Why are Marines so fast
Iacto
Join Date: 2010-11-23 Member: 75209Members
Join Date: 2010-11-23 Member: 75209Members
<div class="IPBDescription">And why they should be slower</div>Ok, Just been playing a 9v9 (:O) match on summit (which is an awesome map, and should definitely become one of the standard maps). Now, thankfully lag wasn't too much of an issue, but there was a massive problem with playing aliens.
Every time I came across a marine, it was almost impossible to hit them.
Now I started off as a skulk (as you do), and got a few kills, but it became very quickly apparent that I just couldn't consistently kill marines. Riddle me this; why are skulks not faster than marines? I remember in the old NS, when you walked really slowly backwards, but now you can just run around in random directions at the speed of the skulk, holding LMB. When I went to the fade, the problems decreased slightly, but they were still there. For example; outside, near the RT on summit (can't remember the actual name), there were two fades, trying to kill a marine with a shotty. Because he was just jumping round in circles, the fades couldn't keep up, and took ages to kill him.
Now am I just imagining things, or has the range of melee weapons decreased? And are skulks and fades actually faster than marines? If not, why not? A marine should have to work in a squad otherwise splat (saw some awesome squad gameplay in this game btw), not be this bizarrely un-killable machine.
Thoughts?
Every time I came across a marine, it was almost impossible to hit them.
Now I started off as a skulk (as you do), and got a few kills, but it became very quickly apparent that I just couldn't consistently kill marines. Riddle me this; why are skulks not faster than marines? I remember in the old NS, when you walked really slowly backwards, but now you can just run around in random directions at the speed of the skulk, holding LMB. When I went to the fade, the problems decreased slightly, but they were still there. For example; outside, near the RT on summit (can't remember the actual name), there were two fades, trying to kill a marine with a shotty. Because he was just jumping round in circles, the fades couldn't keep up, and took ages to kill him.
Now am I just imagining things, or has the range of melee weapons decreased? And are skulks and fades actually faster than marines? If not, why not? A marine should have to work in a squad otherwise splat (saw some awesome squad gameplay in this game btw), not be this bizarrely un-killable machine.
Thoughts?
Comments
AKA. The skulk bite is being fixed because it's broken. "Tweaked" did make me lol.
Once upgrade chambers come into the game, I wouldn't be surprised to see a celerity-style upgrade giving a buff to a skulk's base speed, further ruining a marine's chances of keeping his distance.
I beleive skulk bites failing to register are an unrelated issue.
UWE have already said that they will introduce the old upgrading menu for the aliens in NS1:
<!--quoteo(post=1846799:date=May 17 2011, 06:09 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ May 17 2011, 06:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1846799"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah, aliens will have upgrades again, and they are going to be in the alien buy menu. That menu is being reworked at the moment, and has been designed to allow for plenty of upgrades that the aliens can purchase. Getting upgrades back into the game is a high priority for us as it should add a lot to the alien side.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Skulk bite is likely to get tweaked quite a few times, as newer builds become faster and hit detection becomes more accurate.
anyway, marines are not too fast. skulks have leap, and run a little faster than a sprinting marine anyway.
Yeah but by the time you actually catch up the with the marine you are surrounded by 5 of them and you are forced to use xenoc---
marines can out run fades, skulks easily with sprint currently.
MACS are faster than skulks even, much of this needs addressing.
I made a getsatisfaction post about this a LONG time ago. :D. It's got reasons and stuff.
<a href="http://gsfn.us/t/1ynus" target="_blank">http://gsfn.us/t/1ynus</a>
I made a getsatisfaction post about this a LONG time ago. :D. It's got reasons and stuff.
<a href="http://gsfn.us/t/1ynus" target="_blank">http://gsfn.us/t/1ynus</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Am I the only one who opposes the 'marines should move like they're in jello' club?
...and the battle continues...
If the alternative is "humans can outrun four legged aliens that are designed to be the ultimate predator while running backwards and firing an assault rifle" then yes.
That's why in NS1 aliens are faster! Because even if there is like 3 skulks vs 3 marines, marines can kill them. But if shows up just 1 marine, he better run haha
Well, I can't say much about NS2 because I don't have it.. But what I've seen in videos.. The fade is so slow (compared to the blink in ns1, and strong marine weapons in ns2) that 1 marine with shotgun can kill him easily!
Aliens are much faster than marines.
The only real problem right now is melee detection, it's kinda poor. But if the marine wants to run away, let him. You still won either way. My advice would be to take the time to find a good hiding spot and wait for him to come back, if he does, kill him. If he doesn't, congrats you probably put him out of action for longer than killing him would.
However regardless if the marine is running or sprinting as long as you use leap effectively you should never have a problem closing the distance between yourself and the marine. However movement in NS2 is still being worked on, skulk Bite is fully functional, its just that there is almost always ping/tickrate related lag.
Also if you were not getting the amount of kills as you expected just remember that it may have been late game (i may have been on the server if you played for the first time on summit, i remember someone new joining the alien team). In late game generally skulks generally don't have what it takes to take down shotgun/flame thrower marines by themselves. Even though you've played NS1 the play style is somewhat different now that we are all on a new engine try playing for a few days and see if you get the hang of it.
hiding on the roof and its dark as and i feel fully covered and barely visible more times then not a marine will see me and BAM SHOTGUN DED.
I cant imagine what it would be like playing onos on these maps, they're so tight.
And I think it's about time we have a race. My skulk vs. your rine.
False. Load up Decoda and check the game code.
<!--quoteo(post=1847549:date=May 20 2011, 07:49 PM:name=Codeine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Codeine @ May 20 2011, 07:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1847549"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Skulks feel a bit too big to me compared to NS1, only slightly tho.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed. They look massive.
That was a perfectly good opportunity to quote some more Lua-script, what's wrong with you?
Last time I checked a sprinting marine and a skulk's running-speed were _almost_ the same (skulks being just ever so slightly faster). But when pursuing a marine all a skulk has to do is a make a wrong (sideway-)move and you've lost him, and even if you catch up the time it took you to do so he'll be near his buddies already. Skulks are hopeless in NS2.
I've been in plenty of cases where a sprinting marine stays ahead long enough to get me into an ambush of friendly support if I kept following. It's somewhat annoying but mostly rare since most I've encountered just stick around and fight unless I'm a fade or something.
Honestly I'd like see the jump slowdown back in, but that's only kind of on topic.
We don't make our decisions based on whether or not other FPS games have something, we base our decision on whether a feature will add value to the gameplay, help to fix issues, add depth and strategy, and generally make the game more fun. In the case of sprint it largely came about from Charlie's frustration with spawning at an IP alone, and having to slowly make his way to the other side of the map where a battle is happening. We want players to be able to quickly get into and out of combat, and spend more of their time fighting or building, then wandering through the map.
<!--quoteo(post=1847703:date=May 21 2011, 12:33 PM:name=Kurrine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kurrine @ May 21 2011, 12:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1847703"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Honestly I'd like see the jump slowdown back in, but that's only kind of on topic.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We aren't happy with how rapidly marines can jump around currently, and will most likely be adding in some kind of slowdown, or pause between jumps to make marines less bouncy.
--Cory