<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i disagree, 3.0 is ready for a much borader audience. it may not be in final form but it needs to be balenced for the masses not a bunch of consties and vets who know it insidie and out. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I must disagree with this statement, though im neither vet nor constie. You cannot bent the game in every direction from where the wind blows. If you submit to any complain about this "imbalance" and that "overpower" you ruin the game. Because people complain about something they can't handle instead of finding a solution for it. So if you start tweaking and nerfing you will only create new imbalances and so on. On the other hand. you cannot balance the game based on the asumption that every player has clan skills and teamwork. Clanners may tell me how powerfull the fade is used in the right hands, but I simply see how easy it is to shred it with a shotgun, compared to slash the shotgunner, and see that the 2.0 fade is imbalanced. The problem with game developement is, that you must find a way to please both regulars and professional players. The key is it to find game mechanics, that can be exploited in ways not intended by the developers. Thats what professionals do. They find flaws that can be used to win. Like placing structures to distract sentries or OCs. Or hiding behind a reiling on a walkway where the Onos cant reach you and stomp does not affect you because you are on a diffetent floor level in terms of game mechanics. Or jumping on attacking skulks and sitting on their back while they are helpless..... That is not meant to criticise professional players. I fully understand why such tactics are used, and in clan environments, this is no problem. But such exploits and the balancing toward vet skills also affects pub play, simply because average Joe Pub has not the skills to use a fade properly and dies within 1 and a half seconds after gestation, wasting 50 res to 2 shotgunners with 20 res total, not killing even one.
Balancing this is increadibly difficult, I am well aware of that, and I honestly don't have a clue how to achieve something like real balance in something as complex as NS.
All I can suggest is, that the team should really think about what the mechanics should look like. Should a marine really be able to jump like a grasshopper to evade atttacks he was supposed to fend of from the distance? Should it be so much easier to shoot a single fade than to slash a single marine? should an Onos really be cheaper (reswhise) to compensate his weakness to gunfire, or should he instead be more powerfull like in 1.4? Is it a good thing that some people win because of some small weaknesses in the AI or the engine?
I honestly don't know, but im curious and I trust in the Teams descisions. ( as long sa they finally stop this annoying crackweaseljumping <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> )
<!--QuoteBegin--The Cheat+Jan 23 2004, 09:49 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (The Cheat @ Jan 23 2004, 09:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just read the email, Flay, and I can say that it will definitely help. The game is ready now as of 3.0g in my opinion. The new alien armor absorption changes are the biggest. It is closer to being balanced than it ever was from my playing experience, dating back to the JP-HMG rushes of 1.04 to the regeneration onos in 2.01.
Now is the time. The public awaits and I can tell them right now that 3.0 is kickass! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree, but if you need more players for betas, present and future, I don't think you should be cutting off the consties. Out of interest, what about the Vets? Obviously the PTs will still PT, right?
Meh, I don't know, I just know alot of **** off consties who sent you money to play betas aren't going to be very happy.
It is a donation, it is a way to support the game.
It is <b>not</b> a way to play the betas.
This idea should never have been enforced anyway (especially by the senoir NS community members), as, in the end, if consties do loose Beta-ship, then you're going to be **** off alot of people of whom you yourself said you've been living off (well, their donations at least).
I don't condone their actions & I certainly don't agree with them, but if you really need the funds so much, then why cut off your nose to spite your own face?
Just one mans opinion, but I'm sure it's alot of other peoples aswel.
People, stop arguing and complaining - this thread is for thanking the boss <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
As a constie, I'd like to say I like this. Just be sure to keep mentioning that it's still beta, so they hopefully won't be expecting a perfect product just yet. 3.0 still has issues, but it's getting to the point where it's very playable and fun, so I'm looking forward to having more people involved. Plus, after playing against so many really good players, it's nice to play against the public at times where I realize how much better I've gotten playing against really good players. I can just never tell cause the really good players still kill me too much. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Yeah she's definately ready, 3.0g is a treat.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When someone like CWAG says this, you know it's good! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
It's all good. NS 3.0 is soon to be released to the public anyways. <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
ShockehIf a packet drops on the web and nobody's near to see it...Join Date: 2002-11-19Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well. GG Forums. There will be a wave of nubs coming and complaining. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, but we'll get over the Veterans returning to the general forum I reckon. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
*Chuckle*
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->This idea should never have been enforced anyway (especially by the senoir NS community members), as, in the end, if consties do loose Beta-ship, then you're going to be **** off alot of people of whom you yourself said you've been living off (well, their donations at least). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, they were told it wasn't a Beta entry fee or anything, it was just an added benefit.
<!--QuoteBegin--Absolutionary+Jan 24 2004, 02:25 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Absolutionary @ Jan 24 2004, 02:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> not ready... not balanced enough, marines have upper hand even if you dont notice it now heres my prediction for the release day
1. Sensory fetish, everyone will want focus 2. at least 200 new posts in the general forum about how ns needs to be changed 3. 500x duplicate bug reports 4. Aliens getting taken out easily because onos can still be singled by one light marine 5. People who have never played the game will try it and get a bad impresion <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why are the vets and pts so apprehensive about this? Maybe they don't feel as important anymore <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->.
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:red'> be nice to new player if you meet them, our community needs them !!! </span></span>
<!--QuoteBegin--Invader Scoot+Jan 24 2004, 08:45 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Invader Scoot @ Jan 24 2004, 08:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Man... I really won't enjoy playing a game with people mic spamming about how weak onos and fade are now... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Then don't test this game. Or mute the person. This is better, you have to admit. If you don't like mic spammer and general idiots, join a favorite server that is running the latest 3.0 version and play there, with good admins or whatnot.
<!--QuoteBegin--Edgecrusher+Jan 24 2004, 09:15 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Edgecrusher @ Jan 24 2004, 09:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Why are the vets and pts so apprehensive about this? Maybe they don't feel as important anymore <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It's not that we won't feel as important, but consider most of us really enjoy this game, most of us would hate it to see NS lose it's repuation over something like this.
<!--QuoteBegin--BigBull+Jan 24 2004, 09:15 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BigBull @ Jan 24 2004, 09:15 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Thats why its BETA <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The average player base ( which we want to expand) won't know that, or care.
Well dont start pointing fingers and already bringing a bad vide before 3.0 is actually released.
no matter what people are gonna complain, its there loss. You can either tell them, or yell or just be upset about it,
Whining is gonna be there no matter what. Just suck it up and play <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Comments
i disagree, 3.0 is ready for a much borader audience. it may not be in final form but it needs to be balenced for the masses not a bunch of consties and vets who know it insidie and out.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I must disagree with this statement, though im neither vet nor constie.
You cannot bent the game in every direction from where the wind blows.
If you submit to any complain about this "imbalance" and that "overpower" you ruin the game.
Because people complain about something they can't handle instead of finding a solution for it.
So if you start tweaking and nerfing you will only create new imbalances and so on.
On the other hand. you cannot balance the game based on the asumption that every player has clan skills and
teamwork.
Clanners may tell me how powerfull the fade is used in the right hands, but I simply see how easy it is to shred it with a shotgun, compared to
slash the shotgunner, and see that the 2.0 fade is imbalanced.
The problem with game developement is, that you must find a way to please both regulars and professional players.
The key is it to find game mechanics, that can be exploited in ways not intended by the developers. Thats what professionals do.
They find flaws that can be used to win.
Like placing structures to distract sentries or OCs. Or hiding behind a reiling on a walkway where the Onos cant reach you and stomp does not affect you because you are on a diffetent floor level in terms of game mechanics. Or jumping on attacking skulks and sitting on their back while they are helpless.....
That is not meant to criticise professional players. I fully understand why such tactics are used, and in clan environments, this is no problem.
But such exploits and the balancing toward vet skills also affects pub play, simply because average Joe Pub has not the skills to use a fade properly and dies within 1 and a half seconds after gestation, wasting 50 res to 2 shotgunners with 20 res total, not killing even one.
Balancing this is increadibly difficult, I am well aware of that, and I honestly don't have a clue how to achieve something like real balance in
something as complex as NS.
All I can suggest is, that the team should really think about what the mechanics should look like. Should a marine really be able to jump like a
grasshopper to evade atttacks he was supposed to fend of from the distance?
Should it be so much easier to shoot a single fade than to slash a single marine?
should an Onos really be cheaper (reswhise) to compensate his weakness to gunfire, or should he instead be more powerfull like in 1.4?
Is it a good thing that some people win because of some small weaknesses in the AI or the engine?
I honestly don't know, but im curious and I trust in the Teams descisions. ( as long sa they finally stop this annoying crackweaseljumping <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> )
Meant yes, bring it on, im looking foward.
Now is the time. The public awaits and I can tell them right now that 3.0 is kickass! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree, but if you need more players for betas, present and future, I don't think you should be cutting off the consties. Out of interest, what about the Vets? Obviously the PTs will still PT, right?
Meh, I don't know, I just know alot of **** off consties who sent you money to play betas aren't going to be very happy.
It is a donation, it is a way to support the game.
It is <b>not</b> a way to play the betas.
This idea should never have been enforced anyway (especially by the senoir NS community members), as, in the end, if consties do loose Beta-ship, then you're going to be **** off alot of people of whom you yourself said you've been living off (well, their donations at least).
I don't condone their actions & I certainly don't agree with them, but if you really need the funds so much, then why cut off your nose to spite your own face?
Just one mans opinion, but I'm sure it's alot of other peoples aswel.
?@?@ | ƒm?@?@?@?@?@ ?R
?@?@/?@?@?œ?@?@?@?œ |?@?@?@steam!
?@ |?@?@?@?@( _?œ_)?@ ƒ~
?@œc¤?@?@?@|?¾|?@?@¤?M?_
/?@?Q?Q?@ ?Rƒm?@/?L>?@ )
(?Q?Q?Q?j?@?@?@/?@(_?^
?@|?@?@?@?@?@?@ /
?@|?@?@?^?_?@?_
?@|?@/?@?@?@ )?@ )
?@?¾?@?@?@ ?i?@ ?_
?@?@?@?@?@?@ ?_?Q) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
WTH?
People, stop arguing and complaining - this thread is for thanking the boss <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Good work, cant wait. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyway, bring 'em on, the more the merrier.
?@?@ | ƒm?@?@?@?@?@ ?R
?@?@/?@?@?œ?@?@?@?œ |?@?@?@steam!
?@ |?@?@?@?@( _?œ_)?@ ƒ~
?@œc¤?@?@?@|?¾|?@?@¤?M?_
/?@?Q?Q?@ ?Rƒm?@/?L>?@ )
(?Q?Q?Q?j?@?@?@/?@(_?^
?@|?@?@?@?@?@?@ /
?@|?@?@?^?_?@?_
?@|?@/?@?@?@ )?@ )
?@?¾?@?@?@ ?i?@ ?_
?@?@?@?@?@?@ ?_?Q) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
WTH? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You probably need to install a language packet to read that...
Because a number things can help the community and my personal community in itself.
This is great for gameplay attraction and possibly for the investing Flayra is looking for.
All i can say..
I cant wait.
When someone like CWAG says this, you know it's good! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yeah, but we'll get over the Veterans returning to the general forum I reckon. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
*Chuckle*
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->This idea should never have been enforced anyway (especially by the senoir NS community members), as, in the end, if consties do loose Beta-ship, then you're going to be **** off alot of people of whom you yourself said you've been living off (well, their donations at least).
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, they were told it wasn't a Beta entry fee or anything, it was just an added benefit.
Glass Half empty or half full....
Dont worry about it,
*Mute button muahahah
<!--QuoteBegin--Absolutionary+Jan 24 2004, 02:25 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Absolutionary @ Jan 24 2004, 02:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> not ready... not balanced enough, marines have upper hand even if you dont notice it now
heres my prediction for the release day
1. Sensory fetish, everyone will want focus
2. at least 200 new posts in the general forum about how ns needs to be changed
3. 500x duplicate bug reports
4. Aliens getting taken out easily because onos can still be singled by one light marine
5. People who have never played the game will try it and get a bad impresion <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Which I agree with.
and remember
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:red'>
be nice to new player if you meet them, our community needs them !!!
</span></span>
Then don't test this game. Or mute the person. This is better, you have to admit. If you don't like mic spammer and general idiots, join a favorite server that is running the latest 3.0 version and play there, with good admins or whatnot.
It's not that we won't feel as important, but consider most of us really enjoy this game, most of us would hate it to see NS lose it's repuation over something like this.
The average player base ( which we want to expand) won't know that, or care.
no matter what people are gonna complain, its there loss. You can either tell them, or yell or just be upset about it,
Whining is gonna be there no matter what. Just suck it up and play <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->