Pub Stompers
MaLuS
Join Date: 2013-02-02 Member: 182769Members
Join Date: 2013-02-02 Member: 182769Members
Now the purpose of this thread is not to name and shame, you know who you are. I would just like to say that those of us that are competitive players when joining servers (particularly green servers) that we should all make an effort to balance the teams to give the newbie players a better game to participate in. Many many times now i have seen competitive players (this includes the premier div players too) all stacking one team vs a team of mostly green players and thus stomping them, personally i join the team that looks the weakest to see if i can help them out and teach those that need it. Please guys balance these games, while on these "weaker" teams playing pubs i have often heard the green players saying how they don't like the game because its too hard while being stomped by a team of mostly competitive players & high skill pub players, doing this is detrimental to the growth of the community so please keep this in mind and make the games as equally challenging for both teams as possible and help the new players to show them how much fun this game can be. Please stop with the pub stomping and start with pub balance, if you are the highest skill on the server by a large amount then please go com and teach the others or you can bring in some other high skill players to join the other team. Think of the newbies guys, think of the community and think of the future of the game.
Comments
Didn't they actually lose that round on biodome?
I don't know. I left before the second summit game started. I've already been pwned 3 times by then and didn't see any point in playing further.
Are you kidding me? Most prem players aren't even playing pub anymore and if we do not stack vs rookie teams. If you want to argue about stacking please be honest and don't make up ridiculous lies.
I assume you are talking about Wob and me trying to play on one team for a couple of rounds?
You might have noticed you joined Yo-Clan. That is in my eyes on of the remaining white/non-rookie servers with decent skill in europe next to HBZ.
And even this servers are filled with rookies a lot nowadays. Where if not here are we alowed to play together with our friends? If this is too hard for you, if you wanna be the best player on a server, then please feel free to join another lower skilled server (as you probably did).
If you would have stayed on the server (btw. playing this game vs better players is the only way to improve) you would have noticed Wob and me lost most of the rounds we "stacked vs rookies" for different reasons, like just messing around as gorge and having some fun.
The competitive community is so small (prem div has 5 more or less active teams) that it is almost impossible to find opponents for pcws.
Are we (people who spent a long time with this game now) not allowed to play and enjoy this game with our friends anymore?
Just now (while I am wrinting this) we wanna paly together again.
Unfortunatly we get flamed again for stacking vs rookies.
I also remember a game on summit where rantology joined and was verbally abused for going 20/2. She did nothing wrong, just played on her usual high level. People started insulting her after the round and she left.
The community is very small in this game, guys. Competitive players have the same right to play as any other person and your bound to encounter them frequently. At some times there are so few players that there are only 1 or 2 decent servers per region which have people playing.
Most competitive players are pretty decent guys, who try to go com, gorge or go on suicide missions on purpose just to be able to have some fun and still play this game we all love outside of official games or pcws. And while they usually try to handicap themselves in some way, just cut them some slack if they want to at least play with their friends for a few rounds sometime.
I have been stomped 2/20 k/d very often by guys like ancestral, Wob, eagleeye, eiss and all the other comp guys. I know what it feels like but you have to accept there will often players who are significantly better than you. Yelling, calling stack or ragequitting won't help you. Just take it as a challenge and try to improve your play. The game is not unenjoyable when you loose. It's those games with mute idiots without team play that suck. Or where half of the loosing team ragequits after 5 minutes lessening your chances even more. Try to team up on the pros and nail some higher lifeforms. It feels really good to take down that lerk who went 20/1, even if you loose the round and it takes you 1/20 to achieve. And if its just 1 or 2 comp players in the opposite team, you might still be able to win the round with good team play. There is only so many marines a lerk can take on by himself, even if its eiss
1.) I'm not making up ridiculous lies. Please tell me where I make up ridiculous lies.
2.) You contradict yourself. (This first part vs. everything that follows)
Yes, I'm probably talking about that round. Wob was one of them, I don't know if you were the second. And yes, I joined yoclan because people there usually know what they are doing.
And of course I'm not against playing with your friend per se.
BUT if you are a prem div player who can easily carry a whole pub team on it's own, you might want to consider that switching teams to your equally skilled friends after a forced even might imbalance the game. (Just a tiny bit, you know.) Which completely ruins the fun for everyone, but you two. That's plain selfish.
Furthermore, I did not witness those rounds were you fooled around as gorges and had fun, because I left after you utterly destroyed marines several times in a row as lerks. And by the looks of that scoreboard, most other players apparently did the same, as I recognize only few of the names of the names there, and when I left the server was still full of decent communicative players I know at least by name. (And definitely NOT unskilled rookies.)
I'd like to mention, too, that I did not accuse you of stacking against rookies. I just accused you of stacking. Please don't put words into my mouth.
I'd also like to take a look at this statement:
Are you trying to tell me that because YoClan is expected to have a higher average skill it is okay to stomp rookies there?
What the hell dude?
And I did not leave for a lower skilled server, I quit the game. I don't "wanna be the best player on a server", I want to have fun. I think it says a lot that you defend yourself from a stacking accusation by suggesting I search a rookie server and so I can stomp someone by myself (and you even assume I did!).
Then, the learning argument. I hear that a lot. "You won't get better at this game if you don't play against opponents that are better than yourself."
I fully agree with this statement. You learn nothing by killing rookies.
On the other, you also learn nothing after a six minute struggle on a lost position in the marine team which only leads to you being almost insta-killed by pro lerks. I've done that several times now, and so far I didn't learn anything valuable, except for the fact that uneven teams suck.
So because there's no one in your league you go all the way down to pubs instead of, I don't know, searching for some less skilled competitive players to play against? Why?
Also, what's the problem with playing against your friend in a pub? I reckon you both have teamspeak, anyway, and it would go a long way for team balance.
And that's okay. Don't get me wrong, I really don't have a problem with comp players in public play (some of my friends kick my ass regularly in this game). But if there's two comp players, and two teams, it really pisses me off when they say "fuck balance, l2p".
Coincidence? maybe
It looks like this community dont need/want high level servers anymore.
The HBZ server is dying constantly over the last weeks for example.
2-3 rounds per day and then the server is empty again.
Every try from other clans/communitys wasnt successfull in the past.
Last try was the "Over.Extension | Comp Mod Server" wich is empty most of the time.
For me it looks like this game is killing itself.
Lets call it "Natural selection"
Are you talking about the round where we had a rookie commander dropping multiple shifts and crags in our hive and didn't drop a single cyst?
The round where after 6 minutes the marines had the whole map standing on both sides of our hive, starting to spam the hive with grenades?
The round where after 6 minutes we finally (remeber just 1 rt) had res to go lerk (remember vanilla lerks, no ups, no biomass).
Are you really complaining about wob and me getting out of base with our 2 lerks trying to kill some upgraded shotgunners and having fun?
What do you think how many lower division teams like to play agains premier division teams? THAT is what you can call a stomp.
A very good organized team with skilled players can win a game within the first 3-5 minutes on both sides. We tried it, it is neither fun for any of the teams nor does it improve any of them.
The problem with playings against my friends is that it almost every time leads to the same sg vs fade or lmg vs lerk fights we are fighting in every competitive game.
That is not what we play public for. We do it to have fun. For doing silly things. Also if you would play a little more with us and not rage after the first 1 or 2 games you would notice that we play on different teams most of the time and just go in 1 team every now and then...
There are hardly ever any rookies when we played together. The screenshot in his post at the end was to show that actually the rookies stacked and we could ONLY join aliens.
Get off your high horse and blaming other players. Sometimes we play 2-3 rounds together in a row, sometimes we play 2-3 rounds against each other in a row. We play together for fun and we play against each other for balance (and fun). To paint us as 100% evil all the time and stackers and all this bull**** is childish.
I can't believe you've forgotten to put in the part where we had a rookie commander and 2-3 other rookies on our team so we had to play aliens to try and make something out of it; went lerk, and still lost the game!
Ehhhhh no... He's saying that there are 2 european white (non "rookie-friendly") servers out there for us to play on. If you cherry pick the 2-3 games we play together out of the 6-8 games in a session and flame us for "stacking", where else do you want us to go. It doesn't look at all like you are in favour of people playing with their friends!
That's not what he's saying again. He's saying if you're not up to standards of some of the players in that server, and you're not having fun, go find a server where you can fit in. Although your attitude, like many others, does come across as "omg better players superseded me in skill so I'm no longer at the top of the server."
The lies of rookie stomping resurface!
And how can you come to the objective conclusion that you can't learn anything? Is that a problem with you not being able to think of new ideas/strategies to compensate and overcome better people, or do you literally know everything in the game from micropositioning to timing to macropositioning and the only thing holding you back is poor reflexes which are almost impossible to modify.
We do play against each other. Cherry picking your scenarios here again to make it look like we don't play against each other. Nice.
No. I'm talking about the round were we barely held our naturals because of lerks killing us.
Again: I have no problem with you playing pub, as long as you retain balance, or doing silly things, as long as it's fun. But I asked you guys to balance teams and, well, it didn't help. That's not "every now and then", sorry.
Maybe try running it without the ensl balance mod. The reason I stopped playing there was because it was annoying to adjust to a different game every time, probably that's also the reason why less 'nornal' pubbers joined in the end.
It sucks for the rest of the players when you have average players vs 2 iM players though, especially when they are both Marines.
It pisses you off that people say l2p?
How do you think people get as good as these players you're complaining about?
They learn to play. They fix their mistakes. They improve positioning, timing, ambushing, map reading. All these things are modifiable and can be learnt to the same degree by every single player.
Some things can't be, or are very hard to improve and set a literal hard-cap, like reflexes.
When you stop making positional mistakes and you can read the map as well as any other player then reflexes really only give marginal advantages to players.
These skills are not exclusive to some players. They are just not picked up by the vast majority of players because they won't reflect and learn. So instead of learning to play and improve, they just blame the better players. It's the easy option, right?
Also the speed of the game increased. In ns1 you could attack a rine maybe 2-3 times before he reached a hive location. Now with this cc-rt-cc layout concept and unlimited sprint stamina, it is a huge impact if a rine kills 3 skulks and does whatever he wants to the structures after only one engagement.
I remember times when Tane was blocking off a whole map side just by staying in a corridor and owning every alien in sight. But you could keep him away from the RTs with spores for example. That was like a win-win for both sides. He got kills, aliens kept their RT. But ns2 feels very onesided if the teams are inbalanced. Especially if two good players glue together and cover themselfs.
On the bright side: I have seen pub teams win against rediciously stacked teams with good teamplay. And as soon as the 50:1 players recognized that their team will lose despite their contribution, they just bailed out of the round and left the server.
Another example special to combat: There are guys who always buy sg/jp and have 10:0 kills before I even finished loading the #*&% map. They enjoy owning and 1-shotting aliens for several minutes and spawn camp the whole time. Why not, noone could kill them. But as soon as you get xeno and 1-shot them back -> they curse you and leave the server. I mean..wtf...you raping is ok, but getting killed yourself is out of the question?
There are people who behave questionable on both sides of the fence. Maybe we should cut down on emotions and discuss what the problem is. Is it ns2 or is it really the nature of some players just doing what the game lets them do?
You are right, there were barely any rookies on the server at the time I still played. And the amount of rookies on the marine team in that screenshot would've led to an imbalanced game in any case, with or without competitive players.
But I don't see what that has to do with the quote^^
edit: I just noticed the initial quote was by Malus, not by me. Sorry, misunderstanding
Ignore this.
I don't want to paint you as 100% evil, that would be dumb. We are all humans, after all. But I don't see why I should put up with a deliberate stack, either.
Sorry if I just forgot that game. It's possible that I was gone by then, though.
Well, just because they are white does not mean you shouldn't adapt to the circumstances. You still have some social responsibility, after all.
And frankly, I don't know where you should go. This is really the underlying problem here
Alright, I probably misread that a bit. It's easy to jump to conclusions in posts like this, though.
Please tell me where. I'm not complaining that I die all the time (not directly), but that whole teams have problems due to individual players.
There's only so many ways to go from Sub to Comp Lab, really, and if your aim sucks against that Lerk... what am I supposed to?
We do play against each other. Cherry picking your scenarios here again to make it look like we don't play against each other. Nice.
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Again, I'm not cherry picking. Nor am I condemning a whole group of players. I can only tell you what I saw from my point of view. I saw two uber-skilled players swapping teams - against forced even, mind you - who completely destroyed my team and now ask me to learn to play.
No. I didn't say it pisses me off when somebody says "l2p". It pisses me off when somebody says "fuck balance, l2p". What I mean, is: Somebody who stacks and then counters my complaining with "l2p". Because I don't see what I could learn when I have to camp in my base to survive.
Also, I think my single biggest weakness is aim, and improving that takes hours upon hours of gameplay.
Furthermore, I think you can actually learn more from balanced play, because then stuff actually happens, instead of just "*spawn* *dead* *spawn*".
Yeah, Comp Mod was the reason I stopped by. Not that I was a regular...
I just couldn't be bothered to learn all the differences yet again, sorry
And sorry for triple post.
So please, if you see the comp players join a team, go the opposite team immediately. You are probably decent enough to make a difference there if there are 5 of you, by pulling of some coordinated surprise attack, bile rush or sneaky phase gate or simply by pack playing. But if none of the guys with a brain takes the first steap, probably noone will ever do it because the prospect of getting raped by div 1 lerks while turtling in base together with 8 mute idiots is not a very inviting one.
I heard admins are good against "stack" by forcing random teams from time to time btw.
This is a good method against finn-stack for example
80% of aim is positioning and gamesense. I would suggest you to l2p (gamesense- and map awareness-wise) and your aim will improve by itself.
Just to be clear, I think my precision with my mouse is the main culprit, but I will gladly take tips^^
You can't blame the good players for wanting to play together. It's just more fun to play with friends.
You can't blame the average players either, for misliking very one sided games, because it just is very frustrating to play against a way stronger team.
There is a reason games like CS:GO, Starcraft, Dota-style games have matchmaking. The average player just doesn't have the frustration tolerance that is required to keep a healthy mind-set and keep learning while you get stomped like that.
The matchmaking system doesn't even have to be great in terms of finding the "perfect" balance. What is more important, that you could sign up together with your friends, and it would try to find a match for you. While it is searching, you should be able to play, so you aren't stuck waiting for it (like in the current "organiszed play" feature).
I know people will be saying "the community isn't big enough for matchmaking", and I agree. But I think it still should be done, because it is one of the best hopes to grow the community (besides the great work from people like mendasp, improving the game mechanics).
It is true that you can only improve by challenging yourself, however for many pubbers reaching the skill level of these "pro" players is NEVER going to happen no matter how many hours we dump into playing. Everyone will eventually hit their own personal skill ceiling, and these "pro" players are far above and beyond what an average pubber will EVER be able to achieve.
Thus these types of comments tend to come across as being extremely elitist.
If you guys want this game to live on we need to actively help that happen by help out newbies, teaching them (i know there are some great players out there that do this and thank you!). It is no lie that high skill pubbers, comp players and yes sometimes the prem players, some players (high skill pub & comp) with a name change (thinking nobody would recognize them) do pub stomp. now im not saying this happens all the time intentionally (at least i hope not) but it is something the long standing members of the community should be helping to avoid. we need new blood in the game and that means newbies.
Im not trying to piss anyone off with this thread or attack anyone, simply asking people to be mindful of this problem and to help with this. I just want to see the community grow and help each other.
Amen to this, it's not like I would have the time or the inclination now to put that kind of effort in. More important things need attention these days.