Since when was spawncamping frowned upon? Have I missed out on something? I remember when I used to comm I'd send out my best shot to spawn camp the alien team, pretty much. I remember seeing spawncamps going on as far back as 1.00; if you don't like it, play on a server with spawninvul, or don't let them in your spawn in the first place (or kill them once they're there).
ns is a pretty lame game <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-kwikloader+Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kwikloader @ Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If something is possible in the game and isn't an exploit or purposefully intended to make the game less fun for someone without any positive benefits it's a valid tactic. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything.
To prevent spawn camping you need OCs in the hive. At least 6. Going early gorge to drop OCs in the hive is unstopable. Put them right at the entrance to the hive and marines just can't get in.
Alarm bells go off! My cl_autohelp flashes up like crazy:
'This is an alien hive. Kill it quickly to stop the alien menace!', or something.
Fact is, you're in the hive. A skulk spawns. What is he going to do?
a) Eat you b) Not eat you c) Ask how to go gorge and what cc stands for
Most people would probably lean towards A. So what the original poster is saying is that spawncampers should sit back and allow the skulk to eat them. In a perfect world, they could sit down and negotiate, and perhaps decide to walk their seperate ways. However, the alien will always try to eat the marine, so the marine is somewhat justified in shooting the alien before that happens.
The problem here is that many people choose not to learn.
Picture a marine with a good aim at the end of a long hallway. He kills a skulk, and stays there. The skulk spawns, what does he do? On publics, chances are he will try to kill that marine again and again, without even changing strategy. He'll just keep bouncing along that long hallway, and keep dying in exactly the same manner. They refuse to fault themselves, so they never improve at the game.
Most hives in the game are designed so that you can find cover when you spawn, but most people on public servers don't pay any attention, have no idea when they're about to spawn, and therefore sit completely still for up to 5 seconds once they've spawned, giving them a tasty 4 pistol-bullet death.
I remember a server I got banned from for 'spawncamping'. It consisted fn me, plus a mine. Trying to kill TheAdj as a lerk. Although I killed about 2 skulks when they spawned they screamed bloody murder and got me banned. Funny non the less.
My view on spawncamping is like many. Its a good tactic but if you have 8 marines in the hive and alien spawn queue is filled. Then its time to actually kill the hive mkay.
<!--QuoteBegin-Church+Feb 14 2005, 02:12 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Church @ Feb 14 2005, 02:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->To prevent spawn camping: Don't let marine into your hive. If you fail, you deserve to lose.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> And don't let the aliens into your base as well.
A blanket statement like this, which has been repeated so many time in this thread, is a total farce. If you're talking about all things being equal that <i>might </i>apply, but there are so many what ifs in REAL gameplay (talking pubbin here) that would make this bs.
<!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 12:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 12:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-kwikloader+Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kwikloader @ Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If something is possible in the game and isn't an exploit or purposefully intended to make the game less fun for someone without any positive benefits it's a valid tactic. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?
All server's will have their own oppinion on this, deal with it. If you don't approve, don't frequent that server - simple as that.
<!--QuoteBegin-Flounder+Feb 14 2005, 01:52 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Flounder @ Feb 14 2005, 01:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> To prevent spawn camping you need OCs in the hive. At least 6. Going early gorge to drop OCs in the hive is unstopable. Put them right at the entrance to the hive and marines just can't get in.
Man I am smart. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> How would this work in Combat?
<!--QuoteBegin-Toothy+Feb 14 2005, 01:10 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Toothy @ Feb 14 2005, 01:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Most hives in the game are designed so that you can find cover when you spawn <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Though I agree with most of what you say... This is the only part I disagree with. IMO, the only way to fix spawncamping is to make the hives harder to spawncamp. For example - Waste hive on ns_tanith. As much as I love to play tanith, once you got a marine spawn camping in there, it is incredibly difficult to get him out. The reason? All the spawn points are on the floor, easy to see and it's even easier to blow the skulk that's spawning there to smithereens. However, there are also hives like the one on co_ulysees, in which the alien could spawn on top, near the ramp, near the hive, behind the wall under the hive, etc. It'ld be alot more difficult to kill a skulk that's spawning there than waste hive. (I realize it's co but you get the point.)
So, just to sum up, I think a few maps need to have their spawn points tweaked, and then spawn camping will cause less of an uproar. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-DuoGodOfDeath+Feb 14 2005, 01:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DuoGodOfDeath @ Feb 14 2005, 01:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> My view on spawncamping is like many. Its a good tactic but if you have 8 marines in the hive and alien spawn queue is filled. Then its time to actually kill the hive mkay. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> ^^^^^^^^^^
<!--QuoteBegin-AvengerX+Feb 13 2005, 08:26 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (AvengerX @ Feb 13 2005, 08:26 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> so I was playing a game today, and this dork marine was spawn camping base and milked off at least 10 kills... so I tell him to stop and knock it off, no admins were on at this time, and after a few more times telling him to stop he tells me (in a much more rude manner) "learn to play the game noob"
so is that the direction NS is taking? that the end justifies the means. if thats where this game is headed I don't want to be a part of it <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> *ahem* Learn to play the game <b>NOOB</b>
wasnt me, but Ill give it to you straight <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Jesus Christ kwikloader, learn to use the [QUOTE*] tags and stop with the double and triple posting.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Avenger-X. Just go buy your own server, and install all the mods you want, and have your own custom NS. it would be the simplest solution to all your problems with out causing any uneeded work on anyones part (becasuse the people who will work, willget payed) and if you take the time to learn a little programing, you can tweak NS in just abotu any way you want too.
Dont have money? Get a job. I know unemployment is up, but im sure you can find one if you look hard enough. Heck if your smart enough, you might even beable to start up an ebay busness.
And since youll have your own server, you can ban anyone who doesn't have class, and give researve slots to all the classy people, who just want to have fun.
Im just trying to provide the simplest solution to your problems right now. Nothing More
(If you have intellegence, then you can easily learn how to program plugins, I would learn how, but I like NS how it is)
aonomusDedicated NS Mastermind (no need for school)Join Date: 2003-11-26Member: 23605Members, Constellation
Spawncamping is perfectly valid up to a certain point, when its midgame while the marines are all at a hive seiging, its perfectly fine for a skulk to ninja a armory/armslab/ip kill there, infact, its strategy. Just the same its fine for a marine to ninja a unbuilt hive while the other one is being healed and attended to. What isn't fair is when every player of the team agrees to not kill the IP(s) and just get hilarious kills with several oni stomping and gorges spitting.
In such a case where you have nubs spawncamping for no good reason, just f4, its there for a reason.
<!--QuoteBegin-Sky+Feb 14 2005, 04:10 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Sky @ Feb 14 2005, 04:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Jesus Christ kwikloader, learn to use the [QUOTE*] tags and stop with the double and triple posting.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Bad answer ... the aliens can spawncamp/kill as easily as the marines can - e.g. co_faceoff where several spawns are on the lower level. And leave J.C. out of this, before he slays your **** ... lol
It WON'T work in Combat because you don't have OC's, DUH.
<!--QuoteBegin-kwikloader+Feb 14 2005, 02:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kwikloader @ Feb 14 2005, 02:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 12:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 12:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-kwikloader+Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kwikloader @ Feb 14 2005, 11:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 12:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If something is possible in the game and isn't an exploit or purposefully intended to make the game less fun for someone without any positive benefits it's a valid tactic. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?
All server's will have their own oppinion on this, deal with it. If you don't approve, don't frequent that server - simple as that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh but I don't, however, go ANYWHERE and you will have oodles of people whinging about how EVERYTHING is lame.
<!--QuoteBegin-Soylent green+Feb 14 2005, 06:53 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 14 2005, 06:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Oh but I don't, however, go ANYWHERE and you will have oodles of people whinging about how EVERYTHING is lame. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> We agree on THAT!
Spawncamping is entirely valid.. though it sucks to be on the receiving end.
The problem isn't with spawncamping. It's with poor map design. Marines have a choice of where to put IPs. They can put them in defensible positions.
Aliens don't. Couple that with the ranged fire advantage of the marines, the initial drop before the skulk gains control, the paper-like quality of skulks, and any sort of lag and you're spelling out "No chance in hell"
Ideally, all maps should have *some* sort of cover in the hive room, where there is no single spot you can stand at and be able to take out all the spawning aliens, unless they're stupid and charge.
Too often it seems both hive areas and marine start locations are big and open, with little cover, things that play right into the marines' hands. Personally, if the hive areas had more cover, I'd go as far to say spawncamping isn't just valid, but it's a skilled tactic.
Now, spawncamping when the game is over is dumb, but you can always handle that one. F4, join the other side, and finish it. I've done that on a couple of occasions when the marines were setting up their "electro turret farm of doom" and the Onos Brigade was having a competition to see who could devour the most.
<!--QuoteBegin-kwikloader+Feb 14 2005, 05:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kwikloader @ Feb 14 2005, 05:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Sky+Feb 14 2005, 04:10 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Sky @ Feb 14 2005, 04:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Jesus Christ kwikloader, learn to use the [QUOTE*] tags and stop with the double and triple posting.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Bad answer ... the aliens can spawncamp/kill as easily as the marines can - e.g. co_faceoff where several spawns are on the lower level. And leave J.C. out of this, before he slays your **** ... lol
It WON'T work in Combat because you don't have OC's, DUH. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> My point still stands, if ALL of the spawning team (either marine or alien) gets romped by just ONE spawncamper, then you're all idiots and deserve to lose.
On the other hand, if you all get spawncamped in Combat by the entire enemy team, then guess what? It's the end of the game, you lost, end of story.
No matter what, if your team allows spawncamping to continue for any length of time in Combat, you're doing something wrong. It's not the game's fault, and it's not the admin's job to balance skill levels when one team gets in an advantageous position.
And who is this JC, and how does he know where I live. I'm assuming he knows where I live, because he's going to come kill me apparently. Or maybe he's just coming for my ****, I get that alot.
<!--QuoteBegin-Sky+Feb 14 2005, 09:59 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Sky @ Feb 14 2005, 09:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> No matter what, if your team allows spawncamping to continue for any length of time in Combat, you're doing something wrong. It's not the game's fault, and it's not the admin's job to balance skill levels when one team gets in an advantageous position.
And who is this JC, and how does he know where I live. I'm assuming he knows where I live, because he's going to come kill me apparently. Or maybe he's just coming for my ****, I get that alot. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Saying a team "allows" spawncamping/killing is a joke, get real ... like a team sat there and invited them in.
If you don't know J.C. that's your loss. You'll meet him one day foe show. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
J.C. = Jesus Christ FWI. And I believe that spawn camping all depends on the situation. In CO Camping and racking kills in, not killing hive/CC. No. Killing aliens or marines while attacking the hive/CC. Ok. If you let the guy in your base and he kills eeryone and kills the hive, then you had a poor defence and you loose.
<!--QuoteBegin-Backstaber+Feb 14 2005, 10:29 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Backstaber @ Feb 14 2005, 10:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> J.C. = Jesus Christ FWI. And I believe that spawn camping all depends on the situation. In CO Camping and racking kills in, not killing hive/CC. No. Killing aliens or marines while attacking the hive/CC. Ok. If you let the guy in your base and he kills eeryone and kills the hive, then you had a poor defence and you loose. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Backy! I wubjoo! <3 Welcome to NS Forums my lil bishy
Having spawn protection plugings obviously help people get better at the game.
Having plugins that give people 1000000 levels when they join 2 minutes late help people get better at the game.
Having little gnomes run around with a pickaxe that does 10X more damage than the regular knife helps people get good at the game.
On a less sarcastic note:
Breaking out of a spawncamp with your own skill, helps you to get good at the game.
Learning how to spawncamp to win a game, helps you get good at the game, and also leads many teams to victory.
Learning how to fade, lerk, skulk inside a spawncamp, and doing everything in your power to prevent that marine team from killing your hive during a spawncamp, helps you to get better at the game.
You want to whine about spawncamping, then you don't want to play this game the way it is meant to be played. If I ever meet one person who is anti-spawncamp and anti-script, saying scripts are against the way the game is supposed to be played, I think I'll personally take the liberty of shoving a poolstick up your left nostril.
Spawncamping is one of the few keys to victory in this game. Use it to your advantage.
<!--QuoteBegin-the hole+Feb 14 2005, 11:17 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (the hole @ Feb 14 2005, 11:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If I ever meet one person who is anti-spawncamp and anti-script, saying scripts are against the way the game is supposed to be played, I think I'll personally take the liberty of shoving a poolstick up your left nostril. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Threatening people who prefer to play differently than you is pretty weak. Not that I really care much for either side of this argument but, your opinion of how ns is "supposed" to be played doesn't seem to match up very well with the published opinions of the ns creators.
<!--QuoteBegin-http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/view?action=faq+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/view?action=faq)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>What console commands does the team view as exploits?</b> NS was meant to be played without the console. Any command or behavior that requires the console or a custom .cfg to operate is considered an exploit and won't be allowed in official competitive play, whenever enforceable. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Spawn camping is perfectly fine. Generally all you need to do to stop spawn camping is drop 1 OC next to your hive, something that people don't do anymore. Either the commander will be spending lots of res on medpacks and ammo, or the skulks will hopefully catch the marine in the middle of a reload. This is of course assuming one lone marine.
<!--QuoteBegin-milosis+Feb 14 2005, 11:41 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (milosis @ Feb 14 2005, 11:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i guess thats why they created a forum dedicated to scripting.
oh wait... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The existance of a forum about scripts is only evidence the demand from the community to discuss scripts. It does not negate the existance of the announced opinion that I quoted above, unless of course you are incapable of grasping the fact that nearly all developers of software and any other product for that matter must consider the desires of consumers in addition to their own vision.
Hmm come to think of it. Without scripts HL2 would be worthless. So would half-life and many other games.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->What console commands does the team view as exploits? NS was meant to be played without the console. Any command or behavior that requires the console or a custom .cfg to operate is considered an exploit and won't be allowed in official competitive play, whenever enforceable. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Also the last time I remembered. CAL allows scripts and always has. Plus I'm sure if we were to ask Flayra now about those dastardly scripts. Im sure he would change his mind on that old quote there.
God, I hope I didn't turn this into a scripting thread now.
Comments
It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything.
Man I am smart.
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Alarm bells go off! My cl_autohelp flashes up like crazy:
'This is an alien hive. Kill it quickly to stop the alien menace!', or something.
Fact is, you're in the hive. A skulk spawns. What is he going to do?
a) Eat you
b) Not eat you
c) Ask how to go gorge and what cc stands for
Most people would probably lean towards A. So what the original poster is saying is that spawncampers should sit back and allow the skulk to eat them. In a perfect world, they could sit down and negotiate, and perhaps decide to walk their seperate ways.
However, the alien will always try to eat the marine, so the marine is somewhat justified in shooting the alien before that happens.
The problem here is that many people choose not to learn.
Picture a marine with a good aim at the end of a long hallway. He kills a skulk, and stays there. The skulk spawns, what does he do? On publics, chances are he will try to kill that marine again and again, without even changing strategy. He'll just keep bouncing along that long hallway, and keep dying in exactly the same manner. They refuse to fault themselves, so they never improve at the game.
Most hives in the game are designed so that you can find cover when you spawn, but most people on public servers don't pay any attention, have no idea when they're about to spawn, and therefore sit completely still for up to 5 seconds once they've spawned, giving them a tasty 4 pistol-bullet death.
My view on spawncamping is like many. Its a good tactic but if you have 8 marines in the hive and alien spawn queue is filled. Then its time to actually kill the hive mkay.
And don't let the aliens into your base as well.
A blanket statement like this, which has been repeated so many time in this thread, is a total farce. If you're talking about all things being equal that <i>might </i>apply, but there are so many what ifs in REAL gameplay (talking pubbin here) that would make this bs.
It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?
All server's will have their own oppinion on this, deal with it. If you don't approve, don't frequent that server - simple as that.
Man I am smart. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
How would this work in Combat?
Though I agree with most of what you say... This is the only part I disagree with. IMO, the only way to fix spawncamping is to make the hives harder to spawncamp. For example - Waste hive on ns_tanith. As much as I love to play tanith, once you got a marine spawn camping in there, it is incredibly difficult to get him out. The reason? All the spawn points are on the floor, easy to see and it's even easier to blow the skulk that's spawning there to smithereens. However, there are also hives like the one on co_ulysees, in which the alien could spawn on top, near the ramp, near the hive, behind the wall under the hive, etc. It'ld be alot more difficult to kill a skulk that's spawning there than waste hive. (I realize it's co but you get the point.)
So, just to sum up, I think a few maps need to have their spawn points tweaked, and then spawn camping will cause less of an uproar. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
^^^^^^^^^^
so is that the direction NS is taking? that the end justifies the means. if thats where this game is headed I don't want to be a part of it <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
*ahem* Learn to play the game <b>NOOB</b>
wasnt me, but Ill give it to you straight <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Dont have money? Get a job. I know unemployment is up, but im sure you can find one if you look hard enough. Heck if your smart enough, you might even beable to start up an ebay busness.
And since youll have your own server, you can ban anyone who doesn't have class, and give researve slots to all the classy people, who just want to have fun.
Im just trying to provide the simplest solution to your problems right now. Nothing More
(If you have intellegence, then you can easily learn how to program plugins, I would learn how, but I like NS how it is)
In such a case where you have nubs spawncamping for no good reason, just f4, its there for a reason.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bad answer ... the aliens can spawncamp/kill as easily as the marines can - e.g. co_faceoff where several spawns are on the lower level. And leave J.C. out of this, before he slays your **** ... lol
It WON'T work in Combat because you don't have OC's, DUH.
It may be a "valid tactic", but it's still up to the discretion of the server ops if they want to limit this if the main goal of the team is being sidetracked by one player's efforts re: abuse. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's up to the server admins if they want to slap marines down to 1 hp whenever aliens start to lose while simultaneously spamming spawnhive, but this has no bearing on anything. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?
All server's will have their own oppinion on this, deal with it. If you don't approve, don't frequent that server - simple as that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh but I don't, however, go ANYWHERE and you will have oodles of people whinging about how EVERYTHING is lame.
We agree on THAT!
The problem isn't with spawncamping. It's with poor map design. Marines have a choice of where to put IPs. They can put them in defensible positions.
Aliens don't. Couple that with the ranged fire advantage of the marines, the initial drop before the skulk gains control, the paper-like quality of skulks, and any sort of lag and you're spelling out "No chance in hell"
Ideally, all maps should have *some* sort of cover in the hive room, where there is no single spot you can stand at and be able to take out all the spawning aliens, unless they're stupid and charge.
Too often it seems both hive areas and marine start locations are big and open, with little cover, things that play right into the marines' hands. Personally, if the hive areas had more cover, I'd go as far to say spawncamping isn't just valid, but it's a skilled tactic.
Now, spawncamping when the game is over is dumb, but you can always handle that one. F4, join the other side, and finish it. I've done that on a couple of occasions when the marines were setting up their "electro turret farm of doom" and the Onos Brigade was having a competition to see who could devour the most.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Who said anything about the aliens being spawncamped? Can the marines not get spawncamped or are they immune from it?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There's never a time when an alien should be camping marines spawning at the ips and not also chewing down some building in marine start, that's why. So marines can get spawncamped, but if left unchecked it will always result directly in an alien win, which people can deal with. Apparently it's difficult for some people to understand why spawncamping aliens also leads to victory....just not always quickly/directly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How would this work in Combat? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wave spawning ftw. If there's only one marine in the hive, the large group of skulks will kill him. If there's a bunch of marines in the hive, guess what, it's game over. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bad answer ... the aliens can spawncamp/kill as easily as the marines can - e.g. co_faceoff where several spawns are on the lower level. And leave J.C. out of this, before he slays your **** ... lol
It WON'T work in Combat because you don't have OC's, DUH. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
My point still stands, if ALL of the spawning team (either marine or alien) gets romped by just ONE spawncamper, then you're all idiots and deserve to lose.
On the other hand, if you all get spawncamped in Combat by the entire enemy team, then guess what? It's the end of the game, you lost, end of story.
No matter what, if your team allows spawncamping to continue for any length of time in Combat, you're doing something wrong. It's not the game's fault, and it's not the admin's job to balance skill levels when one team gets in an advantageous position.
And who is this JC, and how does he know where I live. I'm assuming he knows where I live, because he's going to come kill me apparently. Or maybe he's just coming for my ****, I get that alot.
And who is this JC, and how does he know where I live. I'm assuming he knows where I live, because he's going to come kill me apparently. Or maybe he's just coming for my ****, I get that alot. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Saying a team "allows" spawncamping/killing is a joke, get real ... like a team sat there and invited them in.
If you don't know J.C. that's your loss. You'll meet him one day foe show. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Killing aliens or marines while attacking the hive/CC. Ok.
If you let the guy in your base and he kills eeryone and kills the hive, then you had a poor defence and you loose.
Killing aliens or marines while attacking the hive/CC. Ok.
If you let the guy in your base and he kills eeryone and kills the hive, then you had a poor defence and you loose. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Backy! I wubjoo! <3 Welcome to NS Forums my lil bishy
Having plugins that give people 1000000 levels when they join 2 minutes late help people get better at the game.
Having little gnomes run around with a pickaxe that does 10X more damage than the regular knife helps people get good at the game.
On a less sarcastic note:
Breaking out of a spawncamp with your own skill, helps you to get good at the game.
Learning how to spawncamp to win a game, helps you get good at the game, and also leads many teams to victory.
Learning how to fade, lerk, skulk inside a spawncamp, and doing everything in your power to prevent that marine team from killing your hive during a spawncamp, helps you to get better at the game.
You want to whine about spawncamping, then you don't want to play this game the way it is meant to be played. If I ever meet one person who is anti-spawncamp and anti-script, saying scripts are against the way the game is supposed to be played, I think I'll personally take the liberty of shoving a poolstick up your left nostril.
Spawncamping is one of the few keys to victory in this game. Use it to your advantage.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Threatening people who prefer to play differently than you is pretty weak. Not that I really care much for either side of this argument but, your opinion of how ns is "supposed" to be played doesn't seem to match up very well with the published opinions of the ns creators.
<!--QuoteBegin-http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/view?action=faq+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/view?action=faq)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>What console commands does the team view as exploits?</b>
NS was meant to be played without the console. Any command or behavior that requires the console or a custom .cfg to operate is considered an exploit and won't be allowed in official competitive play, whenever enforceable. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
-Brackhar
oh wait... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The existance of a forum about scripts is only evidence the demand from the community to discuss scripts. It does not negate the existance of the announced opinion that I quoted above, unless of course you are incapable of grasping the fact that nearly all developers of software and any other product for that matter must consider the desires of consumers in addition to their own vision.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->What console commands does the team view as exploits?
NS was meant to be played without the console. Any command or behavior that requires the console or a custom .cfg to operate is considered an exploit and won't be allowed in official competitive play, whenever enforceable. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Also the last time I remembered. CAL allows scripts and always has. Plus I'm sure if we were to ask Flayra now about those dastardly scripts. Im sure he would change his mind on that old quote there.
God, I hope I didn't turn this into a scripting thread now.
[shoot's self]