<!--quoteo(post=1724147:date=Aug 21 2009, 04:12 AM:name=TychoCelchuuu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TychoCelchuuu @ Aug 21 2009, 04:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724147"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I love the new look (Skulk might still be my favorite though) but PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE take out the part of spit that messes up the marine. It's never, ever fun to be disabled in a game and the last thing I want is a Gorge turning my vision green by spitting on my kneecap.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1724232:date=Aug 21 2009, 12:55 AM:name=Andos)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andos @ Aug 21 2009, 12:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724232"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Making aliens go directly to ragdoll on death have a big problem: Marines needs some visual feedback on when the alien dies - otherwise they can't tell if the alien is still alive when it moves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think this is a bad thing at all. Marines are already getting a HUD message saying the enemy is dead. If you want to talk immersion then it is doesn't make sense to think everyone knows the instant something is dead.
Just like poking a carcass with a stick or giving it a push with your foot, there's no real way until that moment to know if it's dead or not. I know not everyone likes to play on servers with no death notification, though.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->For example a skulk wallwalking and is shot and falls down towards the marine, they don't look dead as they still move with great speed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think that would be awesome. If the ragdoll takes effect during the fall then your gunfire would change it's trajectory away from you anyway.
After a bit of play people tend to get a good feel for how much damage a given enemy can take, so if we're talking about a marine using 5 or even 10 more rounds to be sure it's dead, I don't see this as a detractor. It's not like anyone is going to unload a full clip into a ragdoll carcass (unless the alien just ate his friend). I, for one, would rather the aliens not do anything upon death besides perhaps let out a yelp or hiss and perhaps have their texture altered in some way (go pale, eyes go dark, etc).
Motivated by lore? "The bacterium, after seeing the strange effect the appearance of the Gorge had on some marines, attempted to improve this blah blah" basically, made cuter so he wont get shot<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1724227:date=Aug 21 2009, 07:42 AM:name=JAmazon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JAmazon @ Aug 21 2009, 07:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724227"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->yeah I think they used the word "overabundance" to imply that hes fat.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I figured that one myself, yet having two attacks (+1 defensive position) and two structures is rather slim.
As a huge gorge lover, I was a little concerned about the hippo look it had, but after watching the video of it in action I would safely say that yes its a good move. I also love the new abilities, a refreshing change for the gorge :D
<!--quoteo(post=1724245:date=Aug 21 2009, 08:38 AM:name=JAmazon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JAmazon @ Aug 21 2009, 08:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724245"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->He's gonna have an adorable flailing cat liek anim when he falls from a high place :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I understand the animation.
I mean first time I saw it I was expecting him to be at the center of the screen, but he was gone. Next thing you know there comes a Gorge falling from the sky.
The last character I was expecting to be coming from above. :P
Looks great, love the look, animations and concepts. The belly slide i could see as kinda a slide where he pushes with his legs and moves faster leaving a short slime trail. PLEASE make sure to think about mass gorges! I have seen health spray stacking so much that they overwhelm teams of marines... I see this as a slight in-balance.
I complete agree with the hybrid of animations and ragdolls approach to deaths the devs are taking. However I have a concern, if belly slide was implemented you would *obviously* want the gorge to keep sliding if killed whilst sliding, playing an animation on that would look nuts... plus as someone pointed out earlier it would deprive us of the comedy of watching dead gorges slam into walls. Would it be simple to have a flag, if bellysliding == true, go straight to ragdoll?
<!--quoteo(post=1724136:date=Aug 21 2009, 02:51 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Aug 21 2009, 02:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724136"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->We do have ragdoll death. As someone pointed out, they can be pretty bland looking, so, in some cases we use an actual animation, such as for the gorge, then as soon as the animation ends (which is right where the video ends) the ragdoll will take over. Some of the aliens are going to use mostly ragdoll, some might be half and half, and some might be mostly animation with the ragdoll at the end. We are going to tweak it for what gives us the best look.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Excelent ! Thanks for replying, thanks for ragdolls crossed with death animations.
<!--quoteo(post=1724254:date=Aug 21 2009, 09:47 AM:name=Delphic)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Delphic @ Aug 21 2009, 09:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724254"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I complete agree with the hybrid of animations and ragdolls approach to deaths the devs are taking. However I have a concern, if belly slide was implemented you would *obviously* want the gorge to keep sliding if killed whilst sliding, playing an animation on that would look nuts... plus as someone pointed out earlier it would deprive us of the comedy of watching dead gorges slam into walls. Would it be simple to have a flag, if bellysliding == true, go straight to ragdoll?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have no doubt that the development team would come up with something great if the belly slide would be implemented.
The overall new look for the Aliens is just awesome. The Expression of the Gorge is masterfully done. You Guys are awesome. Can't wait to get to alpha!
Yes to Belly Slide!!! It would be so fun, imagine chasing after a gorge as a marine whos sliding away down a ramp. It's such a gorge thing to do. It wouldn't be imbalanced in anyway and would be heaps fun.
<!--quoteo(post=1724254:date=Aug 21 2009, 10:47 AM:name=Delphic)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Delphic @ Aug 21 2009, 10:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724254"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I complete agree with the hybrid of animations and ragdolls approach to deaths the devs are taking. However I have a concern, if belly slide was implemented you would *obviously* want the gorge to keep sliding if killed whilst sliding, playing an animation on that would look nuts... plus as someone pointed out earlier it would deprive us of the comedy of watching dead gorges slam into walls. Would it be simple to have a flag, if bellysliding == true, go straight to ragdoll?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> if killed whilst sliding - massive wipeout :D instead of sliding along, gorge rolls and flips down the hallway. epic
<!--quoteo(post=1724188:date=Aug 21 2009, 03:55 AM:name=resresres)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (resresres @ Aug 21 2009, 03:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724188"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->There are NO ladders in NS 2. (@NS2 twitter)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Link? All I heard is that no aliens can climb ladders. <a href="http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2284798528" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2284798528</a> <a href="http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2246303130" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2246303130</a>
As always the model and animations is high-quality and overall the abilities seem fine. It sounds like it’ll be a way better support class and it consequently makes sense that they are limited to build dc/ocs. Oc spamming needs to be controlled in some way tho, spamming the map with walls-of-lame everywhere doesn’t make that fun games.
I can see some problems with the spit tho, the slow debuff sounds okay but the hindering of your view sounds rather annoying. I’m not too sure about the dot effect either, will it stack? Will you be able to cure it with a medpack? ofc this will hopefully be balance be in the alpha/beta. I do like the shorter more damaging secondary fire tho, will be a good way for gorges to help destroying buildings.
Hehe, imagine a gorge sliding through a sloped vent on his belly really fast then bursting out of the vent infront of some marines. Then he quickly jumps off to another ramp and slides away! So awesome! Such a good idea, id lovveee to slide around as a gorgie
<!--quoteo(post=1724183:date=Aug 21 2009, 04:43 AM:name=JAmazon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JAmazon @ Aug 21 2009, 04:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724183"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->^ and somethign tells me that alien structures (unlike marines) are going to be shrinking from their NS1 counterparts. I image the new OC and DC being more like knee high polyps that perform the given task. Much less imposing than the NS1 form but they can be placed closely together/on walls and ceilings by the gorge to create little gardens of death. Now that'd be cool :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really hope you are right! I think the main part of being a Gorge have always been strategical placement of chambers, and I always got sad when I couldn't place pair in the next intersection. So I'm really hoping for more-but-smaller chambers from the him! I'd love to stick a <b>big</b> cluster of Spike-Balls and Heal-Gooo on the wall, and then slide away on the dynamic infestation =)
About the damage soak, how about you'r energy stay as it was if you don't get hit (instead of slowly gaining as when not soaking), and loose it when you take damage? That way he have to make a tactical decision about wasting ammo on you, or wait and hope he get help before you do.
I do like the new components of spit, it makes it easier to actually hit a few times with it. I think you should move abit faster when you currently do while affected by webs, but still slow enough to make the Gorge hit you quite easily. About the vision thing, I don't think it will be to bad. I imagine it blurring your vision slightly (compare it to the tipsy - drunk effect of WoW, only the actual blur though). Afterall, you get hit by acid bacteria, I imagine the pain would sting pretty bad, making your vision blurry from pain. The secondary effect of spit is still usable against marines I assume, just that the close range make it very risky to do, and more suitable against building?
<!--quoteo(post=1724299:date=Aug 21 2009, 12:31 PM:name=perfectheat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (perfectheat @ Aug 21 2009, 12:31 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1724299"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I like the Gorge! Will miss running into web though :(
+ for distorted view. It's suppose to suck getting hit.
And I think slide sounds like fun. At least try it out in Alpha if you think it's a great idea.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It sounds like the spit will double as damage and slow down.
Love the gorge he's as cute and cuddly as I was hoping he'd be, he's always been my favourite class and I can't wait to play him. Belly slide FTW! ;-)
Comments
I agree with this.
Marines needs some visual feedback on when the alien dies - otherwise they can't tell if the alien is still alive when it moves.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think this is a bad thing at all. Marines are already getting a HUD message saying the enemy is dead. If you want to talk immersion then it is doesn't make sense to think everyone knows the instant something is dead.
Just like poking a carcass with a stick or giving it a push with your foot, there's no real way until that moment to know if it's dead or not. I know not everyone likes to play on servers with no death notification, though.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->For example a skulk wallwalking and is shot and falls down towards the marine, they don't look dead as they still move with great speed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think that would be awesome. If the ragdoll takes effect during the fall then your gunfire would change it's trajectory away from you anyway.
After a bit of play people tend to get a good feel for how much damage a given enemy can take, so if we're talking about a marine using 5 or even 10 more rounds to be sure it's dead, I don't see this as a detractor. It's not like anyone is going to unload a full clip into a ragdoll carcass (unless the alien just ate his friend). I, for one, would rather the aliens not do anything upon death besides perhaps let out a yelp or hiss and perhaps have their texture altered in some way (go pale, eyes go dark, etc).
Motivated by lore? "The bacterium, after seeing the strange effect the appearance of the Gorge had on some marines, attempted to improve this blah blah" basically, made cuter so he wont get shot<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
AWESOME :-)
I figured that one myself, yet having two attacks (+1 defensive position) and two structures is rather slim.
I understand the animation.
I mean first time I saw it I was expecting him to be at the center of the screen, but he was gone.
Next thing you know there comes a Gorge falling from the sky.
The last character I was expecting to be coming from above. :P
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Excelent ! Thanks for replying, thanks for ragdolls crossed with death animations.
Thank You.
I have no doubt that the development team would come up with something great if the belly slide would be implemented.
They deserve to be trusted.
You Guys are awesome. Can't wait to get to alpha!
Yes to Belly Slide!!! It would be so fun, imagine chasing after a gorge as a marine whos sliding away down a ramp. It's such a gorge thing to do. It wouldn't be imbalanced in anyway and would be heaps fun.
if killed whilst sliding - massive wipeout :D
instead of sliding along, gorge rolls and flips down the hallway. epic
Need Belly Slide !!!!!!
Link? All I heard is that no aliens can climb ladders.
<a href="http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2284798528" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2284798528</a>
<a href="http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2246303130" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/NS2/status/2246303130</a>
I can see some problems with the spit tho, the slow debuff sounds okay but the hindering of your view sounds rather annoying. I’m not too sure about the dot effect either, will it stack? Will you be able to cure it with a medpack? ofc this will hopefully be balance be in the alpha/beta. I do like the shorter more damaging secondary fire tho, will be a good way for gorges to help destroying buildings.
I really hope you are right! I think the main part of being a Gorge have always been strategical placement of chambers, and I always got sad when I couldn't place pair in the next intersection. So I'm really hoping for more-but-smaller chambers from the him! I'd love to stick a <b>big</b> cluster of Spike-Balls and Heal-Gooo on the wall, and then slide away on the dynamic infestation =)
About the damage soak, how about you'r energy stay as it was if you don't get hit (instead of slowly gaining as when not soaking), and loose it when you take damage? That way he have to make a tactical decision about wasting ammo on you, or wait and hope he get help before you do.
I do like the new components of spit, it makes it easier to actually hit a few times with it. I think you should move abit faster when you currently do while affected by webs, but still slow enough to make the Gorge hit you quite easily. About the vision thing, I don't think it will be to bad. I imagine it blurring your vision slightly (compare it to the tipsy - drunk effect of WoW, only the actual blur though). Afterall, you get hit by acid bacteria, I imagine the pain would sting pretty bad, making your vision blurry from pain. The secondary effect of spit is still usable against marines I assume, just that the close range make it very risky to do, and more suitable against building?
+ for distorted view. It's suppose to suck getting hit.
And I think slide sounds like fun. At least try it out in Alpha if you think it's a great idea.
+ for distorted view. It's suppose to suck getting hit.
And I think slide sounds like fun. At least try it out in Alpha if you think it's a great idea.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It sounds like the spit will double as damage and slow down.
Love the gorge he's as cute and cuddly as I was hoping he'd be, he's always been my favourite class and I can't wait to play him. Belly slide FTW! ;-)