<!--QuoteBegin-Zek+Mar 19 2004, 11:36 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zek @ Mar 19 2004, 11:36 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I don't care what's on it, I just want to see another patch. It's been almost 6 weeks since Beta 3 came out... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> in the playtest irc channel, flayra said that he was hoping to release a new patch every week until he could call it 3.0 <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Add a radius around hive / CC where you don't get experience... you gotta leave base to get experience <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-frasse+Mar 19 2004, 12:18 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (frasse @ Mar 19 2004, 12:18 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->- combat gone<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Seriously.... more people need to play NS :-P But, thats why in any game you see (well, with the exception of Tribes a few years ago) more DM than objective based or strategy based games.
Interesting changes forlorn.... esp the upgrade model.... (sounds kinda like hambone for NS, only lame [I like hambone CO], but it will be interesting to try nonetheless)
Bring back maps that were removed (um.... one of the old ones (bast? was it the one that was removed?)? and ns_delta) (I am assuming they are being fixed).
Movement Chamber: o Movement chambers transfer aliens to a random hive, complete or under construction (priority is still given to hives under attack, complete or evolving) o Movement chambers affect all other chambers in their influence radius: -Defense Chambers heal faster -Offense Chambers shoot faster -Sensory Chambers have a larger influence radius o Make the Movement Chamber replenish alien stamina in a constant flow, rather than in big chunks at a time
Sensory Chamber: (I am not sure whether some of these are included already or not) o Aliens in the radius of influence of a sensory chamber are not detected by motion tracking o Aliens without the cloaking upgrade can walk cloaked under sensory chamber influence, but not run, while aliens with the upgrade can both run and walk while being cloaked o All marines within a certain distance of the sensory chamber (maybe 1/2 cloaking range or something else) are visible on alien hive sight as parasited <b>as long as they stay within "parasiting range" of the sensory chamber</b>
o Marines cannot be telefragged by phasegates and infantry portals any more, rather, they just get pushed away by the teammate that is phasing in. Aliens still get killed o Increase leap damage dramatically o Decrease time needed to throw hand grenade after priming o Increase alien damage for all lifeforms with every hive completed o Different parasite sprites for TSA structures/lifeforms o Marines appear as parasited on hivesight when in a certain range of a completed hive o Fix acid rockets o Fix shotgun reload animation (!!!) o Decrease catpack costs and/or increase duration of influence o Decrease gorge upgrade costs from 10 to 5 (as mentioned by forlorn) o Decrease fade armor & health o Increase charge damage in combination with celerity (celerity makes it extremely hard to hit marines with the charge attack)
Movement Chamber: o Movement chambers transfer aliens to a random hive, complete or under construction (priority is still given to hives under attack, complete or evolving) o Movement chambers affect all other chambers in their influence radius: -Defense Chambers heal faster -Offense Chambers shoot faster -Sensory Chambers have a larger influence radius o Make the Movement Chamber replenish alien stamina in a constant flow, rather than in big chunks at a time
Sensory Chamber: (I am not sure whether some of these are included already or not) o Aliens in the radius of influence of a sensory chamber are not detected by motion tracking o Aliens without the cloaking upgrade can walk cloaked under sensory chamber influence, but not run, while aliens with the upgrade can both run and walk while being cloaked o All marines within a certain distance of the sensory chamber (maybe 1/2 cloaking range or something else) are visible on alien hive sight as parasited <b>as long as they stay within "parasiting range" of the sensory chamber</b>
o Marines cannot be telefragged by phasegates and infantry portals any more, rather, they just get pushed away by the teammate that is phasing in. Aliens still get killed o Increase leap damage dramatically o Decrease time needed to throw hand grenade after priming o Increase alien damage for all lifeforms with every hive completed o Different parasite sprites for TSA structures/lifeforms o Marines appear as parasited on hivesight when in a certain range of a completed hive o Fix acid rockets o Fix shotgun reload animation (!!!) o Decrease catpack costs and/or increase duration of influence o Decrease gorge upgrade costs from 10 to 5 (as mentioned by forlorn) o Decrease fade armor & health o Increase charge damage in combination with celerity (celerity makes it extremely hard to hit marines with the charge attack)
Thats all I can think of right now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Some of your changes are very alien-biased, though i like most of them. Though i do NOT think that making marines visible on the hivesight when in range of a hive is a good idea, it would take away a surprise phase-shotgun rush to quickly take down a hive. very bad idea. Though I support sc's showing nearby marines on SoF.
If I am not mistaken, I believe that the issue of Movement chambers not taking you to certain hives is more of a mappers problem than a coding issue. As it stands now, certain maps have the hives spaced so that the movement chambers function right and others do not.
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C. Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A. Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right.
Ohnoes, yet another one. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> Nice list of pretty good ideas, then... this. I bet you just love getting insta-gibbed as a fade...
<!--QuoteBegin-MMZ>Torak+Mar 22 2004, 05:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MMZ>Torak @ Mar 22 2004, 05:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If I am not mistaken, I believe that the issue of Movement chambers not taking you to certain hives is more of a mappers problem than a coding issue. As it stands now, certain maps have the hives spaced so that the movement chambers function right and others do not.
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C. Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A. Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That's geometrically impossible. However, you could make them equally spaced so that the exit hive depends on the placing of the MC inside the hive.
<!--QuoteBegin-Align+Mar 22 2004, 01:23 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Align @ Mar 22 2004, 01:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-MMZ>Torak+Mar 22 2004, 05:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MMZ>Torak @ Mar 22 2004, 05:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If I am not mistaken, I believe that the issue of Movement chambers not taking you to certain hives is more of a mappers problem than a coding issue. As it stands now, certain maps have the hives spaced so that the movement chambers function right and others do not.
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C. Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A. Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's geometrically impossible. However, you could make them equally spaced so that the exit hive depends on the placing of the MC inside the hive. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It might very well be impossible, but I am reasonbly sure that at least one map works correctly as far as using movements to hop between them goes... doesn't it? And if so, doesn't that make it possible?
Uh, no? But I know what you mean, I played that map as well and got quite a surprise when I was thrown to the middle hive. I wonder which map it is though :/ Like I said, you can place the hive locations so that the outcome depends on where you put the chamber(while still placing it inside the hive locations).
you basically want the hive areas to be disposed as an equilateral triangle, and being able to place the MC's in such a way where you can choose where to go when they are placed in a hive?
That's crazy, it kills most current maps. Eclipse, Veil, and other maps with a flatter hive dispositions will have to leave. And it sets too many limits on the mapper and is probably going to be very unbalanced.
Actually, it's quite possible for a mapper to set up something where from one hive you can get to either of the two others.. (from them you could only get back to the first one of course). Any acute triangle set-up will work for that. You just have to make sure that the distant hive-room is big enough so that it can encompass the difference in the distances between it and the other two.
I can see that being a serious pain for people though until they caught on though..
I'd like to see blink reworked to be blink and devour and stomp replaced with something more fun, the onos toughened up with more armour soak too... these are unlikely to happen. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'd also like to see Combat tweaked to work better with games of 2-10 which means faster spawning and lower hp on the hive and cc. Despite the fact that I love the gorge it doesn't belong in combat - we tried it before.. remember. The hive heals itself, the cc doesn't but welding the cc is remarkably boring so I suggest balancing it with greater HP's meaning that in a prolonged game the aliens gain the advantage. Rather than ditch combat I'd like to see it fill its role as a small games option and an introduction to proper ns. Currently I hear people say that Co requires lots of players to work.. personally I try to avoid it but those games that I have played have not been much fun. Win or lose I just dont care. :/
Other than that I just want a little more balance and some bugfixes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C. Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A. Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is impossible. Just get a sheet of paper and do it like I did it:
Draw Hive A. Draw Hive B at any distance to hive A. Draw a circle around hive A with radius = distance from hive A to hive B. Every point outside this circle fits for hive C to fulfill statement 1. Draw a circle around hive B with distance hive A to B (same distance as the other circle). You could place hive C anywhere IN that circle to fulfill statement 2. Now shade the area that is both OUTSIDE of circle A and INSIDE of circle B, and you will find that if you place the hive anywhere inside that area, you will meet statement 1 & 2. However, whereever you place it, it will be further from hive A than from hive B, which would make statement 3 impossible to meet.
I want to see Movement chambers altered to a variation of the phase code, so that it toggles through hives in a set order(top to bottom on the HUD?). For example, the first time you use a movement it would send you to the furthest hive, if you use one again in the next 5-10 seconds it sends you to the next one down, and again for the third.
Ok I never claimed to be a math wiz, but I KNOW that there is ONE map that functions in the intended fasion, I just cant remember which. And if one maps works right, cant they all be designed to do so?
<!--QuoteBegin-MMZ>Torak+Mar 23 2004, 11:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MMZ>Torak @ Mar 23 2004, 11:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok I never claimed to be a math wiz, but I KNOW that there is ONE map that functions in the intended fasion, I just cant remember which. And if one maps works right, cant they all be designed to do so? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I dont know that map, but if the code of the game itself would be changed, it would give map creators alot more freedom to create their map rather than limit the map layout.
<!--QuoteBegin-Grillkohle+Mar 23 2004, 11:48 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Grillkohle @ Mar 23 2004, 11:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-MMZ>Torak+Mar 23 2004, 11:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MMZ>Torak @ Mar 23 2004, 11:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok I never claimed to be a math wiz, but I KNOW that there is ONE map that functions in the intended fasion, I just cant remember which. And if one maps works right, cant they all be designed to do so? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I dont know that map, but if the code of the game itself would be changed, it would give map creators alot more freedom to create their map rather than limit the map layout. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I don't know what map Torak is thinking about, but I'm pretty sure it exists.
It works because the movement chambers are placed a certain way in the hives themselves so that they create maximum distances to different hives and you warp between them all in a nice circular fashion.
indeed. Don't forget that hives are not single dots, but areas. That's how it's made possible. Nevertheless, I don't think whole maps have to be remade just for that occasion, seeing how often 3 hives occur, and how much of that proportion is it that crucial to actually move instantly from a hive to the middle one.
Forgot in my first post: Skulk speed slightly increased Walljumping added Parasite switchfun <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> (+5 to the skulk armour, not sure about this one though, i think that newbies are having a tough time as skulks, but then again it *could* make good players to good :/ )
How about if team A is winning and has an equal or greater amount of players as team B, that no team B player may join team A at any time until the game ends, or team B gains an advantage in player number. This would persist even if a player disconnects and rejoins server. Result: Eliminate winner-joiners.
Other changes would be...
UNIVERSAL<ul><li>Gorge abilities now Heal/Bile Bomb/Primal Scream/Web</li><li>Bile bomb damage is based on number of hives, 80/160/240.</li><li>Lerk abilities now Bite/Spikes/Umbra/Spores.</li><li>Spikes damage uped to 20.</li><li>Increase leap damage or reduce its energy requirement.</li><li>LMG clip increased to 60 rounds, with only slight reload time increase.</li><li>Maximum pistol clip reserve increased to 40.</li><li>Acid Rocket damage increased.</li><li>Skulk walljumping.</li></ul> CLASSIC ONLY<ul><li>Boosting skulk armor to at 15/23/32/40.</li><li>Making skulks exempt from motion tracking.</li><li>Gorge heal does so based on percentage of alien max health.</li><li>Umbra lasts longer.</li><li>Eliminate per player maximum on web. Just have a per area maximum.</li><li>Skulks retain upgrades through death.</li><li>Onos upgrades cost 4 res, fade upgrades cost 3 res.</li><li>Aliens with only one hive respawn 50% faster.</li><li>TF upgrade to Advanced TF time doubled.</li><li>Medpack drops limited to 5 per 5 seconds.</li><li>Turrets and Offence Chambers target players before structures and switch from a structure to a enemy player if one arives. </li><li>Half knife damage and have it do double damage to structures.</li></ul> COMBAT ONLY<ul><li>Reduce Xeno damage.</li><li>For an alien to get focus, they must be at least level 4.</li></ul> Yeah, that ought to do it. <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-geekanarchy+Mar 23 2004, 05:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (geekanarchy @ Mar 23 2004, 05:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> UNIVERSAL<ul><li>Gorge abilities now Heal/Bile Bomb/Primal Scream/Web</li><li>Bile bomb damage is based on number of hives, 80/160/240.</li></ul> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Not sure how you'd do this in combat, considering there is only one hive.. but still, that's a really good idea. I was always stymied with how to make bile-bomb available earlier, but not overpowering on marine bases.. linking the bile-bomb damage to the number of hives is a great solution.
And while we're moving things around, the whole Onos-metabolize, Fade-paralyze switch should be done too.. (though I really like my sticky-bomb idea for fades)
Mistake on my part, bile should stay the same as it is now in combat, or put to the 240 damage.
This was one of my favorite ideas, aliens get a structure damaging weapon right from the start, but it would be slow, and the gorge would likely need some protection as the marines would have plenty of time to counter react.
I think the fade is too strong so it should have less hp,about 280/140. the acid rocket is tottaly useless with its 25 damage so you should find some balance between teh old 45 and new 25 damage. what about 35? the onos also needs some rebalance: just think about it: an animal with its bite gives more damage than 90 so if skulk bites 75 onos should bite at least 100. On the marine side the siege turret is too weak so i suggest 20 more damage per shot, however jetpack costs too much so i think 12 would be okay. Anyway i would like to thank the creators for this great game, keep up the good work. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-AL()EN+Apr 2 2004, 01:41 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (AL()EN @ Apr 2 2004, 01:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Hi all
I think the fade is too strong so it should have less hp,about 280/140. the acid rocket is tottaly useless with its 25 damage so you should find some balance between teh old 45 and new 25 damage. what about 35? the onos also needs some rebalance: just think about it: an animal with its bite gives more damage than 90 so if skulk bites 75 onos should bite at least 100. On the marine side the siege turret is too weak so i suggest 20 more damage per shot, however jetpack costs too much so i think 12 would be okay. Anyway i would like to thank the creators for this great game, keep up the good work. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Fades aren't too strong in classic, especially if the comm hands out HMG's. Though, fades are a bit overpowered in combat. I don't like making the JP cheaper, and siege is also fine as it is. I'd like to see the cost of marine upgrades are based upon team-sizes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'd like to see the cost of marine upgrades are based upon team-sizes.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> This is a good idea. In large games, the current cost to upgrade the whole marine teams weapons or armor, permanently mind you, seems overly cheap.
<ul><li>Fade cost increased to 3 in combat mode</li></ul><ul><li>Blink energy cost increased by 20%</li></ul>Fade needs to be toned downed a little in combat. Blinking is the lifeline of any fade - a frantically blinking fade is impossible to kill. Increasing the energy cost would do the trick IMO.<ul><li>Acid Rocket deals 40 damage. Energy cost stays</li></ul>Acid Rocket is nowhere as useful as it should be.<ul><li>Charge restored to 1.0x effectiveness</li></ul>Charge, along with Acid Rocket, ranks among the most useless abilities around.<ul><li>Cost of sensory chambers decreased to around 7 res.</li></ul>The nature of sensory chambers requires them to be placed all over the map. At 10 res they are simply not cost effective.<ul><li>Catalyst packs increase reload time and last longer</li></ul>Catalyst packs are not used in Classic at all. This defeinitely needs to be rectified.<ul><li>Hand Grenades are primed and thrown faster and have a larger blast radius. They do 2X damage against structures. Can be resupplied in combat mode.</li></ul>Hand Grenades are rarely used, and don't seem to fit into any role. IMO they should be an early-game substitute for the GL.
Is it not possible to make MTs work like PG with the "choose location" plug in. You know, when you have a PG in marine start, maintenence and triad, and when you use the PG a list comes up like:
Comments
in the playtest irc channel, flayra said that he was hoping to release a new patch every week until he could call it 3.0 <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Seriously.... more people need to play NS :-P But, thats why in any game you see (well, with the exception of Tribes a few years ago) more DM than objective based or strategy based games.
Interesting changes forlorn.... esp the upgrade model.... (sounds kinda like hambone for NS, only lame [I like hambone CO], but it will be interesting to try nonetheless)
Bring back maps that were removed (um.... one of the old ones (bast? was it the one that was removed?)? and ns_delta) (I am assuming they are being fixed).
Movement Chamber:
o Movement chambers transfer aliens to a random hive, complete or under construction (priority is still given to hives under attack, complete or evolving)
o Movement chambers affect all other chambers in their influence radius:
-Defense Chambers heal faster
-Offense Chambers shoot faster
-Sensory Chambers have a larger influence radius
o Make the Movement Chamber replenish alien stamina in a constant flow, rather than in big chunks at a time
Sensory Chamber: (I am not sure whether some of these are included already or not)
o Aliens in the radius of influence of a sensory chamber are not detected by motion tracking
o Aliens without the cloaking upgrade can walk cloaked under sensory chamber influence, but not run, while aliens with the upgrade can both run and walk while being cloaked
o All marines within a certain distance of the sensory chamber (maybe 1/2 cloaking range or something else) are visible on alien hive sight as parasited <b>as long as they stay within "parasiting range" of the sensory chamber</b>
o Marines cannot be telefragged by phasegates and infantry portals any more, rather, they just get pushed away by the teammate that is phasing in. Aliens still get killed
o Increase leap damage dramatically
o Decrease time needed to throw hand grenade after priming
o Increase alien damage for all lifeforms with every hive completed
o Different parasite sprites for TSA structures/lifeforms
o Marines appear as parasited on hivesight when in a certain range of a completed hive
o Fix acid rockets
o Fix shotgun reload animation (!!!)
o Decrease catpack costs and/or increase duration of influence
o Decrease gorge upgrade costs from 10 to 5 (as mentioned by forlorn)
o Decrease fade armor & health
o Increase charge damage in combination with celerity (celerity makes it extremely hard to hit marines with the charge attack)
Thats all I can think of right now.
Movement Chamber:
o Movement chambers transfer aliens to a random hive, complete or under construction (priority is still given to hives under attack, complete or evolving)
o Movement chambers affect all other chambers in their influence radius:
-Defense Chambers heal faster
-Offense Chambers shoot faster
-Sensory Chambers have a larger influence radius
o Make the Movement Chamber replenish alien stamina in a constant flow, rather than in big chunks at a time
Sensory Chamber: (I am not sure whether some of these are included already or not)
o Aliens in the radius of influence of a sensory chamber are not detected by motion tracking
o Aliens without the cloaking upgrade can walk cloaked under sensory chamber influence, but not run, while aliens with the upgrade can both run and walk while being cloaked
o All marines within a certain distance of the sensory chamber (maybe 1/2 cloaking range or something else) are visible on alien hive sight as parasited <b>as long as they stay within "parasiting range" of the sensory chamber</b>
o Marines cannot be telefragged by phasegates and infantry portals any more, rather, they just get pushed away by the teammate that is phasing in. Aliens still get killed
o Increase leap damage dramatically
o Decrease time needed to throw hand grenade after priming
o Increase alien damage for all lifeforms with every hive completed
o Different parasite sprites for TSA structures/lifeforms
o Marines appear as parasited on hivesight when in a certain range of a completed hive
o Fix acid rockets
o Fix shotgun reload animation (!!!)
o Decrease catpack costs and/or increase duration of influence
o Decrease gorge upgrade costs from 10 to 5 (as mentioned by forlorn)
o Decrease fade armor & health
o Increase charge damage in combination with celerity (celerity makes it extremely hard to hit marines with the charge attack)
Thats all I can think of right now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Some of your changes are very alien-biased, though i like most of them. Though i do NOT think that making marines visible on the hivesight when in range of a hive is a good idea, it would take away a surprise phase-shotgun rush to quickly take down a hive. very bad idea. Though I support sc's showing nearby marines on SoF.
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C.
Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A.
Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right.
Ohnoes, yet another one. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> Nice list of pretty good ideas, then... this. I bet you just love getting insta-gibbed as a fade...
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C.
Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A.
Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's geometrically impossible. However, you could make them equally spaced so that the exit hive depends on the placing of the MC inside the hive.
For Example:
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C.
Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A.
Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.
With this as a mapping guideline it should make all the movements work right. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's geometrically impossible. However, you could make them equally spaced so that the exit hive depends on the placing of the MC inside the hive. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It might very well be impossible, but I am reasonbly sure that at least one map works correctly as far as using movements to hop between them goes... doesn't it? And if so, doesn't that make it possible?
Like I said, you can place the hive locations so that the outcome depends on where you put the chamber(while still placing it inside the hive locations).
That's crazy, it kills most current maps. Eclipse, Veil, and other maps with a flatter hive dispositions will have to leave. And it sets too many limits on the mapper and is probably going to be very unbalanced.
I can see that being a serious pain for people though until they caught on though..
I'd also like to see Combat tweaked to work better with games of 2-10 which means faster spawning and lower hp on the hive and cc. Despite the fact that I love the gorge it doesn't belong in combat - we tried it before.. remember. The hive heals itself, the cc doesn't but welding the cc is remarkably boring so I suggest balancing it with greater HP's meaning that in a prolonged game the aliens gain the advantage. Rather than ditch combat I'd like to see it fill its role as a small games option and an introduction to proper ns. Currently I hear people say that Co requires lots of players to work.. personally I try to avoid it but those games that I have played have not been much fun. Win or lose I just dont care. :/
Other than that I just want a little more balance and some bugfixes.
Hive A is closer to hive B than Hive C.
Hive B is closer to hive C than Hive A.
Hive C is closer to hive A than Hive B.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is impossible.
Just get a sheet of paper and do it like I did it:
Draw Hive A.
Draw Hive B at any distance to hive A.
Draw a circle around hive A with radius = distance from hive A to hive B. Every point outside this circle fits for hive C to fulfill statement 1.
Draw a circle around hive B with distance hive A to B (same distance as the other circle). You could place hive C anywhere IN that circle to fulfill statement 2.
Now shade the area that is both OUTSIDE of circle A and INSIDE of circle B, and you will find that if you place the hive anywhere inside that area, you will meet statement 1 & 2. However, whereever you place it, it will be further from hive A than from hive B, which would make statement 3 impossible to meet.
I dont know that map, but if the code of the game itself would be changed, it would give map creators alot more freedom to create their map rather than limit the map layout.
I dont know that map, but if the code of the game itself would be changed, it would give map creators alot more freedom to create their map rather than limit the map layout. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't know what map Torak is thinking about, but I'm pretty sure it exists.
It works because the movement chambers are placed a certain way in the hives themselves so that they create maximum distances to different hives and you warp between them all in a nice circular fashion.
Skulk speed slightly increased
Walljumping added
Parasite switchfun <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
(+5 to the skulk armour, not sure about this one though, i think that newbies are having a tough time as skulks, but then again it *could* make good players to good :/ )
Other changes would be...
UNIVERSAL<ul><li>Gorge abilities now Heal/Bile Bomb/Primal Scream/Web</li><li>Bile bomb damage is based on number of hives, 80/160/240.</li><li>Lerk abilities now Bite/Spikes/Umbra/Spores.</li><li>Spikes damage uped to 20.</li><li>Increase leap damage or reduce its energy requirement.</li><li>LMG clip increased to 60 rounds, with only slight reload time increase.</li><li>Maximum pistol clip reserve increased to 40.</li><li>Acid Rocket damage increased.</li><li>Skulk walljumping.</li></ul>
CLASSIC ONLY<ul><li>Boosting skulk armor to at 15/23/32/40.</li><li>Making skulks exempt from motion tracking.</li><li>Gorge heal does so based on percentage of alien max health.</li><li>Umbra lasts longer.</li><li>Eliminate per player maximum on web. Just have a per area maximum.</li><li>Skulks retain upgrades through death.</li><li>Onos upgrades cost 4 res, fade upgrades cost 3 res.</li><li>Aliens with only one hive respawn 50% faster.</li><li>TF upgrade to Advanced TF time doubled.</li><li>Medpack drops limited to 5 per 5 seconds.</li><li>Turrets and Offence Chambers target players before structures and switch from a structure to a enemy player if one arives. </li><li>Half knife damage and have it do double damage to structures.</li></ul>
COMBAT ONLY<ul><li>Reduce Xeno damage.</li><li>For an alien to get focus, they must be at least level 4.</li></ul>
Yeah, that ought to do it. <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Not sure how you'd do this in combat, considering there is only one hive.. but still, that's a really good idea. I was always stymied with how to make bile-bomb available earlier, but not overpowering on marine bases.. linking the bile-bomb damage to the number of hives is a great solution.
And while we're moving things around, the whole Onos-metabolize, Fade-paralyze switch should be done too.. (though I really like my sticky-bomb idea for fades)
This was one of my favorite ideas, aliens get a structure damaging weapon right from the start, but it would be slow, and the gorge would likely need some protection as the marines would have plenty of time to counter react.
I think the fade is too strong so it should have less hp,about 280/140.
the acid rocket is tottaly useless with its 25 damage so you should find some balance between teh old 45 and new 25 damage. what about 35?
the onos also needs some rebalance: just think about it: an animal with its bite gives more damage than 90 so if skulk bites 75 onos should bite at least 100.
On the marine side the siege turret is too weak so i suggest 20 more damage per shot, however jetpack costs too much so i think 12 would be okay.
Anyway i would like to thank the creators for this great game, keep up the good work. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I think the fade is too strong so it should have less hp,about 280/140.
the acid rocket is tottaly useless with its 25 damage so you should find some balance between teh old 45 and new 25 damage. what about 35?
the onos also needs some rebalance: just think about it: an animal with its bite gives more damage than 90 so if skulk bites 75 onos should bite at least 100.
On the marine side the siege turret is too weak so i suggest 20 more damage per shot, however jetpack costs too much so i think 12 would be okay.
Anyway i would like to thank the creators for this great game, keep up the good work. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Fades aren't too strong in classic, especially if the comm hands out HMG's. Though, fades are a bit overpowered in combat. I don't like making the JP cheaper, and siege is also fine as it is.
I'd like to see the cost of marine upgrades are based upon team-sizes.
This is a good idea. In large games, the current cost to upgrade the whole marine teams weapons or armor, permanently mind you, seems overly cheap.
1. Marine Spawn
2. Maintenence Hive
3. Triad Generator Array
Couldn't the MTs just do that?