<b><a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0106308' target='_blank'>Army of Darkness</a></b> It started out good with the chainsaw battle, but at the point you see the skeletons, I was seriously considering if I should just turn it off. The ending is kind of weird though.
<!--QuoteBegin--Specter+Jun 6 2003, 11:38 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Specter @ Jun 6 2003, 11:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> my list:
minority report (honestly only because i can remember the first 20 minutes or so, then i must have felt asleep) dog soldiers (dunno, just crap) wingcommander black knight (thought great medieval movie, but its just crap) reign of fire <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> dude you listed 3 of my DVD's there! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Dog soldiers - despite what anyone says it kicks serious bootay! Black knight - i have always found ML hillarious... i dont know what your all on about! reign of fire - this was an impulse buy after playing the game... it is an ok film to an extent...
dog soldiers: its so low budget imo it could be good, like clerks... it got good scenes like "where is spoon?" "there is no spoon!" and that stuff, but all in all its just another b-movie!
black knight: ok, i have to say i had other espectations so i was very disappointet... nevr saw it again...
reign of fire: dunno, i just dont like it... they try so hard to get a plot, but fail imo...
<!--QuoteBegin--Specter+Jun 6 2003, 04:30 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Specter @ Jun 6 2003, 04:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> dog soldiers: its so low budget imo it could be good, like clerks... it got good scenes like "where is spoon?" "there is no spoon!" and that stuff, but all in all its just another b-movie!
black knight: ok, i have to say i had other espectations so i was very disappointet... nevr saw it again...
reign of fire: dunno, i just dont like it... they try so hard to get a plot, but fail imo... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Dog soldiers is a great movie, it was realistic and prooved that low buget films can still be great. reign of fire was ok.
<!--QuoteBegin--Aezay+Jun 6 2003, 10:49 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Aezay @ Jun 6 2003, 10:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b><a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0106308' target='_blank'>Army of Darkness</a></b> It started out good with the chainsaw battle, but at the point you see the skeletons, I was seriously considering if I should just turn it off. The ending is kind of weird though. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <b><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>HERETIC!</span></b>
<!--QuoteBegin--Salty+Jun 6 2003, 03:00 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Salty @ Jun 6 2003, 03:00 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Has Kurt Russel made a good movie? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Ye he has!!! The Thing! A classic!
I would prolly have to say most of the Star Trek movies. Some of them were great but the majority are crap.
Actually, there is an even LARGER plot hole in Minority Report. I'll write it out now, so there are SPOILERS AHEAD.
Tom's character sees a future murder is going to commit. He knows nothing of the man who he will eventually murder. Tom only knows what he saw on the precog screen. He begins his search for this unknown future victim.
Tom's character begins his search, and finds out that the victim was the kidnapper of Tom's child.
Skip to the cliffhanger. Tom Cruise's character is pointing his weapon at the unknown victim, who has revealed himself to be a fake. The victim never really did steal anything. He is a poor man, and wants his life insurance money to go to his family. He has to be shown to be in an accident of some sort, so he wants Tom to kill him.
Tom tells him no, that he won't do it. He lowers his gun. The poor man, in a frantic decision, jumps out the window to his death.
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy.
So, when Tom decides to disobey what the vision foretold, and not kill the man, we get a MAJOR plot hole. IF Tom never kills the man, then there is no precog - meaning there is NO WAY he would have ever known about the guy in the first place! The only reason Tom killed the guy was because of the fact that he saw the precog. However, if he never kills the guy, then there is no precog. If there is no precog, there is no murder.
He does kill the guy you Idiot!!!!! The dude grabs the gun and jolts it forward making TOM pull the trigger by accident THEN he falls out the window!!!
Umm the precog was falisified fool he never commited a murder in the first place, remember it was set up? I think the only plot hole was in your head. And I'm in a bad mood so don't take this personally.
And yah what Dubs said. There's absolutely nothing wrong with minority report, it was a great film based on a very good short story and actually original so give it a break.
Also if you paid attention to some of the stuff they were talking about cause and effect you'd remember one of the issues was if someone saw the future could they change it.
the bourne identity....the worlds stupidest film EVER, in the history of mankind...although it did start to border on funny at times. my favourite part being when he killed the large knife wielding maniac hitman with a bic biro. who would've thought that those biros could be so dangerous?!
<!--QuoteBegin--MedHead+Jun 6 2003, 08:56 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MedHead @ Jun 6 2003, 08:56 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Ooh, I forgot! Mission to Mars!
Actually, there is an even LARGER plot hole in Minority Report. I'll write it out now, so there are SPOILERS AHEAD.
Tom's character sees a future murder is going to commit. He knows nothing of the man who he will eventually murder. Tom only knows what he saw on the precog screen. He begins his search for this unknown future victim.
Tom's character begins his search, and finds out that the victim was the kidnapper of Tom's child.
Skip to the cliffhanger. Tom Cruise's character is pointing his weapon at the unknown victim, who has revealed himself to be a fake. The victim never really did steal anything. He is a poor man, and wants his life insurance money to go to his family. He has to be shown to be in an accident of some sort, so he wants Tom to kill him.
Tom tells him no, that he won't do it. He lowers his gun. The poor man, in a frantic decision, jumps out the window to his death.
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy.
So, when Tom decides to disobey what the vision foretold, and not kill the man, we get a MAJOR plot hole. IF Tom never kills the man, then there is no precog - meaning there is NO WAY he would have ever known about the guy in the first place! The only reason Tom killed the guy was because of the fact that he saw the precog. However, if he never kills the guy, then there is no precog. If there is no precog, there is no murder.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, how it worked was, he was originally going to kill his child's supposed killer. He sees himself killing the guy and since he knows he's supposed to kill him, he doesn't. Once he finds the guy, he doesn't kill him, Crow shoots himself/forces John to pull the trigger.
I've got another plothole for you, though. How is he supposed to find and kill Crow the first time, when he doesn't have Agatha and the precog vision to guide him to Crow?
And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|
I loved Minority Report, and I thought that even if the precog wasn't there he still would have gone to Crow. Either that or it was in the precog's vision that the precog would be part of his destiny, which was probably true.
My least favorite movie of all time? Ghost Ship. God, that had to be the most horrible movie I've ever seen. I feel stupider every time I mention that movie. There's also a lot of other horror movies that are just horrible. (horr, <u>horr</u>or, <u>horr</u>ible?) Just Married was also teh crep.
Dubers, the fact remains that it was an accident, and was different than what was shown in the precog. Not only that, but he had made the concious decision to NOT kill him. Remember how rape wasn't shown in the precogs, because it didn't cause the right brain activity? If that was the case, then the murder wouldn't ever have shown up in the first place, because he never planned it. Therefore it wasn't a murder. The victim made him pull the trigger by struggling.
In the beginning of the movie, the precogs find out about a murder around 1 hour before the man with the scissors kills his wife and her lover. Tom Cruise gets 3 days?! Even though he was planning to refrain from shooting the guy from the very start?
Premeditation has been stopped in that area. Therefore, the old man would have either never been able to set the guy up, or he would have been caught by the precogs.
The precogs weren't in any condition to catch anyone considering they were constantly under heavy medication to keep them only semi-conscious.
And if you remember all murders the pre-cogs see are stopped, so no murder does not equal no pre-cog vision. The pre-cogs get a sense of events where someone is thinking about or planning to murder someone, remember when the detective questions Tom's character about the validity of the pre-cogs asking what if the murderer decided to not murder the victim at the last second. Basically the whole film centered around the fact they were essentially arresting people for crimes they did not commit on assumptions that they would commit them they were seemingly never wrong, Tom's case proved that they could be.
Like Tom said in the movie, the precogs don't see what you think about doing, only what you will do. Even if Tom MADE a concious decision but still killed Crow, he would still show up in a precog vision.
As for the 1 hour vs 3 days thing: they explain that in the movie, sometimes the precogs see murders very early or nearly too late.
<!--QuoteBegin--Infinitum+Jun 6 2003, 05:42 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Infinitum @ Jun 6 2003, 05:42 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>HERETIC!</span></b> YOU GO DIE NOW!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--QuoteBegin--Tiio+Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiio @ Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> What!? Please tell me why you think this movie is so good, so I can understand why the people who dont like <b>Star Wars</b> and <b>The Lord of the Ring</b> can walk away without being flamed for their opinions?
To bring up another scene in the movie I dislike, is where he is haunted to overnight in the mill, and the small copies that comes out of the mirror tease him.
<a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0091499' target='_blank'><b>Maximum Overdrive</b></a> Another bad movie, its about machines that comes to life.
<!--QuoteBegin--Aezay+Jun 6 2003, 01:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Aezay @ Jun 6 2003, 01:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Infinitum+Jun 6 2003, 05:42 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Infinitum @ Jun 6 2003, 05:42 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><b><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>HERETIC!</span></b> YOU GO DIE NOW!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--QuoteBegin--Tiio+Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiio @ Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> What!? Please tell me why you think this movie is so good, so I can understand why the people who dont like <b>Star Wars</b> and <b>The Lord of the Ring</b> can walk away without being flamed for their opinions?
To bring up another scene in the movie I dislike, is where he is haunted to overnight in the mill, and the small copies that comes out of the mirror tease him.
<a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0091499' target='_blank'><b>Maximum Overdrive</b></a> Another bad movie, its about machines that comes to life. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Cause the Lord of the Rings trilogy is god awful, Star Wars is lame with the exception of return of the jedi, and Army of Darkness owns.
And if you don't believe me you can say hello to my boomstick.
<!--QuoteBegin--Rion+Jun 6 2003, 01:17 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rion @ Jun 6 2003, 01:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Basically a movie that makes itself look retarded within the first few seconds of it's preview. One that comes to mind would be Phone Booth. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I would have to agree with that one <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--MedHead+Jun 6 2003, 05:30 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MedHead @ Jun 6 2003, 05:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Dubers, the fact remains that it was an accident, and was different than what was shown in the precog. Not only that, but he had made the concious decision to NOT kill him. Remember how rape wasn't shown in the precogs, because it didn't cause the right brain activity? If that was the case, then the murder wouldn't ever have shown up in the first place, because he never planned it. Therefore it wasn't a murder. The victim made him pull the trigger by struggling.
In the beginning of the movie, the precogs find out about a murder around 1 hour before the man with the scissors kills his wife and her lover. Tom Cruise gets 3 days?! Even though he was planning to refrain from shooting the guy from the very start?
Premeditation has been stopped in that area. Therefore, the old man would have either never been able to set the guy up, or he would have been caught by the precogs. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Your getting it wrong again mate. He DID make the descision to kill Crowe and THAT is what the Pre Cogs picked up on only after a few moments before he was about to do it he realised what he was about to do. He lowers his gun the Crow grabs the gun effectively killing himself.
HE DID THINK ABOUT KILLING THE GUY AND THATS WHAT THE PRE COGS PICKED UP ON!!!! That was the whole basis of the pre-crime concept. The images were interpreted as a murder because he THOUGHT about killing him so the images when analysed appead to show Tom was gonna kill the dude. It doesn't matter one little bit that he pre decided he wasn't gonna kill the guy. That doesn't alter the fact that when he thought the guy was his sons killer he made a snap human decision to kill him.
Evil Dead was... odd Evil Dead II was golden Evil Dead: Army of Darkness is a cult classic
Bruce Campbell suits the role of Ash SO well.
"Yeah. Alright you primitive screwheads, listen up. See this? This is my boomstick! It's a twelve gauge double barreled Remington, S-Mart's top-of-the-line. You can find this in the sporting goods department. That's right this sweet baby was made in Grand Rapids Michigan. Retails for about $109.95. It's got a walnut stock, cobalt blue steel and a hair trigger. That's right. Shop Smart. Shop S-mart. Ya got that?! Now I swear, the next one of you primates, even touches me... Ya!"
"Who the hell are you?!" "Names Ash. Housewares" "I'LL SWALLOW YOUR SOUL!" "Come get some" Voice over "Sure I could have stayed in the past. Could've been King, but in my own way I am king" "Hail to the King baby"
<!--QuoteBegin--DuBERS+Jun 6 2003, 07:45 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DuBERS @ Jun 6 2003, 07:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Salty+Jun 6 2003, 03:00 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Salty @ Jun 6 2003, 03:00 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Has Kurt Russel made a good movie? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ye he has!!! The Thing! A classic! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Don't forget Escape From New York!
<!--QuoteBegin--Salty+Jun 6 2003, 10:11 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Salty @ Jun 6 2003, 10:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Ive never seen the thing.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You should really see it.
They recently made a game about The Thing. Official website: <a href='http://www.thethinggames.com' target='_blank'>www.thethinggames.com</a>.
<!--QuoteBegin--Salty+Jun 6 2003, 08:11 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Salty @ Jun 6 2003, 08:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ive never seen the thing. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You my friend are missing out! The thing is a great film and it would't have been without Kurt Russel.
And yes Escape From New York is another classic. Why they remade it I will never know!
<!--QuoteBegin--MedHead+Jun 6 2003, 11:56 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MedHead @ Jun 6 2003, 11:56 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Tom tells him no, that he won't do it. He lowers his gun. The poor man, in a frantic decision, jumps out the window to his death.
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> First of all, the gun did go off in the struggle, and then the man fell out the window. The precog vision did not show a struggle, however.
And the fact that the vision led him to the man isn't necessarily a plot hole. It's known as a self-fulfilling prophecy, and was used a lot in Greek mythology, and used to a lesser extent nowadays. Self-fulfilling prophecies are so much fun, if only because they make you think. Like the first Matrix movie, when the Oracle tells him not to worry about the vase. Telling him not to worry about it CAUSED him to break it. Self-fulfilling. Self-fulfilling prophecies are not plot holes, merely fun literary devices.
And just because the murder didn't happen doesn't mean the precog vision shouldn't have happened. Remember, the precogs only show what will probably happen. And the murder might have happened. But it would have been a crime of passion, not pre-mediatated, as implied by the "normal" ball and the 30-hour warning. And, again, if it was the suicide that was pre-meditated, why was Tom's character's name on the murderer's ball? I couldn't quite pick it out, but he removed his finger from the trigger when lowering the gun. I was under the impression that the "innocent guy" wedged his finger in the trigger lock in the struggle. Why wasn't the struggle shown in the pre-cog vision?
-Ryan!
A cynic is not merely one who reads bitter lessons from the past, he is one who is prematurely disappointed in the future. -- Sidney J. Harris
Comments
It started out good with the chainsaw battle, but at the point you see the skeletons, I was seriously considering if I should just turn it off. The ending is kind of weird though.
Me and my dad were the only males in the entire theater. Even though i was only like 8 It was the first movie I ever slept through.
minority report (honestly only because i can remember the first 20 minutes or so, then i must have felt asleep)
dog soldiers (dunno, just crap)
wingcommander
black knight (thought great medieval movie, but its just crap)
reign of fire <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
dude you listed 3 of my DVD's there! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Dog soldiers - despite what anyone says it kicks serious bootay!
Black knight - i have always found ML hillarious... i dont know what your all on about!
reign of fire - this was an impulse buy after playing the game... it is an ok film to an extent...
its so low budget imo it could be good, like clerks... it got good scenes like "where is spoon?" "there is no spoon!" and that stuff, but all in all its just another b-movie!
black knight:
ok, i have to say i had other espectations so i was very disappointet... nevr saw it again...
reign of fire:
dunno, i just dont like it... they try so hard to get a plot, but fail imo...
its so low budget imo it could be good, like clerks... it got good scenes like "where is spoon?" "there is no spoon!" and that stuff, but all in all its just another b-movie!
black knight:
ok, i have to say i had other espectations so i was very disappointet... nevr saw it again...
reign of fire:
dunno, i just dont like it... they try so hard to get a plot, but fail imo... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dog soldiers is a great movie, it was realistic and prooved that low buget films can still be great. reign of fire was ok.
Again I'v seen so many bad films its awfull.
It started out good with the chainsaw battle, but at the point you see the skeletons, I was seriously considering if I should just turn it off. The ending is kind of weird though. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>HERETIC!</span></b>
YOU GO DIE NOW!
Ye he has!!! The Thing! A classic!
I would prolly have to say most of the Star Trek movies. Some of them were great but the majority are crap.
Actually, there is an even LARGER plot hole in Minority Report. I'll write it out now, so there are SPOILERS AHEAD.
Tom's character sees a future murder is going to commit. He knows nothing of the man who he will eventually murder. Tom only knows what he saw on the precog screen. He begins his search for this unknown future victim.
Tom's character begins his search, and finds out that the victim was the kidnapper of Tom's child.
Skip to the cliffhanger. Tom Cruise's character is pointing his weapon at the unknown victim, who has revealed himself to be a fake. The victim never really did steal anything. He is a poor man, and wants his life insurance money to go to his family. He has to be shown to be in an accident of some sort, so he wants Tom to kill him.
Tom tells him no, that he won't do it. He lowers his gun. The poor man, in a frantic decision, jumps out the window to his death.
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy.
So, when Tom decides to disobey what the vision foretold, and not kill the man, we get a MAJOR plot hole. IF Tom never kills the man, then there is no precog - meaning there is NO WAY he would have ever known about the guy in the first place! The only reason Tom killed the guy was because of the fact that he saw the precog. However, if he never kills the guy, then there is no precog. If there is no precog, there is no murder.
And yah what Dubs said. There's absolutely nothing wrong with minority report, it was a great film based on a very good short story and actually original so give it a break.
Also if you paid attention to some of the stuff they were talking about cause and effect you'd remember one of the issues was if someone saw the future could they change it.
Actually, there is an even LARGER plot hole in Minority Report. I'll write it out now, so there are SPOILERS AHEAD.
Tom's character sees a future murder is going to commit. He knows nothing of the man who he will eventually murder. Tom only knows what he saw on the precog screen. He begins his search for this unknown future victim.
Tom's character begins his search, and finds out that the victim was the kidnapper of Tom's child.
Skip to the cliffhanger. Tom Cruise's character is pointing his weapon at the unknown victim, who has revealed himself to be a fake. The victim never really did steal anything. He is a poor man, and wants his life insurance money to go to his family. He has to be shown to be in an accident of some sort, so he wants Tom to kill him.
Tom tells him no, that he won't do it. He lowers his gun. The poor man, in a frantic decision, jumps out the window to his death.
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy.
So, when Tom decides to disobey what the vision foretold, and not kill the man, we get a MAJOR plot hole. IF Tom never kills the man, then there is no precog - meaning there is NO WAY he would have ever known about the guy in the first place! The only reason Tom killed the guy was because of the fact that he saw the precog. However, if he never kills the guy, then there is no precog. If there is no precog, there is no murder.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, how it worked was, he was originally going to kill his child's supposed killer. He sees himself killing the guy and since he knows he's supposed to kill him, he doesn't. Once he finds the guy, he doesn't kill him, Crow shoots himself/forces John to pull the trigger.
I've got another plothole for you, though. How is he supposed to find and kill Crow the first time, when he doesn't have Agatha and the precog vision to guide him to Crow?
And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|
My least favorite movie of all time? Ghost Ship. God, that had to be the most horrible movie I've ever seen. I feel stupider every time I mention that movie. There's also a lot of other horror movies that are just horrible. (horr, <u>horr</u>or, <u>horr</u>ible?) Just Married was also teh crep.
In the beginning of the movie, the precogs find out about a murder around 1 hour before the man with the scissors kills his wife and her lover. Tom Cruise gets 3 days?! Even though he was planning to refrain from shooting the guy from the very start?
Premeditation has been stopped in that area. Therefore, the old man would have either never been able to set the guy up, or he would have been caught by the precogs.
And if you remember all murders the pre-cogs see are stopped, so no murder does not equal no pre-cog vision. The pre-cogs get a sense of events where someone is thinking about or planning to murder someone, remember when the detective questions Tom's character about the validity of the pre-cogs asking what if the murderer decided to not murder the victim at the last second. Basically the whole film centered around the fact they were essentially arresting people for crimes they did not commit on assumptions that they would commit them they were seemingly never wrong, Tom's case proved that they could be.
Pretty solid plot if you ask me.
As for the 1 hour vs 3 days thing: they explain that in the movie, sometimes the precogs see murders very early or nearly too late.
YOU GO DIE NOW!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Tiio+Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiio @ Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What!? Please tell me why you think this movie is so good, so I can understand why the people who dont like <b>Star Wars</b> and <b>The Lord of the Ring</b> can walk away without being flamed for their opinions?
To bring up another scene in the movie I dislike, is where he is haunted to overnight in the mill, and the small copies that comes out of the mirror tease him.
<a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0091499' target='_blank'><b>Maximum Overdrive</b></a>
Another bad movie, its about machines that comes to life.
YOU GO DIE NOW!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Tiio+Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Tiio @ Jun 6 2003, 07:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And to the guy that said Army of Darkness is bad, may you forever rot in the depths of Hades. :|<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What!? Please tell me why you think this movie is so good, so I can understand why the people who dont like <b>Star Wars</b> and <b>The Lord of the Ring</b> can walk away without being flamed for their opinions?
To bring up another scene in the movie I dislike, is where he is haunted to overnight in the mill, and the small copies that comes out of the mirror tease him.
<a href='http://us.imdb.com/Title?0091499' target='_blank'><b>Maximum Overdrive</b></a>
Another bad movie, its about machines that comes to life. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Cause the Lord of the Rings trilogy is god awful, Star Wars is lame with the exception of return of the jedi, and Army of Darkness owns.
And if you don't believe me you can say hello to my boomstick.
I would have to agree with that one <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
In the beginning of the movie, the precogs find out about a murder around 1 hour before the man with the scissors kills his wife and her lover. Tom Cruise gets 3 days?! Even though he was planning to refrain from shooting the guy from the very start?
Premeditation has been stopped in that area. Therefore, the old man would have either never been able to set the guy up, or he would have been caught by the precogs. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your getting it wrong again mate. He DID make the descision to kill Crowe and THAT is what the Pre Cogs picked up on only after a few moments before he was about to do it he realised what he was about to do. He lowers his gun the Crow grabs the gun effectively killing himself.
HE DID THINK ABOUT KILLING THE GUY AND THATS WHAT THE PRE COGS PICKED UP ON!!!! That was the whole basis of the pre-crime concept. The images were interpreted as a murder because he THOUGHT about killing him so the images when analysed appead to show Tom was gonna kill the dude. It doesn't matter one little bit that he pre decided he wasn't gonna kill the guy. That doesn't alter the fact that when he thought the guy was his sons killer he made a snap human decision to kill him.
Dude watch it again! Stop inventing plot holes.
Evil Dead II was golden
Evil Dead: Army of Darkness is a cult classic
Bruce Campbell suits the role of Ash SO well.
"Yeah. Alright you primitive screwheads, listen up. See this? This is my boomstick! It's a twelve gauge double barreled Remington, S-Mart's top-of-the-line. You can find this in the sporting goods department. That's right this sweet baby was made in Grand Rapids Michigan. Retails for about $109.95. It's got a walnut stock, cobalt blue steel and a hair trigger. That's right. Shop Smart. Shop S-mart. Ya got that?! Now I swear, the next one of you primates, even touches me... Ya!"
"Who the hell are you?!"
"Names Ash. Housewares"
"I'LL SWALLOW YOUR SOUL!"
"Come get some"
Voice over "Sure I could have stayed in the past. Could've been King, but in my own way I am king"
"Hail to the King baby"
"Clatu Verata N... N... it's an 'N' word. N... N... It's definitely an "N" word. Klatu Verata Nrmnphnfhr..."
"...so what's a few syllabyls?"
Oh, anaconda- Some stupid snake that eats people and once in a while regergitates them.
deep blue sea- some really smart sharks that just eat people and do mean things.
Star Trek any after the first one - sucks because they spend so much time around make believe science.
XXX, if you don't know why I envy you.
Ye he has!!! The Thing! A classic! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't forget Escape From New York!
You should really see it.
They recently made a game about The Thing. Official website: <a href='http://www.thethinggames.com' target='_blank'>www.thethinggames.com</a>.
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You my friend are missing out! The thing is a great film and it would't have been without Kurt Russel.
And yes Escape From New York is another classic. Why they remade it I will never know!
Snake: "No one draws until the can hits the ground" *throws the can* *rattattatat* kills all three guys *can hits the ground* Snake: "Draw."
BOOM. PLOT HOLE.
The only way Tom could have EVER known about this fake kidnapper (remember, he knew nothing of this man at the start) is because of the precog's vision. NOTHING but that precog vision gave Tom ANY clue to this guy's existance. Tom wouldn't EVER have gone looking for this guy. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
First of all, the gun did go off in the struggle, and then the man fell out the window. The precog vision did not show a struggle, however.
And the fact that the vision led him to the man isn't necessarily a plot hole. It's known as a self-fulfilling prophecy, and was used a lot in Greek mythology, and used to a lesser extent nowadays. Self-fulfilling prophecies are so much fun, if only because they make you think. Like the first Matrix movie, when the Oracle tells him not to worry about the vase. Telling him not to worry about it CAUSED him to break it. Self-fulfilling. Self-fulfilling prophecies are not plot holes, merely fun literary devices.
And just because the murder didn't happen doesn't mean the precog vision shouldn't have happened. Remember, the precogs only show what will probably happen. And the murder might have happened. But it would have been a crime of passion, not pre-mediatated, as implied by the "normal" ball and the 30-hour warning. And, again, if it was the suicide that was pre-meditated, why was Tom's character's name on the murderer's ball? I couldn't quite pick it out, but he removed his finger from the trigger when lowering the gun. I was under the impression that the "innocent guy" wedged his finger in the trigger lock in the struggle. Why wasn't the struggle shown in the pre-cog vision?
-Ryan!
A cynic is not merely one who reads bitter lessons from the past, he is one who is prematurely disappointed in the future.
-- Sidney J. Harris