AsranielJoin Date: 2002-06-03Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
Lol...
Here in switzerland there is no age restriction for drinking alcohol. There is only a buy restiction. Beer and so are 16+(wine also) and wodka and other things like that are 18+. But you can buy nearly everything you want wit every age. No problem here.
Do we have problems? No we dont. Less alcohol car accidents that in the USA, les alcoholics (yes.. true).
Why? I would say its easy. You dont have to hide yourself when you drink alcohol(no hiden alcoholics, at least.. less of em). When you begin to drive you KNOW the influence of alcohol and i know nearly no one that would drive with too much alcohol, normaly the one who drives dont drink.
I dont see the problem with no age restriction for drinking
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I don't see how you can measure that somebody is mature because they join the army. People who join come from different backgrounds, they're like you or me and not different to anybody. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me ask you a question? Does the US recruit 12 year old children into it's military? No. Now lets think why. Because people of that age are not considered mature enough to make the decision of enlisting to fight and die for your country. Why does recruiting start at age 18? Because that's when society considers a person mature enough to make that very decision. I can't see how any other decision can require more maturity than that.
Re: insurance. Well the legal age for drinking here in Australia is 18 and lots of people drive here. Insurance firms charge large premiums on teenage drivers though because statistically they crash more (apparently). If a parent doesn't want their child to drive, then they don't have to hand the keys over. If a person is living on their own and buys a car, they pay the insurance. Needless to say, if you have any alcohol in your viens when you crash the insurance is forfit. I thus can't see why insurance is a legitimate reason to have a drinking age of 21.
Alcapwn"War is the science of destruction" - John AbbotJoin Date: 2003-06-21Member: 17590Members
The REAL reason that they rasied the drinking age to 21 in the USA is becuase the surgeon generals felt "it was not safe" to drink becuase at age 18 some part in your brain os not fully closed off (forgot what its called) so achohol can seap better into your brain affecting you faster...
At age 21 its mostly closed off. So thats why its 21 here....
<!--QuoteBegin--dr.d+Aug 26 2003, 11:45 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (dr.d @ Aug 26 2003, 11:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I forgot to make this point last time.
The reason the legal drinking age is 21 in so many parts of America is largely due to the fact that car insurance companies lobby to have it that way. I don't think anyone will argue that more people drive in America than any other country and insurance rates are insanely high for anyone under 25, and the last thing Farmers wants to do is shell out cash when a 19 year old went on a bender and totaled his car. That's why provencies like New Orleans where the legal drinking age is 18 get a lot less funding from federal sources (if you ever go there you can see how badly damaged their streets are). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's the reason, I've done a lot of looking into it. It's also why in Canada, Mexico, and most if not all of Europe the drinking age is significantly lower, and I can't think of anywhere (correct me if I'm wrong) it's 21. More people drive cars in Los Angeles than probably most of Canada. Drinking and driving = accidents, more cars on the road = more accidents, and more accidents = more costs for insurance companies.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Let me ask you a question? Does the US recruit 12 year old children into it's military? No. Now lets think why. Because people of that age are not considered mature enough to make the decision of enlisting to fight and die for your country. Why does recruiting start at age 18? Because that's when society considers a person mature enough to make that very decision. I can't see how any other decision can require more maturity than that.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Think about your response, you have answered your own question. Apply your reasoning to what I have said... Maybe "the society" considers 18 not mature enough to drink?
12 year olds are also not strong enough, mentally or physically to join the military. Plus they would be in education.
Joining the military is a career, it doesn't mean you have to be mature to join.
Just a note about alchohol being addictive: So is Caffeine. Caffeine is not restricted by age, is it? Heck, even CHOCOLATE is addictive.
Another note about underage sex (Mentioned earlier, saying that it's more likely to occur): The age of consent in America ranges from 12-18. It's 14, in Canada. <a href='http://www.ageofconsent.com' target='_blank'>http://www.ageofconsent.com</a> As long as you're over the age of consent, and the person you have sex with isn't 5 years olders/younger than you, you can legally have sex.
<!--QuoteBegin--CForrester+Aug 26 2003, 12:41 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CForrester @ Aug 26 2003, 12:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just a note about alchohol being addictive: So is Caffeine. Caffeine is not restricted by age, is it? Heck, even CHOCOLATE is addictive.
Another note about underage sex (Mentioned earlier, saying that it's more likely to occur): The age of consent in America ranges from 12-18. It's 14, in Canada. <a href='http://www.ageofconsent.com' target='_blank'>http://www.ageofconsent.com</a> As long as you're over the age of consent, and the person you have sex with isn't 5 years olders/younger than you, you can legally have sex.
That is all I have to say. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes, but Alcohol and Smoking can seriously harm health... I've also never heard that caffeine is addictive <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->
As for under-age sex, I can't really comment on what I don't know. I am using the UK laws <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Caffeine is harmful to your health, too. My hands shake a lot more than normal. Caffeine is a drug and, like any other drug, is addictive. Even the computer is addicted. <i>Anything</i> can be addictive.
<!--QuoteBegin--Ryo-Ohki+Aug 26 2003, 09:09 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ryo-Ohki @ Aug 26 2003, 09:09 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Let me ask you a question? Does the US recruit 12 year old children into it's military? No. Now lets think why. Because people of that age are not considered mature enough to make the decision of enlisting to fight and die for your country. Why does recruiting start at age 18? Because that's when society considers a person mature enough to make that very decision. I can't see how any other decision can require more maturity than that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Interesting theory. Personally, I think it's because 18 year old males are at their physical prime, and are too young/hormone-addled to have a healthy fear of death.
<!--QuoteBegin--CaL_FiN+Aug 26 2003, 09:46 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CaL_FiN @ Aug 26 2003, 09:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Yes, but Alcohol and Smoking can seriously harm health... I've also never heard that caffeine is addictive <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Try drinking a couple of cups of coffee every morning for a month.
Then try stopping. Feel the BLINDING HEADACHES? That's withdrawal.
I've heard from people that have tried both that quitting smoking is easier than quitting caffeine. (My mother was able to quit smoking, but she was never able to kick her caffeine habit.)
We're off topic now, though. Asraniel, thank you - that pretty much confirms what I thought about it. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Cal our whole point isn't that society thinks that 21 is a good age to start drinking its in that having 21 being the drinking age and 18 being the age required for enlistment its implied that drinking takes more maturity then signing your life away to the government. My point is those two should coincide...either at 21 or at 18. The maturity requried to drink responsible is obviously less then the maturity required to give your life for your country. I don't understand your problem with this.
Yes and I've said. You cannot compair the two based on maturity... Imply what you want but these two things have nothing in common. To me it's like saying this, "Hey, I can see a 12 rated movie, but I am not allowed to have sex, WTH?"
There are many reasons other than maturity, for example: The insurance companys, 18 is a healthy age to train for the military.
Most of my arguements have been against dropping the legal drinking limit under 18. I don't live in America and I don't know a lot of your laws, so I can't really put my point across there.
That_Annoying_KidSire of TitlesJoin Date: 2003-03-01Member: 14175Members, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin--Jammer+Aug 25 2003, 02:22 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jammer @ Aug 25 2003, 02:22 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ryo- Monse answered this question during the last phase of the D. Forums.
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> it is now?
very interesting, you learn something new every damn day
the problem with lowering the drinking age is that during the first generation the increase in alchol related deaths and accidents will shoot up, but then they will plateu as people have grown up with alcohol and have realized that it's nothing special
They are gonna drink anyway. just sneak it and get into more trouble, and many more differant kinds of trouble. Legal age should be 18 to buy it. any age should be legal to drink. well 16 + that way they learn how drinkng effects them.
<b>no</b> age should be legal to drink and drive EVER
<!--QuoteBegin--Jammer+Aug 25 2003, 04:22 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jammer @ Aug 25 2003, 04:22 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ryo- Monse answered this question during the last phase of the D. Forums.
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Unless things have changed since I got out of the navy 8 years ago this isn't true. The only bases I served at on US soil where I could legally drink at 18 were the ones in San Diego, and that was only because the command didn't want us drinking in Tiajuana (not that that stopped us). Otherwise we had to either get alcohol off base or when we pulled into a foriegn port where the legal drinking age was lower.
For the record, I'm in the "if I can die for my country, and vote at 18 I ought to be able to drink" camp.
Comments
Here in switzerland there is no age restriction for drinking alcohol. There is only a buy restiction. Beer and so are 16+(wine also) and wodka and other things like that are 18+.
But you can buy nearly everything you want wit every age. No problem here.
Do we have problems? No we dont. Less alcohol car accidents that in the USA, les alcoholics (yes.. true).
Why? I would say its easy. You dont have to hide yourself when you drink alcohol(no hiden alcoholics, at least.. less of em). When you begin to drive you KNOW the influence of alcohol and i know nearly no one that would drive with too much alcohol, normaly the one who drives dont drink.
I dont see the problem with no age restriction for drinking
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me ask you a question? Does the US recruit 12 year old children into it's military? No. Now lets think why. Because people of that age are not considered mature enough to make the decision of enlisting to fight and die for your country. Why does recruiting start at age 18? Because that's when society considers a person mature enough to make that very decision. I can't see how any other decision can require more maturity than that.
Re: insurance. Well the legal age for drinking here in Australia is 18 and lots of people drive here. Insurance firms charge large premiums on teenage drivers though because statistically they crash more (apparently). If a parent doesn't want their child to drive, then they don't have to hand the keys over. If a person is living on their own and buys a car, they pay the insurance. Needless to say, if you have any alcohol in your viens when you crash the insurance is forfit. I thus can't see why insurance is a legitimate reason to have a drinking age of 21.
At age 21 its mostly closed off. So thats why its 21 here....
Learned that in school
The reason the legal drinking age is 21 in so many parts of America is largely due to the fact that car insurance companies lobby to have it that way. I don't think anyone will argue that more people drive in America than any other country and insurance rates are insanely high for anyone under 25, and the last thing Farmers wants to do is shell out cash when a 19 year old went on a bender and totaled his car. That's why provencies like New Orleans where the legal drinking age is 18 get a lot less funding from federal sources (if you ever go there you can see how badly damaged their streets are). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's the reason, I've done a lot of looking into it. It's also why in Canada, Mexico, and most if not all of Europe the drinking age is significantly lower, and I can't think of anywhere (correct me if I'm wrong) it's 21. More people drive cars in Los Angeles than probably most of Canada. Drinking and driving = accidents, more cars on the road = more accidents, and more accidents = more costs for insurance companies.
Think about your response, you have answered your own question. Apply your reasoning to what I have said... Maybe "the society" considers 18 not mature enough to drink?
12 year olds are also not strong enough, mentally or physically to join the military. Plus they would be in education.
Joining the military is a career, it doesn't mean you have to be mature to join.
Another note about underage sex (Mentioned earlier, saying that it's more likely to occur): The age of consent in America ranges from 12-18. It's 14, in Canada. <a href='http://www.ageofconsent.com' target='_blank'>http://www.ageofconsent.com</a> As long as you're over the age of consent, and the person you have sex with isn't 5 years olders/younger than you, you can legally have sex.
That is all I have to say.
Another note about underage sex (Mentioned earlier, saying that it's more likely to occur): The age of consent in America ranges from 12-18. It's 14, in Canada. <a href='http://www.ageofconsent.com' target='_blank'>http://www.ageofconsent.com</a> As long as you're over the age of consent, and the person you have sex with isn't 5 years olders/younger than you, you can legally have sex.
That is all I have to say. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, but Alcohol and Smoking can seriously harm health... I've also never heard that caffeine is addictive <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->
As for under-age sex, I can't really comment on what I don't know. I am using the UK laws <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
[EDIT]
Wording problems.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Interesting theory. Personally, I think it's because 18 year old males are at their physical prime, and are too young/hormone-addled to have a healthy fear of death.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Try drinking a couple of cups of coffee every morning for a month.
Then try stopping. Feel the BLINDING HEADACHES? That's withdrawal.
I've heard from people that have tried both that quitting smoking is easier than quitting caffeine. (My mother was able to quit smoking, but she was never able to kick her caffeine habit.)
We're off topic now, though. Asraniel, thank you - that pretty much confirms what I thought about it. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
There are many reasons other than maturity, for example: The insurance companys, 18 is a healthy age to train for the military.
Most of my arguements have been against dropping the legal drinking limit under 18. I don't live in America and I don't know a lot of your laws, so I can't really put my point across there.
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
it is now?
very interesting, you learn something new every damn day
the problem with lowering the drinking age is that during the first generation the increase in alchol related deaths and accidents will shoot up, but then they will plateu as people have grown up with alcohol and have realized that it's nothing special
Legal age should be 18 to buy it.
any age should be legal to drink. well 16 +
that way they learn how drinkng effects them.
<b>no</b> age should be legal to drink and drive EVER
I think Germany has it down.
Drinking age on military bases is 18. So if you're going to fight for you country, you're allowed to drink. Otherwise, wait. :-) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unless things have changed since I got out of the navy 8 years ago this isn't true. The only bases I served at on US soil where I could legally drink at 18 were the ones in San Diego, and that was only because the command didn't want us drinking in Tiajuana (not that that stopped us). Otherwise we had to either get alcohol off base or when we pulled into a foriegn port where the legal drinking age was lower.
For the record, I'm in the "if I can die for my country, and vote at 18 I ought to be able to drink" camp.