<!--QuoteBegin-Mantrid+Aug 28 2004, 12:51 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Aug 28 2004, 12:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Wheeee+Aug 27 2004, 09:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Wheeee @ Aug 27 2004, 09:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Mantrid+Aug 28 2004, 12:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Aug 28 2004, 12:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Maybe thats because all the water we've seen is being disturbed.
Water doesn't stand still when theres THREE FREAKING GIANT MONSTERS IN IT.
God, why has it become so popular to bash Half Life and Source? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I didn't see any monsters in the cavern shot? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> MSPaint for the win. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> reflections of the pipes...
<!--QuoteBegin-Rat12321+Aug 27 2004, 10:02 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rat12321 @ Aug 27 2004, 10:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Mantrid+Aug 28 2004, 12:51 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Aug 28 2004, 12:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Wheeee+Aug 27 2004, 09:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Wheeee @ Aug 27 2004, 09:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Mantrid+Aug 28 2004, 12:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Aug 28 2004, 12:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Maybe thats because all the water we've seen is being disturbed.
Water doesn't stand still when theres THREE FREAKING GIANT MONSTERS IN IT.
God, why has it become so popular to bash Half Life and Source? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I didn't see any monsters in the cavern shot? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> MSPaint for the win. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> reflections of the pipes... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Ah, good point.
Well, I'm fairly sure the first object is still a rather large, dare I say "freaking big", monster. And they do stir up liquids.
gah, i can't find it right now...pretty much any HL2 screenshot thread has water effects, though, and if you had read my original post, i had said that i haven't seen *ANY* screens with still water.
<!--QuoteBegin-Daza400+Aug 27 2004, 09:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Daza400 @ Aug 27 2004, 09:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Aug 28 2004, 08:34 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Aug 28 2004, 08:34 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I hope somebody makes a high res texture/material pack + high res models for hl1... and high res sounds would be icing on the cake. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> *cough* *cough* <a href='http://www.hl-improvement.com/' target='_blank'>*cough*</a> *choke* <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo--> daza i didnt know you were on the hit team! if you ever need another modeler ill be here!
you know... the few times I've actually seen water with sludge in it in real life it wasn't all that reflective. If it had oil in it it would have lots of pretty colours but all in all it didn't look much like that. Sorry but you're just making excuses for it =/
I have no doubt though that it looks great in motion. Most engines these days look pretty poor in screenies because many of the effects seem to be based more in movement; I thought F.E.A.R. had horrible lighting looking at it's screenies but when I saw a movie of the same scenes I realised it was actually pretty darn good =o
I'm not bashing Source nor HL, I'm just stating that rather than porting it'd probably be better to remake like the wonderful redo of resident evil which blows old and new RE gamers out of the water with it's scenes, eye-candy and atmosphere ^^ I still remember the entire room gasping when Jill was walking through a deep puddle in a cave and realistic bubbles and churning followed in her wake... We spent a lot of time in that puddle XD
Don't forget this is also Valve proving how easy it is to port to Source and they've always said there would be no new content.
However I for one cannot wait to play Opposing Force: Source. Theres something about Op4 thats more epic and more fun than HL. Either that or I just think the marines are cool.
But the fight between the shipping crates counts as a high point for me.
It's not an excuse...water still has reflective properties even if it's nasty/grimy, they're just a bit more limited than they were beforehand. It probably does have oil in it. If you've ever played that part of the game, you'd know that.
What is really comes down to is it <b>is</b> the new thing to bash Valve/Source. But before I go on a huge rant, I'll stop with that.
<!--QuoteBegin-Mantrid+Aug 28 2004, 03:15 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mantrid @ Aug 28 2004, 03:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Know why? Still water is boring. Companies don't want to release boring screenshots. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Right. You aren't bashing Half-Life for having unrealistic running speeds (OR ALIENS INVADING FROM OTHER DIMENSIONS), so why are you bashing it because the water is choppy when it's not supposed to be? I like it better choppy, even if it means that realistically there's some underwater propeller or something.
Okay, new thing for all new FPS games, lets have water that should be standing look like a nuclear weapon went off underneath it. And I don't have to see the crap in motion to know it looks like crap. FarCry might have sucked gameplay wise, but it sure was eye candy.
FarCry/Doom III > HL2, end of story...Personally, even the HL1 mod, MechMod has better water than HL2.
Don't defend terribly done elements of a game just because you're a fanboy.
Perdition, the HL2 water in motion looks pretty damn good - this stuff just happens to look like crap because it's part of a strange low-poly map that was never supposed to be part of such an advanced engine. And no, it is not supposed to be completely still - there's a big Icthysaurus thing in it. I do think that the CryEngine is the best engine yet, though. It's got it all; dynamic lights, huge environments, pretty indoor scenes, and undoubtedly the best water. And not just one type of water either - compare the ocean water in that game to the murky water of the River map and you'll see what I mean.
Perdition, now I see the light...you're a fanboy <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The water looks great, and if you actually played through that part of the game you'd understand why.
KungFuSquirrelBasher of MuttonsJoin Date: 2002-01-26Member: 103Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
edited August 2004
<!--QuoteBegin-Geminosity+Aug 27 2004, 05:39 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Geminosity @ Aug 27 2004, 05:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> woah... just noticed the main thing bugging me (other than wondering what that thing in the water is supposed to be in either shot ^^; ). The source one is way too bright. Look at the old one and it's kinda moody in a dimly lit kinda way. <b>The source one looks like it has an open roof or something with a ton of sunlight irradiating the room o.O</b> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's because it <i>does</i>. Those are clouds and big structures, not the room you're seeing in the shot.
Err, wait, I may be confusing myself with another shot that shows weird or mismatched environment mapping or something... Hmm. It could go either way.
that's an enclosed room, iirc. in fact, i think that room was underground. anyway, why are you guys getting so defensive about the water. I just pointed out something that i noticed and would like to see changed, and you jump all over me like a pack of ravening wolves? WTH? since when is constructive criticism bad? I didn't flame anyone, nor did I say the source engine was bad, I just said it was silly not having standing water! Jeebus people, what's wrong with you?
KFS, as you work for a company that uses the DOOM 3 Engine you are not allowed to boast about its "Mystical Powar!" and should really refrain from this type of discussion. Its like me saying Burger King Sucks.
(And if you didn't realise it I was kidding <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
well if it had oil in it then it wouldn't look like that at all. You <b>are</b> excusing it. You're saying anyone who doesn't agree with you is 'bashing' HL source too even if it's blatantly not true. Sure perdition is being a bit fix-minded about it but I don't see anyone else 'bashing' it =/
I'm sorry, I'm looking forward to source and all and I know the water in the videos I saw was cool so I'm willing to accept it'll look good in motion, I don't see the big problem with me mentioning that in a still it looks utterly crud. It's not like I'm saying it'll look like that ingame, just in the screenie. And yeah it does look like it's an open room squirrel unless you note the original where you can see an enclosed ceiling. If they changed it to an open top one then it's fine but for a 'port' of the original it's way too bright =o
KungFuSquirrelBasher of MuttonsJoin Date: 2002-01-26Member: 103Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
edited August 2004
Hey, all I've done is try to keep people objective about things i.e. the doom3 vs. hl2 thread. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> I'm as excited about HL2 as anyone, but I just hate to see good tech being needlessly and unnecessarily railed. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'd have loved to see Valve go through and re-do all the content as well, but oh well. I only hope that HL2 handles UV coordinates in the levels differently so people can easily swap in new textures at higher resolutions to really get the most out of the HL1 stuff. That'd be awesome to see. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If I didn't know what HL2 was and I saw that ported HL1 version compared to HL : Nightwatch, I'd be WAY more excited for Nightwatch. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> True true, and your avatar looks like my old teatcher.
Comments
Water doesn't stand still when theres THREE FREAKING GIANT MONSTERS IN IT.
God, why has it become so popular to bash Half Life and Source? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't see any monsters in the cavern shot? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
MSPaint for the win. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
reflections of the pipes...
Water doesn't stand still when theres THREE FREAKING GIANT MONSTERS IN IT.
God, why has it become so popular to bash Half Life and Source? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't see any monsters in the cavern shot? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
MSPaint for the win. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
reflections of the pipes... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah, good point.
Well, I'm fairly sure the first object is still a rather large, dare I say "freaking big", monster. And they do stir up liquids.
*cough* *cough* <a href='http://www.hl-improvement.com/' target='_blank'>*cough*</a> *choke* <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo--> daza i didnt know you were on the hit team! if you ever need another modeler ill be here!
I have no doubt though that it looks great in motion. Most engines these days look pretty poor in screenies because many of the effects seem to be based more in movement; I thought F.E.A.R. had horrible lighting looking at it's screenies but when I saw a movie of the same scenes I realised it was actually pretty darn good =o
I'm not bashing Source nor HL, I'm just stating that rather than porting it'd probably be better to remake like the wonderful redo of resident evil which blows old and new RE gamers out of the water with it's scenes, eye-candy and atmosphere ^^
I still remember the entire room gasping when Jill was walking through a deep puddle in a cave and realistic bubbles and churning followed in her wake... We spent a lot of time in that puddle XD
However I for one cannot wait to play Opposing Force: Source. Theres something about Op4 thats more epic and more fun than HL. Either that or I just think the marines are cool.
But the fight between the shipping crates counts as a high point for me.
What is really comes down to is it <b>is</b> the new thing to bash Valve/Source. But before I go on a huge rant, I'll stop with that.
Right. You aren't bashing Half-Life for having unrealistic running speeds (OR ALIENS INVADING FROM OTHER DIMENSIONS), so why are you bashing it because the water is choppy when it's not supposed to be? I like it better choppy, even if it means that realistically there's some underwater propeller or something.
FarCry/Doom III > HL2, end of story...Personally, even the HL1 mod, MechMod has better water than HL2.
Don't defend terribly done elements of a game just because you're a fanboy.
The water looks great, and if you actually played through that part of the game you'd understand why.
That's because it <i>does</i>. Those are clouds and big structures, not the room you're seeing in the shot.
Err, wait, I may be confusing myself with another shot that shows weird or mismatched environment mapping or something... Hmm. It could go either way.
(And if you didn't realise it I was kidding <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
I'm sorry, I'm looking forward to source and all and I know the water in the videos I saw was cool so I'm willing to accept it'll look good in motion, I don't see the big problem with me mentioning that in a still it looks utterly crud. It's not like I'm saying it'll look like that ingame, just in the screenie.
And yeah it does look like it's an open room squirrel unless you note the original where you can see an enclosed ceiling. If they changed it to an open top one then it's fine but for a 'port' of the original it's way too bright =o
I'd have loved to see Valve go through and re-do all the content as well, but oh well. I only hope that HL2 handles UV coordinates in the levels differently so people can easily swap in new textures at higher resolutions to really get the most out of the HL1 stuff. That'd be awesome to see. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If I didn't know what HL2 was and I saw that ported HL1 version compared to HL : Nightwatch, I'd be WAY more excited for Nightwatch.
If I didn't know what HL2 was and I saw that ported HL1 version compared to HL : Nightwatch, I'd be WAY more excited for Nightwatch. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
True true, and your avatar looks like my old teatcher.