Actually it demands a pressure team so they don't get any nodes. Rambo mode is a sure way to lose the game thus people not going to the waypoints where they are needed, therefore losing your chance to destroy a hive, keep a choke point covered, protect phase gates etc. I see when I command the Rambo’s often lose the game for the team seeing there are only a few people going where I tell them to go, thus the reason I will not give anything to someone who has not listened to me the entire game seeing they would just go off by themselves and just die. NS is a team game, team work is the key to succeed without it you will not win, bottom line.
well,, i like ramboing ^^ , and i think that in huge games rambos normally lead the marines team to the victory through building pgs, but in pcws also, normally 4 marines try to get the spawn of the hive, while the 5 marine build all the rts of the map, or builds a pg in the second hive. That rambo wins the games.
Ramboing is fine, its just that sometimes you need to push in a group. In narrow, tight hallways, its better to have a rambo because a big group will wind up shooting each other in the back and not being able to hit the enemy. 1-2 skulks can drop that entire team, where as if you send 1-2 people, they may die, but you aren't totally screwed.
Ramboing has its place, but not everyone can do it.
I think the saying 'all eggs in one basket' applies here.
think about these three points for a moment..
1 If marines are going to win, In Serious Games this is usually based on the first 5-10 minutes.. i think most of us can agree that the initial strategies for marines makes all the difference. if they dont get it right then, its a goner. (e.g in public if noone takes the comm chair straight away, the game just becomes a game of aim practise)
2 aliens move fast.. very fast.. so its near impossible for a marine team to know where aliens are throughout most of the initial 5-10 minutes. tho its very easy, given their speed, for aliens to locate the marine team and call for assistance.
3 done correctly one or two skulks can wipe out a group of marines easily, even if they die.. other skulks can get there and thus the battle for this 'choke point, phase gate, hive pressure point' begins.
seriously.. 2 or 3+ marines together step on each others toes alot, block each others aiming and other wise presenting a large noisy target for the speedy alien side. while this is happening, gorges are about building up the defences..umm.. and here is the point.. ON THEIR OWN! - you dont call the gorge a rambo do you? nor do you have a skulk watching over a gorge in case a rambo appears
and the last 19 times out of 20 I fought a gorge alone I won, even if I died by the consequent oc or late skulk.. killing a gorge is easy worth a marines life. and has huge impacts on the res available to aliens.. not only is he not building a res tower of his own, he has to spend more res to become gorge again, has to wait or fight for more res.
so actually in a pcw, 2/3 marines ramboing is a hell of alot harder to pinpoint and kill than a bunch and in larger public games any number of ramboes are harder to catch in the first 5 mins. and if your a good rambo, or just generally good at killing skulks then three marines out their on their own stand a pretty good chance of taking out some early gorges/towers
even if 2 out of 3 marines get killed that one remaining which aliens wont be aware of can build/kill gorge/scout.
on the reverse of small amounts of aliens killing large numbers of marines.. one marine can take out several bunched up skulks on a mission.. on their own skulks are dangerous, together tho they are over confident and provide a big target which one marine can do alot of damage to..
I think the point is, just because a marine is on his own and 'theoritically' is easyer to kill.. does NOT mean he is working against the team..
I remember ramboing once, took out several res towers and put up several while these so called 'choke points...whatever' are being fought.. and because we had the res after then and aliens didnt, arguably I won the game for the team.. they were the decoys, I was the real worker.. you can bet your arse that while you are screaming for soldiers to defend a way point.. there are aliens creeping about, slowly and surly building up their infrastructure.
a bad rambo that is discouraged, is just simply a nobody who has no skill and always dies before killing anything.... and, well, lets face it.. even that can make a skulk think that the marines reason for being there has a purpose and himself wastes times scouting the area looking for 'the rest' of the marines.
tho i still maintain that any rambo worth complaining about has a commander worth complaining about.
I agree with you almost completly, but it's when your "rambos" don't listen and constantly ask for meds//ammo. It's helpful having skilled players deep in enemy lines keeep'n the aliens on their toes. oh btw there is a reason why comm has squad appointing capabilites. eg. 6vs6 scrim map:tanith
squad 1) 2 marines wp>chem transport squad 2) 1 marine wp>west acess squad 3) 3 players wp> reactor room comander: squad 1 secure chem transport then move into hive for further instructions. squad 2, reactor room then to west acess to rendevouz w/ squad 3.
<!--QuoteBegin-Kobayashi+Apr 27 2004, 01:37 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Kobayashi @ Apr 27 2004, 01:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Act Chill: no, those people are good marines suffering under a bad com. probably you...
If they're in a hive, unnoticed, then DROP THEM A PG. If you don't take an opportunity when it presents itself, you're a really bad com. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> This is an RTS... therefore there are VARIED strategies
Ive seen MANY comms, good one's, clan ones... do stuff JUST LIKE THAT... illogical.... but he is the comm... listen
Also.... there is no such thing as a bad strategy in an rts.... only bad counters...
ns is different. there IS such a thing as a bad strategy in ns, in fact almost all strategies except for 1 or 2 are impractical when against a competant team
Oh there are bad strategies in NS....for example turret farming right from the start. Never ever a reliable strat.
Splitting up your HA train to attack all 3 hives at once is a bad strategy, unless each squad is at least 3 people.
The entire alien team res-whoring so everyone gets onos "faster" is a bad strat.
Relocating to a random hallway far away from everything with not even one rt and plenty of vents is a bad strat.
There are a couple really retarded strats that sometimes actually work, but really have no right to, for example spamming rts on every resnode right from the start, or cc blocking.
[/stating the obvious] <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
Ramboing has its place, but not everyone can do it.
in the words of the great late charles barkley..
I May Be Wrong, But I Doubt It
I think the saying 'all eggs in one basket' applies here.
think about these three points for a moment..
1
If marines are going to win, In Serious Games this is usually based on the first 5-10 minutes.. i think most of us can agree that the initial strategies for marines makes all the difference. if they dont get it right then, its a goner.
(e.g in public if noone takes the comm chair straight away, the game just becomes a game of aim practise)
2
aliens move fast.. very fast.. so its near impossible for a marine team to know where aliens are throughout most of the initial 5-10 minutes. tho its very easy, given their speed, for aliens to locate the marine team and call for assistance.
3
done correctly one or two skulks can wipe out a group of marines easily, even if they die.. other skulks can get there and thus the battle for this 'choke point, phase gate, hive pressure point' begins.
seriously.. 2 or 3+ marines together step on each others toes alot, block each others aiming and other wise presenting a large noisy target for the speedy alien side.
while this is happening, gorges are about building up the defences..umm.. and here is the point.. ON THEIR OWN! - you dont call the gorge a rambo do you? nor do you have a skulk watching over a gorge in case a rambo appears
and the last 19 times out of 20 I fought a gorge alone I won, even if I died by the consequent oc or late skulk.. killing a gorge is easy worth a marines life. and has huge impacts on the res available to aliens.. not only is he not building a res tower of his own, he has to spend more res to become gorge again, has to wait or fight for more res.
so actually in a pcw, 2/3 marines ramboing is a hell of alot harder to pinpoint and kill than a bunch and in larger public games any number of ramboes are harder to catch in the first 5 mins. and if your a good rambo, or just generally good at killing skulks then three marines out their on their own stand a pretty good chance of taking out some early gorges/towers
even if 2 out of 3 marines get killed that one remaining which aliens wont be aware of can build/kill gorge/scout.
on the reverse of small amounts of aliens killing large numbers of marines..
one marine can take out several bunched up skulks on a mission.. on their own skulks are dangerous, together tho they are over confident and provide a big target which one marine can do alot of damage to..
I think the point is, just because a marine is on his own and 'theoritically' is easyer to kill.. does NOT mean he is working against the team..
I remember ramboing once, took out several res towers and put up several while these so called 'choke points...whatever' are being fought.. and because we had the res after then and aliens didnt, arguably I won the game for the team.. they were the decoys, I was the real worker..
you can bet your arse that while you are screaming for soldiers to defend a way point.. there are aliens creeping about, slowly and surly building up their infrastructure.
a bad rambo that is discouraged, is just simply a nobody who has no skill and always dies before killing anything.... and, well, lets face it.. even that can make a skulk think that the marines reason for being there has a purpose and himself wastes times scouting the area looking for 'the rest' of the marines.
tho i still maintain that any rambo worth complaining about has a commander worth complaining about.
SADE-yX
oh btw there is a reason why comm has squad appointing capabilites.
eg. 6vs6 scrim map:tanith
squad 1) 2 marines wp>chem transport
squad 2) 1 marine wp>west acess
squad 3) 3 players wp> reactor room
comander: squad 1 secure chem transport then move into hive for further instructions. squad 2, reactor room then to west acess to rendevouz w/ squad 3.
If they're in a hive, unnoticed, then DROP THEM A PG. If you don't take an opportunity when it presents itself, you're a really bad com. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is an RTS... therefore there are VARIED strategies
Ive seen MANY comms, good one's, clan ones... do stuff JUST LIKE THAT... illogical.... but he is the comm... listen
Also.... there is no such thing as a bad strategy in an rts.... only bad counters...
~Jason
Splitting up your HA train to attack all 3 hives at once is a bad strategy, unless each squad is at least 3 people.
The entire alien team res-whoring so everyone gets onos "faster" is a bad strat.
Relocating to a random hallway far away from everything with not even one rt and plenty of vents is a bad strat.
There are a couple really retarded strats that sometimes actually work, but really have no right to, for example spamming rts on every resnode right from the start, or cc blocking.
[/stating the obvious] <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->