ns2_origin

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  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Yes, thanks for the picture. I can certainly do it, would love to, but don't you think there is already enough cover in Comp Lab? ..plus it's smaller than Topo.
    ..I guess i just try it.
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited March 2017
    There is a lot of cover atm, but once you get to this spot the amount of places an alien can ambush from gets increasingly smaller.
    23686CFB71F0BBDB36CB058ADF5041C654A0D88A

    It's only the left wall and right pillars which is easy to check and punish.

    Sorry for being difficult. :tongue:

    It's fine if you want to keep it as is for a strong marine natural.
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Ah the good ol' NS -> NS2 map issues :D
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Sorry for being difficult. :tongue:
    ahum *takes note*
    This goes right into your chart :p

    It doesn't help in an engagement, just for ambush which you can check, so i guess I make the ceiling higher.
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    I used to be really anal about all the stats of a map, esp new maps. Eg how long it takes to travel from TP to RT, TP to TP, how many units high/across the map's bounding box is.

    Ultimately, the best thing to do is just play the damned map, see how it feels.
  • ZdrytchXZdrytchX Australia Join Date: 2016-02-06 Member: 212662Members
    I don't really like the conection north of cargo (duel res room) and the hallways near the xeno research. Kinda confusing visually in-map although the overview doesn't look like it would be confusing.
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Update:
    -Added more rock cover to Biodome, so you can't shoot the hive from outside (you can still hit one arm tho)
    -Smoothed floor in Biodome for better structure placement (Trees take space, but arent shown in commander view, so remember their position; gorge tunnels still make trouble, just like in Cave in Mineshaft; they hate displacement geo apparently)
    -Visual improvements to Cargo, Shipping and Tram Tunnels
    -Removed the tram+container prop at the marine entrance of Shipping (was kinda a death trap, not enough open space)
  • WyzcrakWyzcrak Pot Pie Aficionado Join Date: 2002-12-04 Member: 10447Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    There are a few recent ns2_origin games in TGNS Replay now, with more to come -- the map has been received well. The videos captured so far include a lot of early commentary on the design.

    http://rr.tacticalgamer.com/Replay
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    edited April 2017
    Thanks to everyone playtesting the map during the SCC session!

    @Wyzcrak : Thanks for the replays! Very valueable feedback and fun to watch. I laughed hard when you tried to go through the rocky vent to furnace as gorge and paniced because of the lava pool.
    The Map is similar to Veil, so I'm hoping to pull off the layout as it is.
    I'm still balancing and improving the map, so I would appreciate, if you kept Furnace as possible Alien Start for now. It's also supposed to be the best hive to hold Cargo doubleres at start.
    I've made a few improvements for Furnace hive tho:
    -Added more pipes to Smelting Room and changed their height so its easier to get up there and navigate between pipes
    -Shortened the diagonal part of the vent leading into Ore Scanner so skulks can get closer to the exit before being spotted
    (still enough time for marines building the power node hopefully)
    -Detailed corridor between Lava Catwalk and Ore Scanner, more cover for skulks and the bucket blocks the vent entrance
    zOMyEhB.jpg


    I've added another vent entrance into Cargo and increased the Ceiling. The new vent should help aliens starting in Biodome or Ventilation
    EPkeZhz.jpg


    I'm thinking about another vent somewhere between Biodome and Ventilation so marines can't block Water Treatment too easily.
    There might also be a problem with aliens being locked in into Biodome too easily, but might just be aliens not using the vent system to flank properly.
  • 2cough2cough Rocky Mountain High Join Date: 2013-03-14 Member: 183952Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter
    Had a few rounds on this the other night finally. Unfortunately teams made them kind of stompy rounds, but I could see through the stomp. I think it already flows and feels very natural. Also, man... nostalgia. So good to run though laser drilling into lava... from biodome into comp lab. Ventilation is a great adaptation too :D:D:dizzy:

    The only thing that made me a bit uncomfortable was how narrow some of the thresholds between some rooms are. I'll have to go back and make specific notes of which ones I'm referring to. K actually I looked real quick at the overlay in archie's vid. I kind of feel like... all room thresholds are a bit narrow. Very easy for skulk pouncing since there's not much room to take wide corners to avoid this.

    Other than that, I need to play on it more, but seems like it could be an easy mapvote pick at this point for me :)
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Thanks man, I'm always glad when NS1 players like the remake.
    Also glad when ppl can see through stomps and unbalanced teams instead of jumping to balance conclusions.
    I'll think about the room connections and what I can do.
  • EbichuEbichu Japan Join Date: 2014-12-09 Member: 199999Members
    Hi. Thanks for the map!
    I think we need some ambient sounds.
    Generator noise, lava flow. Bird songs in biodome )). Any ideas?
    It's too quiet now.
  • MephillesMephilles Germany Join Date: 2013-08-07 Member: 186634Members, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    so just played a gather on your map aqnd noticed that marines have a huge advantage on the res game on origin. Aliens don't rly have natural RTs and cargo is way too easy to reach for marines to be able for aliens to be capped effectively.

    So 2 ways on how to deal with that.

    Option 1: Move the cargo RTs out of cargo, 1 into Water treatment and the other one into Generator. This would create natural RTs for aliens and help them establish a res game

    Option 2: Completely remove the 2 lanes that lead from marine naturals to cargo. (Tram Tunnels and not sure what it is called on the other side). This will make the layout very similar to veil. Marines need way longer to get there and a commitment from aliens to take and hold cargo is a valid possibility then
  • The_Welsh_WizardThe_Welsh_Wizard Join Date: 2013-09-10 Member: 188101Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Played one gather on it. That's not much, but enough for me to write here. Many rooms are nicely built and the overall layout felt similar to Veil.
    It was 2 pretty clear marine wins. The map overall feels oversized, many rooms are very big and many line of sights are extremely long. Cargo is too easy for marines to get, one reason Veil works is because marines have a long way to go to get Nano. I don't really like double RT rooms and would prefer the two RTs spread out, but that is my personal opinion only. However that room makes it too easy for marines too hold too much res and that leaves Aliens in a difficult position, especially because they only have one natural RT.
    Also I noticed the Biodome RT is way too easy snipeable from Water Treatment.

    The map has potential though.
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Not happy to hear that but thanks for the feedback guys.
  • KasharicKasharic Hull, England Join Date: 2013-03-27 Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    Long line of sights are necessarily an issue as long as you offer different routes, flanking opportunities or just general cover on the sides (I'm looking at you Hub on tram, and y-junction on veil!).
    As for the rooms feeling too big, I ran around the map and It seems to me that the rooms are fine when it comes to size, but there just isn't enough in there yet, there is a lot of open space that feels like it would need some macro-geometry or extra propping etc. (which I assumed you already knew, with this being so early into the maps creation process)

    As for the layout, in high level play this is very marine sided, even in relatively low skill pubs it is still pretty marine OP. It all seems to come down to how fast marines take and hold cargo.
  • BicsumBicsum Join Date: 2012-02-27 Member: 147596Members, Reinforced - Gold
    edited March 2017
    About Laser Drilling:
    I think that the res node position will make it too easy for skulks to bite the resource tower and get out without consequences, making the 'res bite skulk vs marine recapper'-game boring

    Like this is pretty much how it will play out most of the time:
    bPXKU11.png


    The marine is noticed from too far away and the skulk gets to exit too easily. Usually biting an RT is somewhat of an commitment, that puts the skulk in a bad position. When a marine enters the room while you're still at the resource tower, he should have the possibility to kill you.
    The way it is right now, you never have to commit to biting and because of how exposed the room is, you don't really have the option to fight either.

    I'd suggest to move the res node more to the south and add some view cover, so that the entering marine can't immediately shoot the skulk as he tries get away from the RT
    qQdDXW3.png

  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    I think there are a lot of examples in other offical maps, where you can get out too easily.
    And I wanted to try the ns1 setup first in this room.
    You are right tho that this rooms gameplay is kinda straight forward and boring and I'm all for making it more fun.
    I'll think about your node placement, it seems good. And I'm planning to shorten Laser Drilling anyway, because right now you can view entities disappear from Access entrance due to the view limit of 1500? units.
  • HandschuhHandschuh Join Date: 2005-03-08 Member: 44338Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Community Developer
    You need to consider in ns1 it was much easier to kill skulks behind rts if you shoot at the right spot... often killed skulks easily in lasterdrilling behind the rt...

    Did I see it right that there is no hidingspot at the top of the complab like in ns1?
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    Yes, I considered that hiding spot too strong for a marine natural. Imagine you could hide on top of Topo in Veil. There are already a lot of hiding spots and cover in comp lab.

    I've added a lot more cover, ambush spots and vents to the map to help Aliens.
    I would love to add more starting cysts, so Aliens need less cysts to expand at start, but there is a range limit to them right now.

    Blocking the tram tunnels corridor completly to increase travel time for Marines to Cargo will be a last resort for the future, if nothing else works out.
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    edited April 2017
    Update:
    New Res node layout, since this map was just too marine friendly!

    -Added Ventilation Access location and res node between Biodome and Ventilation
    -Added res node in Ore Extraction between Furnace and Ventilation
    -Removed one res node in Cargo (former double-res);
    might remove the other node, too, but I want this room to have some action.
    BAOCu9d.jpg
    9UIT11G.jpg


    Overview:
    bNGjiiP.jpg
  • KasharicKasharic Hull, England Join Date: 2013-03-27 Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    @pSyk0mAn The images aren't working bud :(
  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    edited April 2017
    They are. Forum is bugging out. Copy paste the links :p
    ..or check workshop link for pics and overview:
    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=859097492
  • KasharicKasharic Hull, England Join Date: 2013-03-27 Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
    Played earlier tonight, the alterations to res positions are already helping, feels a lot more balanced already. The map is feeling really good imo, I'm still relatively unfamiliar with routes and such so I don't play all that well on it, but I can see it becoming a fan favorite pretty fast once its done.
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    Played 1 round on it today. Here's my pov. :)

  • ZavaroZavaro Tucson, Arizona Join Date: 2005-02-14 Member: 41174Members, Super Administrators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    Damn. That's real good.
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    My pov from today's playtest. :)

  • pSyk0mAnpSyk0mAn Nerdish by Nature Germany Join Date: 2003-08-07 Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
    edited April 2017
    Some notable changes of the recent updates aside from detailing and adding a few more cover and ambush spots:

    -Marines can no longer get into Scanning -> Ore Extraction vent without help of another marine or structure.
    This was just too strong, it already feels like Marines are everywhere on this map, and I might even remove Marine Access completely in the future, if necessary.

    -Detailed a lot of vents and made them more alien friendly. Reduced line of sight, added cover or ambush spots. Fades are able to blink-hop through most of them.
    Especially the vent leading from Generator into Ventilation was very frustrating for aliens and gave marines another easy way into the hive room.

    If you wanna vote and play the map on public server, I've found your best chance is the 8bitgamers servers, since more regulars vote for it there.
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