A good cloaking spy won't need a disguise. Uncloak behind an SG, by the time it has turned, sap. Sap around til you're close to engineer, stabby stabby/revolver he's dead; no need. Would make it more interested and needing an element of skill to use sappers.
I counter with <a href="http://nerfnow.com/comic/129" target="_blank">Nerf</a> <a href="http://nerfnow.com/comic/130" target="_blank">Now</a> (that's two links). If you do the aforementioned with a disguise on, you can fight the engineer on even terms: If he tries to kill you first, you can shoot back since his sentry is no longer a threat. If he tries to save his sentry first, you can stab him in the back. And if he manages to get the sapper off before you can get into position for a stab you've still got your disguise, so you can sap the sentry again.
If you don't have a disguise, you lose one of the best tools in your arsenal, the stab 'n sap. A stab 'n sap will at best result in both of you dead and the sentry still alive, at worst in your comically impotent death. It's simply impossible to uncloak, stab, switch to sapper and deploy sapper before the sentry blows you away if you don't have a disguise. And if the engineer is standing right behind the sentry (and they often do), that's your only option.
Losing the disguise kit would make spies vastly less useful against sentries, and against good engineers they already have a hard enough time. I still expect you shall be proven wrong shortly.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited May 2009
Hiding behind the engy will give you some time though, he will get hit first if your slow <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
The only thing annoying for the spy IMHO are other teamates on bottleneck maps. They soak up things that go boom and will make you go boom or make you flcker! they say the sniper is more of a loner, but I think the spy is much more of a loner and teamates tend to get you very dead very fast...
Just gimme maps like fastlane, badwater etc that have multiple elevations and routes instead of bottleneckboomspamsomemore (well at least when I play spy <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />)
Remember the cut-out coupon thing in the Scout update? Someone filled & sent it in... <a href="http://xs139.xs.to/xs139/09212/mann_co266.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://xs139.xs.to/xs139/09212/mann_co266.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a> >Ambassador :O
This fills what role the spy lacked before? Long range assassination, like the SNIPER? All prev updates filled a hole in a class weakness, or at least varied them, this does not seem to do either. If you can deal headshots (crit) then I don't see why ever using normal revolver again. The only chance you have to get away 9/10 cases when spotted and faced with a 1vs1 is getting a crit. Hitting the head and getting a crit are just about the same for a spy. The only real in-role use I can think of is shooting engineers in the head while in disguise then switch to zapper as normal, instead of backstab.
My guess is that it'll have higher accuracy (possibly 100% accurate) with lower rate of fire. No headshots.
I certainly like the way it LOOKS.
Also, we haven't heard anything from the sniper lately. I thought they were going to make a dual update. Are they saving the last sniper unlock, or has the sniper truly been backstabbed for the time being?
<!--quoteo(post=1707226:date=May 19 2009, 05:53 PM:name=lolfighter)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lolfighter @ May 19 2009, 05:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1707226"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My guess is that it'll have higher accuracy (possibly 100% accurate) with lower rate of fire. No headshots.
I certainly like the way it LOOKS.
Also, we haven't heard anything from the sniper lately. I thought they were going to make a dual update. Are they saving the last sniper unlock, or has the sniper truly been backstabbed for the time being?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The Sniper only has one unlock to go. They only have one day to go. The math here is not difficult.
Eh? They've announced a release date? I mean, if they release on thursday, they've only got today left. But what if they release on friday? Or what if the sniper has bled to death? You're being snide and rude.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1707258:date=May 20 2009, 11:54 AM:name=lolfighter)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lolfighter @ May 20 2009, 11:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1707258"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The revolver DOES have some inaccuracy. It's not worth mentioning at short distance, but at medium distance it can miss.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It actually has a lot of inaccuracy, and as such I am really looking forward to playing with this new sniper/spy hybrid. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1707258:date=May 20 2009, 11:54 AM:name=lolfighter)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lolfighter @ May 20 2009, 11:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1707258"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The revolver DOES have some inaccuracy. It's not worth mentioning at short distance, but at medium distance it can miss.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It has the odd feeling of bullets curving "around" the target when this happens for me. Maybe it has something to do with the inaccuracy and the motionblur while moving since moving makes you more inaccurate.
Valve is pulling more random-background-image trickery. I sure hope <a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v401/aboojumsnark/ohnoes-1.jpg" target="_blank">this</a> doesn't mean what it looks like...
So... was I the only one who noticed that the spy SLID a sapper at the engineer's turret? Or that the turret looked like it lost a level before it died? :o
there's an achievement for jarate-ing an enemy and then killing them with your blade so I'd guess the Jarate is an SMG replacement :3 That'd leave the shield as a blade replacement (wonder if you can attack with it?) and the bow for the sniper.
Comments
If you don't have a disguise, you lose one of the best tools in your arsenal, the stab 'n sap. A stab 'n sap will at best result in both of you dead and the sentry still alive, at worst in your comically impotent death. It's simply impossible to uncloak, stab, switch to sapper and deploy sapper before the sentry blows you away if you don't have a disguise. And if the engineer is standing right behind the sentry (and they often do), that's your only option.
Losing the disguise kit would make spies vastly less useful against sentries, and against good engineers they already have a hard enough time. I still expect you shall be proven wrong shortly.
The only thing annoying for the spy IMHO are other teamates on bottleneck maps. They soak up things that go boom and will make you go boom or make you flcker! they say the sniper is more of a loner, but I think the spy is much more of a loner and teamates tend to get you very dead very fast...
Just gimme maps like fastlane, badwater etc that have multiple elevations and routes instead of bottleneckboomspamsomemore (well at least when I play spy <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />)
MEET THE SPY!
<a href="http://www.wegame.com/watch/MTS_TF2_iPod/" target="_blank">http://www.wegame.com/watch/MTS_TF2_iPod/</a>
<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZTj6tauY1JU"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ZTj6tauY1JU" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>
And this made me laugh too hard.
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/X_Stickman/Stuff/spyCSI.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>Wait, does this mean the Engineer is the Scout's father?!</span>
<a href="http://xs139.xs.to/xs139/09212/mann_co266.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://xs139.xs.to/xs139/09212/mann_co266.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
>Ambassador
:O
Also amusing are the blog posts at teamfortress.com.
I certainly like the way it LOOKS.
Also, we haven't heard anything from the sniper lately. I thought they were going to make a dual update. Are they saving the last sniper unlock, or has the sniper truly been backstabbed for the time being?
I certainly like the way it LOOKS.
Also, we haven't heard anything from the sniper lately. I thought they were going to make a dual update. Are they saving the last sniper unlock, or has the sniper truly been backstabbed for the time being?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The Sniper only has one unlock to go. They only have one day to go. The math here is not difficult.
Model looks absolutely stunning though.
lolf: it's said the 21st in the "Major Updates" list since the spy showed up. (previously 19th)
It actually has a lot of inaccuracy, and as such I am really looking forward to playing with this new sniper/spy hybrid. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
It has the odd feeling of bullets curving "around" the target when this happens for me. Maybe it has something to do with the inaccuracy and the motionblur while moving since moving makes you more inaccurate.
So... was I the only one who noticed that the spy SLID a sapper at the engineer's turret? Or that the turret looked like it lost a level before it died? :o
That'd leave the shield as a blade replacement (wonder if you can attack with it?) and the bow for the sniper.
Could be wrong though? :p