so, people are saying (somewhere anyway) that shottie are too powerful.
people also say skulks are too good.
mariens need too much teamwork.
aliens are too easy to use.
farming is the only way to win.
...
i'll back up. i started playing halloween way back when. the day it was released. so, yea, maybe im biased about 1.04. but... i donno. i was one of those people who, SOMEHOW, still had fun winning or losing as both aliens or marines in 1.00. sure, it had problems. but people complained SO much. and i see a similar trend.
how is it that people are complaining about strategies that work?
dont get me wrong. some things ARE unfair. but i cant find ONE effective strat or decision or maneuver that ISNT being attacked (except for teamwork).
look at it this way: if youre losing, something is wrong. MAYBE its not the games fault.
i think that there were too many cahnges for v 2.0 the games seem to be longer and more tedious 3 hived aliens fall to a ha shottie rush which happened today at least twice to me <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> turrets are TOO acurate, i mean u blink tru a halway that has turrets and they hit u while blinking. i believe that the shootie should have a lower rate of fire because its like an auto shotgun. oc spikes are dodgable but hard to dodge, much like rine turrets fades use too much energy and ar more like a bigger badder skulk which can be killed with 2 shotgun hits at point blank range wich is practically the only way the fade can attack. i believe hmgs are fine and that lerks are fine. i just disagrree with all or most of the things wriiten here in my post
<!--QuoteBegin--Nevermore+Aug 9 2003, 01:39 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nevermore @ Aug 9 2003, 01:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> ok ok ok.
so, people are saying (somewhere anyway) that shottie are too powerful.
people also say skulks are too good.
mariens need too much teamwork.
aliens are too easy to use.
farming is the only way to win.
...
i'll back up. i started playing halloween way back when. the day it was released. so, yea, maybe im biased about 1.04. but... i donno. i was one of those people who, SOMEHOW, still had fun winning or losing as both aliens or marines in 1.00. sure, it had problems. but people complained SO much. and i see a similar trend.
how is it that people are complaining about strategies that work?
dont get me wrong. some things ARE unfair. but i cant find ONE effective strat or decision or maneuver that ISNT being attacked (except for teamwork).
look at it this way: if youre losing, something is wrong. MAYBE its not the games fault. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> My problem is not with the strategies, its with the lack of strategies. Each weapon/building/anything had a certain purpose. Sometimes JP's were better, sometimes HA was better, now JP's are the dumbest things to use unless the alien team is really too dumb to build a buncha OC's (newbies can't resist OC/Turret farming so its a rare occasion).
I think all aliens starting with 25 res is a bit overpowered.
Every alien in an 8-man team caps a node before marines even get their pants on. Soon, aliens have enough res to build sensories next to all of their RTs, then they all go skulk again with maybe one or two to stick back and build up additional hives.
Also, take a look at the prices of objects: A marine RT is 20res, electrify is 30 res. That's probably the best solution for early in the game and that's 50 res... come on, now. That's ridiculous. That means you can cap one RT, and get a IP/TF/few turrets up before you need to start waiting for res.
Aliens, on the other hand... 10 res to gorge, 15 res for a RT, 10 res for an o-chamber. You can gorge, build a RT, and an o-chamber in the time that it takes to build a RT and electrify it as a marine. Multiply this by a few gorges. By the time marines have enough to move out in a group, the gorges already have a few ochambers and a sensory up to keep the marines at bay with their LMGs. Then the game typically becomes a war over a single node; while marines might get that node, the time they spent doing it let every alien muster enough res to go Onos to crush them.
Solution: Make marine RTs cost like 10 res, and electrify cost 15.
<!--QuoteBegin--[FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed+Aug 9 2003, 01:52 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ([FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed @ Aug 9 2003, 01:52 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Sometimes JP's were better, sometimes HA was better, now JP's are the dumbest things to use unless the alien team is really too dumb to build a buncha OC's (newbies can't resist OC/Turret farming so its a rare occasion). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree, give a competent marine a jetpack and a shotty and he will completley own anything the alien team sends at him*, especially with the help of heavies. If there are no heavies, he just gets gangraped by lerks and onii. Main force of heavies and a couple of jps out front to shotty the onii before they eat your expensive HAs makes for a very good combonation.
*One at a time. If he gets two things on him without backup, kiss that 25 res goodbye.
i see youre point, JAW. im just saying, in general, anything that works "works too well". its a theme of this community. not inherently good or bad.
the fact of the matter is, as it has been for the 8-odd months of this games life, ANYTHING can happen.
i think people need to just go at it, rather than analyze everything. of course, thats how the system works. but i get a feeling people are putting criticisim first and the gameplay second.
hell, i'd like this game if it were a jazzed-up Battleship. so there's me weakness.
ah well. until all players reach contentment... "you sunk my battleship"
<!--QuoteBegin--Poofat+Aug 9 2003, 02:05 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Poofat @ Aug 9 2003, 02:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--[FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed+Aug 9 2003, 01:52 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ([FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed @ Aug 9 2003, 01:52 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Sometimes JP's were better, sometimes HA was better, now JP's are the dumbest things to use unless the alien team is really too dumb to build a buncha OC's (newbies can't resist OC/Turret farming so its a rare occasion). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree, give a competent marine a jetpack and a shotty and he will completley own anything the alien team sends at him*, especially with the help of heavies. If there are no heavies, he just gets gangraped by lerks and onii. Main force of heavies and a couple of jps out front to shotty the onii before they eat your expensive HAs makes for a very good combonation.
*One at a time. If he gets two things on him without backup, kiss that 25 res goodbye. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I was referring to 1.04. In 1.04 shotties weren't rapid fire machine guns with super damage, I used to like how shotties worked, instead of just fire psycotically at the first sign of an alien, you'd have to time the shot right for a 1 hit kill. I'd always stare the skulk down untill he realized I wasn't gonna shoot at him and he thought I was on crack, as soon as he got 3 feet away BOOM, instant kill. Now you can hand any newb a shottie and he'll do damage with it, not hard either at 10 res a pop.
In 1.04 there was a use for everything, different situations called for different strategies. Now its the same every game, turret farming till you get upgrades/HA/HMG/GL then attack. Or siege, thats about it. I've not seen JP's used for any purpose other than for the sake of fun. Noone ever combines JP's with HA's, or atleast not much, whats the point? Not hard to kill a marine without HA. I'm sure you've noticed the popularity of spores eh? Some lerks are so dumb they constantly shoot spores at HA's not knowing their immunity to it. Yet there are no different situations really. It's the same every game, now by the same I mean every alien team and every marine team has the same goal. Marines: Get some RT's, turrets in base for back up defense (almost necessary now...or so it seems), try to lock down hives, all this while waiting for enough money to get an HA train goin. Why give a guy a JP? When for slightly extra you can add another tank. How often do you ahve enough players, no no, COMPITENT players, to get a decent HA group going + jet packers? It's always around 4 HA's, and if you have 2 guys left who aren't guarding RT's or something, just suit them up with HA, why JP? HA will do more damage. OC's will drop a non HA in no time flat along with the help of aliens, but HA's can take hits and be endlessly welded, what can a normal marine do? He isn't gonna get welded easily flying around, all he can do is rely on HP spam, which is hard to do while flying anyway.
I've seen the same thing every game just about, not literally the same exact thing but, both teams have the same goals, whichever reaches theirs first wins.
As far as balance goes, it's quite balanced, but thats not the issue, we sacrifice game play for balance? Hah...I'd rather something be one sided than have this kind of "balance". 1.04 wasn't AS balanced, but it sure was a helluva lot funner, just had some easily fixable problems that coulda changed everything and made 1.0 even greater than it already was rather than trash it and give us something new (not 100% but pretty close).
I play Day of Defeat now....I've never been big on war games or death match games, always stuck to strategy, so let that be an example of how much the fun has gone.
Once gain, those few problems make it bad.
Oh I'll add number 5 to the list.
Everything is too fast!! I'm sick of max upgrades in 10 minutes. Yeesh.
So far, my experiences with 2.0 have been rather boring. Gone are the frantic 1.04 games, where seconds counted, where that one extra OC ment you lost to a JP rush, where that one lapse in communication lost a lockdown hive, only with the knowledge fades are coming soon to tear you a new one. Gone is the massively effective webbing. Gone are the close, exciting games.
My games of 2.0 have been slow, boring, and generally non-eventful. Instead of rushing a group of marines trying to build an outpost with a couple skulks, I'm forced to cloak and ambush, which usually means I get 1 bite on 1 marine, then get splattered against the wall in seconds. On marines, the gorges build SC and OCs at every corner, making it impossible to go anywhere unless you have EVERYONE with you with grenades and medpacks, or a seige. Every game I see the marines do the same thing, basicly turret marine start to hell and back, and somehow, get HMGs and just sit there all game. Once in awhile they leave base, and usually don't get much done. Fades...don't get me started, I don't even waste my res on them anymore, no acid=useless for me, I'd rather lerk and have a distance weapon at that point in the game.
Granted, I'm still looking for a GOOD server that has players who aren't as noobish as most I've been playing with are, but its still redicious.
a_civilianLikes seeing numbersJoin Date: 2003-01-08Member: 12041Members, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead
edited August 2003
<!--QuoteBegin--altairian+Aug 7 2003, 09:28 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (altairian @ Aug 7 2003, 09:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->But why is it that a group of skulks can run headlong in to a group of marines and win?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Because the disorganized marines unload their clips into each other's backs.
A LOT MORE FUN. IN ALL WAYS (save babblers, bless their souless souls).
It is also strategically several orders of magnitude more complex and multidimensional than 1.x ever had the capability of being - a simple product of the aliens having several opening strategies and numerous viable combos of evolutions.
1c destroys most of this, just like 1a ruined a lot of the fun, but I am really assuming these are just abberant ideas being thrown around. I really wish they'd stop yanking our chain and not attempt to discuss patch changes to a game that has barely had the chance to be burnt in the glare of mass public play... anyway...
<!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i'm really missing 1.04... playing alien on 2.0 is not that fun anymore and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteBegin--eggmac+Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eggmac @ Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i'm really missing 1.04... playing alien on 2.0 is not that fun anymore and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now
The....<i>guts</i> that some people have never fail to astound me.
Maybe I'm just too disgusted with this thread to write a full response, but here's my response all the same:
<b>Play the game</b>.
One who is as apparently as <i>smart</i> as you, Johnny, would fully realize that all things must change. When a certain mod such as NS is still in its infancy, finally walking on two feet, it is not finished. The first client patch that was released October 2002 was most assuredly <i>not</i> Flayra's complete vision. Remember this - the mod will take shape over time. it <b>will</b> change. Wait until the next client patch - I'm sure it will be even more different from 1.04 than what 2.0 is. To tell the complete truth, I was getting heavily disillusioned with 1.0X near the end, anyhow. When 2.0 was released, it thankfully revitalized my interest in NS and my utter trust in Flayra to create a great gaming experience.
In short : embrace change. Moving against change will only make you unhappy. Try to realize that 1.04 is <b>gone</b>. Yes, <b>gone</b>. Only by going along with the change will you ever be content-I can certainly guarantee you that much. Iif you are still stuck in a 1.04 mentality, you're gonna be out of luck rather soon when it's only a memory. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Make poor MonsE happy - keep the critical comments to yourselves and enjoy the ride <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Just one thing I want to say about skulks. They don't seem overpowered at all, just right actually. I've never played as marine and thought "OMG these skulks are so unfair"! It can be hard to get the LMG bullets onto the skulk properly, but if you line up the crosshair right, skulks can fall suprisingly fast.
Who says skulks are susposed to be sneaky little ****? They CAN be, but the idea is that a lone marine will have alot of difficulty with a lone skulk. Stealth and tactics should be reserved for situations where there is too much ground to cover, or there is several marines(or a marine with good upgrades or a better gun).
This vunerability to skulks is why marines can't travel alone.
<!--QuoteBegin--Daemonlaud+Aug 9 2003, 08:42 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Daemonlaud @ Aug 9 2003, 08:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I really really don't get it.
2.0 is just a lot more freaking fun.
A LOT MORE FUN. IN ALL WAYS (save babblers, bless their souless souls).
It is also strategically several orders of magnitude more complex and multidimensional than 1.x ever had the capability of being - a simple product of the aliens having several opening strategies and numerous viable combos of evolutions.
1c destroys most of this, just like 1a ruined a lot of the fun, but I am really assuming these are just abberant ideas being thrown around. I really wish they'd stop yanking our chain and not attempt to discuss patch changes to a game that has barely had the chance to be burnt in the glare of mass public play... anyway... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yet another person claiming there are more strategies available in 2.0, well I say they are less. Untill you can tell me multiple strategies for each race then you have no room to talk.
Anyone can walk in and say "there's more strategies with 2.0", yet noone is willing to back that.
What strategies can aliens do? They don't need strategies, few occassions do they actually need team work.
Marines? HA's/Shotties/GL/HMG. Name another, don't mention jet packs, we all know 2 OC's drops a JP'er in no time flat. All a JP is good for now is getting into certain vents, like red room outside of viaduct on ns_nothing.
Please, name more than 2-3 strategies for each race, I dare ya. And don't make up stupid strategies that noone in their right mind would use. You could say "welder rush", cause that is, technically, a strategy, but not one anyone would use. I'm talking real strategies.
It is ALOT LESS FUN. See, you either dind't play 1.04 often enough, or you sucked (not to diss) too much at it to enjoy the quality of 1.04's game play. Anyone I know who has skill, any decent player whos played 1.04 long enough agrees with me. So far I've seen few skilled players like 2.0, the ones that like it are newbies, who like just about anything. You can't argue that either, its not hard to please a newb. They see marines vs aliens with big guns and whoop dee doo they have a good time.
Its like using dial up for so long, you don't really care, up untill you get cable modem or DSL, then there's no going back. Same with this. The majority of people who like 2.0 never got to play 1.04 enough, or maybe not with any good teams. I feel sorry for the ones who didn't get to play 1.04 on a good server with good players and realize its true potential.
<!--QuoteBegin--lazygamer+Aug 9 2003, 11:33 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (lazygamer @ Aug 9 2003, 11:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Who says skulks are susposed to be sneaky little ****? They CAN be, but the idea is that a lone marine will have alot of difficulty with a lone skulk. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Flayra said it, you know flayra, the guy who created the game? I can't prove this, but someone quoted Flayra about it before, feel free to correct me if I"m wrong, but the original intent is somewhat like Aliens vs Predator, the aliens are supposed to have deadly attacks but be quite weak, requiring them to sneak instead of charge into battle.
A lone marine should be able to drop atleast 2 skulks if he has good aim. That is, if the skulks don't have cara, also varies depending on upgrades. Skulks aren't supposed to be an equal match for marines. It's supposed to be, skulks who charge in don't get much done against good marines, thats how it should be, they should require a small bit of brain power and tactical skill to get anything done with the FIRST LEVEL ALIEN. That's how it should be, unskilled skulks should get dropped like flies aginst a skilled marine. Thats how it was in 1.04, only it was a bit too easy to see skulks and it only took 8 bullets to kill them without carapace. If you put skulks at an equal level as marines, then what are fades? A higher level than skulks, so if skulks are equal, than fades are far superior, then Onos.....*sigh*. The point is, its so easy to get fades/onos if the alien team knows how to play, its so entirely easy that they hardly use skulks anymore unless they're dumb enough to keep getting killed. Early game has skulks and lots of them, they're not supposed to own the marines.
<!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 09:38 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 09:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--eggmac+Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eggmac @ Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i'm really missing 1.04... playing alien on 2.0 is not that fun anymore and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> He means in non public games, or public games with lotsa very skilled regulars heh. It's actually true, its the exact same problem in 1.04, 2.0 didn't bring balance, it just nerfed things that were fun to use and changed alot. It's like re-arranging your living room, didn't even add a big screen TV, just moved things around and got rid of some things *cough* jet packs *cough*.
Same situation as 1.04, skilled marines always own aliens, public games = alien domination. Balance nothing.
<!--QuoteBegin--[FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed+Aug 9 2003, 12:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ([FoD]JohnnyAppleWeed @ Aug 9 2003, 12:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 09:38 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 09:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--eggmac+Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (eggmac @ Aug 9 2003, 09:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--JuNgLiSt+Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (JuNgLiSt @ Aug 9 2003, 04:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i'm really missing 1.04... playing alien on 2.0 is not that fun anymore and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> He means in non public games, or public games with lotsa very skilled regulars heh. It's actually true, its the exact same problem in 1.04, 2.0 didn't bring balance, it just nerfed things that were fun to use and changed alot. It's like re-arranging your living room, didn't even add a big screen TV, just moved things around and got rid of some things *cough* jet packs *cough*.
Same situation as 1.04, skilled marines always own aliens, public games = alien domination. Balance nothing. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Agreed. Comms are going to learn soon now that shotgun rushes smash ANYTHING in your way. They're going to learn to use mines and scatter them around hives so you die as soon as you spawn. Right now I see nothing but n00bs on the marine team, and we usually win because they're so disorganized. But when the marine team is organized, the games are either losses, or very long and drawn out.
2.0, like 1.04 is still looks like a beta. dunno what happened to all that testing time.
i hoped for a balanced great game to compete on, but the changes been made are only, well, stupid. aliens r weak? ok, givem power, ow now aliens can win once or twice and ppl cant kill onos, lets make aliens totally weak again.
doh. ns looks like will stay beta 4ever, 2.0 made too much hype for it to die, most ppl that used to play here on brazil r giving it up, getting tired of lame **** changelog.
well, maybe ns 3.0 will come up, who knows. till then, good luck, and good bye.
One who is as apparently as <i>smart</i> as you, Johnny, would fully realize that all things must change. When a certain mod such as NS is still in its infancy, finally walking on two feet, it is not finished. The first client patch that was released October 2002 was most assuredly <i>not</i> Flayra's complete vision. Remember this - the mod will take shape over time. it <b>will</b> change. Wait until the next client patch - I'm sure it will be even more different from 1.04 than what 2.0 is. To tell the complete truth, I was getting heavily disillusioned with 1.0X near the end, anyhow. When 2.0 was released, it thankfully revitalized my interest in NS and my utter trust in Flayra to create a great gaming experience.
In short : embrace change. Moving against change will only make you unhappy. Try to realize that 1.04 is <b>gone</b>. Yes, <b>gone</b>. Only by going along with the change will you ever be content-I can certainly guarantee you that much. Iif you are still stuck in a 1.04 mentality, you're gonna be out of luck rather soon when it's only a memory. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Again, again and again people like you show up saying stupid things like this. Do you even read my posts? Honostly? I welcome change, but just cause something changed doesn't mean its better. My car changed, it got a flat tire, better change or worse change? 2 + 2 = 4
I've played the game, well over 80 games now since 2.0. And no, they're not all with newbies either, when I finally get into my regular server with skilled people marines dominate easily even against skilled aliens. In the other public newb games aliens dominate every game. Don't tell me to play the game, I've played it, probably more than you. What makes you think I would dare degrade the game before I play it? What kind of moron do you take me for? Don't assume. Assumptions get people nowhere.
I love change, I wanted 2.0 so bad, but it brought <b> bad change </b> in alot of ways, (yes there is a such thing as bad change). Alot of good things, but alot of unnecessary things. There were a hand ful of problems with 1.04 that could have easily been changed rather than changing EVERYTHING for the fun of it. They changed things that didn't need changing. Who asked for shorter games? They always said how games will last about 10 minutes because you can fully tech in that time. Who wants that ? Now now I know I'm not paying for it so I don't have the right to get mad over it, they don't owe me anything, I know. But still, they had such a great game, it was so popular and they went and risked losing alot of that popularity by making SO many drastic changes.
"IF IT AINT BROKE, DONT FIX IT" I've already said it. There was no point in trying to make games last 10 minutes, THEY LASTED 2 MINUTES IN 1.04 SOMETIMES. In 1.04 games lasted anywhere from 2-100 minutes (really not often that it got up to or past 100 but I'm not gonna lie), it all depended on the team. Now in their pathetic attempt to shorten games they've made them last forever in onos vs turret games. Once again, another case of Flayra using only skilled clan players to test the game and completely forgot that newbies existed.
There are ALOT more newbies than pros out there yet they chose to base the game around pro play, odd isn't it?
Do me a favor, if you ever post again, leave the assumptions out of it, read my posts first.
- Remove res-for-kills from the marine team, and water it down for the alien team. I have a variety of reasons I'm too lazy to type out. If you insist, I'll list them.
- Beef fades.
- Nerf shotguns. It should do more damage the less armor you have. Armor absorption should absorb almost all of the damage. This would make shotguns useful for what they SHOULD be used for: A cheap, effective counter to skulks and lerks.
- Slightly up HMG damage, though this might not be needed. HMGs are a rare sight.
That_Annoying_KidSire of TitlesJoin Date: 2003-03-01Member: 14175Members, Constellation
edited August 2003
I'm going to make like MonsE and not make balance posts until I've played 2.0 till I'm sick of it (damn, no balance posts for me) <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<span style='color:green'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>go play 2.0 instead of posting about how it needs changes</span></span> <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
2.0 has brought a ton of new sounds, improvements, new weapons and it just generally makes NS a much more professional looking game
<!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> threads like these make baby onos cry
[edit] changed font colors to look shnazy and made a point clearer [/edit]
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
Fades are ok as they are. They can be used at a distraction so your skulks can eat some intruders, they can quickly teleport out of the battle and regenerate. HMGs are NOT a rare sight, they are the most effective larger alien killer, if you give them more dmg, the bigger aliens wont have a chance
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
edited August 2003
<!--QuoteBegin--That Annoying Kid+Aug 9 2003, 01:18 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (That Annoying Kid @ Aug 9 2003, 01:18 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I'm going to make like MonsE and not make balance posts until I've played 2.0 till I'm sick of it (damn, no balance posts for me)
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:green'>go play 2.0 instead of posting about how it needs changes</span></span> <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
2.0 has brought a ton of new sounds, improvements, new weapons and it just generally makes NS a much more professional looking game
threads like these make baby onos cry <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Both server statistic and Flayra doenst lie, and if you're sick of them you dont have to read them.
/Edit, changed colour of the quote (and no, I'm not agreeing with you).
That_Annoying_KidSire of TitlesJoin Date: 2003-03-01Member: 14175Members, Constellation
I'm confused, are you agreeing with what I said?
gah, I hate being a newbie <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Epidemic+Aug 9 2003, 01:21 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Epidemic @ Aug 9 2003, 01:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Fades are ok as they are. They can be used at a distraction so your skulks can eat some intruders, they can quickly teleport out of the battle and regenerate. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> A 50 res distraction? I'd rather go gorge and poke at resource nodes as a distraction...
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Monkeybonk+Aug 9 2003, 01:46 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Monkeybonk @ Aug 9 2003, 01:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Epidemic+Aug 9 2003, 01:21 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Epidemic @ Aug 9 2003, 01:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Fades are ok as they are. They can be used at a distraction so your skulks can eat some intruders, they can quickly teleport out of the battle and regenerate. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> A 50 res distraction? I'd rather go gorge and poke at resource nodes as a distraction... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It's not only a distraction, and it's teamplay, 50 res for a movable distraction is quite okay
Comments
so, people are saying (somewhere anyway) that shottie are too powerful.
people also say skulks are too good.
mariens need too much teamwork.
aliens are too easy to use.
farming is the only way to win.
...
i'll back up. i started playing halloween way back when. the day it was released. so, yea, maybe im biased about 1.04. but... i donno. i was one of those people who, SOMEHOW, still had fun winning or losing as both aliens or marines in 1.00. sure, it had problems. but people complained SO much. and i see a similar trend.
how is it that people are complaining about strategies that work?
dont get me wrong. some things ARE unfair. but i cant find ONE effective strat or decision or maneuver that ISNT being attacked (except for teamwork).
look at it this way: if youre losing, something is wrong. MAYBE its not the games fault.
<!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> > <!--emo&::fade::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'><!--endemo-->
so, people are saying (somewhere anyway) that shottie are too powerful.
people also say skulks are too good.
mariens need too much teamwork.
aliens are too easy to use.
farming is the only way to win.
...
i'll back up. i started playing halloween way back when. the day it was released. so, yea, maybe im biased about 1.04. but... i donno. i was one of those people who, SOMEHOW, still had fun winning or losing as both aliens or marines in 1.00. sure, it had problems. but people complained SO much. and i see a similar trend.
how is it that people are complaining about strategies that work?
dont get me wrong. some things ARE unfair. but i cant find ONE effective strat or decision or maneuver that ISNT being attacked (except for teamwork).
look at it this way: if youre losing, something is wrong. MAYBE its not the games fault. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
My problem is not with the strategies, its with the lack of strategies. Each weapon/building/anything had a certain purpose. Sometimes JP's were better, sometimes HA was better, now JP's are the dumbest things to use unless the alien team is really too dumb to build a buncha OC's (newbies can't resist OC/Turret farming so its a rare occasion).
Every alien in an 8-man team caps a node before marines even get their pants on. Soon, aliens have enough res to build sensories next to all of their RTs, then they all go skulk again with maybe one or two to stick back and build up additional hives.
Also, take a look at the prices of objects:
A marine RT is 20res, electrify is 30 res. That's probably the best solution for early in the game and that's 50 res... come on, now. That's ridiculous. That means you can cap one RT, and get a IP/TF/few turrets up before you need to start waiting for res.
Aliens, on the other hand...
10 res to gorge, 15 res for a RT, 10 res for an o-chamber. You can gorge, build a RT, and an o-chamber in the time that it takes to build a RT and electrify it as a marine. Multiply this by a few gorges. By the time marines have enough to move out in a group, the gorges already have a few ochambers and a sensory up to keep the marines at bay with their LMGs. Then the game typically becomes a war over a single node; while marines might get that node, the time they spent doing it let every alien muster enough res to go Onos to crush them.
Solution: Make marine RTs cost like 10 res, and electrify cost 15.
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I disagree, give a competent marine a jetpack and a shotty and he will completley own anything the alien team sends at him*, especially with the help of heavies. If there are no heavies, he just gets gangraped by lerks and onii. Main force of heavies and a couple of jps out front to shotty the onii before they eat your expensive HAs makes for a very good combonation.
*One at a time. If he gets two things on him without backup, kiss that 25 res goodbye.
the fact of the matter is, as it has been for the 8-odd months of this games life, ANYTHING can happen.
i think people need to just go at it, rather than analyze everything. of course, thats how the system works. but i get a feeling people are putting criticisim first and the gameplay second.
hell, i'd like this game if it were a jazzed-up Battleship. so there's me weakness.
ah well. until all players reach contentment...
"you sunk my battleship"
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I disagree, give a competent marine a jetpack and a shotty and he will completley own anything the alien team sends at him*, especially with the help of heavies. If there are no heavies, he just gets gangraped by lerks and onii. Main force of heavies and a couple of jps out front to shotty the onii before they eat your expensive HAs makes for a very good combonation.
*One at a time. If he gets two things on him without backup, kiss that 25 res goodbye. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I was referring to 1.04. In 1.04 shotties weren't rapid fire machine guns with super damage, I used to like how shotties worked, instead of just fire psycotically at the first sign of an alien, you'd have to time the shot right for a 1 hit kill. I'd always stare the skulk down untill he realized I wasn't gonna shoot at him and he thought I was on crack, as soon as he got 3 feet away BOOM, instant kill. Now you can hand any newb a shottie and he'll do damage with it, not hard either at 10 res a pop.
In 1.04 there was a use for everything, different situations called for different strategies. Now its the same every game, turret farming till you get upgrades/HA/HMG/GL then attack. Or siege, thats about it. I've not seen JP's used for any purpose other than for the sake of fun. Noone ever combines JP's with HA's, or atleast not much, whats the point? Not hard to kill a marine without HA. I'm sure you've noticed the popularity of spores eh? Some lerks are so dumb they constantly shoot spores at HA's not knowing their immunity to it. Yet there are no different situations really. It's the same every game, now by the same I mean every alien team and every marine team has the same goal. Marines: Get some RT's, turrets in base for back up defense (almost necessary now...or so it seems), try to lock down hives, all this while waiting for enough money to get an HA train goin. Why give a guy a JP? When for slightly extra you can add another tank. How often do you ahve enough players, no no, COMPITENT players, to get a decent HA group going + jet packers? It's always around 4 HA's, and if you have 2 guys left who aren't guarding RT's or something, just suit them up with HA, why JP? HA will do more damage. OC's will drop a non HA in no time flat along with the help of aliens, but HA's can take hits and be endlessly welded, what can a normal marine do? He isn't gonna get welded easily flying around, all he can do is rely on HP spam, which is hard to do while flying anyway.
I've seen the same thing every game just about, not literally the same exact thing but, both teams have the same goals, whichever reaches theirs first wins.
As far as balance goes, it's quite balanced, but thats not the issue, we sacrifice game play for balance? Hah...I'd rather something be one sided than have this kind of "balance". 1.04 wasn't AS balanced, but it sure was a helluva lot funner, just had some easily fixable problems that coulda changed everything and made 1.0 even greater than it already was rather than trash it and give us something new (not 100% but pretty close).
I play Day of Defeat now....I've never been big on war games or death match games, always stuck to strategy, so let that be an example of how much the fun has gone.
Once gain, those few problems make it bad.
Oh I'll add number 5 to the list.
Everything is too fast!! I'm sick of max upgrades in 10 minutes. Yeesh.
We all just need to get used to it, but JPs do suck now and turets + ocs are abit to accurate.
You use leap past a turet and it still hits you down about 10/15hp.
My games of 2.0 have been slow, boring, and generally non-eventful. Instead of rushing a group of marines trying to build an outpost with a couple skulks, I'm forced to cloak and ambush, which usually means I get 1 bite on 1 marine, then get splattered against the wall in seconds. On marines, the gorges build SC and OCs at every corner, making it impossible to go anywhere unless you have EVERYONE with you with grenades and medpacks, or a seige. Every game I see the marines do the same thing, basicly turret marine start to hell and back, and somehow, get HMGs and just sit there all game. Once in awhile they leave base, and usually don't get much done. Fades...don't get me started, I don't even waste my res on them anymore, no acid=useless for me, I'd rather lerk and have a distance weapon at that point in the game.
Granted, I'm still looking for a GOOD server that has players who aren't as noobish as most I've been playing with are, but its still redicious.
The more I play 2.0, the more I want 1.04 back.
Because the disorganized marines unload their clips into each other's backs.
2.0 is just a lot more freaking fun.
A LOT MORE FUN. IN ALL WAYS (save babblers, bless their souless souls).
It is also strategically several orders of magnitude more complex and multidimensional than 1.x ever had the capability of being - a simple product of the aliens having several opening strategies and numerous viable combos of evolutions.
1c destroys most of this, just like 1a ruined a lot of the fun, but I am really assuming these are just abberant ideas being thrown around. I really wish they'd stop yanking our chain and not attempt to discuss patch changes to a game that has barely had the chance to be burnt in the glare of mass public play...
anyway...
and marines are extremely overpowered
here in Brasil the thing is going down, you guys have to do something to bring back the "funny thing" that 1.04 has
and marines are extremely overpowered
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hahah, comedy gold!
and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now
The....<i>guts</i> that some people have never fail to astound me.
Maybe I'm just too disgusted with this thread to write a full response, but here's my response all the same:
<b>Play the game</b>.
One who is as apparently as <i>smart</i> as you, Johnny, would fully realize that all things must change. When a certain mod such as NS is still in its infancy, finally walking on two feet, it is not finished. The first client patch that was released October 2002 was most assuredly <i>not</i> Flayra's complete vision. Remember this - the mod will take shape over time. it <b>will</b> change. Wait until the next client patch - I'm sure it will be even more different from 1.04 than what 2.0 is. To tell the complete truth, I was getting heavily disillusioned with 1.0X near the end, anyhow. When 2.0 was released, it thankfully revitalized my interest in NS and my utter trust in Flayra to create a great gaming experience.
In short : embrace change. Moving against change will only make you unhappy. Try to realize that 1.04 is <b>gone</b>. Yes, <b>gone</b>. Only by going along with the change will you ever be content-I can certainly guarantee you that much. Iif you are still stuck in a 1.04 mentality, you're gonna be out of luck rather soon when it's only a memory. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Make poor MonsE happy - keep the critical comments to yourselves and enjoy the ride <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Who says skulks are susposed to be sneaky little ****? They CAN be, but the idea is that a lone marine will have alot of difficulty with a lone skulk. Stealth and tactics should be reserved for situations where there is too much ground to cover, or there is several marines(or a marine with good upgrades or a better gun).
This vunerability to skulks is why marines can't travel alone.
2.0 is just a lot more freaking fun.
A LOT MORE FUN. IN ALL WAYS (save babblers, bless their souless souls).
It is also strategically several orders of magnitude more complex and multidimensional than 1.x ever had the capability of being - a simple product of the aliens having several opening strategies and numerous viable combos of evolutions.
1c destroys most of this, just like 1a ruined a lot of the fun, but I am really assuming these are just abberant ideas being thrown around. I really wish they'd stop yanking our chain and not attempt to discuss patch changes to a game that has barely had the chance to be burnt in the glare of mass public play...
anyway... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yet another person claiming there are more strategies available in 2.0, well I say they are less. Untill you can tell me multiple strategies for each race then you have no room to talk.
Anyone can walk in and say "there's more strategies with 2.0", yet noone is willing to back that.
What strategies can aliens do? They don't need strategies, few occassions do they actually need team work.
Marines? HA's/Shotties/GL/HMG. Name another, don't mention jet packs, we all know 2 OC's drops a JP'er in no time flat. All a JP is good for now is getting into certain vents, like red room outside of viaduct on ns_nothing.
Please, name more than 2-3 strategies for each race, I dare ya. And don't make up stupid strategies that noone in their right mind would use. You could say "welder rush", cause that is, technically, a strategy, but not one anyone would use. I'm talking real strategies.
It is ALOT LESS FUN. See, you either dind't play 1.04 often enough, or you sucked (not to diss) too much at it to enjoy the quality of 1.04's game play. Anyone I know who has skill, any decent player whos played 1.04 long enough agrees with me. So far I've seen few skilled players like 2.0, the ones that like it are newbies, who like just about anything. You can't argue that either, its not hard to please a newb. They see marines vs aliens with big guns and whoop dee doo they have a good time.
Its like using dial up for so long, you don't really care, up untill you get cable modem or DSL, then there's no going back. Same with this. The majority of people who like 2.0 never got to play 1.04 enough, or maybe not with any good teams. I feel sorry for the ones who didn't get to play 1.04 on a good server with good players and realize its true potential.
Some people are easy to please.
Who says skulks are susposed to be sneaky little ****? They CAN be, but the idea is that a lone marine will have alot of difficulty with a lone skulk.
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Flayra said it, you know flayra, the guy who created the game? I can't prove this, but someone quoted Flayra about it before, feel free to correct me if I"m wrong, but the original intent is somewhat like Aliens vs Predator, the aliens are supposed to have deadly attacks but be quite weak, requiring them to sneak instead of charge into battle.
A lone marine should be able to drop atleast 2 skulks if he has good aim. That is, if the skulks don't have cara, also varies depending on upgrades. Skulks aren't supposed to be an equal match for marines. It's supposed to be, skulks who charge in don't get much done against good marines, thats how it should be, they should require a small bit of brain power and tactical skill to get anything done with the FIRST LEVEL ALIEN. That's how it should be, unskilled skulks should get dropped like flies aginst a skilled marine. Thats how it was in 1.04, only it was a bit too easy to see skulks and it only took 8 bullets to kill them without carapace. If you put skulks at an equal level as marines, then what are fades? A higher level than skulks, so if skulks are equal, than fades are far superior, then Onos.....*sigh*. The point is, its so easy to get fades/onos if the alien team knows how to play, its so entirely easy that they hardly use skulks anymore unless they're dumb enough to keep getting killed. Early game has skulks and lots of them, they're not supposed to own the marines.
and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
He means in non public games, or public games with lotsa very skilled regulars heh. It's actually true, its the exact same problem in 1.04, 2.0 didn't bring balance, it just nerfed things that were fun to use and changed alot. It's like re-arranging your living room, didn't even add a big screen TV, just moved things around and got rid of some things *cough* jet packs *cough*.
Same situation as 1.04, skilled marines always own aliens, public games = alien domination. Balance nothing.
and marines are extremely overpowered
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
hahah, comedy gold! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
why? if the comms that you're playing with are weak, it's not my fault... a good comm can beat the aliens very easily now <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He means in non public games, or public games with lotsa very skilled regulars heh. It's actually true, its the exact same problem in 1.04, 2.0 didn't bring balance, it just nerfed things that were fun to use and changed alot. It's like re-arranging your living room, didn't even add a big screen TV, just moved things around and got rid of some things *cough* jet packs *cough*.
Same situation as 1.04, skilled marines always own aliens, public games = alien domination. Balance nothing. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed. Comms are going to learn soon now that shotgun rushes smash ANYTHING in your way. They're going to learn to use mines and scatter them around hives so you die as soon as you spawn. Right now I see nothing but n00bs on the marine team, and we usually win because they're so disorganized. But when the marine team is organized, the games are either losses, or very long and drawn out.
2.0, like 1.04 is still looks like a beta. dunno what happened to all that testing time.
i hoped for a balanced great game to compete on, but the changes been made are only, well, stupid. aliens r weak? ok, givem power, ow now aliens can win once or twice and ppl cant kill onos, lets make aliens totally weak again.
doh. ns looks like will stay beta 4ever, 2.0 made too much hype for it to die, most ppl that used to play here on brazil r giving it up, getting tired of lame **** changelog.
well, maybe ns 3.0 will come up, who knows. till then, good luck, and good bye.
<b>Play the game</b>.
One who is as apparently as <i>smart</i> as you, Johnny, would fully realize that all things must change. When a certain mod such as NS is still in its infancy, finally walking on two feet, it is not finished. The first client patch that was released October 2002 was most assuredly <i>not</i> Flayra's complete vision. Remember this - the mod will take shape over time. it <b>will</b> change. Wait until the next client patch - I'm sure it will be even more different from 1.04 than what 2.0 is. To tell the complete truth, I was getting heavily disillusioned with 1.0X near the end, anyhow. When 2.0 was released, it thankfully revitalized my interest in NS and my utter trust in Flayra to create a great gaming experience.
In short : embrace change. Moving against change will only make you unhappy. Try to realize that 1.04 is <b>gone</b>. Yes, <b>gone</b>. Only by going along with the change will you ever be content-I can certainly guarantee you that much. Iif you are still stuck in a 1.04 mentality, you're gonna be out of luck rather soon when it's only a memory. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
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Again, again and again people like you show up saying stupid things like this. Do you even read my posts? Honostly? I welcome change, but just cause something changed doesn't mean its better. My car changed, it got a flat tire, better change or worse change? 2 + 2 = 4
I've played the game, well over 80 games now since 2.0. And no, they're not all with newbies either, when I finally get into my regular server with skilled people marines dominate easily even against skilled aliens. In the other public newb games aliens dominate every game. Don't tell me to play the game, I've played it, probably more than you. What makes you think I would dare degrade the game before I play it? What kind of moron do you take me for? Don't assume. Assumptions get people nowhere.
I love change, I wanted 2.0 so bad, but it brought <b> bad change </b> in alot of ways, (yes there is a such thing as bad change). Alot of good things, but alot of unnecessary things. There were a hand ful of problems with 1.04 that could have easily been changed rather than changing EVERYTHING for the fun of it. They changed things that didn't need changing. Who asked for shorter games? They always said how games will last about 10 minutes because you can fully tech in that time. Who wants that ? Now now I know I'm not paying for it so I don't have the right to get mad over it, they don't owe me anything, I know. But still, they had such a great game, it was so popular and they went and risked losing alot of that popularity by making SO many drastic changes.
"IF IT AINT BROKE, DONT FIX IT" I've already said it. There was no point in trying to make games last 10 minutes, THEY LASTED 2 MINUTES IN 1.04 SOMETIMES. In 1.04 games lasted anywhere from 2-100 minutes (really not often that it got up to or past 100 but I'm not gonna lie), it all depended on the team. Now in their pathetic attempt to shorten games they've made them last forever in onos vs turret games. Once again, another case of Flayra using only skilled clan players to test the game and completely forgot that newbies existed.
There are ALOT more newbies than pros out there yet they chose to base the game around pro play, odd isn't it?
Do me a favor, if you ever post again, leave the assumptions out of it, read my posts first.
- Beef fades.
- Nerf shotguns. It should do more damage the less armor you have. Armor absorption should absorb almost all of the damage. This would make shotguns useful for what they SHOULD be used for: A cheap, effective counter to skulks and lerks.
- Slightly up HMG damage, though this might not be needed. HMGs are a rare sight.
<span style='color:green'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>go play 2.0 instead of posting about how it needs changes</span></span> <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
2.0 has brought a ton of new sounds, improvements, new weapons and it just generally makes NS a much more professional looking game
<!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
threads like these make baby onos cry
[edit]
changed font colors to look shnazy and made a point clearer
[/edit]
HMGs are NOT a rare sight, they are the most effective larger alien killer, if you give them more dmg, the bigger aliens wont have a chance
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:green'>go play 2.0 instead of posting about how it needs changes</span></span> <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
2.0 has brought a ton of new sounds, improvements, new weapons and it just generally makes NS a much more professional looking game
<!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
threads like these make baby onos cry <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Both server statistic and Flayra doenst lie, and if you're sick of them you dont have to read them.
/Edit, changed colour of the quote (and no, I'm not agreeing with you).
gah, I hate being a newbie <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
A 50 res distraction? I'd rather go gorge and poke at resource nodes as a distraction...
A 50 res distraction? I'd rather go gorge and poke at resource nodes as a distraction... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not only a distraction, and it's teamplay, 50 res for a movable distraction is quite okay