Two unacceptable design mistake persisting from NS1

24

Comments

  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852791:date=Jun 15 2011, 12:24 AM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Jun 15 2011, 12:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852791"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Heh, think about the way you guys eat. Do you keep your mouth 30% open when you chew? If so, it's rude and completely annoying.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Think about when you bite your pillow. Do your jaws close 100% of the way or are they prevented from closing all of the way because they are biting on to something?

    Plus, obligatory "your eyes aren't in your mouth therefore we're not talking about what is perfectly real, we're talking about how best to implement a feature in a video game"
  • ThaldarinThaldarin Alonzi&#33; Join Date: 2003-07-15 Member: 18173Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1852794:date=Jun 15 2011, 12:26 AM:name=zex)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (zex @ Jun 15 2011, 12:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852794"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Think about when you bite your pillow. Do your jaws close 100% of the way or are they prevented from closing all of the way because they are biting on to something?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    From your logic, you must then have your victims piece of body in your mouth on screen. Meaning the 100% full shutting of the mouth, visually, is the same.

    Welcome back to square one.
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852795:date=Jun 15 2011, 12:27 AM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Jun 15 2011, 12:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852795"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->From your logic, you must then have your victims piece of body in your mouth on screen. Meaning the 100% full shutting of the mouth, visually, is the same.
    Welcome back to square one.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->obligatory "your eyes aren't in your mouth therefore we're not talking about what is perfectly real, we're talking about how best to implement a feature in a video game"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Back to square one indeed.
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    Neither one of these is even noticeable for me in general play.

    Skulk jaws can kind of hurt my eyes if I'm concentrating on something in the distance while killing a power node, but in actual combat it doesn't bother me, and I didn't even notice that the rifle muzzleflash did obscure the crosshair, I've honestly never had any issue aiming with it.
  • PsiWarpPsiWarp Gifted Gorge Richmond, B.C., Canada Join Date: 2010-08-28 Member: 73810Members
    edited June 2011
    I'll be down with 70% closed for missed bites and 100% closed for actual hits (instead of the hit indicator).
  • DaxedDaxed Join Date: 2008-03-19 Member: 63905Members
    Just let me know when somebody hacks out the biting animation.
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    I like the hit indicator, it indicates hits, whereas the mouth only partially closing just indicates you had an animation glitch.
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852810:date=Jun 15 2011, 12:48 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 15 2011, 12:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852810"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I like the hit indicator, it indicates hits, whereas the mouth only partially closing just indicates you had an animation glitch.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    go back and read the past few posts, you aren't quite getting it
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    What's to get? Some guy said he wanted it instead of the hit indicator, it's a silly idea.

    Having it as well as the hit indicator, I don't really care, I don't have any problem with the current implementation.
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    edited June 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1852815:date=Jun 15 2011, 12:56 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 15 2011, 12:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852815"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What's to get? Some guy said he wanted it instead of the hit indicator, it's a silly idea.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You seem to have misread WHAT is being proposed as a hit indicator, and are confusing it with the proposed "miss" indicator.

    My suggestion was to have the jaws not close completely ON MISSES so that the gameplay is not obstructed, but to close completely ON HITS so it's obvious when you've done damage.
  • TechercizerTechercizer 7th Player Join Date: 2011-06-11 Member: 103832Members
    edited June 2011
    There's a hit indicator?

    I didn't notice it (in all of my one matches that I haven't been a marine). Where is it?
  • PsiWarpPsiWarp Gifted Gorge Richmond, B.C., Canada Join Date: 2010-08-28 Member: 73810Members
    edited June 2011
    Nor will I complain if the hit indicator remained, how would removing that be silly?

    @Techercizer: It's the blue cross that flashes at your crosshair when you hit something.
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852816:date=Jun 15 2011, 01:58 AM:name=zex)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (zex @ Jun 15 2011, 01:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852816"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You seem to have misread WHAT is being proposed as a hit indicator, and are confusing it with the proposed "miss" indicator.

    My suggestion was to have the jaws not close completely ON MISSES so that the gameplay is not obstructed, but to close completely ON HITS so it's obvious when you've done damage.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Seems a bit counterintuitive given that if you actually bit something it would prevent the jaws from closing.

    Be kind of like having the hit indicator always peg except when you hit something.
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852820:date=Jun 15 2011, 01:04 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 15 2011, 01:04 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852820"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Seems a bit counterintuitive given that if you actually bit something it would prevent the jaws from closing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    How many times is this conversation going to go in circles? If you actually bit something YOU WOULDNT SEE THE INSIDE OF YOUR MOUTH, ergo we're talking about a game and not what literally happens inside biting mouths.
  • TechercizerTechercizer 7th Player Join Date: 2011-06-11 Member: 103832Members
    edited June 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1852819:date=Jun 14 2011, 07:59 PM:name=PsiWarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsiWarp @ Jun 14 2011, 07:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852819"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->@Techercizer: It's the blue cross that flashes at your crosshair when you hit something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Ah, well, I probably didn't hit anything then! =P
    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Seems a bit counterintuitive given that if you actually bit something it would prevent the jaws from closing.

    Be kind of like having the hit indicator always peg except when you hit something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I think of having the jaws close all the way as a more "violent" animation; one that gives you a satisfying moment of biting in reward for good aim. The not-closed one is more like a flub in my opinion; it says "whoops, I thought I was biting something, but I guess there's nothing there" to me.
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    Odd, doesn't say that to me.

    Best to keep the hit indicator as well in any case, as that is far less ambiguous.
  • zexzex Join Date: 2009-10-07 Member: 68978Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852826:date=Jun 15 2011, 01:14 AM:name=Techercizer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Techercizer @ Jun 15 2011, 01:14 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852826"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think of having the jaws close all the way as a more "violent" animation; one that gives you a satisfying moment of biting in reward for good aim. The not-closed one is more like a flub in my opinion; it says "whoops, I thought I was biting something, but I guess there's nothing there" to me.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Exactly. Visual feedback that differentiates a Bite ATTEMPT vs a successful bite.
  • Fluid CoreFluid Core Join Date: 2007-12-26 Member: 63260Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited June 2011
    I think some blood in your mouth when you connect with a marine would be best. If you connect multiple bites in a row, the blood should add up, wich would be really satisfying... You don't need a kill indicator, you can already see who killed who and the fact that a marine corpse are on the ground and not running around shooting at you. I mostly play skulk, and I'm not really bothered by the mouth closing. When lagg improves, you should only bite when you aim at the marine anyway and not just spam it. You get used to it quickly, and the flashlight helps you make out marines easier in combat too.
  • HarimauHarimau Join Date: 2007-12-24 Member: 63250Members
    edited June 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1852794:date=Jun 15 2011, 08:26 AM:name=zex)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (zex @ Jun 15 2011, 08:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852794"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Think about when you bite your pillow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    ROFL.


    Anyway, game needs translucency.
  • mammajoe44mammajoe44 Join Date: 2011-06-04 Member: 102635Members
    skulks have a built in bright model hack so i wouldnt be crying
  • ErriiieeeeErriiieeee Join Date: 2011-05-12 Member: 98431Members
    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->With this implementation, it also leaves the possibility for obvious Hit feedback, if the jaws close 100% only when a hit is landed and 70% on misses.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    +1

    I love the camera in the mouth. Skulks have the most immersive class for Khara.
  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    Yes, i really like skulk bite as it is right now, i love the whole skulk feeling.

    But indeed, the muzzle flash is too big. But it is probably really just the bloom, because i think before the bloom update it didn't bother me.
  • Jason WhoreJason Whore Join Date: 2011-04-11 Member: 92514Members
    whats wrong with the skulk? k, it closes so what? you blink is that annoying for you?
    pl0x don't take that out... if people flame about it just speed it up? would add some kind of power to it also hmm.. and 70% when miss 100% when hit? WTF ? other way around stupids ! if at all.

    The gorge's something else btw. if i swith from skulk to gorge i am like WTF thats obstructing my view... but then i get used to it and im like hey thats fine accthually
  • ZaggyZaggy NullPointerException The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-12-10 Member: 24214Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Onos, Subnautica Playtester
    What about making the jaws appear only when you're on target, like in AvP Gold?
  • Jason WhoreJason Whore Join Date: 2011-04-11 Member: 92514Members
    I just ran around in ma house biting things and closing my eyes skulk style...
    didn't annoyed me. annoyed my mom thought :/
  • jkflipflopjkflipflop Join Date: 2010-10-13 Member: 74423Members
    It just looks bad in the videos. When you're actually playing I find the Skulk to be really immersive.
  • WatchMakerWatchMaker Join Date: 2003-09-26 Member: 21233Members, Constellation
    I love how the title misleads you to believe this thread would be about anything other than superficial aesthetics.
  • NurEinMenschNurEinMensch Join Date: 2003-02-26 Member: 14056Members, Constellation
    Skulk bite cam is fine, don't change it. But seriously, this is 2011, it has been like that in NS1 forever, and now all of a sudden it's a big problem?
  • assbdaassbda Join Date: 2011-05-02 Member: 96737Members
    edited June 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1852937:date=Jun 15 2011, 10:49 PM:name=NurEinMensch)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NurEinMensch @ Jun 15 2011, 10:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852937"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Skulk bite cam is fine, don't change it. But seriously, this is 2011, it has been like that in NS1 forever, and now all of a sudden it's a big problem?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    the big problem is all the 'new players' to the ns scene cant handle the skulks
    I for one love playing skulk, its so f**king easy, all you have to do is relax and take your time with your bites. lol i can just imagine people holding down their fire button around marines causing their "dont know wtf is going on when jaw closes" whining.

    I mean, you get up to a marine, you hear the chomps, how f*cking hard is it?

    edit-
    its always been like that. _always_
  • ZurikiZuriki Join Date: 2010-11-20 Member: 75105Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1852934:date=Jun 15 2011, 11:34 AM:name=WatchMaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (WatchMaker @ Jun 15 2011, 11:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1852934"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I love how the title misleads you to believe this thread would be about anything other than superficial aesthetics.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    +1
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