Ns Not Scary Enough?

Quietstorm · February 2004

<div class="IPBDescription">Post on Customization caught my interest</div> I was meandering over through the forums through the past few days, and I saw a post on the Customization section it was "Making NS Scary..."So I looked through it, posted a few things (babbled about the upcoming ns_terror map I'm working on)...and then after reading a few responses and came to realize...NS isn't scary at all...unless you turn yer Gamma down (LOL turn yer Gamma down...most people turn it up so they can see the cloaked Skulks now), and input some custom sounds...

How come NS doesn't have that scare factor? I mean...walking through dark dank hallways is stressing enough, and Skulks are creepy (lerks are creepier), but how bout finding bodies around the map...or the lack of bodies, and when you get into the hive room bodies are strewn across the lair... Blood spatter across walls and bloody handprints are nifty too...I know there are guidelines to maps (right?), but seriously my friends...younger players play Half Life...in the game there are plenty of creepy blood markings....I mean I love Natural Selection, Hell I donated money to it ( I still haven't received my symbol though, lol [Not worried about it, as long as they got my money]) but I'd like to see a more frightening atmosphere to the maps....Anyhoo, comments,suggestions, etc...

... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /> + <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif' /> = <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /> !?!?!?

Wuked · February 2004

perhaps its jsut the fact that you can type exit at anytime and be ported back to your desktop <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

the only time i ever get scared is when i turn around and get bitten straight away by a skulk - i usually jump about 3 metres in the air <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

i agree it is a shame about the filters for younger palyers- but perhaps that can be accomodated with some sort of setting in the future ?
I never knew about the guidlines until I tried to convince someone that we needed blood splatters all over our map <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

Evo · February 2004

AFAIK, Flayra decided a long time ago that NS would be PG-13ish, and emphasize more of a neo-dirty revolution/colonization than a straight up horror job.

Its something that I don't entirely agree with myself (I rather enjoy guts 'n gore, buckets o' blood, and a whole lotta swearing. But thats just me <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />), but its his decision and you've gotta respect it. Actually you don't have to respect it, all you've got to do is deal with it because I don't think it'll ever be changing. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

Feel free to try and 'creep up' your own game and maps though! <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

ZiGGY · February 2004

ns isnt scary because there is (usually) no single permanent gorge with whom the fate of the game is decided.

Buggy · February 2004

dah i **** my pants when i see a gorge.

no really .. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

they like, got this filthy tongue and they're staring at me...

Seriously though, i agree with the other guy: NS isnt meant to be horror-like

Maveric · February 2004

NS maps arn't scary because they're too bright. Nearly all of the maps have bright, well-lit areas and few places for aliens to "pop out!" at you. There's also little-to-none ambient sound, and ambient sound is everything!

Aliens VS Predator is scary because almost ALL of the map is near black. As well, when you enter a alien-ish location you KNOW you're gonna get screwed by something. Even if nothing's there, you feel you're screwed... BIG TIME.

You dont really need bodies... how many dead bodies are in a AvP map? Not many, afaik from the demos. Sure, maybe afew skinned humans and a finger or two here and there, but there's always that ambient sound and "shock" music (shock music - music or ambient sound changes that are sudden and relate to what you've seen or will see) that's always playing.

I remember playing the Marine demo of AvP and i was scared s***less. Simply because these things <i>litterally were</i> comming out of the walls! The aliens are <b>pitch black and just simply look creepy</b> and they fit in PERFECTLY with their enviroment. My adren was pumping when i was escaping when that stomach-burster scene popped up simply because <i>the music changed</i>. That, and the aliens were slashing at my heels all the way out.

NS...

NS just doesn't seem to have that "OMG THEY'RE COMING OUT OF THE F***ING WALLS MAN!!!1" and "GAME OVER MAN, GAME OVER!!1!" feeling. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /> Fortunetly i still jump when a cloaked skulk bites my face off. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

NeonSpyder · February 2004

i know, ive played avp 1&2 and they definatly have a deeply terrifying feel to them, it takes me forever to get past the first marine mission, im to f***cking scared that something is going to tear off my head from the roof, good god it reminds me of the 'hallway' scene in unreal, its all anout lighting and sound. you dont even need 'better' models if you cant even really see the models <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

th0r0n · February 2004

single player games will always be scarier than multiplayer games, it's the feeling of being alone that scares me.

frostymoose · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (th0r0n^ @ Feb 23 2004, 12:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> single player games will always be scarier than multiplayer games, it's the feeling of being alone that scares me. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
<u><b>exactly</b></u>

I reinstalled avp yesterday and damn is it creepy. the aliens are hard to see, they move fast as hell, attack in groups, make creepy screams, come from behind, and seem to come back from the dead at times and there you are with no backup anywhere...

Maveric · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (th0r0n^ @ Feb 22 2004, 10:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> it's the feeling of being alone that scares me.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
it's the feeling of [me] being alone [against human enemies in a multiplayer game] that scares me.

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />

coil · February 2004

There's nothing scarier than having your Commander tell you to hold a position all by yourself, waiting for your team to arrive. You & your LMG in a dark corner, and that's it.

bLuISh · February 2004

isnt half-life rated M? then who gives a bloody damn about those 11 year olds? they shouldnt have been playing anything half-life related in the first place. if im wrong about the content rating...i take it all back

Mantrid · February 2004

Yeah, its "M". For Blood and Gore, I believe...

Why are we worried about the very young?

Black_Hawk_VS · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Feb 23 2004, 01:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Yeah, its "M". For Blood and Gore, I believe...
 </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Why do we need blood and gore and excessive swearing to make a game fun? I like NS how it is, plus it slaps the news media in the face when they say all FPS games are nothing but excessive blood and gore.

Qwerty · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (coil @ Feb 22 2004, 09:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> There's nothing scarier than having your Commander tell you to hold a position all by yourself, waiting for your team to arrive. You & your LMG in a dark corner, and that's it.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
omg man i hate it when a commander says go capture an rt bout 100 miles away from any friendly marines. and skulks are chasing me

J_D_W · February 2004

NS isnt meant to be scary.

dragonrat · February 2004

And blood and gore does not automatically equal scary. Rather the opposite. Lack of imagination from the mapmaker.

dragonrat

crono1 · February 2004

I want custom sounds! Especially a marine one for gorge hunting. There isn't anything more fun and scary than chasing a gorge with a knife! The risk is so high :/

Mendevel · February 2004

They exist, add them if your heart desires.

Scuzball · February 2004

Know what was scary about the Alien movies?

The fact that you <i>couldn't</i> see them. You got a general outline, some flashes from strobelights, but mostley it was shiny darkness and steam everywhere, mixed with scary music and SFX.

And by god, it was scary. Becuase it's your <i>imagination</i> cooking up this horrible monster that's 100x scarier than anything they'll ever cook up on screen.

IMHO, that's why the Alien series declined. They started showing the aliens in full light, running around, and well... they looked bad. CGI + bright lights = nothx. Nothing was left to the imagination, and so was completely drained of any scary-ness.

NS is still scary, like people said, in the darker areas of the maps. That's because your imagination gets to mess with you when there's nothing to see ^__^

Lee_Harvey · February 2004

I agree that NS isn;t meant to be scary. I personally hate anything that calls itself a horror movie, half because most of them suck and half because I hate jump scenes (which is all modern horror movies are; dont get me started). However, I realize that many NS players appreciate being scared out of their minds occasionally. I would justy like to say that NS (<i>not</i> Combat) gives you some of the tension of "Well, something's gonna pop out and rip my face off, but I wonder when and where?". And I must admit, I have nearly peed myself when I get hit by a cloaked skulk or devoured by a cloaked onos.

So while not having quite the horror factor of AvP, it has enough to keep everyone fairly happy. I'd say take what you can get and don't expect the game to be something it's just not.

RaVe · February 2004

Although NS isn't scary itself, the players can range from extremely boring to horrifyingly scary players *coughNadagastcough*

Nothng much more scary in an NS game than a skulk which just leaps (Yes LEAPS) from around the corner and kills you in one bite.

AlienCow · February 2004

Well damn. I scare too easily.

Seriously, I hate NS and love it all at once.

But then, I was scared playing Half Life single player... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

PS - Is my cow pic scary? <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

BrigadierWolf · February 2004

I dont think that excessive blood and Gore really makes anything scary.. I mean, comon, Ive played Doom, Ive played all of the Resident Evil series,.. Been there DONE THAT. What I think really needs to be improved is the atmosphere. everything is just too damn bright. Even with my Gamma set to .5 It STILL doesnt seem dark enough.

What I think it comes down to are two things. Amotsphere being the MOST important. And of course, this is mostly up to the mappers. I think generous use of the Particle system to create Fog, Steam and Smoke effects could do wonders. Combine that with Dark Maintenance type corridors With intermittant Glowing computer screens, and I think you'll have one NICE design.
The Second factor is really up to the team.. Ambient Music. Theres already some good music, But At least *I* think there should be more.. Heck, I'd even volunteer to make it myself.

I really do think that the Particle system in NS is really underused though.. They could use it to make, for example, REALLY Nice Explosion and Muzzleflash effects, But instead, NS still just uses the same old HL sprites.. I really think that was the biggest letdown for me. The particle system has such great potential, and Its never used for anything more complicated than a few map effects.

On that Note... Any of you Devs know If you added the Smoking guns yet, I sent em to Flayra several weeks ago but I havent heard from him since.

Stingrayofsweden · February 2004

Ns can be made scary, at least when you're sitting home alone (so nothing and nobody can distract you) and you keep the gamma low. In normal NS anyways, in combat you simply respawn without having lost anything at all except a couple of secounds of game time.

Fro5ty · February 2004

Ambience is what's missing. We don't have anything to keep us on our toes save for the occasion where we don't know what to expect, which is rare. NS_Metals' elevator area is a nice example of ambience. What made all the survivor horror games scary was the ambience and lack of knowledge on what's comming. The only things that scare me is an onos chasing me while I'm reloading, hearing a fade while only at lvl 1 a/w and an lmg with only another guy. As for gore and all that? With the current maps, it wouldn't work. But some new ones where it's used in moderation with some nice ambient lighting and sounds and it'll work. Have a few bloody boot prints on the ground, running (long strides showing they were running) with a few droplets of blood along the path then it stop suddenly. No more blood, foot prints, nothing. A good way is you're comming out of a small corridor to a long hallway. You hear the hissing of steam as you look around. An ambient skulk chuckle comes from no where and you start searching the area. You find the trail and follow it to the end. You hit a certain marker and a barrage or sounds hit you. Skulk biting, sounds of someone being bitten, and maybe some other alien noises to make you think you're being attacked. That is atmosphere, moderate to little gore and a lot of effects.

AlienCow · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>An ambient skulk chuckle comes from no where and you start searching the area.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

THAT is possibly the BEST idea I have heard in ages. It would also be a great place for skulks to ambush - especially against those players who have visited the area before and think "Ha. Ain't falling for that one again." *CHOMP*

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' />

Skyrage · February 2004

Want scary? Play System Shock 2...(underdogs)

As for NS, some more ambient sounds and so on would be a nice touch on maps, but thing is, people will get used to it in the end...that's why it's almost impossible to create something that will always be scary in a multi-player environment...

[edit2] oh...ok...warez? well..to each his own...

Warfare · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (J D W @ Feb 23 2004, 09:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> NS isnt meant to be scary.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Then why are the skulks given such scary teeth <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

NS can be scary if you make it scary, like making it really dark.
The problem is that it's very bright to other players (we all know that everyone removes shadows, except for those and improve the shadows).
I make NS as scary as I can get it, with custom ambient and MP3's that I play in my music folder.

mousiehamster · February 2004

The alien models aren't scary (THE SIZE of the SKULK in paticular..) and u have to be alone in a quiet place to feel true fear. I guess it's also the ambient sounds and the sounds the ALIENS make... I mean that skulk-bite sound is totally <i>not</i> scary. I think marines should produce less sound (walkings sounds should only be heard by aliens, not marines). The marine death cries need to be more variable as well, not just "Ugh" but "ARGHHHHHH", as in screams that you should hear a mile away. Imagine a lone marine suddenly hearing a scream comin' from the adjacent hallway...

Also what could possibly be scary are situations when marines are going through a passageway which they know are real dangerous but go through it anyway. For example, a small, dark room where there are plenty of places where aliens could hide.

Epidemic · February 2004

The only thing that NS do nowadays is shock me when that skulks uncloaks 1 foot from my ****, not scary though.
One of the reasons could also be that your life has too little value, you simply respawn and ready to go out again :/

Ns Not Scary Enough?

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