Ns_vargus

Kittamaru · November 2006

To fix the floating skulk problem, simply lower the main clipbrush, then use clipbrush wedges to raise and lower a skulk over the next portion so they don't get stuck. This will simulate a skulk "stepping over" them, which makes sense

DarkATi · November 2006

I think for now I'm gonna wait and see exactly how it looks in-game. I know players hate getting stuck, especially on walls as a skulk, so I'm trying to make this map more "friendly" towards the player. We'll see in beta testing, if this thing ever makes it that far.

Cheers,
~ DarkATi

EDIT: Double Post...

Kittamaru · November 2006

Dark, could you give me a quick simple explanation of how exactly clipnodes work? I know they are something players will walk over, are invisible, but what else is their effect on the compile?

Also, if anyone has a quick Tut for hint brushes (The ones I've found have been unhelpful <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />)

Kouji_San · November 2006

Is it ok if I give a little example? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

Simple explaination:
Clipnodes are nothing more a defination in the engine where the player cannot go. They are invisible shells arround solid objects so you can't walk trough the walls of a map into the void.

The only bad effect on the compile would be if you don't use a simplified clipbrush arround complex brushes. In this case hlbsp will add many clipnodes which aren't needed. A clipbrush is nothing more then a normal brush textured in the CLIP texture. CLIP textures are invisible ingame but you can help the compile tools by telling them not to compile clipnodes for anything you have inside the clipbrush. But instead use the simplyfied clipbrush as the clipping hull. It's also a good idea to clipbrush areas you can't get to like inaccessable scenery outside the playable area of the map

You can put these for example arround the pipes like DarkATi did in his example shots.

Kittamaru · November 2006

But the clip brushes have to touch the surrounding geometry to completely seal it off, like fixing a leak on the map, right?

Kouji_San · November 2006

A leak should always be fixed by normal brushes. I think it's not possible to seal it with a clipbrush (it's only used for clipping hulls generation during bsp?). But if it can seal leaks it still won't be rendered -->you will still have a hole in your map trough which you can see into the void.

Anyway DarkATI, clipbrush every weird shapes on walls and ceilings you can man. player and hlbsp will thank you for it <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

Map is 75% done as posted in the first post? GET TO WORK! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

Kittamaru · November 2006

Not what I meant <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

I mean, for a clipbrush to prevent any other clipnodes being added to a complex geometry beneath it, it must FULLY cover the geometry, ect

]]]
*)|
* |
*)|
* |
*)|
]]]

Where the brackets are the edge of the wall, the astrics and parenthases are the geometry, and the |'s are the clip brush. It must be wall to wall, correct?

Kouji_San · November 2006

I'm not good with ascii but here goes

Let's say this tsa logo is a complex brush and the symbols are the clipbrush (in this case a simple box shape)
_____
| <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tsa.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::tsa::" border="0" alt="tsa.gif" /> |
--------

You cannot go inside a clipbrush and touch the tsa logo, instead everything inside the clipbrush will be discarded from the clip hulls. Significantly reducing the amount of clipnodes in the final bsp tree

--------

This is what I get from your ascii drawing? tsa logo again (green=normal wall, red=clipbrush)-->
<span style="color:#FF0000">_____</span>
<span style="color:#33FF33">|</span> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tsa.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::tsa::" border="0" alt="tsa.gif" /> <span style="color:#FF0000">|</span>
<span style="color:#FF0000">--------</span>

This will only improve player movement. But it's not the way to use the clipbrush, since it will still add the clip hulls behind the clipbrush. Which would be rather silly, because the player can't get there <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

Offtopicness over I hope... sry DarkAti for hijacking the thread like this <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/marine.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::marine::" border="0" alt="marine.gif" />

Kittamaru · November 2006

So, in order for it to work, you have to surround the object in clip brushes?

Thaldarin · November 2006

Yes. Basically instead of all those faces that the pipe has generating each clip node per face you have on big square clip node.

Kittamaru · November 2006

what if said object is up against a wall?

DarkATi · December 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kittamaru @ Nov 30 2006, 08:24 PM) [snapback]1582506[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
what if said object is up against a wall?
</div>

Rephrase the question?

I'm quite confused.

Cheers,
~ DarkATi

Thaldarin · December 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kittamaru @ Dec 1 2006, 12:24 AM) [snapback]1582506[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
what if said object is up against a wall?
</div>

Assuming you mean two solid objects touching then..... that 1 clip node which was just a flat wall can now become two (or more depending on amount of things/shape touching the wall) clip nodes.

DarkATi · December 2006

Well, friends, it has been quite some time since I posted a new update / screenshot.

I am compiling right now. If everything goes through I should have a new screenshot or two for you tonight. I won't have this done before Christmas, though, sorry. But, something to look forward to in 2007, eh?

Wow, it has been sooo long since I first began this project. I can't wait for this to make beta.

*Ns_Vargus_b1* ...

*grins*

Cheers & Happy Holidays,
~ DarkATi

CrashLemon · December 2006

*Tip* After this map, start mapping for HL2 <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

DarkATi · December 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CrashLemon @ Dec 17 2006, 05:59 PM) [snapback]1589627[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
*Tip* After this map, start mapping for HL2 <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
</div>

Oh I already map for HL2. I looove the new features in source. I only have two complaints:

1. The dadgum texture applier tool won't let you add texture + attributes correctly to multiple surfaces / move around with the camera tool.

2. Source is based around "props". Brushwork has taken a backseat, and you can't match the level of complexity or detail with solid brushwork, making brush props look "cheap".

Ns_Vargus has been a looooong time project. I can't wait to finish her and move on to something in source, though.

UPDATE: Still compiling... slow RAD.

Cheers & Happy Holidays,
~ DarkATi

Kouji_San · December 2006

*taps foor on floor, while looking at his watch*

DarkATi · December 2006

BuildVISLeafs running very slow at almost 40%...

~ DarkATi

Mentar · December 2006

get a better computer <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

CrashLemon · December 2006

zZzZzZZzz... Almost done now?

DarkATi · December 2006

Haha, ATi has a bad computer... but NO, actually I was busy at church these last few hours.

Well, the new area looked like garbage, so I won't post it, but here's an overview.

H = Hive
MS = Marine Start
N = Node (Outside of a Hive or the MS of course, I didn't label any of those.)

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v650/DarkATi/overviewnew7.png" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />

Cheers & Happy Holidays,
~ DarkATi

Kouji_San · December 2006

Am I seeing things or do two of your hives (left and bottom) only have 1 main exit?

<span style="color:#666666">*scratches behind ear*</span>

[edit]
Oh and fix this garbage area and get back to compiling you nubcaek! I wannah walk arround in the map and "oh and ah<span style="color:#666666">*</span>" at all your pretties in there!!! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

<span style="color:#666666">*warning some drooling might be involved</span>

Thaldarin · December 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kouji_San @ Dec 18 2006, 03:58 AM) [snapback]1589737[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
Am I seeing things or do two of your hives (left and bottom) only have 1 main exit?

<span style="color:#666666">*scratches behind ear*</span>

[edit]
Oh and fix this garbage area and get back to compiling you nubcaek! I wannah walk arround in the map and "oh and ah<span style="color:#666666">*</span>" at all your pretties in there!!! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

<span style="color:#666666">*warning some drooling might be involved</span>
</div>

Yeah but with the map being a WIP there is obvious planned routes for the 2nd exits to the hives

CrashLemon · December 2006

Lol, dosen't seem like the same map <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DarkATi @ Sep 22 2004, 03:52 AM) [snapback]1250810[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>

BEFORE ------------------------------------
<img src="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/uploads//post-4-1095843796.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />

AFTER ------------------------------------
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v650/DarkATi/overviewnew7.png" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
</div>

Kouji_San · December 2006

Still no shots <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" />

StixNStonz · December 2006

lol you seriously cant figure out where that piece of map went?!

...rotate it clockwise by 90 degrees and look for the blue 'U'

DarkATi · December 2006

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(StixNStonz @ Dec 21 2006, 04:02 AM) [snapback]1590812[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
lol you seriously cant figure out where that piece of map went?!

...rotate it clockwise by 90 degrees and look for the blue 'U'
</div>

I don't think he was serious.

Cheers & Happy Holidays,
~ DarkATi

Kouji_San · December 2006

Can we have screenshots for Xmas? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi

Thaldarin · January 2007

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kouji_San @ Dec 21 2006, 06:34 PM) [snapback]1590976[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'>
Can we have screenshots for Xmas? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />

/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
/poke DarkATi
</div>

Looks like he is a bloody humbug. No presents for us it seemed.

DarkATi · January 2007

Hey guys, had me some surgery yesterday... still working on the map. (with one hand) I can't do much of anything with my left hand for 6 weeks.

Just wanted to update.

Cheers,
~ DarkATi

Ns_vargus

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