
My Parents have always too.
As probably in most countrys, the average teenager has his/her first alcohol experience much earlier. It's extrem easy to get alcohol for young people, many supermarkets will sell a 14-year-old beer without any questions. I know many friends who have a copy of their brothers ID and drinking in general is very much accepted in Germany, most adults think it's normal that teenagers drink sometimes more than they should.
Although I'm almost never drinking alcohol (I'm 17), I'm a rare case and I've often been with friends who were drinking quite much and I've never saw only one of them completely lose their selfcontrol or anything like that. I know of enough situations where this happens, but these weren't mostly teenagers.
It sounds quite shizophrenic that in the USA, in some states you're allowed to sign contracts, drive, serve and sometimes even get executed before you're allowed to drink a bottle of beer. I won't talk about "not drinking in the public", but it just doesn't seems right that you are mature and wise enough to decide wether to kill a person or not, but yet you're not allowed to drink alcohol.
Here in Germany, we've quite many car-accidents involving young drivers (18-21) and sometimes the influence of drugs (alcohol or others) can be verified.
But I believe that these statistics are more a result of a nation that believes that it's your right to drive across a wet street at night without a speedlimit than of drug abuse.
If anyone of you watched "2Fast and 2Furious", well, my friends and I where quite amazed that these people (participating in illegal streetraces and supposed to be very good race drivers) where already shaking and holding their wheels with all their power when the tachometer showed speeds our parentss would drive at without on a street packed with traffic.
Well, I may went a bit off-topic, but my point is that it needs much more maturity to drive a car or to got to war than it needs to controll your alcohol consum.
..and i dont think there are any restrictions about "drinking age".
most of me friends use this, and partey every weekend, effectively killing their Brains, and they have Jobs to buy it too.
me? i dont have a job, and i dont drink - so i got more time for school and such. but they never come to school drunk Sammie...
...and since they all are Partey peepz, i dont really talk to them, im the Geek outsider, last year it wasnt really a prob, since we lived at the school and we werent allowed to drink, so what was left was to be geekisk <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->...
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-)
Simple. Learn what the effects of alcohol are on your body. Lots of teen drunk drivers get where they are because they haven't learned to drink responsibly, and they have no idea how debilitating alcohol can be.
I started drinking (illegally, of course, due to ridiculous drinking laws) about two years before I began driving, and it gave me a healthy respect for the effects of alcohol. I occasionally need to drive after I've been drinking, but I always know when I've had too much and need to sober up (or, in one extreme case, take a cab). Never once have I been tempted to drive while over the legal limit.
If you allow 14 year olds to drink, they'll only come to class drunk if their parents let them stay out all night drinking - which, let's face it, if your parents are that incompetent, you'll be out drinking illegally anyway. Making it legal at least makes it so you can have a glass of wine when you're out with your parents at a restaurant (as it stands now, you can't legally have a drink in a restaurant even if your parent buys it for you), and increases the odds that you'll learn to drink responsibly before you start driving.
As it stands now, if you were following the letter of the law, the first time you had a drink would be in most cases at a point when you have a car AND no parental guidance. Fortunately, most people seem to ignore the letter of the law. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't see how this is a good point. It's like saying "try jumping of a cliff and if it hurts, don't do it again." I understand that trial and error works in some cases, but not when it comes to putting harm in a child's way.
At 18, you're a young adult and can take care of yourself. At 14 you're technically a child, summed up by what you said yourself:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->they'll only come to class drunk if their parents let them stay out all night drinking<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you want to lower the legal limit, then there's nothing parents can do to stop their children going out drinking. It shouldn't be a parent's responsibilty at this age. How would you feel letting your child out at 14, knowing that they could go into a nightclub or get served with alcohol? Plus the fact <b>under</b> 14 year olds will get fake IDs so they can go out drinking.
At the age of 14 there is a lot of pier pressure... It's pretty hard to avoid trying alcohol as it is now when you're 14. If it were legal, this would be much worse.
You might have been a model 14 year old... Many are not... At the age of 14, you cannot be put in jail for what you do under the influence of alcohol. It will increaese the chances of petty crime, under age sex, unprotected sex and many other things.
Alcohol is an addictive drug... Many people forget this. How would you feel if you could buy cigarettes at 12 years old?
It's better teaching children what alcohol does to them. I think this delays children drinking long enough for them to try it when they're older/ready.
Edit: OK, I re-read your post... It seems to me like you're defending it on the grounds it makes better drivers, but totally oblivious to the other problems it makes.
Trying alcohol in a safe setting is not the same as jumping off a cliff. I begin to suspect you've never tried either. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
How the heck is a 14 year old going to get to a nightclub without their parents knowing? Bear in mind, this is before they or any of their friends can drive, especially if you raise the driving age to 18. And at the age of 14, you live at home. What sort of criminal mastermind 14 year old is going to be able to pull this off?
[edit - if the kid is living in the sort of environment where he CAN pull this off, I'd say alcohol is the LEAST of your worries. Worry instead about him becoming a crack dealer.]
Also, teaching the kid what alcohol does - the best teacher is experience in a safe environment. Waiting until you're 21 and getting trashed with your buddies, who have barely had any drinking experience themselves, is a good way to get in trouble. Just getting a lecture from your parents at the age of 13 or whatever is not going to have any impact whatsoever.
You can legally die for your country, you can legally have sex, you can legally drive, you can legally drink. Nice and tidy.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How the heck is a 14 year old going to get to a nightclub without their parents knowing?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And at the age of 14, you live at home.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your whole post is just proving my point. Even with the legal age set at 14, teenagers would have to tip-toe around their parents and ask them? Pff... It just prooves how childish these 14 year olds are. I highly doubt the majority of teenagers would ask for their parents permission anyway.
There's about 10 night-clubs near me, all within easyish access (taxi/bus/walk.)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->if the kid is living in the sort of environment where he CAN pull this off, I'd say alcohol is the LEAST of your worries<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Again, this just proves the immaturity of these teenagers (see above points.) You make it sound like having the age lowered would mean you have to sneak around and slighly buy alcohol without your parents knowing. Remember, it would be legal... It would be pretty easy to go and get drunk and they couldn't stop you. I highly doubt parents would want to be worried about you drinking at such a young age.
Remember, not everybody is you. There are plently of people who will just go out and get trashed every night. They may do it now, but if it was legal for them to buy alcohol it just makes it all the easier for them.
In the UK you can drink in your own house over the age of 6 or something. I see nothing wrong with your parents giving you alcohol at a younger age. This does not mean lower the age limits though!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Waiting until you're 21 and getting trashed with your buddies, who have barely had any drinking experience themselves, is a good way to get in trouble.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly... But if you do something irresponsible, you pay for your actions. If you're 14 you'll probably just get a slap on the wrists.
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
If this is true than the army is going about their recruiting all wrong.
Instead of "Be all you can be" it should be "drink all you can drink"
heck I'd be singing up as soon as I hit 18 (I'm 19 by the way).
As far as the drinking goes Samwise is right. Laws don't mean diddly compared to parenting, the likelyhood of a kid saying "Gee it's illegal I better respect the letter of the law." is a let less likely than them saying "Crap my parents won't let me drink so I'm gunn have to keep it on the down low and hit the alleys with my homies and pound a 40, of course they'll all need rides since I'm the only one with a car but iz cool we just go cruising for chicks after we get crunked."
right, anway, if parents teach their kids responsiblity, this includes how to deal with drugs, violence, sex etc. they will have a much healthier lifestyle than if the parents imploy the completely hopeless "No." method. Teaching abstenance in anything to a teenager is like teaching a blind monkey how to drive, they may look like they understand you but they aren't learning anything.
In any case, it doesn't change the base arguement. A nation determines that a person of the age of 18 is mature enough to make the decision to give his/her life in the service of his/her country. Now why should a person who is mature enough to make such a decision be denied the right to drink? If the age for drinking is 21, then the age of military service should be the same. Because implying that it requires more maturity to drink alcohol than it does to undergo military training and fight for your country is just ludicrous!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Because implying that it requires more maturity to drink alcohol than it does to undergo military training and fight for your country is just ludicrous!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is not implying that at all. Defending your country is still a job, does a Supermarket Assistant need alcohol to work?
I go with Samwise on this
My beliefe is that you should be able to drink before you can drive (I am from the US drinking age is 21 EVERY WHERE, driving ranges from like 14(Ithink) - 18)
personaly I wont put out exact ages, my simple beliefe is that drink+smoke THEN drive.
The number of manslaughter cases that have to do with the defendant being drunk is stupidly high (remember most drunk drivers don't kill themselves they kill others). Peronaly I am 20, I don't drive (to many psychos on the road, and I am from NYC we have the MTA), MY parents have alowed me to drink (inmoderation) for a few years now. I have no urge to get wasted (I DON'T like being outa controll of my self), however I DO know what 1 or 2 beers can do to some one.
Personaly I tihnk most of the problem is simply with american culture. Going out and getting wasted is concidered a good idea (god help us) however the idea of a designated driver, or cabs or anything, Generaly isn't thought of.
now as for the military thing?
eh, I fail to see how they are related? I am personaly for the lowering of the drinking age, but it has nothing to do with military service.
they are both arbetray numbers picked by random people in the senate/HoR
and yes drinking age was picked by them, even though it is technicaly a states jursidiction. There was a bill passed that stated the fed gov would remove all funding for interstate highways in states that had a lower drinking age then 21.
Lets go deeper. A car in the hands of a drunk is a dangerous weapon, no question there. But a soldier IS a weapon: he is trained to kill people. Now if a nation determines that an 18 year old is mature enough to know that when he is taught to bayonet an enemy he doesn't go back home and impale his next door neighbour, surely such an individual is mature enough to drink responsably?
Btw, a supermarket assisstant does not need alcohol to work any more than a soldier. But a soldier is considered mature enough to fight and die for his country. Why thus say he is too "immature" to have a drink?
The reason the legal drinking age is 21 in so many parts of America is largely due to the fact that car insurance companies lobby to have it that way. I don't think anyone will argue that more people drive in America than any other country and insurance rates are insanely high for anyone under 25, and the last thing Farmers wants to do is shell out cash when a 19 year old went on a bender and totaled his car. That's why provencies like New Orleans where the legal drinking age is 18 get a lot less funding from federal sources (if you ever go there you can see how badly damaged their streets are).
I don't see how you can measure that somebody is mature because they join the army. People who join come from different backgrounds, they're like you or me and not different to anybody.
Dr. D makes a very good point. There are lots and lots of other reasons like this too.
Choosing to join the army does not make you anymore mature than your peers, but making it through boot can surely be a good indicator. Drinking age on military bases is 18, not everyone that joins makes it to a base. I don't know if this age change is extended to boot camp or not though.