Bs_0 Vs Bs_1 Tournaments.
digz
be still, maggot Join Date: 2002-05-07 Member: 588Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
be still, maggot Join Date: 2002-05-07 Member: 588Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Pros/Cons/Thoughts?</div> CAL allows scripting, which is primarily a North American Leauge. Ive heard that European clans/leagues prefer to not allow the use of scripts. I myself use several scripts (check the "Share your Scripts" thread, in the scripting forum), which have by far been extreamly usefull in competitive NS. What are your thoughts on this subject? Should leagues take away the ability to script for a vanilla NS, or should they allow complete control on the user end?
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Comments
Pretty much an empty debate, there has been no problems on the NA side, and no problems on the Euro side, with regards to script complaints.
Pretty much a moot subject.
Detectability and enforcement is the issue. Making something illegal doesn't do very much if there is no way to prove or detect that they are using a macro.
Detectability and enforcement is the issue. Making something illegal doesn't do very much if there is no way to prove or detect that they are using a macro. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That doesnt stop us from trying to enforce things such as ESP. I still dont see the issue.
ESP does things outside the realm of the game's possibilities, macros and script workarounds and turbofire mouse1s do not. It is a tad easier to prove that someone is using a wallhack/esp, than that someone shot their pistol so fast they are obviously using a macro.
but as firewater said, orient yourself to the majority of players...
if there were so many europeans that wanted to play with bs0, they would either start another league, or they would start a storm of protests and try to change the rules
but whatever the stance about bs, you should try to follow the rules
if bs is on, you should not try to avoid imho
but whatever the stance about bs, you should try to follow the rules
if bs is on, you should not try to avoid imho <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course you should try and follow the rules, I am merely being realistic about the enforcement and likelyhood that the rules are followed.
ESP does things outside the realm of the game's possibilities, macros and script workarounds and turbofire mouse1s do not. It is a tad easier to prove that someone is using a wallhack/esp, than that someone shot their pistol so fast they are obviously using a macro. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The possibility of cheating yourself around a block doesnt justify allowing it.
but as firewater said, orient yourself to the majority of players...
if there were so many europeans that wanted to play with bs0, they would either start another league, or they would start a storm of protests and try to change the rules
but whatever the stance about bs, you should try to follow the rules
if bs is on, you should not try to avoid imho <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good post mate, almost made me cry from laughing so much.
mp_blockscripts 1 should be for pub servers where the admins believe scripts play the game for other people & as such are unfair.
mp_blockscripts 0 should be for everyone else with a clue.
Minstrel makes a good point. You can buy "gaming keyboards" which allow you to execute many commands from one keypress. How are these any different from using in game aliases <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showforum=62' target='_blank'>available to everyone</a> or macro programs available to significantly fewer people due to their obscurity & difficulty of use?
I also like the hypocrisy espoused by the championing of mp_blockscripts 1 in conjunction with mp_consistency 0 by some leagues/tournaments.
but as firewater said, orient yourself to the majority of players...
if there were so many europeans that wanted to play with bs0, they would either start another league, or they would start a storm of protests and try to change the rules
but whatever the stance about bs, you should try to follow the rules
if bs is on, you should not try to avoid imho <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good post mate, almost made me cry from laughing so much.
mp_blockscripts 1 should be for pub servers where the admins believe scripts play the game for other people & as such are unfair.
mp_blockscripts 0 should be for everyone else with a clue.
Minstrel makes a good point. You can buy "gaming keyboards" which allow you to execute many commands from one keypress. How are these any different from using in game aliases <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showforum=62' target='_blank'>available to everyone</a> or macro programs available to significantly fewer people due to their obscurity & difficulty of use?
I also like the hypocrisy espoused by the championing of mp_blockscripts 1 in conjunction with mp_consistency 0 by some leagues/tournaments. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because a pistol script is the devil, while pink skulks are just cute.
<span style='color:orange'>Sarcastic or not, lets keep things on topic without insulting eachother.</span>
As for blockscripts: Up the the discretion of the tournament organizers. If clans don't like it, they don't have to play. Personally, I don't really care either way.
Can you actually name a league, that uses mp_bs 1 but not mp_const 1.
/rant
Pretty much an empty debate, there has been no problems on the NA side, and no problems on the Euro side, with regards to script complaints.
Pretty much a moot subject. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
An empty debate?
You mean to tell me that scripting has little to no effect on competitve play, and that scripting has no effect on the outcome of matches? Would you consider, for example, scripts that are exploitive (ie wiggle walk script) be allowed in every match, even if the map is designed to be balanced with marines moving at a gameplay speed and not the exploitive speed? (Note, I dont want to get into a debate here concerning what scripts ARE and ARE NOT exploitive, perhaps another thread... another discussion, but for the sake of arguement here I am using the wiggle walk script AS an exploitive one).
What effect does bs_1 have on competitive gameplay? What do you lose when you cant script on bs_0 matches? What can be said from the point of view of players who compete without scripts?
The majority of players who are good with scripts are still pretty frigging good without scripts. I don't script for any of my vital game functions, and thus I generally knowtice no difference whatsoever between BS_1 and BS_0 servers, but I imagine the most destructive aspect of a BS_1 server for players who script (increasing exponentially with the ammount of game functions they have done by scripts) would be just having to get used to everything binded differently then normal.
/rant <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mp_bs 1 is hardly an issue of pistol scripts, it is an issue of bunnyhopping with space or mwheel. As you have stated, scripts neither makes or breaks a player, but it still effects their play.
I see no need to force a player to use mwheel instead of space. In my mind, that is all bs does.
I would love to see someone explain to me how mwheel is different than a 3jump script.
It is worth nothing that BS still remains an issue in international competitive play.
Pscript don't aim for you but they make you fire twice faster.
Macro hit the max ROF 100% of the time.
Lerk cry skulk cry.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
nub down.
I've tried other scripts. I've tried metabolize scripts, blink swipe, leap bite, etc etc etc.
I don't use any of them, because they limited my gameplay far more than they enhanced it.
On bs 1 servers I've had the 'scripting not allowed' message come up when just firing fast. It seems to me that it's overkill for such a minor topic.
I've tried other scripts. I've tried metabolize scripts, blink swipe, leap bite, etc etc etc.
I don't use any of them, because they limited my gameplay far more than they enhanced it.
On bs 1 servers I've had the 'scripting not allowed' message come up when just firing fast. It seems to me that it's overkill for such a minor topic. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wigglewalk script, which is more abusive then pistol scripts by a long shot, and is quite possible to do without _special still.
I've tried other scripts. I've tried metabolize scripts, blink swipe, leap bite, etc etc etc.
I don't use any of them, because they limited my gameplay far more than they enhanced it.
On bs 1 servers I've had the 'scripting not allowed' message come up when just firing fast. It seems to me that it's overkill for such a minor topic. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wigglewalk script, which is more abusive then pistol scripts by a long shot, and is quite possible to do without _special still. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
And almost all clanners (that I know of) don't use it.
I'm not sure about that. The biggest problem with it is that you cannot do anything else but move forward while it's being used. Then again, you could always use a macro program to do it for you, but that's cheating ^____^
Because scripts are the "in" thing to blame for losing at the moment, and therefore that variable makes people think they lost because they were out played?