Final Presidential Debate
EEK
Join Date: 2004-02-25 Member: 26898Banned
Join Date: 2004-02-25 Member: 26898Banned
Well?
I was laughing when Bush was talking about his wife and said "Well uh, she speaks English better then I do," and no one laughed at all, and he just stood there <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> At least they were more on-base this time, this debate got down to the dirt and focused on the important issues and what they are standing for.
I'm saying another victory for Kerry. Bush just isn't a good speaker so I'm not surprised.
"I believe the victory in Afghanistan was a blessing from the Almighty." - George W. Bush.
Kerry's closing statement was very powerful as well, Bush's was kinda rambling and baseless and I lost track of his point halfway through.
I think Kerry had the greatest effect on the crowd too, he did something at the very end, stood up and waved and the crowd went totally apeshit.
I was laughing when Bush was talking about his wife and said "Well uh, she speaks English better then I do," and no one laughed at all, and he just stood there <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> At least they were more on-base this time, this debate got down to the dirt and focused on the important issues and what they are standing for.
I'm saying another victory for Kerry. Bush just isn't a good speaker so I'm not surprised.
"I believe the victory in Afghanistan was a blessing from the Almighty." - George W. Bush.
Kerry's closing statement was very powerful as well, Bush's was kinda rambling and baseless and I lost track of his point halfway through.
I think Kerry had the greatest effect on the crowd too, he did something at the very end, stood up and waved and the crowd went totally apeshit.
Comments
Not as much as the first, but more than the second.
But certainly the best performances from both of them.
Their comments about their wives at the end gave me a good laugh.
One point to the Assualt Weapon.
One point to the **** marriage.
One point to social security.
Tie on national security (I may be a bit biased toward Kerry, but that's how I see it)
EDIT: oops forgot Jobs, that goes to Kerry.
The rest go to Bush.
EDIT: What the hell? A word for person who loves another of the same gender is censored?
By the way, I was very impressed with Bush's stance and Kerry's stance on gun control, they both nearly agreed with gun control and banning assault weapons, but Kerry nailed Bush when he said 'So why did you let this expire?'
PS: Bush is a liar, liar on Osama bin Laden.
We heard nothing new, so I'm going to base the entire debate on the quality and quantity of jokes made. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
To continue my trend of posting the "polls" if they can even be called that:
<a href='http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/?GT1=5472' target='_blank'>http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/?GT1=5472</a>
Take it with a grain of salt.
Nether candidate gave me a satisfactory answer on the issue of our borders, nether of them want to come off to harsh, even though the majority of the country supports much tougher action on the borders, especially with Mexico.
I was disturbed by how Kerry said that letting the public manage a small amount of their social security would be "disasterous". Basically, he said that the public is too stupid to manage their own money.
I was also disturbed when he was talking about healthcare "If its good enough for the senators, its good enough for the American public." So, now the senators are better than everyone else, and if its good enough for them, it damn well better be good enough for the lowly public?
Kerry could have done much better, and I was dissapointed in his preformance.
edit: Maybe I missed the part about stem cell research, but I recall the moderator asking a joint question about stem cell research and something else, but did either of them talk about stem cell research?
39% changed to Kerry
25% changed to Bush
36% are still undecided.
39% changed to Kerry
25% changed to Bush
36% are still undecided. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Scientifically selected undecided voters != randomly selected undecided voters.
Which, in a statistics viewpoint, nulls the poll.
39% changed to Kerry
25% changed to Bush
36% are still undecided. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Scientifically selected undecided voters != randomly selected undecided voters.
Which, in a statistics viewpoint, nulls the poll. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Have you ever taken a statistics class in your life? Do you know anything at all how they work? If you say yes, I know you're a total liar because that statement you just made was one of the dumbest most ignorant things I've heard.
Ever notice how polls that let anyone say anything always say they're not scientifically accurate? The idea behind a scientific poll is finding out a key demographic spread to represent an equal ratio of similar voters.
Who wants to bet that if BUSH won that poll, Hero would be saying it was the greatest thing ever?
I'd have to agree that Kerry was weak once or twice, but nowhere near the stuttering, singleminded mess that Bush was.
Oh... and as to the bit about why Osama Bin Laden was dropped... Bush lied to the cameras. He said that Bin Laden never stopped being an issue. <i>On to the quotes!</i>
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I want justice...There's an old poster out West, as I recall, that said, 'Wanted: Dead or Alive,'"
- G.W. Bush, 9/17/01, UPI<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"...Secondly, he is not escaping us. This is a guy, who, three months ago, was in control of a county [sic]. Now he's maybe in control of a cave. He's on the run. Listen, a while ago I said to the American people, our objective is more than bin Laden. But one of the things for certain is we're going to get him running and keep him running, and bring him to justice. And that's what's happening. He's on the run, if he's running at all. So we don't know whether he's in cave with the door shut, or a cave with the door open -- we just don't know...."
- Bush, in remarks in a Press Availablity with the Press Travel Pool,
The Prairie Chapel Ranch, Crawford TX, 12/28/01, as reported on
official White House site<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I am truly not that concerned about him."
- G.W. Bush, repsonding to a question about bin Laden's whereabouts,
3/13/02 (The New American, 4/8/02)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Now then. Anyone defending Bush on this note, after he screwed himself on national TV? Doublethink doesn't work on everybody, boys.
39% changed to Kerry
25% changed to Bush
36% are still undecided. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Scientifically selected undecided voters != randomly selected undecided voters.
Which, in a statistics viewpoint, nulls the poll. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Now that's just stupid, stop talking unless you understand how these things work. Ever notice how polls that let anyone say anything always say they're not scientifically accurate? The idea behind a scientific poll is finding out a key demographic spread to represent an equal ratio of similar voters. Moron. I'll bet if it said more voted for Bush you'd have no problem with it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
What the hell are you talking about? You didn't even provide a damn link! Please, before obviously flaming me, learn some statistics. The idea behind a demographic spread is to ask random people from all over the US (to have the best results possible, uninfluenced by humans) about their opinion on something, <i> which obviously would represent a equivical ratio of similar voters. </i> If it's not random, that means it is biased in some way, shape, or form, somehow. That is human nature, intentional or not.
Also, I believe I have stated my opinions SEVERAL times on these forums, that I can't stand either Bush, nor Kerry. I didn't even HINT that I'd rather see Bush win, because, I could care less. We're screwed eitherway.
EDIT: CBSnews.com seems to have died. It's on there somewhere. If you don't believe me, it's your damn job to verify the numbers yourself.
CBS is known to be incredably liberal, as with most news networks other than FOX News, which is incredably conservative.
Since when did the news actually bring us unbiased news?
I'd have to agree that Kerry was weak once or twice, but nowhere near the stuttering, singleminded mess that Bush was.
Oh... and as to the bit about why Osama Bin Laden was dropped... Bush lied to the cameras. He said that Bin Laden never stopped being an issue. <i>On to the quotes!</i>
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I want justice...There's an old poster out West, as I recall, that said, 'Wanted: Dead or Alive,'"
- G.W. Bush, 9/17/01, UPI<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"...Secondly, he is not escaping us. This is a guy, who, three months ago, was in control of a county [sic]. Now he's maybe in control of a cave. He's on the run. Listen, a while ago I said to the American people, our objective is more than bin Laden. But one of the things for certain is we're going to get him running and keep him running, and bring him to justice. And that's what's happening. He's on the run, if he's running at all. So we don't know whether he's in cave with the door shut, or a cave with the door open -- we just don't know...."
- Bush, in remarks in a Press Availablity with the Press Travel Pool,
The Prairie Chapel Ranch, Crawford TX, 12/28/01, as reported on
official White House site<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I am truly not that concerned about him."
- G.W. Bush, repsonding to a question about bin Laden's whereabouts,
3/13/02 (The New American, 4/8/02)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Now then. Anyone defending Bush on this note, after he screwed himself on national TV? Doublethink doesn't work on everybody, boys. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is an effective argument because Kerry has never contradicted himself before in his political career.
::Biggest.Rolleyes.Evar.::
EDIT: CBSnews.com seems to have died. It's on there somewhere. If you don't believe me, it's your damn job to verify the numbers yourself. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
What the hell is the point in a biased demographical spread poll?! That's like polling Texas on who should be President, and whatever information they recieve, they can apply it to the rest of the US. Just, wow.
Also, its YOUR job to provide YOUR numbers to YOUR arguement.
Keep the insults coming EEK, they make you look smart.
I think it was the other way around, but I'm not sure. Can't find the study, but I'm looking.
EDIT IN RESPONSE TO YOUR EDIT:
I think the study said that, basically, Fox news is half as conservative as other networks are liberal.
I'd have to agree that Kerry was weak once or twice, but nowhere near the stuttering, singleminded mess that Bush was.
Oh... and as to the bit about why Osama Bin Laden was dropped... Bush lied to the cameras. He said that Bin Laden never stopped being an issue. <i>On to the quotes!</i>
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I want justice...There's an old poster out West, as I recall, that said, 'Wanted: Dead or Alive,'"
- G.W. Bush, 9/17/01, UPI<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"...Secondly, he is not escaping us. This is a guy, who, three months ago, was in control of a county [sic]. Now he's maybe in control of a cave. He's on the run. Listen, a while ago I said to the American people, our objective is more than bin Laden. But one of the things for certain is we're going to get him running and keep him running, and bring him to justice. And that's what's happening. He's on the run, if he's running at all. So we don't know whether he's in cave with the door shut, or a cave with the door open -- we just don't know...."
- Bush, in remarks in a Press Availablity with the Press Travel Pool,
The Prairie Chapel Ranch, Crawford TX, 12/28/01, as reported on
official White House site<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"I am truly not that concerned about him."
- G.W. Bush, repsonding to a question about bin Laden's whereabouts,
3/13/02 (The New American, 4/8/02)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Now then. Anyone defending Bush on this note, after he screwed himself on national TV? Doublethink doesn't work on everybody, boys. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is an effective argument because Kerry has never contradicted himself before in his political career.
::Biggest.Rolleyes.Evar.:: <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh, I see how it is:
Kerry does it: Hes a flip-flopper! Hes not fit to lead the country!
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry!
You people really need to get your **** together.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes because education and jobs are completely unrelated, not entwined like most people would foolishly assume. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Maybe the students hate it because it requires them to meet certain standards?
I had to meet certain standard in school myself, it wasn't easy, but it can be done.
I personally could care less whether or not teachers like any plan, ever, with how over paid they are. Teaching. Is. Not. Hard. If the kinds want to learn and the teacher is half competent, learning will take place in a classroom. You can't force a kid to become motivated that?s up to him/her as we all must have realized at one point ourselves. No Child Left Behind should be No Child Who Cares About Their Future Left Behind.
Also are you implying Bush took money that was designated for education and gave it to anonymous millionaires? I would love some proof of this from a generally reliable source.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hes a polotician. Its what they do. Don't tell me that bush isn't doing the same thing.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you call "making sense" appeasing the audience I'd say yeah. The first step to making the right decision is knowing the correct answer. Bush doesn't even have the correct answers half the time and often sidesteps questions.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you call "making sense" appeasing the audience I'd say yeah. The first step to making the right decision is knowing the correct answer. Bush doesn't even have the correct answers half the time and often sidesteps questions. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, and Kerry gets straight to the point? I hate how Kerry speaks, he puts so much added crap in there, he just needs to get to the point like Bush does, even if he sounds like an idiot sometimes.
Skulkbait is right, they're both politicians. It's what they do. I'm not denying that Bush does the same thing, that'd just be stupid.
Reasa, curiously, have you ever taught? Both of my parents are educators-- and my father took an administrative position at a charter school for troubled kids as a challenge, and I can atest that it certainly wasn't easy. Nor has my mother's career been a breeze, though she teaches at one of the better public high school in the country.
You have 0 credibility with me, as of that mindless statement. And to head you off at the pass, I really don't give a rat's **** what that means to you. You're off base.
Anyway, now it's more like "We're both going to spew rhetoric. You guys vote for who you think is lying the least" and I'm like, meh.....
Bush REALLY missed a chance to pounce on kerry after his assault weapons ban comment. He blew it big... that one got me yelling at the TV.
This debate really reminded us that there are still issues that need attention here at home. We put them on the back burner temporarily after september 11th, but they're eventually going to become prime concerns again- and IMO after september 11th, they just weren't a priority to bush (which I can understand).
Another issue I got **** about was the comment about veterans benefits. Telling everyone you threw more money at the problem is great for appeasing the clueless, but it doesn't mean you actually fixed the problem.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you call "making sense" appeasing the audience I'd say yeah. The first step to making the right decision is knowing the correct answer. Bush doesn't even have the correct answers half the time and often sidesteps questions. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, and Kerry gets straight to the point? I hate how Kerry speaks, he puts so much added crap in there, he just needs to get to the point like Bush does, even if he sounds like an idiot sometimes.
Skulkbait is right, they're both politicians. It's what they do. I'm not denying that Bush does the same thing, that'd just be stupid. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Added crap? I don't think Kerry puts much fluff in his responses. He mentions a lot of examples where Bush's plans fail but I wouldn't call that added crap; they are facts. Now as to how accurate those facts are is a question for factcheck.org to answer but I wouldn't discredit him for bringing up Bush's numerous failures. They are quite valid in a debate.
Bush does it: Well at least he isn't kerry! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite true, however the Kerry camp seems to focus their slogan on "I'm not Bush, so vote for me!" more than the other way around.
In the end, they both flip-flop, but it seems like Kerry does it to appease his audience. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you call "making sense" appeasing the audience I'd say yeah. The first step to making the right decision is knowing the correct answer. Bush doesn't even have the correct answers half the time and often sidesteps questions. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, and Kerry gets straight to the point? I hate how Kerry speaks, he puts so much added crap in there, he just needs to get to the point like Bush does, even if he sounds like an idiot sometimes.
Skulkbait is right, they're both politicians. It's what they do. I'm not denying that Bush does the same thing, that'd just be stupid. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Added crap? I don't think Kerry puts much fluff in his responses. He mentions a lot of examples where Bush's plans fail but I wouldn't call that added crap; they are facts. Now as to how accurate those facts are is a question for factcheck.org to answer but I wouldn't discredit him for bringing up Bush's numerous failures. They are quite valid in a debate. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I mean added words that shouldn't be there. Added words to drag the sentence out, etc. Sure, politicians distort facts all the time, its what they do.
Sure pointing out flaws in someone else's actions is a valid argument. The problem is, while he spewed that he would do better, he had "a plan" for everything, he never went into any detail about why the plan works, why it won't fail, what are the shortcomings and why the overall benefit of his "plans" makes up for them.
You get a guy to lay it on me straight, and I'll respect him. I may not agree, but I'll give him props for that at least.
No, it's not easy to do in 90 seconds.... but in all 3 debates, they pretty much said the same one liners back and forth to each other. I mean wow, you could have a drinking game about it.
"Every time bush says "liberal" take a shot!"
"Every time kerry says "I can do better" Take a shot!"
"Every time bush says "wrong war, wrong place, wrong time" take a shot!"
"Every time kerry says "I have a plan!" Take a shot!"
"Every time.... oh screw it, you're probably passed out by now......"