<!--quoteo(post=1677445:date=May 3 2008, 05:46 AM:name=Rhodri)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rhodri @ May 3 2008, 05:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677445"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh and do you want us to start sending you pencils and paper so you guys can actually write your ideas down? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Pen and paper? You're living in the past! NOTEPAD.exe is where it's at.
Awesome mock-ups. I hope you manage to achieve that kind of style or quality, or better. Whatever else I might have liked to say has already been said. No point repeating it.
See, we need more of these. This is the kind of news we want <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1677500:date=May 3 2008, 07:18 PM:name=SerDai)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SerDai @ May 3 2008, 07:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677500"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The way to settle this is to have 3 ways of managing economy: libertarian (each one gets what he earns by killing enemies), communist (resources are divided equally) and welfare (a certain ammount of income is taxed from the rich and given to the poor).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'd prefer a representative currency system. ie. Resources = Bullion. Credits = Currency. Marines earn credits. The team earns resources. Spending personal credits means you're also spending your team's resources, but you're limited by how much credits you possess and can spend...
fanaticThis post has been edited.Join Date: 2003-07-23Member: 18377Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1677502:date=May 3 2008, 01:06 PM:name=Narcil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Narcil @ May 3 2008, 01:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677502"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->tbh the thing that drove teamwork for the marines in ns was the commander being the sole distribution system of tech and weapons. With the marines being able to buy their own weapons when they want it, it would be almost impossible to organise sg rushes etc in pubs. i could only see the weapon purchasing working in clan matches where the team is all working together. IMO this buying feature will just be a hindrance to marine team play and i could see it as being the major downfall of ns2<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Actually, the way I see it, individuals buying weapons themselves would be worse for competitive players than pubbers. A lot of pubbers are only playing for a "quick fix", while competitive players generally prefer the game mechanics to be more complex. I really hope the buy menu is only meant for some sort of Combat mode.
Apart from that, stuff looks/sounds good/interesting. 2010 is going to be a good year. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink-fix.gif" />
Not enough time to read what everyone else said here <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
Did anyone else notice the "Nuke" in the weapons upgrade menu in the first mockup...? Could this be the EMP blast thing?
EMP blast would surely be silly, you would just kill off computers, lights and stuff that you, as a marine need to get around the level. But, saying that, you could also use it to open electronic doors and shut down rouge computers that may have defences within the map. Just an idea.
I think we should all refer to the Gorge Suit as the G-Suit. Gorge Suit just sounds silly...
I like the blurring on the menu. Looks good enough to eat!
Bouncing shells on the shotgun sounds fun! But it depends on how it will look in game... I also love the fact that you used the pod/add on idea I suggested somewhere on the forums. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Could we see some other shells for the shotgun. Say an Inferno Shell (bursts on impact and has a chance of setting it’s target on fire) Or maybe an Armour Penetration Shell (AP Shell), that would go through think walls.
All in all it looks very nice. Would like to see some more alien stuff next week! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
La ChupacabraJoin Date: 2008-02-25Member: 63729Members
edited May 2008
<!--quoteo(post=1677516:date=May 3 2008, 03:46 PM:name=INKEDOUT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(INKEDOUT @ May 3 2008, 03:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677516"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think we should all refer to the Gorge Suit as the G-Suit. Gorge Suit just sounds silly...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's the point! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> Listen to the podcast, mate! It should clear things <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Hom, on the other side, it would be cool to spy on Kharaa in a gorge suit like in TF2 <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
"Don't mind me, I'm just gorging, char, char, char" <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
EDIT: reminds me of Allo, Allo! episodes when the two british airmen were disguised as a cow <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Awesome! I like that you guys finally gave us some NS2 matrial =) But how about that "Welding Bot" (or what ever the name is),,, Are you going to include that?? (It whould be awesome <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />)
<!--quoteo(post=1677499:date=May 3 2008, 11:14 AM:name=MarshalTT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MarshalTT @ May 3 2008, 11:14 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677499"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->About the resouce system, and the buymenu.
I think the best way to keep the old ways and also integrate the new buymenu you should do the next thing.
From the "resourcetowers" only the commander get the resource. If a marine kill an alien, he get that resource, not the commander. So if he killed enough aliens, then he can buy weapons and upgardes for his self. But if the team need extra resource then the player can donate his resource to commander, or to another player.
Example like in World in Conflict. Every body gets Tactical Aid points in the fight. But you can give your point to other players, so together you can call in better airstrikes, ariborne, scan, nuke etc.. If you press the TAB button the scoreboard is show up and you can see the names. Next to the players name there are 2 button. A number 1 and a number 5. Number 1 give the player 1 TA point number 5 give 5 TA point. Thats all. And i think this is a very simple and good system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
sounds like a great idea, but it would require the commander to have free control of his res to distribute amongst his marines and upgrades/meds/ammo.
ex. - game start - Comm: "SHOTGUN RUSH" - comm allocates most to all res to marines so marines can purchase shotguns -
I also agree with everybody about the Comm role of play. The Commander needs to the most important part of the marine team, with the micromanagement of resources to leading players to their objectives, versus the alien side where as there is no leader figure and it is more of a "For the greater good" kind of feel and gameplay
I'm pretty sure Valve/Turtle Rock will be using match making for L4D (heard something about it, as well adding match making to TF2, for PC). Also, not sure if you guys mentioned this or not (didn't hear it), but if there's a couple of players that aren't any where near each other or any other squad, would they be placed in like a 'neutral' group? So if you needed you could quick click all the people who are alone or something?
I'm getting the impression that marine res flow will be split into 2 pools: One "team" pool for the commander to spend on team upgrades and structures, and another "individual" pool for the marines to spend on weapons and equipment.
That's all well and good so far, but realize that a lot of the strategic diversity available to Marines in NS1 came from being able to tilt marine res flow towards one of those goals at the expense of the other -- ie, one team could spend a lot of money on weapons and gear while getting very few upgrades, and another team could invest their money into structures and team upgrades early and hold off on the weapons till later. Those two games would then play out very differently because of that strategic choice made by the commander.
I'm worried that this strategic diversity could disappear if marine res flow is locked into a particular distribution pattern, like say 50% goes to the team pool and 50% to the individual pool. The particular type of weapons and upgrades purchased might be different from game to game, but every marine team would always then have to spend exactly half its money on equipment and half on buildings/tech.
Therefore, the marine comm should at the least have some way of controlling how much of his income flows into each pool. He should also be able to dump team money into individual pools when players need weapons fast, like for a team push or something, or have some other way of letting the comm get heavy weapons into players hands when necessary.
<!--quoteo(post=1677578:date=May 4 2008, 07:04 AM:name=Cxwf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Cxwf @ May 4 2008, 07:04 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677578"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm getting the impression that marine res flow will be split into 2 pools: One "team" pool for the commander to spend on team upgrades and structures, and another "individual" pool for the marines to spend on weapons and equipment.
That's all well and good so far, but realize that a lot of the strategic diversity available to Marines in NS1 came from being able to tilt marine res flow towards one of those goals at the expense of the other -- ie, one team could spend a lot of money on weapons and gear while getting very few upgrades, and another team could invest their money into structures and team upgrades early and hold off on the weapons till later. Those two games would then play out very differently because of that strategic choice made by the commander.
I'm worried that this strategic diversity could disappear if marine res flow is locked into a particular distribution pattern, like say 50% goes to the team pool and 50% to the individual pool. The particular type of weapons and upgrades purchased might be different from game to game, but every marine team would always then have to spend exactly half its money on equipment and half on buildings/tech.
Therefore, the marine comm should at the least have some way of controlling how much of his income flows into each pool. He should also be able to dump team money into individual pools when players need weapons fast, like for a team push or something, or have some other way of letting the comm get heavy weapons into players hands when necessary.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->See <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=104216&view=findpost&p=1677598" target="_blank">this post</a> in the 'Marines buying own weapons' thread. In short: - Commander spends 'team res' for structures and tech - Marines spend 'personal res' for advanced weapons/personal upgrades - Marines gain personal res from rfk, building, spotting Hives and other supportive actions like healing/repairing - The commander unlocks weapon 'tiers' or 'categories' using team res (e.g. 'explosives', 'support', 'shotguns') - Each tier gives a basic starter weapon/item that all players can equip for free - Individual Marines can work towards unlocking more powerful weapons that they keep until they die, and get back again when they spawn - All weapons can be picked up from the floor
Summary: - Joe Public gets a basic gun per category to play with, and can try out a better weapon until they die if picked up. Similarly, higher skilled players can gift their more advanced weapon to a friend if they are new - Players always have access to a selection of weapons, and can further personalise this selection - Commander still chooses the direction he wants to take the team in - Splitting resource systems into separate pools gives you more control over balancing different sides of the game (the FPS versus the RTS). It modularises game features so they can be balanced and tested individually.
Best to read the whole post as it has some examples.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->OK the steamworks thing was rather disturbing, that Crispy knows more about it that developers using Source confused-fix.gif So far as I see it the idea is to lower the entry barrier for game developers to sell their game over steam (so valve can take a slice for distribution and put more consumer eyeballs infront of the valve store ads).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->To play devil's advocate here, it could just be that they have a good reason to not have any advanced plans for how Steamworks could be leveraged to UWE's advantage. E.g. they've gotten very good vibes from Valve about selling NS2 via Steam so they know they will be able to count on Valve's support when it comes to that, allowing them to focus their limited manpower on the development instead of trying to run things concurrently. Though, I do have to admit I was hoping for more than a verbal shrug!
Now it becomes interesting =) Great mockups! I really like the idea with the bubble for the different squads. I think you should release NS² via steam and sell it in DVD boxes too <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> I'd like to get my hands on one of these rather than just downloading it from steam <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
What is this ro0m in this pic ? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
In the background, what ro0m is that ? maybe a ro0m from <a href="http://www.jailbreaksource.com" target="_blank">Jailbreak HL2 MOD</a> ? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tiny.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::onos::" border="0" alt="tiny.gif" />
This is <!--coloro:#00FF00--><span style="color:#00FF00"><!--/coloro-->only an idea<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->. this is <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->NOT<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> an advertisment
<!--quoteo(post=1677634:date=May 4 2008, 04:36 PM:name=J!)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(J! @ May 4 2008, 04:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677634"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The room is a test done by one of our 2TR alpha mappers.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
THANK YOU <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> i hope a lots of ro0ms, maps, models <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Now to some negative feedback. The chat takes up a way too big section of the screen, especially when you play clangames noone really reads chat anyways. Even for usage on public servers I think it's a too big space to waste on chatting. The transparency is cool as something I've been wanting forever.
The concept of using armor piercing rounds inside a pressurized space station is interesting to say the least. It would be leet if when you shoot an external facing wall it makes a hissing noise or starts the room to depressurize or smthn ^^ (alot of effort but still it wud be leet). Or it could just be explained away; the armor piercing rounds work on principle that nanomachine sensors on the tip of the bullet on detection that there is a difference of pressure between the inside and outside by using scanning technology downloaded from the command center to the rifle, the bullet self destructs before hitting the hull wall.
But yeah I like the mock ups especially the squad management system however I hope it wont be like super sensitive on range etc, or possible you could change the sensitivity of the range checking so that if you have two fairly spread groups of players attacking either side of the map one may be able to extend the range of the grouping so that half map distance would still include a squad member - although through contemplating this it would be easier to still make it possible to hard set squads and use this new system in support to the original way.
imo the buy menu is far better for competitive play. In a pro match it is a waste of time for the com to drop stuff, because pro players who are part of a well organized team will know what they need, or do what the com says. This system is giving noob pubbers the benefit of the doubt for the benefit of competitive play.
<!--quoteo(post=1677644:date=May 4 2008, 12:28 PM:name=Lenard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lenard @ May 4 2008, 12:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677644"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->imo the buy menu is far better for competitive play. In a pro match it is a waste of time for the com to drop stuff, because pro players who are part of a well organized team will know what they need, or do what the com says. This system is giving noob pubbers the benefit of the doubt for the benefit of competitive play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <i><b>what</b></i>? don't make assumptions about competitive play when you have no prior experience to base this off of.
<!--quoteo(post=1677644:date=May 4 2008, 01:28 PM:name=Lenard)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lenard @ May 4 2008, 01:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677644"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->imo the buy menu is far better for competitive play. In a pro match it is a waste of time for the com to drop stuff, because pro players who are part of a well organized team will know what they need, or do what the com says. This system is giving noob pubbers the benefit of the doubt for the benefit of competitive play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually I would disagree as handing out weapons in pubs is much more difficult than it is in competitive play. I would much rather have the ability for the pub team to purchase weapons rather than the competitive team.
however, some Upgrades to the Commander-Technology would be nice, like Auto-Request-Fulfill, that might could be done as an Extra Automation-Center, where Ammo&Health-Automation could be switched active or not. (Having to run across the whole map, just to get some Ammo is pretty much annoying)
BTW: the News-Feed is still hanging with the 5-Year-Anniversary as the most recent News.
Good mockups and dieas guys - some interestin developments which I can safely say we are al looking forward to regardless but one thing with the armory purchasing scheme:
It is already implemented in NS1 on a couple of european servers and it sux really badly, there is no chance of a shotgun rush / beacon rush at all as everyone has to spend at least 30 seconds runnin from the armory to teh proto to the armory to pick up their gear by which time, they have either a) all been picked off by a solo fade whilst in the menu screen and b) the pg is gone.
So in terms of public games it is an epic fail - when everyone on teh server knows precisely what is goin on then I have seen it work but generally people just grab weapons as and when they want and run off and lose them.
Perhaps a menu screen before you spawn might be implementable but then the beacon rush still would need work.
Ofc the play mechanics will be different and am lookin forward to some sever playtesting to balance it all right.
(believe it is the NSStats.Corona-Network.com server for anyone who wants to give it a bash)
Comments
Pen and paper? You're living in the past!
NOTEPAD.exe is where it's at.
Awesome mock-ups. I hope you manage to achieve that kind of style or quality, or better. Whatever else I might have liked to say has already been said. No point repeating it.
See, we need more of these. This is the kind of news we want <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1677500:date=May 3 2008, 07:18 PM:name=SerDai)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SerDai @ May 3 2008, 07:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1677500"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The way to settle this is to have 3 ways of managing economy: libertarian (each one gets what he earns by killing enemies), communist (resources are divided equally) and welfare (a certain ammount of income is taxed from the rich and given to the poor).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'd prefer a representative currency system. ie. Resources = Bullion. Credits = Currency. Marines earn credits. The team earns resources. Spending personal credits means you're also spending your team's resources, but you're limited by how much credits you possess and can spend...
Actually, the way I see it, individuals buying weapons themselves would be worse for competitive players than pubbers. A lot of pubbers are only playing for a "quick fix", while competitive players generally prefer the game mechanics to be more complex. I really hope the buy menu is only meant for some sort of Combat mode.
Apart from that, stuff looks/sounds good/interesting. 2010 is going to be a good year. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink-fix.gif" />
Did anyone else notice the "Nuke" in the weapons upgrade menu in the first mockup...? Could this be the EMP blast thing?
EMP blast would surely be silly, you would just kill off computers, lights and stuff that you, as a marine need to get around the level. But, saying that, you could also use it to open electronic doors and shut down rouge computers that may have defences within the map. Just an idea.
I think we should all refer to the Gorge Suit as the G-Suit. Gorge Suit just sounds silly...
I like the blurring on the menu. Looks good enough to eat!
Bouncing shells on the shotgun sounds fun! But it depends on how it will look in game... I also love the fact that you used the pod/add on idea I suggested somewhere on the forums. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Could we see some other shells for the shotgun. Say an Inferno Shell (bursts on impact and has a chance of setting it’s target on fire) Or maybe an Armour Penetration Shell (AP Shell), that would go through think walls.
All in all it looks very nice. Would like to see some more alien stuff next week! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Keep up the good work guys!
That's the point! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> Listen to the podcast, mate! It should clear things <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Hom, on the other side, it would be cool to spy on Kharaa in a gorge suit like in TF2 <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
"Don't mind me, I'm just gorging, char, char, char" <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
EDIT: reminds me of Allo, Allo! episodes when the two british airmen were disguised as a cow <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
But how about that "Welding Bot" (or what ever the name is),,, Are you going to include that?? (It whould be awesome <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />)
I think the best way to keep the old ways and also integrate the new buymenu you should do the next thing.
From the "resourcetowers" only the commander get the resource. If a marine kill an alien, he get that resource, not the commander. So if he killed enough aliens, then he can buy weapons and upgardes for his self. But if the team need extra resource then the player can donate his resource to commander, or to another player.
Example like in World in Conflict. Every body gets Tactical Aid points in the fight. But you can give your point to other players, so together you can call in better airstrikes, ariborne, scan, nuke etc.. If you press the TAB button the scoreboard is show up and you can see the names. Next to the players name there are 2 button. A number 1 and a number 5. Number 1 give the player 1 TA point number 5 give 5 TA point. Thats all. And i think this is a very simple and good system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
sounds like a great idea, but it would require the commander to have free control of his res to distribute amongst his marines and upgrades/meds/ammo.
ex.
- game start -
Comm: "SHOTGUN RUSH"
- comm allocates most to all res to marines so marines can purchase shotguns -
I also agree with everybody about the Comm role of play. The Commander needs to the most important part of the marine team, with the micromanagement of resources to leading players to their objectives, versus the alien side where as there is no leader figure and it is more of a "For the greater good" kind of feel and gameplay
That's all well and good so far, but realize that a lot of the strategic diversity available to Marines in NS1 came from being able to tilt marine res flow towards one of those goals at the expense of the other -- ie, one team could spend a lot of money on weapons and gear while getting very few upgrades, and another team could invest their money into structures and team upgrades early and hold off on the weapons till later. Those two games would then play out very differently because of that strategic choice made by the commander.
I'm worried that this strategic diversity could disappear if marine res flow is locked into a particular distribution pattern, like say 50% goes to the team pool and 50% to the individual pool. The particular type of weapons and upgrades purchased might be different from game to game, but every marine team would always then have to spend exactly half its money on equipment and half on buildings/tech.
Therefore, the marine comm should at the least have some way of controlling how much of his income flows into each pool. He should also be able to dump team money into individual pools when players need weapons fast, like for a team push or something, or have some other way of letting the comm get heavy weapons into players hands when necessary.
nice mock-ups tho, i like the individual energies for alien weapons - very simple but adds a new dimension to using alien abilities
Many Marines will cry when they lost their weapons...
That's all well and good so far, but realize that a lot of the strategic diversity available to Marines in NS1 came from being able to tilt marine res flow towards one of those goals at the expense of the other -- ie, one team could spend a lot of money on weapons and gear while getting very few upgrades, and another team could invest their money into structures and team upgrades early and hold off on the weapons till later. Those two games would then play out very differently because of that strategic choice made by the commander.
I'm worried that this strategic diversity could disappear if marine res flow is locked into a particular distribution pattern, like say 50% goes to the team pool and 50% to the individual pool. The particular type of weapons and upgrades purchased might be different from game to game, but every marine team would always then have to spend exactly half its money on equipment and half on buildings/tech.
Therefore, the marine comm should at the least have some way of controlling how much of his income flows into each pool. He should also be able to dump team money into individual pools when players need weapons fast, like for a team push or something, or have some other way of letting the comm get heavy weapons into players hands when necessary.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->See <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=104216&view=findpost&p=1677598" target="_blank">this post</a> in the 'Marines buying own weapons' thread. In short:
- Commander spends 'team res' for structures and tech
- Marines spend 'personal res' for advanced weapons/personal upgrades
- Marines gain personal res from rfk, building, spotting Hives and other supportive actions like healing/repairing
- The commander unlocks weapon 'tiers' or 'categories' using team res (e.g. 'explosives', 'support', 'shotguns')
- Each tier gives a basic starter weapon/item that all players can equip for free
- Individual Marines can work towards unlocking more powerful weapons that they keep until they die, and get back again when they spawn
- All weapons can be picked up from the floor
Summary:
- Joe Public gets a basic gun per category to play with, and can try out a better weapon until they die if picked up. Similarly, higher skilled players can gift their more advanced weapon to a friend if they are new
- Players always have access to a selection of weapons, and can further personalise this selection
- Commander still chooses the direction he wants to take the team in
- Splitting resource systems into separate pools gives you more control over balancing different sides of the game (the FPS versus the RTS). It modularises game features so they can be balanced and tested individually.
Best to read the whole post as it has some examples.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->OK the steamworks thing was rather disturbing, that Crispy knows more about it that developers using Source confused-fix.gif So far as I see it the idea is to lower the entry barrier for game developers to sell their game over steam (so valve can take a slice for distribution and put more consumer eyeballs infront of the valve store ads).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->To play devil's advocate here, it could just be that they have a good reason to not have any advanced plans for how Steamworks could be leveraged to UWE's advantage. E.g. they've gotten very good vibes from Valve about selling NS2 via Steam so they know they will be able to count on Valve's support when it comes to that, allowing them to focus their limited manpower on the development instead of trying to run things concurrently. Though, I do have to admit I was hoping for more than a verbal shrug!
Great mockups! I really like the idea with the bubble for the different squads.
I think you should release NS² via steam and sell it in DVD boxes too <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
I'd like to get my hands on one of these rather than just downloading it from steam <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
Anyway keep up the good work! =)
<img src="http://www.unknownworlds.com/images/news/NS2_marine_mockup.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
In the background, what ro0m is that ? maybe a ro0m from <a href="http://www.jailbreaksource.com" target="_blank">Jailbreak HL2 MOD</a> ? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tiny.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::onos::" border="0" alt="tiny.gif" />
...so, yeah I downloaded Jailbreak: Source this morning (0.4 just released) and I think I'll give it a shot.
Commander mackup is verry nice ! Esp. i like chat console with colors and small fonts !
Also Buy menu is good ! Squads with colors are also good !
But i heard those pics are photoshop works not taken from prototype NS2 engine arent they?
So game will be too late for us ! May be in 2020 !!!
THANK YOU <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> i hope a lots of ro0ms, maps, models <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Now to some negative feedback. The chat takes up a way too big section of the screen, especially when you play clangames noone really reads chat anyways. Even for usage on public servers I think it's a too big space to waste on chatting. The transparency is cool as something I've been wanting forever.
But yeah I like the mock ups especially the squad management system however I hope it wont be like super sensitive on range etc, or possible you could change the sensitivity of the range checking so that if you have two fairly spread groups of players attacking either side of the map one may be able to extend the range of the grouping so that half map distance would still include a squad member - although through contemplating this it would be easier to still make it possible to hard set squads and use this new system in support to the original way.
<i><b>what</b></i>?
don't make assumptions about competitive play when you have no prior experience to base this off of.
<b>I need to learn to be nicer.</b>
Actually I would disagree as handing out weapons in pubs is much more difficult than it is in competitive play. I would much rather have the ability for the pub team to purchase weapons rather than the competitive team.
Those mock ups look sweet, btw, get me really hyped up!
however, some Upgrades to the Commander-Technology would be nice, like Auto-Request-Fulfill, that might could be done as an Extra Automation-Center, where Ammo&Health-Automation could be switched active or not.
(Having to run across the whole map, just to get some Ammo is pretty much annoying)
BTW: the News-Feed is still hanging with the 5-Year-Anniversary as the most recent News.
It is already implemented in NS1 on a couple of european servers and it sux really badly, there is no chance of a shotgun rush / beacon rush at all as everyone has to spend at least 30 seconds runnin from the armory to teh proto to the armory to pick up their gear by which time, they have either a) all been picked off by a solo fade whilst in the menu screen and b) the pg is gone.
So in terms of public games it is an epic fail - when everyone on teh server knows precisely what is goin on then I have seen it work but generally people just grab weapons as and when they want and run off and lose them.
Perhaps a menu screen before you spawn might be implementable but then the beacon rush still would need work.
Ofc the play mechanics will be different and am lookin forward to some sever playtesting to balance it all right.
(believe it is the NSStats.Corona-Network.com server for anyone who wants to give it a bash)
keep it up aim high and over shoot i say.
i kind of wish i had more time to spend with this community at the momment i miss you lot.