EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
<!--quoteo(post=1599594:date=Jan 17 2007, 06:52 AM:name=DiscoZombie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DiscoZombie @ Jan 17 2007, 06:52 AM) [snapback]1599594[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I like how blizzard acknowleges the fact that female humans, and humans in general, are the generic class, and bimbos - all the jokes are generic bad jokes, all the flirts are bimbo flirts or bad pick-up lines... <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
C'mon, stuff like "why does everyone automatically assume I know <i>tailoring</i> <b>and</b> cooking" is good stuff.
My main character is male. All of my alts are female. If you're going to spend your whole day gawking at an avatar it may as well be somewhat pleasing to the eye.
LikuI, am the Somberlain.Join Date: 2003-01-10Member: 12128Members
<!--quoteo(post=1599689:date=Jan 17 2007, 06:55 PM:name=Scythe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Scythe @ Jan 17 2007, 06:55 PM) [snapback]1599689[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> These things emit this unearthly howl as they stomp around, shaking the ground as they walk. Very very cool.
--Scythe-- <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ever play Shadow of the Colossus?
<!--quoteo(post=1599695:date=Jan 17 2007, 09:09 PM:name=emperor_awesome)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(emperor_awesome @ Jan 17 2007, 09:09 PM) [snapback]1599695[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> It looks like they've fired all of their mappers. Silithus v2.0 anyone? <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What game are YOU talking about? All I see is really awesome stuff.
<!--quoteo(post=1599701:date=Jan 17 2007, 08:28 PM:name=Omegaman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Omegaman @ Jan 17 2007, 08:28 PM) [snapback]1599701[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> What game are YOU talking about? All I see is really awesome stuff.
Edit: Tycho, tell that to Galactus. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are saying outlands isn't a big flat plain like those pictures show?
<!--quoteo(post=1599702:date=Jan 18 2007, 01:31 AM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xyth @ Jan 18 2007, 01:31 AM) [snapback]1599702[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> You are saying outlands isn't a big flat plain like those pictures show? <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes, seeing as each picture has at least a slope to it...
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Isn't the barrent the same? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
I see hills!
And another thing, GET THIS OF MY INTERNET BEFORE I GO OUT AND GET IT <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1599704:date=Jan 17 2007, 08:34 PM:name=Aldaris)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Aldaris @ Jan 17 2007, 08:34 PM) [snapback]1599704[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Yes, seeing as each picture has at least a slope to it... <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it.
Edit: And barrens is not really he same. Walk around the barrens, there is alot of attention to details. Such as the oasises and random ponds/ destroyed houses and stuff.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Still the "mapping" for wow, kind of consists of these generated terrains, with prefab models, with different skins <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1599714:date=Jan 17 2007, 08:56 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kouji_San @ Jan 17 2007, 08:56 PM) [snapback]1599714[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Still the "mapping" for wow, kind of consists of these generated terrains, with prefab models, with different skins <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
models and skinning would be the bigger job... <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
True, but that's not an excuse to turn out piss-poor work like outlands. Terrain may be randomly generated for the most part (Understandable, mapping that much area would take a long time) but they could have done something to make it not so damned obvious. Take a look at an area like thunderbluff or westfall. Is alot of the terrain stuff randomly generated? Yeah. Does it look as butt ugly as outlands and silithus? No.
<!--quoteo(post=1599710:date=Jan 18 2007, 01:51 AM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xyth @ Jan 18 2007, 01:51 AM) [snapback]1599710[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm not a mapper, so those terms mean little to me, but simply, you asked if it was flat, which it isn't. If you meant detail, there are a number of destroyed towers and siege weapons more towards the portal. There are scars full of green, er, stuff. There's a massive red crystal jutting out of the ground. Hellfire penisula has detail. Why are you making assumptions about how the rest of out Outlands looks like, off of just 3 pictures from <i>one</i> zone.
In regards to the 'mapping' I mean uh mapping. I would say it does look half-arsed, but well, when you got to create an entire continent, put some areas in for grinding on mobs for those who wish to etc. you will find there is a need for some open areas of terrain which are purposely implemented. Also it could well fit in with the backstory "eg. Desolate war torn land", it's not exactly going to have a civilization of cities and towns and tribes all close together with no open spaces being war torn is it?
That wasn't what he said. The textures and randomly generated terrain CAN look nice for WoW, but these don't, so they've really lowered the bar to get it out the door on time.
QuaunautThe longest seven days in history...Join Date: 2003-03-21Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
edited January 2007
<!--quoteo(post=1599717:date=Jan 17 2007, 06:03 PM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xyth @ Jan 17 2007, 06:03 PM) [snapback]1599717[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> True, but that's not an excuse to turn out piss-poor work like outlands. Terrain may be randomly generated for the most part (Understandable, mapping that much area would take a long time) but they could have done something to make it not so damned obvious. Take a look at an area like thunderbluff or westfall. Is alot of the terrain stuff randomly generated? Yeah. Does it look as butt ugly as outlands and silithus? No. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats just Hellfire Peninsula. Its the first zone. And even then, try going in it ingame and telling me again that they didn't put work into it. Its one of the most well designed zones I've ever been in. Seriously, you can't base crap off of two or three screenshots. And No, its not the prettiest thing in the world- but its worlds above Silithus or Tanaris. The sky alone is enough to give it a good applause. Furthermore, Glory Road, Hellfire Citadel itself, the Gunnery Platforms, Void Ridge, the Expedition Armory...so much awesome stuff in that zone. And thats just the first zone. Wait til you see Zangarmarsh, or, my personal favorite atm(though I haven't seen Bladefist Mountains or Netherstorm yet) is Nagrand. Imagine Thunder Bluff's kind of terrain...on steroids, and 2 or 3x prettier. Its jaw-dropping. And their changes to their own fog effect really stand out there, too.
May I also mention, they can't change Hellfire Peninsula into a real beauty because its one part of outland thats been featured in the lore before- it is widely known to be a barren and dead area. Don't worry, other areas are much more eye pleasing off the bat.
I've only seen hellfire so far and I can already tell you that it's one of the most interestingly designed areas in the game in terms of aesthetics. yeah, the color scheme is mostly the same as durotar, but the sky, the landscape, the visible artifacts of the ravages of war - horde and alliance cannons and destroyed battlements everywhere, Burning Legion gates, infernals getting summoned out of the sky all over the place and doing battle with horde and alliance NPCs, flying guards of both factions flying overhead... it really drags you into the excitement.
I like their new instance design choices too. the two first Citadel instances are just the right length and difficulty for them to be fun without getting tedious. I guess I do kinda miss having more than three bosses in an instance though. I'm sure later instances have more.
I heard there's a bunch of Warcraft 2 references. I like Warcraft 3 as a game much more, but WC2's story really pulled me in. Have I been lied to? Is it only at higher, 65-70 levels? Or do I get to boogie with all my WC2 buddies?
QuaunautThe longest seven days in history...Join Date: 2003-03-21Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1599864:date=Jan 18 2007, 07:59 AM:name=TychoCelchuuu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TychoCelchuuu @ Jan 18 2007, 07:59 AM) [snapback]1599864[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I heard there's a bunch of Warcraft 2 references. I like Warcraft 3 as a game much more, but WC2's story really pulled me in. Have I been lied to? Is it only at higher, 65-70 levels? Or do I get to boogie with all my WC2 buddies? <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Far as I can tell, most definitely. I've played W1 and W3, but not W2, and theres a lot here that is pretty vaguely creeping into my mind. The Son of Hellscream and the original(BROWN) Orcs, Fel Orcs, Magtheridon(okay, WC3), and lots more.
<!--quoteo(post=1599710:date=Jan 18 2007, 02:51 AM:name=Xyth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xyth @ Jan 18 2007, 02:51 AM) [snapback]1599710[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it.
Edit: And barrens is not really he same. Walk around the barrens, there is alot of attention to details. Such as the oasises and random ponds/ destroyed houses and stuff. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have seen three pictures and judge the looks of outland. That is somewhat... meh.
Well, Hellfirepenninsula (or whoever the hell you spell it) is a wasteland so... it looks pretty empty. Zanga and Terrokara look a lot more like forests with big mushrooms and shiny stuff everywhere., the bonedessert is pretty cooll with the big arena in the middle. The new cities just look awesome (the draenai thing is just incredible).
<!--quoteo(post=1599900:date=Jan 18 2007, 01:56 PM:name=Tyrain)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tyrain @ Jan 18 2007, 01:56 PM) [snapback]1599900[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> You have seen three pictures and judge the looks of outland. That is somewhat... meh.
Well, Hellfirepenninsula (or whoever the hell you spell it) is a wasteland so... it looks pretty empty. Zanga and Terrokara look a lot more like forests with big mushrooms and shiny stuff everywhere., the bonedessert is pretty cooll with the big arena in the middle. The new cities just look awesome (the draenai thing is just incredible).
Don't judge the game from 3 pics please. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Or did you mean of WoW? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
I kid, I kid. WoW has great style. The engine, though... a little old and creaky. Doesn't even have proper shadows. Rather sad.
I kid, I kid. WoW has great style. The engine, though... a little old and creaky. Doesn't even have proper shadows. Rather sad. [/quote]
It may be a little old and creeky, and yeah, it doesn't have anywhere near the same graphical bells and whistles we've come to expect with newer releases, especially if you put it side by side with recent titles, hell, even with titles back when WoW was first release, it wasn't looking the best.
But it's got it's own style, and that counts for a lot. Sure the polycount is exceptionally low for, well, everything, and textures are all pretty tired, but shove the graphics settings to full and you've still got a pretty much perfect framerate (RAM permitting in high-pop areas really) and a world that doesn't look too bad.
It also opens it up to a lot of people who don't have the hardware to play more modern looking games, like EQ2, for example. Sure, it looks great, but if your subscribers aren't getting good framerates they'll become frustrated, or perhaps not even get past the trial period.
Now i'm not justifying shoddy visuals as a means to get a greater playerbase, personally i'd prefer it to look better, but to be perfectly honest, 7.5 million subscribers means there's obviously something there beyond visuals.
<!--quoteo(post=1599970:date=Jan 18 2007, 06:44 PM:name=esuna)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(esuna @ Jan 18 2007, 06:44 PM) [snapback]1599970[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Now i'm not justifying shoddy visuals as a means to get a greater playerbase, personally i'd prefer it to look better, but to be perfectly honest, 7.5 million subscribers means there's obviously something there beyond visuals. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And that something is what we in the business call crack-cocaine.
Comments
I like how blizzard acknowleges the fact that female humans, and humans in general, are the generic class, and bimbos - all the jokes are generic bad jokes, all the flirts are bimbo flirts or bad pick-up lines...
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
C'mon, stuff like "why does everyone automatically assume I know <i>tailoring</i> <b>and</b> cooking" is good stuff.
Fel Reaver pics:
<img src="http://xs311.xs.to/xs311/07034/placeholder003.png" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://xs311.xs.to/xs311/07034/placeholder002.png" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://xs311.xs.to/xs311/07034/placeholder001.png" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
These things emit this unearthly howl as they stomp around, shaking the ground as they walk. Very very cool.
--Scythe--
These things emit this unearthly howl as they stomp around, shaking the ground as they walk. Very very cool.
--Scythe--
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ever play Shadow of the Colossus?
It looks like they've fired all of their mappers. Silithus v2.0 anyone?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What game are YOU talking about? All I see is really awesome stuff.
Edit: Tycho, tell that to Galactus.
What game are YOU talking about? All I see is really awesome stuff.
Edit: Tycho, tell that to Galactus.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are saying outlands isn't a big flat plain like those pictures show?
You are saying outlands isn't a big flat plain like those pictures show?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, seeing as each picture has at least a slope to it...
I see hills!
And another thing, GET THIS OF MY INTERNET BEFORE I GO OUT AND GET IT <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
Yes, seeing as each picture has at least a slope to it...
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it.
Edit: And barrens is not really he same. Walk around the barrens, there is alot of attention to details. Such as the oasises and random ponds/ destroyed houses and stuff.
models and skinning would be the bigger job...
Still the "mapping" for wow, kind of consists of these generated terrains, with prefab models, with different skins <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
models and skinning would be the bigger job...
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
True, but that's not an excuse to turn out piss-poor work like outlands. Terrain may be randomly generated for the most part (Understandable, mapping that much area would take a long time) but they could have done something to make it not so damned obvious. Take a look at an area like thunderbluff or westfall. Is alot of the terrain stuff randomly generated? Yeah. Does it look as butt ugly as outlands and silithus? No.
Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not a mapper, so those terms mean little to me, but simply, you asked if it was flat, which it isn't. If you meant detail, there are a number of destroyed towers and siege weapons more towards the portal. There are scars full of green, er, stuff. There's a massive red crystal jutting out of the ground. Hellfire penisula has detail. Why are you making assumptions about how the rest of out Outlands looks like, off of just 3 pictures from <i>one</i> zone.
In regards to the 'mapping' I mean uh mapping. I would say it does look half-arsed, but well, when you got to create an entire continent, put some areas in for grinding on mobs for those who wish to etc. you will find there is a need for some open areas of terrain which are purposely implemented. Also it could well fit in with the backstory "eg. Desolate war torn land", it's not exactly going to have a civilization of cities and towns and tribes all close together with no open spaces being war torn is it?
True, but that's not an excuse to turn out piss-poor work like outlands. Terrain may be randomly generated for the most part (Understandable, mapping that much area would take a long time) but they could have done something to make it not so damned obvious. Take a look at an area like thunderbluff or westfall. Is alot of the terrain stuff randomly generated? Yeah. Does it look as butt ugly as outlands and silithus? No.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thats just Hellfire Peninsula. Its the first zone. And even then, try going in it ingame and telling me again that they didn't put work into it. Its one of the most well designed zones I've ever been in. Seriously, you can't base crap off of two or three screenshots. And No, its not the prettiest thing in the world- but its worlds above Silithus or Tanaris. The sky alone is enough to give it a good applause. Furthermore, Glory Road, Hellfire Citadel itself, the Gunnery Platforms, Void Ridge, the Expedition Armory...so much awesome stuff in that zone. And thats just the first zone. Wait til you see Zangarmarsh, or, my personal favorite atm(though I haven't seen Bladefist Mountains or Netherstorm yet) is Nagrand. Imagine Thunder Bluff's kind of terrain...on steroids, and 2 or 3x prettier. Its jaw-dropping. And their changes to their own fog effect really stand out there, too.
May I also mention, they can't change Hellfire Peninsula into a real beauty because its one part of outland thats been featured in the lore before- it is widely known to be a barren and dead area. Don't worry, other areas are much more eye pleasing off the bat.
I like their new instance design choices too. the two first Citadel instances are just the right length and difficulty for them to be fun without getting tedious. I guess I do kinda miss having more than three bosses in an instance though. I'm sure later instances have more.
I heard there's a bunch of Warcraft 2 references. I like Warcraft 3 as a game much more, but WC2's story really pulled me in. Have I been lied to? Is it only at higher, 65-70 levels? Or do I get to boogie with all my WC2 buddies?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Far as I can tell, most definitely. I've played W1 and W3, but not W2, and theres a lot here that is pretty vaguely creeping into my mind. The Son of Hellscream and the original(BROWN) Orcs, Fel Orcs, Magtheridon(okay, WC3), and lots more.
Using randomly generated noise as a displacement map for a landscape is not mapping. Little to no actual effort seems to have been put into the design of outlands from what I can tell from those screenies. Besides from a few obvious macro designs (cities being on plateaus and such). Compare that to the detail they spent on many of the newbie areas, it's obvious they rushed through it.
Edit: And barrens is not really he same. Walk around the barrens, there is alot of attention to details. Such as the oasises and random ponds/ destroyed houses and stuff.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have seen three pictures and judge the looks of outland. That is somewhat... meh.
Well, Hellfirepenninsula (or whoever the hell you spell it) is a wasteland so... it looks pretty empty. Zanga and Terrokara look a lot more like forests with big mushrooms and shiny stuff everywhere., the bonedessert is pretty cooll with the big arena in the middle. The new cities just look awesome (the draenai thing is just incredible).
Don't judge the game from 3 pics please.
You have seen three pictures and judge the looks of outland. That is somewhat... meh.
Well, Hellfirepenninsula (or whoever the hell you spell it) is a wasteland so... it looks pretty empty. Zanga and Terrokara look a lot more like forests with big mushrooms and shiny stuff everywhere., the bonedessert is pretty cooll with the big arena in the middle. The new cities just look awesome (the draenai thing is just incredible).
Don't judge the game from 3 pics please.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Feel free to post better pics then.
Feel free to post better pics then.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<img src="http://www.bytepress.com/images/GuildWarsNightFallNews/1/resized-HIGHLANDS_VAULT_THE_VAULT_413_002.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://www.playfuls.com/images/screenshots/pc/Guild_Wars_Nightfall/0008.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://guides.gamepressure.com/guildwars/gfx/gallery/large/Guild%20Wars%20Screenshots/guild_wars_screen_1.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
<img src="http://guides.gamepressure.com/guildwars/gfx/gallery/large/Guild%20Wars%20Screenshots/guild_wars_screen_17.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
lolo better pics.
Or did you mean of WoW? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
I kid, I kid. WoW has great style. The engine, though... a little old and creaky. Doesn't even have proper shadows. Rather sad.
[/quote]
It may be a little old and creeky, and yeah, it doesn't have anywhere near the same graphical bells and whistles we've come to expect with newer releases, especially if you put it side by side with recent titles, hell, even with titles back when WoW was first release, it wasn't looking the best.
But it's got it's own style, and that counts for a lot. Sure the polycount is exceptionally low for, well, everything, and textures are all pretty tired, but shove the graphics settings to full and you've still got a pretty much perfect framerate (RAM permitting in high-pop areas really) and a world that doesn't look too bad.
It also opens it up to a lot of people who don't have the hardware to play more modern looking games, like EQ2, for example. Sure, it looks great, but if your subscribers aren't getting good framerates they'll become frustrated, or perhaps not even get past the trial period.
Now i'm not justifying shoddy visuals as a means to get a greater playerbase, personally i'd prefer it to look better, but to be perfectly honest, 7.5 million subscribers means there's obviously something there beyond visuals.
Now i'm not justifying shoddy visuals as a means to get a greater playerbase, personally i'd prefer it to look better, but to be perfectly honest, 7.5 million subscribers means there's obviously something there beyond visuals.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And that something is what we in the business call crack-cocaine.