Detail Textures for NS?

KungFuDiscoMonkey · February 2004

I don't think so. I've been playing the HL:SP again on steam (I'm on "Lambda Core") and I haven't noticed any new details. Looks like the same old low res HL <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

BigD · February 2004

Oh wow, that wall in Yamazaki's example was good enough to get me on the bandwagon.

Tomorrow, or this weekend I'll try it out. My vid card is a TNT2, which is rather archaic, so I'll be able to give a good reply on the hit it takes when drawing the extra stuff. (It's not low, low end, but I notice damn near every little change in FPS with it anyway.)

Awesome stuff guys!

Reese · February 2004

That should definitley help in trying to prove a case for official mod support of this setting. I think that, given there isn't too substantial of a performance hit, being able to document what effects this settings has on performance will definitly make it more likely that Flayra could set this on by default, and make all our maps the prettier.

Also i'm curious about the method valve used for implementing this. Specifically if there's any kind of CSS type design where we could have master detail specifications and map specific ones to change some of the textures without having to redefine everything each time. (copying the text file isn't much, but copying/renaming the graphics seems kinda like a waste of space and energy)

**Edit: clarifications.

Cagey · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Reese @ Feb 12 2004, 10:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Also i'm curious about the method valve used for implementing this. Specifically if there's any kind of CSS type design where we could have master detail specifications and map specific ones to change some of the textures without having to redefine everything each time. (copying the text file isn't much, but copying/renaming the graphics seems kinda like a waste of space and energy)
 </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
I don't believe there is a heirarchy in place for this, but if a standard set of detail images becomes part of the mod, mappers would be able to reference them without renaming them.

BigD · February 2004

Not happening. I seem to have the same problem Soylent Green does. The command r_detailtextures just doesn't exist for me. Tried it in dev mode, a few other mods, nothing. Strange. Like it doesn't appear, even with steams "autocomplete" style feature, like other commands. It just isn't there. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' />

How is your guys steam setup? Just like every other steam? I'd really like to try this. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

Soylent_green · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Odd. If you type "r_de" into the console, the little autocomplete box should have "r_detailtextures 0" and "r_detailtexturessupported 1" in it. This is what I get:
</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

What I'm saying is that it doesn't:

Soylent_green · February 2004

Deleting the clientregistry.blob file and allowing steam to rebuild it does not help either.

Edit: Since this feature is simply overdrawing with another texture it should be available on all graphics cards. And since I'm using a radeon 9800pro and BigDXLT is using a Tnt-2 and we are having the same/similar problem it allmost certainly is not hardware related.

Reebdoog · February 2004

Yeh, im not getting this little feature either, using a GFmx440, so its def not hardware related, must be some settings somewhere?

Supernorn · February 2004

uh.....I just set r_detailtextures to "1" in the config found in nspt, and then set it to readonly.

Works fine for me.

prsearle · February 2004

Perhaps it's related to the games you have installed? I have HL, DOD, dedicated server and OpFor installed under "My Games". Possibly the engine update is only effective if you've installed a certain one?

Soylent_green · February 2004

Nope, I got all the official ones installed(even CS).

Reese · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 13 2004, 08:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Nope, I got all the official ones installed(even CS).  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Yeah, i'd blame CS.

Maybe someone should contact valve about the whole issue?

KungFuSquirrel · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Reese @ Feb 13 2004, 10:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Maybe someone should contact valve about the whole issue?  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Probably not a good idea. It seems that this feature was not intended to be used until after the CZ release...

Yamazaki · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (KungFuSquirrel @ Feb 13 2004, 07:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Reese @ Feb 13 2004, 10:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Maybe someone should contact valve about the whole issue? </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Probably not a good idea. It seems that this feature was not intended to be used until after the CZ release...  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Well... too bad <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

If they put it into the hands of their playerbase then it's going to get used, not mentioning it publically is no safeguard against curious users.

Belgarion · February 2004

lol. i love it. the public will educate itself, or at least a few iquisitive people will make sure the public is notified. if they havn't said we can't use it, why not? they've already given it to us. it would be a waste <i>not</i> to use it!

:edit: they = valve

Xyth · February 2004

Hmmm, I don't have it listed either, my thoughts are that perhaps it's not supposed to be listed yet except some setting is changed on a few of your guys steam that allowed it to be viewed.
Anyway, Im 100% for releasing this before CZ comes out, all the more reason for people to play NS <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

Rokiyo · February 2004

r_detailtextures works fine for me. I have every official game except for DMC, plus Sven Coop, NS and Spirit of Halflife as 3rd Party Games.

EDIT: Also, I have played HL, DoD, CS and Op4 all atleast once through steam. Perhaps you need to run one of the above atleast once to get it to work?

Reese · February 2004

Maybe it was something that accidentally slipped through the cracks. Kinda like constie members being listed as "Flayra" instead of NSPlayer for that one patch. In that case it may not be universally supported on all systems until cs-cz comes out.

BigD · February 2004

Played every mod in there at least once. (Played the first hour of halflife as well.)

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' />

I'm thinking Reese is correct in that it's just not always there. Not "intended" to be released so to speak.

Rokiyo · February 2004

hmm well perhaps it could either be automatically detected depending on your hardware, or like the console was in HL1 where you couldn't turn it on without putting in some command line switches.

Try putting -r_detailtexturessupported 1 in the "Launch Options" of Half-Life, and see if it makes any difference. Also, what video card and OS are you running? I've got a Geforce FX 5600 running on Windows XP.

There has to be some pattern to it, as we all know computers aren't capable of being truly random.

brute_force · February 2004

It works for me. If I type in r_det then it shows in that dropdown thing... whatever. Hmm, maybe I should use this for my map.

Hand_Me_The_Gun_And_Ask_Me_Again · February 2004

Works fine on this 'ere Geforce 4Ti, Win98SE blah.

I've been experimenting a little, and it looks like the scale numbers are how many times the detail texture is tiled across the parent texture, regardless of its size.

If you have a 256x128 parent texture, for example, and set the X and Y scaling for the detail texture to both be 10, you'll have the texture looking 'squashed', as it'll be tiling it ten times across 256 horizontal texels and ten times across 128 vertical texels. It looks a bit strange as a result, so set X to 10, Y to 5.

Likewise, if you've got a smaller texture, the detail will be, um, much more detailed than on a larger texture. If you want details to appear the same on a 128x128 texture as on a 256x256 texture, halve the scaling values.

It looks a pretty nifty feature; Someplace Else is already being detailed. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

Soylent_green · February 2004

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

I installed the latest cats today. They fixed the problem, so it appears that it is infact a hardware/driver issue. I reinstalled the old drivers again to see if support was for some reason missing in the old driver, but it still worked so it appears my old driver install got borked somehow <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' />.

Is anyone with a geforce 3 ti or higher, radeon 8500 or higher experiencing this problem? Is any one with older hardware not experiencing a problem?

I would still find it very strange if this was a hardware problem since the effect is pretty much like a light map with higher detail repeated over a surface. Although on older hardware they might have to do another pass to apply it and that might mean extra programming that VALVe didn't wan't to do or something(?).

edit: Maybe VALVe implemented it as a shader?

Reebdoog · February 2004

Lets all put down some sys specs and see what is similar to the machines that have this option, and which ones don't.

I dont have the detailtextures option.
WinXP, Geforce 4 440mx running det drivers 6.14.10.5303
Steam with - CS, DOD, TFC, Deathmatch Classic, Op Force. 3rd Party - Op force CTF and NS.
Steam Settings - OpenGL 1024x768 32bpp

Soylent_green · February 2004

I have it now that drivers are no longer bOrked.

Steam with all the trimings NS and sven co-op
Running cat 4.2, used to run 3.6. Both run fine(when not b0rked).
Steam Settings - OpenGL 800x600 32bpp, 160 Hz.
edit: (doh) radeon 9800 pro 128 MB

DarkATi · February 2004

I have r_detailtextures 1

Specs:

Installed Games: CS, DoD, TFC, HL, NS 2.01, NS 3.0 Beta Patch 3
Hardware Specs: ATi Radeon 9700 Pro All-In-Wonder
CPU - 2.66Ghz P4, 1.0Gb RAM, 120GB WD HDD, Gigabyte Mobo

~ DarkATi

Mouse · February 2004

so is anyone planning on releasing a set of detail textures?

coil · February 2004

I do not have the r_detailtextures variable accessible (putting "r_det" in console shows no commands). Win2kSP4, GeForce2MX32. Only have HL, Op4, and many 3rd-party mods installed.

DarkATi · February 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mouse @ Feb 17 2004, 02:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> so is anyone planning on releasing a set of detail textures?  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Booyah!

<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=63170' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...showtopic=63170</a>

~ DarkATi

Reese · February 2004

I think the detail textures bit is somehow graphics driver related. We've had at least one instance where the only system change made was a more recent driver and it solved the problem. I think that should be the first thing you might want to check coil. I don't really understand why it's a current driver issue but it seems to be. I guess check back in if that doesn't fix it up.

Detail Textures for NS?

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