<!--quoteo(post=1793024:date=Aug 9 2010, 03:21 AM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Aug 9 2010, 03:21 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1793024"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why are you MAKING rocks and boulders when there are props readily available?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sooo I think necromancy is ok if its your own thread and its actually a progress update... right? :D Sooo here it is:
Before we start I hope I have done an acceptable job of making Siege maps less blocky and boring and at the same time keep the details and props from being obstructive of game-play.
I am trying to keep it acceptably similar to NS1_seige007 but I have taken a few liberties and made quite a few changes in an attempt to adapt the map to NS2 game play.
Finally. Please keep the QQ about siege maps to a minimum please and focus on constructive feedback.
This is the Alien side complete. (for now) The lighting is reliant on power-grid so when aliens control it, it will be a lot darker... (I am REALLY hoping alien structures get bio-luminescence).
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/Door_zps8561cd73.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> The power point in this screen will control the lights for the entire corridor up-to the hives. (Getting behind them somehow and destroying it will plunge the entire corridor into total darkness and the marines will have to build it as soon as they can when the door opens/if it dies.)
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/SecondCourner_zps9b7c81d0.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> I have made a rather drastic change here by adding a hole in the wall at the second courner... This will allow the marines to have shots at the hive from one step further away, make it much harder for onos to push down the tunnels due to them being shot through the wall however I hope it will also balance out due to allowing aliens to bile bomb and xenocide in return.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/FinalCourner_zpsd1a79a12.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Another major change is the screens in-front of each hive this covers up half of the hive making it much harder to hit them this was in responce to the duel exos having MUCH more firepower than HMGs in NS1 and the ability to shoot the hives from one courner earlier.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/Hives_zps8738e30b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> The hive lights are controlled by the power nodes in the hive and have only been added in-case of the unlikely event of the marines and aliens swapping bases. The hives will hopefully be relying on bio-luminescence from the alien structures. (If not implemented I will have it so the light strength is halved when the nodes are not constructed and come up with a more subtle solution later.)
I am thinking of having some sort of siege room power activated lights as well, perhaps the ceiling lights or maybe some separate ones.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/HiveSkulksEyeViewTwo_zps372914f5.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Its a little crampted but hopefully makes up for it by allowing nice safe places to gestate and to place amble crags/shifts/eggs. The walkway leading into the wall is to a door leading to the siege room, this door wont be an active one.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/ResRooms_zps15841c8b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Again relying on bio-luminescence, if not ... pitch black should be good. :)
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/UnderDoor_zps6980a7a6.jpg" target="_blank">Scurry Way</a> Nice space under the walk way for a bit of scurrying... I bet a sneaky alien comm could get structures under there as well!
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/CubbyHole_zps3850e064.jpg" target="_blank">Cubby Hole</a> A little hard to make out due to textures but above the rockface is a cubby hole for the aliens. Hopefully useful for bile bombing gorges... sadly I don't think cysts will be able to get up there...
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/BonusPoints_zpsfa84a2e0.jpg" target="_blank">Mouth Cam!</a> Bonus for anyone who spotted this before this screen shot!
Hope people like my progress so far, Feedback will be most appreciated!
Soul_RiderMod BeanJoin Date: 2004-06-19Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
edited October 2012
If you use the [img] code on photobucket, you can host the images directly in the thread, rather than making us click through each of the pictures.....
Other than that, it is looking good :)
We just need a modder to code ns2_siege...
I'd love to, but I am a bit busy at the moment with my other mods..
I'll have a chat with the guys though and see if anyone wants to help make it, as a team effort it might be fairly easy to do..
Although, mobile sieges should stay, just to spice up the game play a little. Makes the push to the hives all the more exciting, but I think the sieges should still have some form of marine interaction before they are able to fire, maybe a small build to deploy them..
Damn, I'm even thinking about how to implement it :P
Yeah fixed that! :) Sorry some forums are a little pissy about image spam.
Yeah I dunno what I am going to do about getting it "working" I presume someone will make a simple code/scrips for a timed door for me when I draw closer to completion! :)
As to the "siege?" I suppose I was just going to have it so sieges could be massed up before the door opened and then driven into the siege-room as soon as the door opens, another option would be to make the siege room up a ladder so that sieges cant be driven in and have to be built <b>inside</b> the siege room... For now I am going to leave it so that sieges can just be driven into the siege until I get to finally play test the map! :)
Good luck with your other mods and I should hopefully have a few more pictures soon! :D
<!--quoteo(post=1992472:date=Oct 16 2012, 05:13 PM:name=PsympleJester)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsympleJester @ Oct 16 2012, 05:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1992472"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah fixed that! :) Sorry some forums are a little pissy about image spam.
Yeah I dunno what I am going to do about getting it "working" I presume someone will make a simple code/scrips for a timed door for me when I draw closer to completion! :)
As to the "siege?" I suppose I was just going to have it so sieges could be massed up before the door opened and then driven into the siege-room as soon as the door opens, another option would be to make the siege room up a ladder so that sieges cant be driven in and have to be built <b>inside</b> the siege room... For now I am going to leave it so that sieges can just be driven into the siege until I get to finally play test the map! :)
Good luck with your other mods and I should hopefully have a few more pictures soon! :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Currently writing a timed_door entity for mappers. I am pretty noob, but I would like to elaborate onto a full ns2_siege gamemode. Gonna post in modding for ideas/assistance.
I used Door entity as base, working on the Lua atm. <!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1--> <class name="timed_door"> <model> <file>models/misc/door/door.model</file> </model> <parameter name="openTime" type="real" label="Open time in seconds" default="60.0"/> <parameter name="clean" type="boolean" label="Uses the alternate clean version of the door model" default="false"/> </class><!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
<!--quoteo(post=1998587:date=Oct 27 2012, 06:30 PM:name=PogoP)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PogoP @ Oct 27 2012, 06:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1998587"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I used to LOVE Siege007. Don't stray too far from the original!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is a problem I am facing... The problem being that NS1 Siege007 was VERY bland, I replicated this originally creating the entire map to the exact proportions. Problems arose:
Firstly draw distance messes up siege... yeah its a cheap excuse but siege maps are big yo... :P
Secondly I didn't want to receive the same "its ugly" complaints.
Finally balance... NS2 isn't the same game as NS1: Dual Exos put out 2x the damage NS1 hmg's used to do. Aliens wont be able to build forward bases behind the Marines even if they managed to get fades into the JP room due to cysts. (Fades getting past the marines into JP room and setting up DC/MC bases in JP room used to mean Game Over for Marines...
Because of this I took the prop heavy approach, which should allow aliens to get past easier, and have made a few alterations to the main battle area (the alien halls) that I hope will make the map more balanced.
As well as this I am considering adding stairs to the JP room allowing exo's/non JP's to climb to the higher levels also (and cysts). Not to mention I will have to shrink the hight of JP room due to JP hight being seriously nerfed + draw distance.
This will then present problems where I will have JP room level over level and I need to figure out how to make my commander able to build on all levels... or reasons why he cant build on all levels?
Anyway... yeah... I dont think there will be much option to "leave it as it was"... I am doing my very best to make the map "feel" the same as it did... I commanded 100's if not a 1000 games on NS_siege007 (it was the default (server crash) map for my communities server) and I loved it dearly. But its hard trying to make a NS1 map play the same as it did.. when the game has changed so much.
One room with Forward Curved walls. <img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomLeftRoom_zps2d974496.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Other without. <b>*QUICK NOTE* </b>The powernode is missing from this screen shot (its located next to the fire extinguisher (A recurring theme in my map) in the centre) <img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomRightRoom_zps23ea9994.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Keep both different or does one look/feel better than the other?
Res Node. <img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomResNode_zps3bf76516.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<!--quoteo(post=2011153:date=Nov 5 2012, 08:28 AM:name=PsympleJester)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsympleJester @ Nov 5 2012, 08:28 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2011153"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Indeed... Thank you for such a constructive comment...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Indeed the map looks too much good for a siege map haha. Keep up with the good work. I'm looking forward to it.
Due to the revelation that the distance between the end of the alien halls first corridor to the back of the marine door room was longer than the engines draw distance severe changes have been made to the door room...
<!--quoteo(post=2037559:date=Nov 30 2012, 12:02 AM:name=PsympleJester)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsympleJester @ Nov 30 2012, 12:02 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2037559"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Due to the revelation that the distance between the end of the alien halls first corridor to the back of the marine door room was longer than the engines draw distance severe changes have been made to the door room...
*Sad Face*<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can extend it now using extra entities mod, also looking forward to your map, siege was fun.
<!--quoteo(post=2042570:date=Dec 9 2012, 08:46 PM:name=Magneto)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Magneto @ Dec 9 2012, 08:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042570"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You can extend it now using extra entities mod, also looking forward to your map, siege was fun.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep and you can use the func_door and the logic_timer to create the siege doors.
<!--quoteo(post=2042570:date=Dec 9 2012, 08:46 PM:name=Magneto)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Magneto @ Dec 9 2012, 08:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2042570"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You can extend it now using extra entities mod, also looking forward to your map, siege was fun.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait what... link? :D
Nvm found it... BADASS, now I just need to work out how this thing works! xD
<!--quoteo(post=2043526:date=Dec 11 2012, 05:47 AM:name=Swiftspear)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Swiftspear @ Dec 11 2012, 05:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2043526"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I know you hate me, but this is legitimately one of the coolest projects in the mapping forum. Don't let the haters get you down!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Never seen this before but its boss. Cannot wait to play siege again. Have some great moments with heavy amour pushes and in the siege room.
So far pictures look good. I'm not a purist enough to care that you've made changes, that map was pretty bare bones.
<!--quoteo(post=2010529:date=Nov 4 2012, 07:19 PM:name=PsympleJester)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsympleJester @ Nov 4 2012, 07:19 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2010529"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->But its hard trying to make a NS1 map play the same as it did.. when the game has changed so much.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
don't try to make it same as NS1, this is NS2 and deserves the proper NS2 gameplay
It's definitely not for me to understand why someone would remake the worst map in all of NS1.
You could just take some existing official maps and double/triple the rez nodes at each room and you'd have a game 10x more fun than siege.
As someone who's worked professionally on several RTS games, I can understand player desires for a training wheels "no rush" mode, or a high resource mode (eg Big Game Hunters in Starcraft.) A quality map with these traits would probably be quite fun!
But the original siege007 was made by someone who apparently had no clue about how the two races played (let's have long, coverless corridors in a game where one team is predominantly melee!)
So certainly the best opportunity to improve the original is for it to be made by someone who understands how NS2 is actually played, and although you want each room to be reflective of what it's inspired by you'd want to do things like shorten the massive corridors, add more cover, and possibly add better flanking options. Pipes on ceilings are a good start.
Your making a siegemap? :D Link? Remake or new build? I am very much interested!
The siege room isn't done yet, I have 3 more rooms to go and, the siege room will be the last one I make.
---
As a player who played ns_siege007 probably 1000-1500 times... I really cant see where you comments are coming from at all, the map was particularly well balanced in my opinion and the fatal flaw of long corridors that you point out meant nothing to the insane speed of the ns1 fade... Due to the nature of NS2 and the fact it has slowed down insanely compared to ns1 I have made a large number of changes in an attempt to retain the maps charm without it becoming a Marine sided map.
Anyway as I have said earlier, siege provides something above combat and below pub play for people to learn the basics of the game, its not supposed to be about tactics and micro management of resources, its supposed to be about individuals attempting to work as a team to push or defend a room...
Doesn't mean each and every game is exactly the same however: I very much enjoyed attempting to defend every single room on siege007 and my particular favorite was allowing the aliens to have every room on the map from the moment the door opened and just defending the Marine Start and Jetpack room.
Here is the one I made. It isn't nearly as detailed as yours. Just something I threw together in one evening. I don't even remember which ns1 siege map inspired it, as I didn't play NS1 very much compared to NS2.
The main holdup is that the doors from ExtraEntitiesMod only stop PLAYERS from moving through them at this time. They are completely transparent to ARCs, MACs, cysts, and I think drifters and infestation spreading as well. Obviously not suitable.
Also, don't let the haters bring you down! Siege has always had a love/hate relationship with the players! :D
<!--quoteo(post=2057895:date=Jan 8 2013, 03:08 PM:name=bp2008)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bp2008 @ Jan 8 2013, 03:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057895"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Here is the one I made. It isn't nearly as detailed as yours. Just something I threw together in one evening. I don't even remember which ns1 siege map inspired it, as I didn't play NS1 very much compared to NS2.
The main holdup is that the doors from ExtraEntitiesMod only stop PLAYERS from moving through them at this time. They are completely transparent to ARCs, MACs, cysts, and I think drifters and infestation spreading as well. Obviously not suitable.
Also, don't let the haters bring you down! Siege has always had a love/hate relationship with the players! :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah interesting, did you get any luck with anyone testing it? Shame about the entities mod and drifters... Infestation might not be too much of a bad thing, although I can see early shift in marine doorway being a hilarious strat.... xD
Just have to always send 1 marine to the door to kill cysts/eggs at the start of the game... :p
Looks interesting map layout, sorta reminds me of siege003 (because of the siege corridor)...
Anyway thank you for the feedback and I hope you get testers for your map/maybe finish it off someday! :D
<!--quoteo(post=2057911:date=Jan 8 2013, 08:38 AM:name=PsympleJester)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsympleJester @ Jan 8 2013, 08:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2057911"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ah interesting, did you get any luck with anyone testing it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, I started up a server in my back bedroom and had a half dozen people on it.
Found a lot of issues right away though. Aliens could build in the siege room (couldn't build cysts though because of line of sight). Marines could lock the doors (which was permanent) after the timer opened them. And of course AI units like ARCs could path through the closed doors.
And Aliens in particular didn't seem to have enough resource nodes, so I doubled them and added some more to the Marine side to compensate a bit. I also fixed the siege-room building by extending the glass beyond the range of the infestation, and fixed the lockable doors by changing the door type slightly (they open and close when you go near now).
Those fixes aren't published yet. Can't really playtest again anyway until the door pathing gets fixed or I find a different way to do the timed doors.
Comments
Because it just wouldn't be the same.
Sooo here it is:
Before we start I hope I have done an acceptable job of making Siege maps less blocky and boring and at the same time keep the details and props from being obstructive of game-play.
I am trying to keep it acceptably similar to NS1_seige007 but I have taken a few liberties and made
quite a few changes in an attempt to adapt the map to NS2 game play.
Finally.
Please keep the QQ about siege maps to a minimum please and focus on constructive feedback.
This is the Alien side complete. (for now)
The lighting is reliant on power-grid so when aliens control it, it will be a lot darker...
(I am REALLY hoping alien structures get bio-luminescence).
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/AliensideTopView_zpsf8a12fc8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/Door_zps8561cd73.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
The power point in this screen will control the lights for the entire corridor up-to the hives.
(Getting behind them somehow and destroying it will plunge the entire corridor into total darkness and
the marines will have to build it as soon as they can when the door opens/if it dies.)
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/FirstCourner_zps8f429b98.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/SecondCourner_zps9b7c81d0.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
I have made a rather drastic change here by adding a hole in the wall at the second courner...
This will allow the marines to have shots at the hive from one step further away, make it much harder for onos to push down the tunnels due to them being shot through the wall however I hope it will also balance out due to allowing aliens to bile bomb and xenocide in return.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/ThirdCourner_zpse7407635.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/FinalCourner_zpsd1a79a12.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Another major change is the screens in-front of each hive this covers up half of the hive making it much harder to hit them
this was in responce to the duel exos having MUCH more firepower than HMGs in NS1 and the ability to shoot the hives from
one courner earlier.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/Hives_zps8738e30b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
The hive lights are controlled by the power nodes in the hive and have only been added in-case of the unlikely event of the marines and aliens swapping bases. The hives will hopefully be relying on bio-luminescence from the alien structures. (If not implemented I will have it so the light strength is halved when the nodes are not constructed and come up with a more subtle solution later.)
I am thinking of having some sort of siege room power activated lights as well, perhaps the ceiling lights or maybe some separate ones.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/HiveSkulksEyeView_zps70b1ccfd.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/HiveSkulksEyeViewTwo_zps372914f5.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Its a little crampted but hopefully makes up for it by allowing nice safe places to gestate and to place amble crags/shifts/eggs.
The walkway leading into the wall is to a door leading to the siege room, this door wont be an active one.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/ResRooms_zps15841c8b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Again relying on bio-luminescence, if not ... pitch black should be good. :)
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/UnderDoor_zps6980a7a6.jpg" target="_blank">Scurry Way</a>
Nice space under the walk way for a bit of scurrying... I bet a sneaky alien comm could get structures under there as well!
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/CubbyHole_zps3850e064.jpg" target="_blank">Cubby Hole</a>
A little hard to make out due to textures but above the rockface is a cubby hole for the aliens.
Hopefully useful for bile bombing gorges... sadly I don't think cysts will be able to get up there...
<a href="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/BonusPoints_zpsfa84a2e0.jpg" target="_blank">Mouth Cam!</a>
Bonus for anyone who spotted this before this screen shot!
Hope people like my progress so far,
Feedback will be most appreciated!
Other than that, it is looking good :)
We just need a modder to code ns2_siege...
I'd love to, but I am a bit busy at the moment with my other mods..
I'll have a chat with the guys though and see if anyone wants to help make it, as a team effort it might be fairly easy to do..
Although, mobile sieges should stay, just to spice up the game play a little. Makes the push to the hives all the more exciting, but I think the sieges should still have some form of marine interaction before they are able to fire, maybe a small build to deploy them..
Damn, I'm even thinking about how to implement it :P
Sorry some forums are a little pissy about image spam.
Yeah I dunno what I am going to do about getting it "working" I presume someone will
make a simple code/scrips for a timed door for me when I draw closer to completion! :)
As to the "siege?" I suppose I was just going to have it so sieges could be massed up before
the door opened and then driven into the siege-room as soon as the door opens, another
option would be to make the siege room up a ladder so that sieges cant be driven in and have
to be built <b>inside</b> the siege room... For now I am going to leave it so that sieges can
just be driven into the siege until I get to finally play test the map! :)
Good luck with your other mods and I should hopefully have a few more pictures soon! :D
Sorry some forums are a little pissy about image spam.
Yeah I dunno what I am going to do about getting it "working" I presume someone will
make a simple code/scrips for a timed door for me when I draw closer to completion! :)
As to the "siege?" I suppose I was just going to have it so sieges could be massed up before
the door opened and then driven into the siege-room as soon as the door opens, another
option would be to make the siege room up a ladder so that sieges cant be driven in and have
to be built <b>inside</b> the siege room... For now I am going to leave it so that sieges can
just be driven into the siege until I get to finally play test the map! :)
Good luck with your other mods and I should hopefully have a few more pictures soon! :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Currently writing a timed_door entity for mappers. I am pretty noob, but I would like to elaborate onto a full ns2_siege gamemode. Gonna post in modding for ideas/assistance.
I used Door entity as base, working on the Lua atm.
<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1--> <class name="timed_door">
<model>
<file>models/misc/door/door.model</file>
</model>
<parameter name="openTime" type="real" label="Open time in seconds" default="60.0"/>
<parameter name="clean" type="boolean" label="Uses the alternate clean version of the door model" default="false"/>
</class><!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
Good luck with your work sir!
I had a little break on Siege007 to work on my second map idea and hopefully
I will be moving back to 007 with some fresh ideas.
That is a problem I am facing...
The problem being that NS1 Siege007 was VERY bland, I replicated this originally creating the entire map to the exact proportions.
Problems arose:
Firstly draw distance messes up siege... yeah its a cheap excuse but siege maps are big yo... :P
Secondly I didn't want to receive the same "its ugly" complaints.
Finally balance... NS2 isn't the same game as NS1:
Dual Exos put out 2x the damage NS1 hmg's used to do.
Aliens wont be able to build forward bases behind the Marines even if they managed to get fades into the JP room due to cysts.
(Fades getting past the marines into JP room and setting up DC/MC bases in JP room used to mean Game Over for Marines...
Because of this I took the prop heavy approach, which should allow aliens to get past easier, and have made a few alterations to the main battle area (the alien halls) that I hope will make the map more balanced.
As well as this I am considering adding stairs to the JP room allowing exo's/non JP's to climb to the higher levels also (and cysts).
Not to mention I will have to shrink the hight of JP room due to JP hight being seriously nerfed + draw distance.
This will then present problems where I will have JP room level over level and I need to figure out how to make my commander able to build on all levels... or reasons why he cant build on all levels?
Anyway... yeah... I dont think there will be much option to "leave it as it was"... I am doing my very best to make the map "feel" the same as it did... I commanded 100's if not a 1000 games on NS_siege007 (it was the default (server crash) map for my communities server) and I loved it dearly. But its hard trying to make a NS1 map play the same as it did.. when the game has changed so much.
Anyway... screens of the marines side doorway...
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomNR_zps47c75af6.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomNL_zpsc92a21a2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomFR_zps90660be4.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomFL_zps3716b03b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Opinions please...
One room with Forward Curved walls.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomLeftRoom_zps2d974496.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Other without. <b>*QUICK NOTE* </b>The powernode is missing from this screen shot (its located next to the fire extinguisher (A recurring theme in my map) in the centre)
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomRightRoom_zps23ea9994.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Keep both different or does one look/feel better than the other?
Res Node.
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorRoomResNode_zps3bf76516.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Indeed... Thank you for such a constructive comment...
Indeed the map looks too much good for a siege map haha. Keep up with the good work. I'm looking forward to it.
*Sad Face*
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/TopDownRamps.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Long Corridors:
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/LongHallsB.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/LongHallsA.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Those drastic changes:
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorV22nd.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/DoorV2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
*Sad Face*<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can extend it now using extra entities mod, also looking forward to your map, siege was fun.
Yep and you can use the func_door and the logic_timer to create the siege doors.
Wait what... link? :D
Nvm found it... BADASS, now I just need to work out how this thing works! xD
Never seen this before but its boss. Cannot wait to play siege again. Have some great moments with heavy amour pushes and in the siege room.
So far pictures look good. I'm not a purist enough to care that you've made changes, that map was pretty bare bones.
Seeing this thread again makes me wanna make a siege map.
don't try to make it same as NS1, this is NS2 and deserves the proper NS2 gameplay
This is what I have so far...
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/RampRoom_zpsfadb3d1b.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/RampRoom2_zps707a5b00.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/RampRoom3_zpsfdcec8c0.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/PsympleJester/RampRoom4_zps434dc21c.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Where is your siege room?
You could just take some existing official maps and double/triple the rez nodes at each room and you'd have a game 10x more fun than siege.
As someone who's worked professionally on several RTS games, I can understand player desires for a training wheels "no rush" mode, or a high resource mode (eg Big Game Hunters in Starcraft.) A quality map with these traits would probably be quite fun!
But the original siege007 was made by someone who apparently had no clue about how the two races played (let's have long, coverless corridors in a game where one team is predominantly melee!)
So certainly the best opportunity to improve the original is for it to be made by someone who understands how NS2 is actually played, and although you want each room to be reflective of what it's inspired by you'd want to do things like shorten the massive corridors, add more cover, and possibly add better flanking options. Pipes on ceilings are a good start.
Link? Remake or new build?
I am very much interested!
The siege room isn't done yet, I have 3 more rooms to go and, the siege room will be the last one I make.
---
As a player who played ns_siege007 probably 1000-1500 times...
I really cant see where you comments are coming from at all, the map was particularly well balanced in my opinion and the fatal flaw of long corridors that you point out meant nothing to the insane speed of the ns1 fade...
Due to the nature of NS2 and the fact it has slowed down insanely compared to ns1 I have made a large number of changes in an attempt to retain the maps charm without it becoming a Marine sided map.
Anyway as I have said earlier, siege provides something above combat and below pub play for people to learn the basics of the game, its not supposed to be about tactics and micro management of resources, its supposed to be about individuals attempting to work as a team to push or defend a room...
Doesn't mean each and every game is exactly the same however: I very much enjoyed attempting to defend every single room on siege007 and my particular favorite was allowing the aliens to have every room on the map from the moment the door opened and just defending the Marine Start and Jetpack room.
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=126878" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=126878</a>
The main holdup is that the doors from ExtraEntitiesMod only stop PLAYERS from moving through them at this time. They are completely transparent to ARCs, MACs, cysts, and I think drifters and infestation spreading as well. Obviously not suitable.
Also, don't let the haters bring you down! Siege has always had a love/hate relationship with the players! :D
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=126878" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=126878</a>
The main holdup is that the doors from ExtraEntitiesMod only stop PLAYERS from moving through them at this time. They are completely transparent to ARCs, MACs, cysts, and I think drifters and infestation spreading as well. Obviously not suitable.
Also, don't let the haters bring you down! Siege has always had a love/hate relationship with the players! :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah interesting, did you get any luck with anyone testing it?
Shame about the entities mod and drifters... Infestation might not be too much of a bad thing, although I can see early shift in marine doorway being a hilarious strat.... xD
Just have to always send 1 marine to the door to kill cysts/eggs at the start of the game... :p
Looks interesting map layout, sorta reminds me of siege003 (because of the siege corridor)...
Anyway thank you for the feedback and I hope you get testers for your map/maybe finish it off someday! :D
Yeah, I started up a server in my back bedroom and had a half dozen people on it.
Found a lot of issues right away though. Aliens could build in the siege room (couldn't build cysts though because of line of sight). Marines could lock the doors (which was permanent) after the timer opened them. And of course AI units like ARCs could path through the closed doors.
And Aliens in particular didn't seem to have enough resource nodes, so I doubled them and added some more to the Marine side to compensate a bit. I also fixed the siege-room building by extending the glass beyond the range of the infestation, and fixed the lockable doors by changing the door type slightly (they open and close when you go near now).
Those fixes aren't published yet. Can't really playtest again anyway until the door pathing gets fixed or I find a different way to do the timed doors.