How can you say there is little to no skill in CO. That is just plain ignorant. That regen celerity adren and carapace fade isn't going against vanilla marines. Yes they can also tech up too. OOoOoo!
Combat isn't skilless you just have to adapt differently then you would in NS. But I mean hell DMS every round of every game and teching to jetpacks NEVER GETS OLD RIGHT!
Did I say having fun playing co is stupid? You can have fun doing something that takes little to no skill.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->By the time I'm a jper/focus fade in your average pub yes I am going up against vanilla skulks/rines. Because of my lack of skill of course I do this by being 2 and 8. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes because you can get a jp being 2-8 before the aliens get fades..... I believe you missed my point
<!--QuoteBegin-Teppla+Aug 27 2004, 06:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Teppla @ Aug 27 2004, 06:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> It doesn't, they just need an excuse for the reason they died so they can maintain their self esteem at a sufficient level to not commit suicide irl. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> exactly.
In combat getting focus before the marines have jp's is pointless as its not needed to kill marines. I dont find it lame or noobie but i dont see how any 1-hit-kill weapon ever shows a high level of skill (in any game). The main problem i have is that one good alien that has focus can ruin the game for a team of average marines. As Nem said focus is in the game for a reason (whitch i can only see is killing jp/resuplyers) and untill i see Sc's being a better option in clan games i will still say that i would never judge a players skill if that player is using focus.
As for siege maps then its handy to kill jp marines
And for clasic NS, well i havent got a SC upgrade in months <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I find Focus lame in combat mode when its combine with spore spam and/or cloaking. There is no effective counter to it because welding is so rare in combat.
I, see focus in CO (ugh, don't play it much) as cheap and no-skilled. Cloaking dosn't bother me. get scan <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Focus is not lame. Marines get level 1 armor, and the skulk will have to Focus bite 2 times, which takes the same amount of time as 3 normal bites. WOW! It takes 3 normal bites to kill a Marine WITHOUT Focus -- what a coincidence! Therefore, level 1 armor is like wasting that skulks's 2 points. Plus, you are a little bit closer to the HA or Jetpack that <i>you know</i> you're gonna get. Besides, aliens need a way to kill those crazy hard to hit jetpackers.
Lerk is a skulk with wings, just aim a little higher. Armor won't work if they use gas. Get HA or use a shotty, and stay out of umbra. One shot = dead duck.
Fades will own anyone who thinks he's Rambo. Sorry Rambo, but you'll have to travel with a friend for now on. Focus is not the problem. It's the Fade.
Onos with Focus lost out on a more useful upgrade.
Hey, how about this: Grab a shotty, and no more skulk. You will kill him in one shot before he gets close enough to smell you. In fact, that shotty will kill the skulk with full armor, and you'll get to kill all his other 7 friends too, due to it's fast shootin'! (aiming is required)
Do the math: Focus = 2 Extra Armor = 1 point (cheaper than Focus, yeah) Shotgun = 2 points (you get a free damage upgrade in the deal)
As you're supposed to see: Marines are always one step ahead of the Aliens.
Cloaking? Not a problem. One marine gets scanning and ALL Aliens lose out on an upgrade. The ones who already have cloaking: good-bye skill point!
<!--QuoteBegin-Inadaze+Aug 29 2004, 06:53 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Inadaze @ Aug 29 2004, 06:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Focus is not lame. Marines get level 1 armor, and the skulk will have to Focus bite 2 times, which takes the same amount of time as 3 normal bites. WOW! It takes 3 normal bites to kill a Marine WITHOUT Focus -- what a coincidence! Therefore, level 1 armor is like wasting that skulks's 2 points. Plus, you are a little bit closer to the HA or Jetpack that <i>you know</i> you're gonna get. Besides, aliens need a way to kill those crazy hard to hit jetpackers.
Lerk is a skulk with wings, just aim a little higher. Armor won't work if they use gas. Get HA or use a shotty, and stay out of umbra. One shot = dead duck.
Fades will own anyone who thinks he's Rambo. Sorry Rambo, but you'll have to travel with a friend for now on. Focus is not the problem. It's the Fade.
Onos with Focus lost out on a more useful upgrade.
Hey, how about this: Grab a shotty, and no more skulk. You will kill him in one shot before he gets close enough to smell you. In fact, that shotty will kill the skulk with full armor, and you'll get to kill all his other 7 friends too, due to it's fast shootin'! (aiming is required)
Do the math: Focus = 2 Extra Armor = 1 point (cheaper than Focus, yeah) Shotgun = 2 points (you get a free damage upgrade in the deal)
As you're supposed to see: Marines are always one step ahead of the Aliens.
Cloaking? Not a problem. One marine gets scanning and ALL Aliens lose out on an upgrade. The ones who already have cloaking: good-bye skill point! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You obiusly didnt play this game enough to find out marines have no direct counter to focus exept welding + ha which is allready very rare and easy counterble by 1 onos. GG.
As long as it decloaks aliens nearby; It is efective... lol... What else scan have to do to be EFFECTIVE... automatically disable cloacking for all aliens, for the rest of the round, in whole map?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Necrosis+Aug 29 2004, 04:01 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Necrosis @ Aug 29 2004, 04:01 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> By that argument you may as well remove ammo counters because Fades don't have to reload.
People may have noticed that HA beats Focus. Why not upgrade to that and use teamwork and welders. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well by the time it takes a fade to heal then the marine has more than enough time to reload.
As for your second point, a single HA doesn't help much because it larger maps the fade get heal and attack alot of times before the marine gets to a hive. As for a group of Ha/Welders then that is a great ant-focus machine.
Only problem with HA in co is that it takes a while to get to the hive and as there is a the time limit it takes considerably longer to get a team of HA's to a hive then jps which is another reason they are not used much
Back on topic: There was a post on the S&I or the Beta forum saying that marines should all start with welders. I think thats a great idea it will increase teamwork and be a very successful focus counter. Also means the marines can weld a cc faster and get back on the offensive rather than cover 1 guy with a welder
I don't find focus lame. first of all, you have to use 2 skillpoints. a marine with 2 skillpoints, could get damage 1 and armor 1 , and maybe kill that focus skulk.
marine teamplay ftw.
edit : and to reply to the topics title, it does take skill to use focus. but I find it more rewarding to kill marines in other ways.
This has probably already been said up there, but resupply anyone? I get focus almost all of the time, and the armor1 + resupply combo foils my 2-hit kill almost 3/4 of the time. That might be because I suck, but now we're getting to the argument that focus requires skill.
I personally think that armor3 should make focus take three hits (subject to playtesting), but that's it.
OK, this has gone on for long enough. A little hint: If you can't bolster your arguments by anything but attacks at the other side's abilities, chances are you should reconsider your points.
Comments
OOO look at me I'm a fade with regen celerity adren and carapace and im 40 and 3 I"M SO GOOD!
People who complain about focus need to learn how to play classic.
<span style='color:white'>Be nice.</span>
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->By the time I'm a jper/focus fade in your average pub yes I am going up against vanilla skulks/rines. Because of my lack of skill of course I do this by being 2 and 8.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes because you can get a jp being 2-8 before the aliens get fades..... I believe you missed my point
exactly.
As for siege maps then its handy to kill jp marines
And for clasic NS, well i havent got a SC upgrade in months <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Edit: Explained myself better
I, see focus in CO (ugh, don't play it much) as cheap and no-skilled. Cloaking dosn't bother me. get scan <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Lerk is a skulk with wings, just aim a little higher. Armor won't work if they use gas. Get HA or use a shotty, and stay out of umbra. One shot = dead duck.
Fades will own anyone who thinks he's Rambo. Sorry Rambo, but you'll have to travel with a friend for now on. Focus is not the problem. It's the Fade.
Onos with Focus lost out on a more useful upgrade.
Hey, how about this: Grab a shotty, and no more skulk. You will kill him in one shot before he gets close enough to smell you. In fact, that shotty will kill the skulk with full armor, and you'll get to kill all his other 7 friends too, due to it's fast shootin'! (aiming is required)
Do the math:
Focus = 2
Extra Armor = 1 point (cheaper than Focus, yeah)
Shotgun = 2 points (you get a free damage upgrade in the deal)
As you're supposed to see: Marines are always one step ahead of the Aliens.
Cloaking? Not a problem. One marine gets scanning and ALL Aliens lose out on an upgrade. The ones who already have cloaking: good-bye skill point!
Lerk is a skulk with wings, just aim a little higher. Armor won't work if they use gas. Get HA or use a shotty, and stay out of umbra. One shot = dead duck.
Fades will own anyone who thinks he's Rambo. Sorry Rambo, but you'll have to travel with a friend for now on. Focus is not the problem. It's the Fade.
Onos with Focus lost out on a more useful upgrade.
Hey, how about this: Grab a shotty, and no more skulk. You will kill him in one shot before he gets close enough to smell you. In fact, that shotty will kill the skulk with full armor, and you'll get to kill all his other 7 friends too, due to it's fast shootin'! (aiming is required)
Do the math:
Focus = 2
Extra Armor = 1 point (cheaper than Focus, yeah)
Shotgun = 2 points (you get a free damage upgrade in the deal)
As you're supposed to see: Marines are always one step ahead of the Aliens.
Cloaking? Not a problem. One marine gets scanning and ALL Aliens lose out on an upgrade. The ones who already have cloaking: good-bye skill point! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You obiusly didnt play this game enough to find out marines have no direct counter to focus exept welding + ha which is allready very rare and easy counterble by 1 onos. GG.
Fade gets hit by a shotgun 2 times and run away to get hp/ap at hive or uses regen
Full hp/ap
Marine gets hit by focus fade once, fade runs away, marine need some leel of teamwork to get full ap again
Fade and marine meet up again, marine needs one hit to die, fade needs 3-5 shots
The only way to make it fair is to give all marines welders of to make it easier to tell who needs welding
Shotgun != Focus
same as
Jp != lerk
People may have noticed that HA beats Focus. Why not upgrade to that and use teamwork and welders.
People may have noticed that HA beats Focus. Why not upgrade to that and use teamwork and welders. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well by the time it takes a fade to heal then the marine has more than enough time to reload.
As for your second point, a single HA doesn't help much because it larger maps the fade get heal and attack alot of times before the marine gets to a hive. As for a group of Ha/Welders then that is a great ant-focus machine.
Only problem with HA in co is that it takes a while to get to the hive and as there is a the time limit it takes considerably longer to get a team of HA's to a hive then jps which is another reason they are not used much
Back on topic:
There was a post on the S&I or the Beta forum saying that marines should all start with welders. I think thats a great idea it will increase teamwork and be a very successful focus counter. Also means the marines can weld a cc faster and get back on the offensive rather than cover 1 guy with a welder
Quit whining an adapt
(Note I don't use focus until I'm lvl8 as I don't need it when I skulk/lerk)
marine teamplay ftw.
edit : and to reply to the topics title, it does take skill to use focus. but I find it more rewarding to kill marines in other ways.
I personally think that armor3 should make focus take three hits (subject to playtesting), but that's it.
<span style='color:red'>***Locked.***</span>