I can see how it's supposed to be an asymmetry thing, but I don't think it works. Alien commanders are going to give individual orders regardless via voice or text, it only makes sense for the game to actually support those orders directly.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited March 2013
The Hive Mind can expand without the help of the aliens out in the field and indirectly helps out the team and as dragonmith said, using indirect Hive Sight indicators. Where the Commander actively supports the marines in the field and the marines must build stuff otherwise stuff doesn't get built.
I find it very fitting in terms of asymmetry, as it still is possible to give "suggestions" as the Hive Mind :P
Today a good Khamm on Tram placed a lot of "threats here" which helped me tremendously. I didn't have to have my map open for longer than 0.5 seconds at a time.
Metal ManJoin Date: 2011-11-13Member: 132717Members
You make a great point. Even if it is not as essential to give waypoints to alien players this should be easily available. People arguing that aliens don't need it may be right. Well then why is there an alien commander?
It's almost like UWE subconsciously determined that the alien commander isn't quite an actual commander... more like a distant "gardener" (quoted for the truth) that you wave to and say "keep up the good work!" Not going to go into this right now but the alien commander was implemented terribly in NS2. He has absolutely no association with his team. He does his (vital) job and the fighters do theirs somewhat independently.
The Hive Mind can expand without the help of the aliens out in the field and indirectly helps out the team and as dragonmith said, using indirect Hive Sight indicators. Where the Commander actively supports the marines in the field and the marines must build stuff otherwise stuff doesn't get built.
I find it very fitting in terms of asymmetry, as it still is possible to give "suggestions" as the Hive Mind :P
Orders are a basic RTS interface feature, so making it asymmetrical is a bit silly (like giving ctrl-groups to the comm but not the khamm). NS2 is in desperate need of better methods for the comm to organize his teammates.
Have to disagree sorry Metal Man. I'm not a great Khammander but I have seen some. The key thing that they did was not so much building upgrades and such, but place drifters and other alien support structures in places to ensure aliens knew exactly what was going on in the marine team. The alien commander doesn't provide immediate support in the form of medpacks and ammo, he grows support (crags, shifts, eggs etc.) which ensure they win.
I also think often people don't adopt the mindset that the Khammander can actually provide leadership, and therefore he doesn't. Many maps I've played in aliens either don't listen to the khammander, or the khammander doesn't say anything the entire game.
Perhaps the better thread title would be why can't the Khamm give waypoints. Frankly, the marine comm never really gives 'orders' in the normal sense since the vast majority of orders are build orders and those happen automatically whenever a marine is within a set range of a building that needs to be constructed. Very rarely in games does the comm ever give out orders on a regular basis since it's too much to micromanage.
So long as the Khamm has a mic, he shouldn't have a problem leading the team. Waypoints are overrated, and I don't think it would hurt the marines if they were removed. I can't see any pressing need for aliens to have them, but I don't object to it either.
totally agree with the issue brought up in this thread. I know multiple times when i am marine commander and wish i could make the threat or alert icons on the map like alien can. I am not exactly sure why you cannot give individual alien way points, i wasn't aware of this. To me there is nothing meaningful to having one side have one option or the other, or really lend anything to asymmetrical gameplay. Why isnt each option available to both sides?
totally agree with the issue brought up in this thread. I know multiple times when i am marine commander and wish i could make the threat or alert icons on the map like alien can. I am not exactly sure why you cannot give individual alien way points, i wasn't aware of this. To me there is nothing meaningful to having one side have one option or the other, or really lend anything to asymmetrical gameplay. Why isnt each option available to both sides?
You can do the alert, middle mouse button on the minimap.
the alerts are very poorly implemented. it is super easy to miss them, not understand what the hell they mean, or just ignore them completely. it is nothing like english words being spoken to you and written on the screen, that has a much more resonating effect with even the noobest players.
aliens should have this. i cant count the number of times ive tried to do this instinctively before noticing you cant as alien comm
I agree. The khaamander, or whatever it's called, doesn't seem to be encouraged to interact or talk to their squads as much as marines [should the plural noun for khaara be squad? Something like "swarm" seems more appropriate ]. Khaams generally seem quieter than comms (from my anecdotal xp), and I never [read: less frequently] seem to know what they're doing/what they want. I blame the lack of small talk between troops and comm: When the comm gives orders to marines they at least have some clue about what his plan is (even if he isn't directly telling them); whereas, with the khaara it can be a mystery.
Has anyone ever heard the phrase "The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing"? Imagine the left hands are the FPSers and the right hand is the khaam, that's how i often feel the khaara's "hive mind" works. Whilst i've got you imagining things also imagine something that actually has 7 left hands and 1 right hand, this has nothing to do with my point but imagine it anyway, it's cool, isn't it? Clark Ashton Smith should totally write a short story about it, once he's stopped being dead, of course.
Also, I know that khaam has the warning things but they aint best. Whenever someone puts down a "Threat" thing i'm never quite shure if it means there's a threat to alien team and we should go there and eat the squishy, Red Bloods, or if that's a dangerous place we're being told to avoid.
Comments
Anyway, what I want to know is why can't alien com see what upgrades he has?
I find it very fitting in terms of asymmetry, as it still is possible to give "suggestions" as the Hive Mind :P
Ping them. Failing that, use a beacon, they will come...
Every. Freaking. Time.
That would be the push-to-talk button on your mic.
No I am trying to get them to leave the base, so far telling them the alien hive has beer hidden in it works.
Unfortunately without a giant flashing light and gps telling them how to walk forward 100ft the marines get lost...
It's almost like UWE subconsciously determined that the alien commander isn't quite an actual commander... more like a distant "gardener" (quoted for the truth) that you wave to and say "keep up the good work!" Not going to go into this right now but the alien commander was implemented terribly in NS2. He has absolutely no association with his team. He does his (vital) job and the fighters do theirs somewhat independently.
As a matter of fact he can since the Gorgeous Update.
I also think often people don't adopt the mindset that the Khammander can actually provide leadership, and therefore he doesn't. Many maps I've played in aliens either don't listen to the khammander, or the khammander doesn't say anything the entire game.
So long as the Khamm has a mic, he shouldn't have a problem leading the team. Waypoints are overrated, and I don't think it would hurt the marines if they were removed. I can't see any pressing need for aliens to have them, but I don't object to it either.
You can do the alert, middle mouse button on the minimap.
aliens should have this. i cant count the number of times ive tried to do this instinctively before noticing you cant as alien comm
Has anyone ever heard the phrase "The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing"? Imagine the left hands are the FPSers and the right hand is the khaam, that's how i often feel the khaara's "hive mind" works. Whilst i've got you imagining things also imagine something that actually has 7 left hands and 1 right hand, this has nothing to do with my point but imagine it anyway, it's cool, isn't it? Clark Ashton Smith should totally write a short story about it, once he's stopped being dead, of course.
Also, I know that khaam has the warning things but they aint best. Whenever someone puts down a "Threat" thing i'm never quite shure if it means there's a threat to alien team and we should go there and eat the squishy, Red Bloods, or if that's a dangerous place we're being told to avoid.