I'll just chime in here and offer the perfect solution to the whole hopping whenever attacked by skulks thing -- Make the marine's weapon either totally useless, accuracy-wise when jumping, or make it actually useless until he's on the ground again. This hopping thing is really annoying, because skulks are supposed to have the upper hand in close combat.
What were the win stats for NS1? How come "50% win rate" was never made such a big deal about in NS1? I definitely recall aliens winning most games in NS1, and I definitely recall never actually giving a shit, because the game was much more fun and even losing was pretty fun.
I'll quote that because of how much this sums the problem here. Asymetric games are often very fun. Think: L4D 1 & 2, Alien vs Predator, or Zombie Panic, a CS: Source mod, opposing an ever-growing zombie teams (dead humans turn into zombies) against humans that lose close to 70% of the game. Still the best concept I ever played.
I'll just chime in here and offer the perfect solution to the whole hopping whenever attacked by skulks thing -- Make the marine's weapon either totally useless, accuracy-wise when jumping, or make it actually useless until he's on the ground again. This hopping thing is really annoying, because skulks are supposed to have the upper hand in close combat.
The problem is not that marines retain their accuracy while jumping. The problem is that a succesful dodge can put quite some distance between a skulk and marine, and that skulks are a bit too slow to close that gap again. I'm ok with how they reduced skulk air control, but a slight boost in acceleration and/or jump range for instance should make them a bit more resilient in close combat, without having to nerf marines.
You haven't played RTS games or things similar, if it ain't balanced people go ballistic, you never hear the end of it.
And you know what, most players would never actually know the difference.
It took over 10 years of patches for Starcraft to reach the balanced state it's praised for, and even still, there's plenty of useless units that only show up in trick plays or are simply not used at all. Protoss Scouts, for example, immediately spring to mind.
True, but the game is highly balanced, this is because people will moan and moan on RTS games for not being balanced, here's one the new Widow Mine so many have complained about it or the Medivac Boost..... I say balance has to come first, or people won't play, even if its fun.
There are some changes happening for the Mine and Boost!
You used FPS as a balance argument which is wrong because everyone can get the same weapon, or same class, so there's no balance really to be had, but playing those games it's seems the devs want a certain things to be overpowered to make players feel they've achieved something, and game likes this where you having two sides which are different needs balance, or people won't play that broken side.
What were the win stats for NS1? How come "50% win rate" was never made such a big deal about in NS1? I definitely recall aliens winning most games in NS1, and I definitely recall never actually giving a shit, because the game was much more fun and even losing was pretty fun.
Then why are people complaining about the Marines then? You make it sound like the Aliens have just swapped position, because remove the Skulk are there's no complaints about the Aliens, if any are minor.
Right now we have an issue where one side is easy to play, is more fun to play in all aspects, is easier to learn, and has a lower skill requirement to play well, and a side that is the exact opposite. Why should the win rate be 50%? Why should the easier team deserve an equal chance of winning?
Then you playing against easy opponents, maybe I'm lucky that I get to play against regular players and high level Clans like Suanamen and Archea(might have spelled them wrong), also the ENSL gathers.
though I disagree about fun, if you going to use such a crass measurement, the rest of the Aliens lifeforms are fun and you could argue too easy, though as I said you play for different reasons, not just for mindless fun.
I wouldn't say Marines are easier because the higher lifeforms can easily solo any marine, the marines have always required more team work, also more attention to the map, I see the Marines having different requirement then the Aliens. While both need to do the same Aliens are able to attack and be more care-free, the Marines have to be more vigilant, also on guard.
1) Amongst English-speaking countries, RTS is absolutely nowhere near as popular as FPS. Korea doesn't count any more than we could say shitty grindtastic MMOs are popular because the entire country of China plays them until they literally die. The most optimistic sales count for Starcraft was 9 million units, which was worldwide and 10 years of sales. Battlefield 3 sold over half that many copies in North America in the first week, and Modern Warfare 3 moved over 6 million copies in the first day.
Yea, doesn't give you much hope, does it? Hey folks what do you want a complex game, or mostly mindless games.... FPS has nearly messed up the gaming community, luckily there are some gaming companies when making a FPS make it good job of it, like Deux Ex and so fourth and games of similar ilk.
2) NS2 is not a real RTS game. Having a commander and some buttons to push and buildings to plop doesn't make it an RTS game any more than earning experience points in a shooter suddenly makes it a role-playing game. Determining what makes a game fit into a genre takes more than just excising individual features and tossing them in respective piles and then looking at which pile is higher.
You're right and wrong, there's both elements are used and as I said earlier, this is where my gripe really is, the RTS elements does need more, the FPS side seems mostly fine... the RTS needs a buff. Though a reverse of the Aliens structure would be good, make the Gorge the mobile Commander again, though NS2 does have the ability to become a strong RTS game, also you make the mistake many do, you're experience a RTS game though and FPS format, you action are part of the Strategic side of the game.
3) I'll let you off this time but please don't compare RTS games to chess ever again. There isn't really a single concept in chess that can even remotely be applied to how RTS games function without some serious effort taken to shoehorn in concepts that aren't even unique to chess. If you can invite a comparison between chess and your typical RTS game, you might as well invite the comparison that Starcraft is a lot like Go. Because you place pieces (units). And have to plan. And eventually you might win? If you think you'd like to argue this I'll start you off with this: In a way that doesn't sound totally insane, please explain to me what chess has that's directly analogous to build orders, rock-paper-scissors balance, territory control, and micro.
I'll give you an example, in Chess you need to have favorable position like it any RTS game, you need to make sure you best Unit(pieces) stay alive you have to be cost effective, you need to counter each-other moves, you can just blindly go for it, I guess you can but that's where you could easily win or lose.
I say they're pretty similar, you just have to accept that RTS have moved on from Chess, but Chess is the main concept it's built upon.
KasharicHull, EnglandJoin Date: 2013-03-27Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
Quick point on the chess topic hopefully before it gets out of hand
chess is a turn based strategy game, RTS' are of course "real-time" strategy games... they are similar in some ways but VERY different in a majority of ways. when broken down to their skeletal structure yes... they both require strategy, planning and forethought. but that is where the similarities end. so you are both equally right.
I'm going to jump in and try and bring the thread back on topic
After playing alot these past 4 - 5 days I've come to realize a few things.
1: I suck as Skulk... (this is actually a very liberating thing to realize)
2: My K/D ratio as Marine (while lower than alot of other players) is pretty nice, playing marine is quick, easy and fun.
3: Playing commander is far less scary than I first thought.
Realizing I suck as Skulk wasn't simply me looking at my K/D and thinking "holy crap... 12 deaths - 2 kills I suck" (especially when compared to a few skulks who had 2 deaths - 14 kills)...it was me playing 10+ games in a row as a marine and seeing some people play Skulk really F***ing well. I've played against bad Skulks (the ones who run straight at you or don't move slowly to ambush) and then their are the good players... you know... the ones that you don't hear or see and suddenly you're being attacked, You juke, spin and they aren't anywhere to be seen, after checking ceilings, corners and vents you start moving again... 10 seconds later you die with no idea you were about to be attacked again.
I think later on Skulk scaling could be alot better than it is... but early game, if you are playing your skulk properly, their is no problem.... I'm just one of many that cant seem to play them well enough (yet.)
I can imagine that the people who are really good at playing Skulk are enjoying playing them much more than I do... but that is not to say I don't enjoy playing them. I just have a long way to go before I can consider myself to play skulk "well"
I'll just chime in here and offer the perfect solution to the whole hopping whenever attacked by skulks thing -- Make the marine's weapon either totally useless, accuracy-wise when jumping, or make it actually useless until he's on the ground again. This hopping thing is really annoying, because skulks are supposed to have the upper hand in close combat.
So instead of making the skulk fun and balanced vs marines by fixing the variable that ruined skulks (acceleration), you want to change some variables on the marine side?
How will this effect your ability to dodge swooping lerks and SS'ing fades ?
Also weapons that spray randomly belong in camperfest games like BF/COD/crap not NS2.
I play this game almost everyday for 5 months. 5 months of fun. Even when I losing over and over again, I was always in a good mood after the game, well, maybe not in exactly "good" mood, but without the negative certainly.
But the last few weeks every evening my mood after the game is getting worse and worse. Every time I stalking my prey and attacking from the shadows and die because my victim starts jump aside ... every time I get angry. I begin to hate Marines. I can't do anything with myself.
I hope that the next patch will correct this ridiculous situation with skulks vs marines, and I will stop angry and continue to enjoy this great game.
Yea, doesn't give you much hope, does it? Hey folks what do you want a complex game, or mostly mindless games.... FPS has nearly messed up the gaming community, luckily there are some gaming companies when making a FPS make it good job of it, like Deux Ex and so fourth and games of similar ilk.
Also weapons that spray randomly belong in camperfest games like BF/COD/crap not NS2.
So I take it you've only played about three games since NS1? The most successful competitive FPS game in history? Giant cones of fire. Weird.
You know why nobody makes FPS games that are "hardcore" like you want anymore? Two reasons, the first is that you are in the extreme minority of gamers and there's absolutely zero profit to be made making a game tailored to your ridiculous demands. The second is that people like you have incredibly crap attitudes anyway and nobody wants people like you playing their games. Look at how in fifteen words you managed to:
- Flippantly dismiss any sort of weapon fire pattern as "spraying".
- State that every game where you have to "spray" is therefore automatically a "camperfest", not to mention this includes an outright connotation that doing anything besides leaping around in circles = camping = bad.
- Toss out titles of two of the best-selling FPS franchises out there, because 'it's cool to hate popular games'. I'm sure this just got you a little hipster erection. You then dismiss them, and anything else with weapon fire patterns, as being "crap".
Seriously, I'm impressed at how you managed to try to cram three wordgames into that sentence. You should be a politician.
Even Dystopia took advantage of cones of fire and weapon inaccuracy for several weapons. I didn't hear you people whining. In fact, Dystopia was quite well-regarded. But I'm sure it was 'camperfest crap' and 'just like [insert popular to hate game title here]'. I love how you guys spew your elitist opinions like you're the #1 authority on what makes FPS games good.
NS2's depressing player levels suggests otherwise.
Yea, doesn't give you much hope, does it? Hey folks what do you want a complex game, or mostly mindless games.... FPS has nearly messed up the gaming community, luckily there are some gaming companies when making a FPS make it good job of it, like Deux Ex and so fourth and games of similar ilk.
you have no idea what you're talking about
Then educate, I've given reason why I don't see FPS has done any good, mindless fun maybe, but actually helps the gaming industry move or innovate, I doubt it.
Games like Dues ex and Thief actually gave the first person genre something to rely on, an improvement from the usual shoot things in front of you design of most FPS, but games like that are made rarely now.
In essence FPS should be side feature not a main one, because it hasn't really got any meat to it.
Think skulks need a VERY slight speed boost, nothing drastic (think hopping is fine). Look at stingreddog's youtube channel, marines are wiping skulks pretty easily. While aliens have superior numbers in the first battle, and a slight edge in enemy positional awareness, marines are still coming out on top pretty handily. A very small increase in inherent skulk speed should eliminate difficulty in closing ground, anything more would lopside engagements again.
I don't understand... Why are fully armored and armed men not supposed to be more agile in air than any four-legged predator.
Changing directions in mid-air is man's innate ability. And as we all know, even a human child can easily outrun any dog, cat or whatever you may compare a Skulk to.
Yea, doesn't give you much hope, does it? Hey folks what do you want a complex game, or mostly mindless games.... FPS has nearly messed up the gaming community, luckily there are some gaming companies when making a FPS make it good job of it, like Deux Ex and so fourth and games of similar ilk.
you have no idea what you're talking about
Then educate, I've given reason why I don't see FPS has done any good, mindless fun maybe, but actually helps the gaming industry move or innovate, I doubt it.
Games like Dues ex and Thief actually gave the first person genre something to rely on, an improvement from the usual shoot things in front of you design of most FPS, but games like that are made rarely now.
In essence FPS should be side feature not a main one, because it hasn't really got any meat to it.
You can't compare a strong singleplayer fps with a competitive multiplayer fps. Those are two different things. One depends on story and substance to be engaging in a purely solo experience. The other is all about measuring skill with others, and can be interesting enough without having much depth, as long as there's a high skill ceiling. Do you really think games like Quake, Unreal, Counterstrike, etc, ruined the fps genre?
It's like saying the 100m sprint shouldn't be a main feature on the olympics because it hasn't got any meat to it.
The issue is if you jump from above you'd be at about 9-10 speed, if the stars align and you actually collide with a marine while biting him the speed is reduced instantly to just below marine movement, if he then jumps in the opposite direction of where your facing 9/10 he gains more ground and can just shoot you.
If they fixed collision and changed the way speed is reduced is you'd probably fix this issue without changing any other values.
Also could not 'awesome' that gliss post anymore from before, holy shit at the end of the day even the worst player who couldn't bhop and got maybe 4 res from RFK still had a potential blast doing it, the 'vision' or 'culture' surrounding NS2 is woeful.
Stir you right up lol. I'm quite impressed with that.
Recoil in a game where you need to shoot at fast moving small targets just does not fit. Unless the design goal is to make everything slow down (starting with the skulk haha)
Forgive me for wanting a game that has a play style of rewarding movement, rather than taking cover to see your opponent before they see you.
Nobody making games for a particular crowd? True, and there are plenty of people making "realistic" cover based shooters with recoil etc. Hence why when people make suggestions trying to bring in ideas from the type of FPS that is at 100% market saturation people like me get angry. Can't we keep one game (like say this one) free from that stuff?
The fix to this problem is to make the skulks acceleration near to equivalent to the marine. FFS just tonight I jumped down and bit a marine twice from behind and before I got the third bite in, he leaps to safety and kills me. Absolute BS. Marine should not be that fast off the line relative to the skulk. When the marine leaps away, it looks on screen as if they are attached to a bungee cord that has just yanked them across the room.
The fix to this problem is to make the skulks acceleration near to equivalent to the marine. FFS just tonight I jumped down and bit a marine twice from behind and before I got the third bite in, he leaps to safety and kills me. Absolute BS. Marine should not be that fast off the line relative to the skulk. When the marine leaps away, it looks on screen as if they are attached to a bungee cord that has just yanked them across the room.
This. Skulk acceleration should be faster than marine, not vice versa.
I'm wondering if the Skulk got heavier. Maybe it's not the acceleration/friction change, but Skulks simply got fat? That's how they feel They have so much momentum... Where would I need to look for the Skulk parameters?
Also, I think UWE only gets stats from their servers (UWE Official).
On other servers (not necessarily modded, just not official), the player skill is usually higher, so the Skulk slowness has a much bigger influence.
On UWE servers, games are sometimes ok. The real bad stomps happen more frequently on non-UWE servers, and are a really big percentage of games.
Even modded servers? Because I don't think that would make sense.
There are a lot of vanilla "modded" servers (vote mod or something minor) that wouldn't get noticed this way.
I'm just saying that the problem appears more often on non-UWE official servers. So they might have a diferent view on it.
KasharicHull, EnglandJoin Date: 2013-03-27Member: 184473Members, Forum Admins, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, NS2 Community Developer
anyone else noticed a change in Skulks since the 244 release?
one of two things has happened... I've just gotten better at playing (laughable :P ) OR something has been done to skulks/marines that has made playing Skulk easier. Any info etc?
rather than the subjective suggestions to raise acceleration etc by arbitrary numbers; i think the focus should first be directed at making skulk movement more intuitive.
for example jumping at a marine from a higher elevation/walljump chain (high momentum) is useless, it has no benefits and only causes harm when you overshoot/bounce past him. ergo you're better off just holding control to drop, and that doesn't make any sense at all... it needs to be changed asap.
jumping off the ceiling onto a marine should have an incentive to justify the increased risk. essentially it doesn't matter whether it's increased acceleration, bite damage scaling up with speed or improved air control.
rather than the subjective suggestions to raise acceleration etc by arbitrary numbers; i think the focus should first be directed at making skulk movement more intuitive.
for example jumping at a marine from a higher elevation/walljump chain (high momentum) is useless, it has no benefits and only causes harm when you overshoot/bounce past him. ergo you're better off just holding control to drop, and that doesn't make any sense at all... it needs to be changed asap.
jumping off the ceiling onto a marine should have an incentive to justify the increased risk. essentially it doesn't matter whether it's increased acceleration, bite damage scaling up with speed or improved air control.
Agreed. The forward momentum of the wall jump should be replaced by a speed boost in the direction you are looking.
rather than the subjective suggestions to raise acceleration etc by arbitrary numbers; i think the focus should first be directed at making skulk movement more intuitive.
for example jumping at a marine from a higher elevation/walljump chain (high momentum) is useless, it has no benefits and only causes harm when you overshoot/bounce past him. ergo you're better off just holding control to drop, and that doesn't make any sense at all... it needs to be changed asap.
jumping off the ceiling onto a marine should have an incentive to justify the increased risk. essentially it doesn't matter whether it's increased acceleration, bite damage scaling up with speed or improved air control.
Agreed. The forward momentum of the wall jump should be replaced by a speed boost in the direction you are looking.
The problem with wall jump as I see it is that it just isn't enough of a boost and can't be kept well enough. If Skulks could manage an easy 9 or a hard 10, it'd be closer to the easy 9, hard 13 it was when I first learned to do it.
Of course, part of the reason we can't keep the old speeds is because we can no longer chain jumps as easily (due to the loss of a boost in the direction you jumped off of the wall). Yes, we had that once. You could jump off of a wall like a small leap. It was kind of powerful... and then it went away.
Or maybe I'm remembering it wrong after all of my time spent jumping off of comm chairs in a ring around the rosy game of death with marines in their bases.
Comments
I'll quote that because of how much this sums the problem here. Asymetric games are often very fun. Think: L4D 1 & 2, Alien vs Predator, or Zombie Panic, a CS: Source mod, opposing an ever-growing zombie teams (dead humans turn into zombies) against humans that lose close to 70% of the game. Still the best concept I ever played.
The problem is not that marines retain their accuracy while jumping. The problem is that a succesful dodge can put quite some distance between a skulk and marine, and that skulks are a bit too slow to close that gap again. I'm ok with how they reduced skulk air control, but a slight boost in acceleration and/or jump range for instance should make them a bit more resilient in close combat, without having to nerf marines.
True, but the game is highly balanced, this is because people will moan and moan on RTS games for not being balanced, here's one the new Widow Mine so many have complained about it or the Medivac Boost..... I say balance has to come first, or people won't play, even if its fun.
There are some changes happening for the Mine and Boost!
You used FPS as a balance argument which is wrong because everyone can get the same weapon, or same class, so there's no balance really to be had, but playing those games it's seems the devs want a certain things to be overpowered to make players feel they've achieved something, and game likes this where you having two sides which are different needs balance, or people won't play that broken side.
Then why are people complaining about the Marines then? You make it sound like the Aliens have just swapped position, because remove the Skulk are there's no complaints about the Aliens, if any are minor.
Then you playing against easy opponents, maybe I'm lucky that I get to play against regular players and high level Clans like Suanamen and Archea(might have spelled them wrong), also the ENSL gathers.
though I disagree about fun, if you going to use such a crass measurement, the rest of the Aliens lifeforms are fun and you could argue too easy, though as I said you play for different reasons, not just for mindless fun.
I wouldn't say Marines are easier because the higher lifeforms can easily solo any marine, the marines have always required more team work, also more attention to the map, I see the Marines having different requirement then the Aliens. While both need to do the same Aliens are able to attack and be more care-free, the Marines have to be more vigilant, also on guard.
Yea, doesn't give you much hope, does it? Hey folks what do you want a complex game, or mostly mindless games.... FPS has nearly messed up the gaming community, luckily there are some gaming companies when making a FPS make it good job of it, like Deux Ex and so fourth and games of similar ilk.
You're right and wrong, there's both elements are used and as I said earlier, this is where my gripe really is, the RTS elements does need more, the FPS side seems mostly fine... the RTS needs a buff. Though a reverse of the Aliens structure would be good, make the Gorge the mobile Commander again, though NS2 does have the ability to become a strong RTS game, also you make the mistake many do, you're experience a RTS game though and FPS format, you action are part of the Strategic side of the game.
I'll give you an example, in Chess you need to have favorable position like it any RTS game, you need to make sure you best Unit(pieces) stay alive you have to be cost effective, you need to counter each-other moves, you can just blindly go for it, I guess you can but that's where you could easily win or lose.
I say they're pretty similar, you just have to accept that RTS have moved on from Chess, but Chess is the main concept it's built upon.
chess is a turn based strategy game, RTS' are of course "real-time" strategy games... they are similar in some ways but VERY different in a majority of ways. when broken down to their skeletal structure yes... they both require strategy, planning and forethought. but that is where the similarities end. so you are both equally right.
I'm going to jump in and try and bring the thread back on topic
After playing alot these past 4 - 5 days I've come to realize a few things.
1: I suck as Skulk... (this is actually a very liberating thing to realize)
2: My K/D ratio as Marine (while lower than alot of other players) is pretty nice, playing marine is quick, easy and fun.
3: Playing commander is far less scary than I first thought.
Realizing I suck as Skulk wasn't simply me looking at my K/D and thinking "holy crap... 12 deaths - 2 kills I suck" (especially when compared to a few skulks who had 2 deaths - 14 kills)...it was me playing 10+ games in a row as a marine and seeing some people play Skulk really F***ing well. I've played against bad Skulks (the ones who run straight at you or don't move slowly to ambush) and then their are the good players... you know... the ones that you don't hear or see and suddenly you're being attacked, You juke, spin and they aren't anywhere to be seen, after checking ceilings, corners and vents you start moving again... 10 seconds later you die with no idea you were about to be attacked again.
I think later on Skulk scaling could be alot better than it is... but early game, if you are playing your skulk properly, their is no problem.... I'm just one of many that cant seem to play them well enough (yet.)
I can imagine that the people who are really good at playing Skulk are enjoying playing them much more than I do... but that is not to say I don't enjoy playing them. I just have a long way to go before I can consider myself to play skulk "well"
So instead of making the skulk fun and balanced vs marines by fixing the variable that ruined skulks (acceleration), you want to change some variables on the marine side?
How will this effect your ability to dodge swooping lerks and SS'ing fades ?
Also weapons that spray randomly belong in camperfest games like BF/COD/crap not NS2.
But the last few weeks every evening my mood after the game is getting worse and worse. Every time I stalking my prey and attacking from the shadows and die because my victim starts jump aside ... every time I get angry. I begin to hate Marines. I can't do anything with myself.
I hope that the next patch will correct this ridiculous situation with skulks vs marines, and I will stop angry and continue to enjoy this great game.
So I take it you've only played about three games since NS1? The most successful competitive FPS game in history? Giant cones of fire. Weird.
You know why nobody makes FPS games that are "hardcore" like you want anymore? Two reasons, the first is that you are in the extreme minority of gamers and there's absolutely zero profit to be made making a game tailored to your ridiculous demands. The second is that people like you have incredibly crap attitudes anyway and nobody wants people like you playing their games. Look at how in fifteen words you managed to:
- Flippantly dismiss any sort of weapon fire pattern as "spraying".
- State that every game where you have to "spray" is therefore automatically a "camperfest", not to mention this includes an outright connotation that doing anything besides leaping around in circles = camping = bad.
- Toss out titles of two of the best-selling FPS franchises out there, because 'it's cool to hate popular games'. I'm sure this just got you a little hipster erection. You then dismiss them, and anything else with weapon fire patterns, as being "crap".
Seriously, I'm impressed at how you managed to try to cram three wordgames into that sentence. You should be a politician.
Even Dystopia took advantage of cones of fire and weapon inaccuracy for several weapons. I didn't hear you people whining. In fact, Dystopia was quite well-regarded. But I'm sure it was 'camperfest crap' and 'just like [insert popular to hate game title here]'. I love how you guys spew your elitist opinions like you're the #1 authority on what makes FPS games good.
NS2's depressing player levels suggests otherwise.
Then educate, I've given reason why I don't see FPS has done any good, mindless fun maybe, but actually helps the gaming industry move or innovate, I doubt it.
Games like Dues ex and Thief actually gave the first person genre something to rely on, an improvement from the usual shoot things in front of you design of most FPS, but games like that are made rarely now.
In essence FPS should be side feature not a main one, because it hasn't really got any meat to it.
Changing directions in mid-air is man's innate ability. And as we all know, even a human child can easily outrun any dog, cat or whatever you may compare a Skulk to.
You can't compare a strong singleplayer fps with a competitive multiplayer fps. Those are two different things. One depends on story and substance to be engaging in a purely solo experience. The other is all about measuring skill with others, and can be interesting enough without having much depth, as long as there's a high skill ceiling. Do you really think games like Quake, Unreal, Counterstrike, etc, ruined the fps genre?
It's like saying the 100m sprint shouldn't be a main feature on the olympics because it hasn't got any meat to it.
I feel the speed is actually ok, it's acceleration that's the issue.
The issue is if you jump from above you'd be at about 9-10 speed, if the stars align and you actually collide with a marine while biting him the speed is reduced instantly to just below marine movement, if he then jumps in the opposite direction of where your facing 9/10 he gains more ground and can just shoot you.
If they fixed collision and changed the way speed is reduced is you'd probably fix this issue without changing any other values.
Also could not 'awesome' that gliss post anymore from before, holy shit at the end of the day even the worst player who couldn't bhop and got maybe 4 res from RFK still had a potential blast doing it, the 'vision' or 'culture' surrounding NS2 is woeful.
Stir you right up lol. I'm quite impressed with that.
Recoil in a game where you need to shoot at fast moving small targets just does not fit. Unless the design goal is to make everything slow down (starting with the skulk haha)
Forgive me for wanting a game that has a play style of rewarding movement, rather than taking cover to see your opponent before they see you.
Nobody making games for a particular crowd? True, and there are plenty of people making "realistic" cover based shooters with recoil etc. Hence why when people make suggestions trying to bring in ideas from the type of FPS that is at 100% market saturation people like me get angry. Can't we keep one game (like say this one) free from that stuff?
The fix to this problem is to make the skulks acceleration near to equivalent to the marine. FFS just tonight I jumped down and bit a marine twice from behind and before I got the third bite in, he leaps to safety and kills me. Absolute BS. Marine should not be that fast off the line relative to the skulk. When the marine leaps away, it looks on screen as if they are attached to a bungee cord that has just yanked them across the room.
This. Skulk acceleration should be faster than marine, not vice versa.
Where would I need to look for the Skulk parameters?
On other servers (not necessarily modded, just not official), the player skill is usually higher, so the Skulk slowness has a much bigger influence.
On UWE servers, games are sometimes ok. The real bad stomps happen more frequently on non-UWE servers, and are a really big percentage of games.
There are a lot of vanilla "modded" servers (vote mod or something minor) that wouldn't get noticed this way.
I'm just saying that the problem appears more often on non-UWE official servers. So they might have a diferent view on it.
Thanks
I don't always use the awesome button, but when I do, it's for something very awesome.
one of two things has happened... I've just gotten better at playing (laughable :P ) OR something has been done to skulks/marines that has made playing Skulk easier. Any info etc?
for example jumping at a marine from a higher elevation/walljump chain (high momentum) is useless, it has no benefits and only causes harm when you overshoot/bounce past him. ergo you're better off just holding control to drop, and that doesn't make any sense at all... it needs to be changed asap.
jumping off the ceiling onto a marine should have an incentive to justify the increased risk. essentially it doesn't matter whether it's increased acceleration, bite damage scaling up with speed or improved air control.
Agreed. The forward momentum of the wall jump should be replaced by a speed boost in the direction you are looking.
Just want to clarify momentum.
The problem with wall jump as I see it is that it just isn't enough of a boost and can't be kept well enough. If Skulks could manage an easy 9 or a hard 10, it'd be closer to the easy 9, hard 13 it was when I first learned to do it.
Of course, part of the reason we can't keep the old speeds is because we can no longer chain jumps as easily (due to the loss of a boost in the direction you jumped off of the wall). Yes, we had that once. You could jump off of a wall like a small leap. It was kind of powerful... and then it went away.
Or maybe I'm remembering it wrong after all of my time spent jumping off of comm chairs in a ring around the rosy game of death with marines in their bases.