<!--quoteo(post=1851359:date=Jun 9 2011, 08:20 PM:name=Floodinator)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Floodinator @ Jun 9 2011, 08:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851359"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If this gets in i would start playing the "picasso"-style gorge <3<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If there might be server issues keeping the gorge's patch out there, how about another way? What if when the gorge spray is linked to the main infestation, it poofs out of existence and gets replaced by a full comm-size patch? Just do a quick check upon application: If a commander patch has a radius of... 3, whenever the gorge lays a patch, check if it's within 3 units of a section of connected main infestation. If so, have it lay a full-sized patch. Maybe use more energy than normal when this happens.
Other option: If bilebomb can spread infestation, let that become permanent when attached to the main growth. It takes up more energy, so growth could still be paced.
The problem with gorge doing any permanent infestation is it destroys the pacing of expansion. The alien comm has to balance energy between infestation, spawning floaties, and other goodies. If gorge can just spam, the entire map will be green before you know it.
IeptBarakatThe most difficult name to speak ingame.Join Date: 2009-07-10Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
If the Gorge gets his web abilities back as a purchasable player upgrade. That uses spit on infestation to make infestation webs. That would work well in making sure pesky marines aren't sprinting and flying around your bases. Naturally they could be burnt to a crisp by flamethrowers(large scale) and welders(small scale).
And if the infestation dies, the webbing would wither away.
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited June 2011
<!--quoteo(post=1851512:date=Jun 10 2011, 09:38 AM:name=kabab)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kabab @ Jun 10 2011, 09:38 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851512"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Either power nodes or the ARC should kill infestation..
The biggest problem currently is that infestation takes over the map and marines end up spending 95% of the time weed wacking...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agree. I don't know why they increased the infestation health. It's ridiculous that marines have to spend almost 2 entire clips of flamethrower to kill a single patch. One clip should take out 2 or 3 patches. And PLEASE fix the issue where marines can take out the infestation nexus of a hive without killing the hive. It's so crippling to the aliens because all their structures die and you can't place any more infestation that stays.
<!--quoteo(post=1851418:date=Jun 10 2011, 06:09 AM:name=Deadzone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Deadzone @ Jun 10 2011, 06:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851418"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Regarding making the Gorge's stuff permanent
If there might be server issues keeping the gorge's patch out there, how about another way? What if when the gorge spray is linked to the main infestation, it poofs out of existence and gets replaced by a full comm-size patch? Just do a quick check upon application: If a commander patch has a radius of... 3, whenever the gorge lays a patch, check if it's within 3 units of a section of connected main infestation. If so, have it lay a full-sized patch. Maybe use more energy than normal when this happens.
Other option: If bilebomb can spread infestation, let that become permanent when attached to the main growth. It takes up more energy, so growth could still be paced.
The problem with gorge doing any permanent infestation is it destroys the pacing of expansion. The alien comm has to balance energy between infestation, spawning floaties, and other goodies. If gorge can just spam, the entire map will be green before you know it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Although if the gorge is spreading infestation, he isn't fighting.
So it slows down expansion in the sense that they can't blow stuff up as well or contest areas as much.
I would prefer growth as a name honestly, croach just sounds like crotch. All the other names are words, croach isn't a word.
As to resources, I honestly think that the commander role itself should have personal and team resources, not the player using it, it doesn't make a lot of sense for the player to spend their own money on stuff, and you do have a need for a tech resource and a stuff resource.
Failing that however, move all the commander stuff over to team resources, and add extractor upgrades back in, players need more personal resources later in the game because currently there is a severe deficit in personal res later on when people are dying more, being able to spend team resources to make more personal resources is sensible as currently there's a huge float of team resources. Combine that with increased team resource use because it's now used to buy commander stuff (I also suggest putting alien prices up for things as they have fewer structures to buy, therefore they need to be more expensive) and you should fix the resource problems.
If you're shying away from having aliens put lots of money into all their structures, consider charging team resources for infestation patches, one res per patch should give aliens a steady resource sink in line with marines spending money on ARCs and medpacks and suchlike, although personally I think medpacks should be energy based like before, they're annoying enough to use as it is, I don't want to have to pay money for them as well.
<!--quoteo(post=1851518:date=Jun 10 2011, 12:50 PM:name=TravCarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TravCarp @ Jun 10 2011, 12:50 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851518"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Creep :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah, figured that one might step on some toes though :P
<!--quoteo(post=1851548:date=Jun 10 2011, 01:47 PM:name=Typhon)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Typhon @ Jun 10 2011, 01:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851548"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah, figured that one might step on some toes though :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Eh it's more of a word that describes the action. There shouldn't be any stepping on toes I would like to think.
<!--quoteo(post=1851566:date=Jun 10 2011, 02:20 PM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 10 2011, 02:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851566"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's also wholesale stealing from starcraft.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because they got to use the word first, because it "feels" like it fits with Starcraft, does that mean that no one else can use it? That's BS man. Now I understand using words that directly relate to Starcraft like their heroes and worlds would fall under the issue of copyright. BUT I highly doubt you can copyright a ###### word from a dictionary. Prove me wrong, please.
<!--coloro:#00BFFF--><span style="color:#00BFFF"><!--/coloro-->Edit: I think we are on the wrong topic, are we not suppose to be on the twitter one talking about the infestation?<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Here is a quote from the wiki for ns2, hopefully this will help your creativity guise.
"The Khaara creatures themselves did not start from bacteria, various alien creatures were "infected" by this alien infestation, which evolves and mutates the creatures into what is referred to as the Khaara. It evolved them to be better fighters, builders, and lovers (you should see the amount of women the gorge gets). So, spike claws to walk on walls, or slash through armor, or spikes that can shoot from tubes on the side of the head.
Evolving armor is a natural step in the mutation, especially after years of encounters with the marines. This starts as small bone bits that break through the surface of the skin and form into little bone clusters. In specific areas of vulnerability these continue to spread and grow and build up to form into larger bone plates that serve as armor."
swalkSay hello to my little friend.Join Date: 2011-01-20Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->- Allow MACs to heal ARCs and other MACs<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Please also let MACs repair Marines armor, instead of medpack doing it!
<!--quoteo(post=1851572:date=Jun 10 2011, 07:30 PM:name=TravCarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TravCarp @ Jun 10 2011, 07:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851572"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Because they got to use the word first, because it "feels" like it fits with Starcraft, does that mean that no one else can use it? That's BS man. Now I understand using words that directly relate to Starcraft like their heroes and worlds would fall under the issue of copyright. BUT I highly doubt you can copyright a ###### word from a dictionary. Prove me wrong, please.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Whether it's copyrighted is irrelevant, it's still clearly stealing from starcraft.
Starcraft makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Unless nobody at UWE has ever heard of stacraft, that's fairly obviously stealing ideas from starcraft.
Which is exactly what everyone who reviews the game will say, along with 'these guys clearly have no talent' and similar criticisms levied against people who blatantly steal crap from other games.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Prevalence of commander hand-offs part-way through game because comm out of personal resources (would never happen assist abilities cost team resources) - Consider changing med and ammo back to team resources (but this will give aliens waay too many team resources). I don’t like this one bit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why not make some tweaks to the "energy" resource and use that as the basis for dropping medpacks and ammo?
Also, while on the topic of energy. I think it would be great if energy pools could be combined among the different hives or command chairs to allow the commander to use his energy based actions without having to click on the individual hive or cc.
<!--quoteo(post=1851633:date=Jun 10 2011, 03:00 PM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 10 2011, 03:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851633"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Starcraft makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's called infestation in NS2, not creep. Also, Starcraft was not the first to come up with an alien race that expands via living bio-goo.
I might warm up to croach ..just wish it didn't sounds so similar to creep and crotch. :\ sorry first thing that popped in my head when I read it.
As for how gorge infestation should interact with pustules/com growth.... create it so pustules (along with hives), have a radius around them that will eventually fill up with their own infestation. On top of that, they have a second longer radius that allows gorge/(and comm?) infestation to become permanent once its connected to the permanent infestation within the smaller radius. Gorge still can spread infestation the same way they currently do, but if they do it within range of the pustule, it can become permanent..but again only up to a certain range from the pustule.
Picture below: black dots are pustule, brown is what the pustule grows itself, and orange is where gorges and comm infestation can expand on
1. To solve problem of comms swapping when one runs out of personal res, you could zero out a player's personal res when they become comm. Or to be less harsh, 'bank' it, so they drop to zero upon entering the comm chair, but when they leave they get back what they had when they entered. On the other hand, is swapping comms to make more efficient use of resources a bad thing? Why does it need to be prevented?
2. I think it would be awesome if the 'pheromone' system for alien comm gave benefits to the alien players, in similar veins to med/ammo/catpacks from the marine comm (and would cost personal res accordingly, and since they'd affect a largish area and multiple units for some period of time, would cost probably 5-10 pres). Aside from signaling an area to the alien players you could do things like: - Attack: faster attack speed - Defend: some damage negation - Caution: Marine units in area become tagged on hivesight even if not visible/parasited/on infestation - Gather: if at least 3 aliens in area, all gain extra HP and/or armor which slowly decays once they leave/effect expires (overheal)
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=NS2 Design Log)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NS2 Design Log)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->- Consider changing med and ammo back to team resources (but this will give aliens waay too many team resources). I don't like this one bit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That doesn't connect at all. It's like saying "We're adding in Hydras, so we need to increase personal res flow for both sides."
The only thing that changes is the opportunity cost of med/ammo. Instead of sacrificing a MAC or ARC (things that <i>should</i> cost team resources as well), you're sacrificing tech/structures.
As long as med/ammo can compete with the other options for spending team resources (structures, upgrades, etc) it's fine.
<!--quoteo(post=1851662:date=Jun 11 2011, 01:09 AM:name=jkflipflop)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jkflipflop @ Jun 11 2011, 01:09 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851662"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's called infestation in NS2, not creep. Also, Starcraft was not the first to come up with an alien race that expands via living bio-goo.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1851633:date=Jun 10 2011, 03:00 PM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Jun 10 2011, 03:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851633"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Whether it's copyrighted is irrelevant, it's still clearly stealing from starcraft.
Starcraft makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Unless nobody at UWE has ever heard of stacraft, that's fairly obviously stealing ideas from starcraft.
Which is exactly what everyone who reviews the game will say, along with 'these guys clearly have no talent' and similar criticisms levied against people who blatantly steal crap from other games.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Unkown Worlds is stealing more than just the idea of creep from Starcraft. Starcraft also has guns and aliens, Natural Selection has these too. coincidence? I think not.
Comments
Yes please.
If there might be server issues keeping the gorge's patch out there, how about another way? What if when the gorge spray is linked to the main infestation, it poofs out of existence and gets replaced by a full comm-size patch? Just do a quick check upon application: If a commander patch has a radius of... 3, whenever the gorge lays a patch, check if it's within 3 units of a section of connected main infestation. If so, have it lay a full-sized patch. Maybe use more energy than normal when this happens.
Other option: If bilebomb can spread infestation, let that become permanent when attached to the main growth. It takes up more energy, so growth could still be paced.
The problem with gorge doing any permanent infestation is it destroys the pacing of expansion. The alien comm has to balance energy between infestation, spawning floaties, and other goodies. If gorge can just spam, the entire map will be green before you know it.
Muck
Junk
Slime
Ooze
Goo
Gunk
Mat (in the 'bacterial mat' sense)
The biggest problem currently is that infestation takes over the map and marines end up spending 95% of the time weed wacking...
And if the infestation dies, the webbing would wither away.
Muck
Junk
Slime
Ooze
Goo
Gunk
Mat (in the 'bacterial mat' sense)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Creep :)
The biggest problem currently is that infestation takes over the map and marines end up spending 95% of the time weed wacking...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agree. I don't know why they increased the infestation health. It's ridiculous that marines have to spend almost 2 entire clips of flamethrower to kill a single patch. One clip should take out 2 or 3 patches. And PLEASE fix the issue where marines can take out the infestation nexus of a hive without killing the hive. It's so crippling to the aliens because all their structures die and you can't place any more infestation that stays.
If there might be server issues keeping the gorge's patch out there, how about another way? What if when the gorge spray is linked to the main infestation, it poofs out of existence and gets replaced by a full comm-size patch? Just do a quick check upon application: If a commander patch has a radius of... 3, whenever the gorge lays a patch, check if it's within 3 units of a section of connected main infestation. If so, have it lay a full-sized patch. Maybe use more energy than normal when this happens.
Other option: If bilebomb can spread infestation, let that become permanent when attached to the main growth. It takes up more energy, so growth could still be paced.
The problem with gorge doing any permanent infestation is it destroys the pacing of expansion. The alien comm has to balance energy between infestation, spawning floaties, and other goodies. If gorge can just spam, the entire map will be green before you know it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Although if the gorge is spreading infestation, he isn't fighting.
So it slows down expansion in the sense that they can't blow stuff up as well or contest areas as much.
I would prefer growth as a name honestly, croach just sounds like crotch. All the other names are words, croach isn't a word.
As to resources, I honestly think that the commander role itself should have personal and team resources, not the player using it, it doesn't make a lot of sense for the player to spend their own money on stuff, and you do have a need for a tech resource and a stuff resource.
Failing that however, move all the commander stuff over to team resources, and add extractor upgrades back in, players need more personal resources later in the game because currently there is a severe deficit in personal res later on when people are dying more, being able to spend team resources to make more personal resources is sensible as currently there's a huge float of team resources. Combine that with increased team resource use because it's now used to buy commander stuff (I also suggest putting alien prices up for things as they have fewer structures to buy, therefore they need to be more expensive) and you should fix the resource problems.
If you're shying away from having aliens put lots of money into all their structures, consider charging team resources for infestation patches, one res per patch should give aliens a steady resource sink in line with marines spending money on ARCs and medpacks and suchlike, although personally I think medpacks should be energy based like before, they're annoying enough to use as it is, I don't want to have to pay money for them as well.
Yeah, figured that one might step on some toes though :P
Eh it's more of a word that describes the action. There shouldn't be any stepping on toes I would like to think.
Because they got to use the word first, because it "feels" like it fits with Starcraft, does that mean that no one else can use it? That's BS man. Now I understand using words that directly relate to Starcraft like their heroes and worlds would fall under the issue of copyright. BUT I highly doubt you can copyright a ###### word from a dictionary. Prove me wrong, please.
Mold is another good one (how did I miss that?)
blot
rot
fungus
alien herpes
derpes
herpaderpes
scourge
mould
plasmo (latin: to mould)
morbus (latin: sickness, disease)
edit: wrong thread, could a kindly mod please move this to the twitter feedback thread?
alien cuisine?
New name for infestation... 'Strain'
Here is a quote from the wiki for ns2, hopefully this will help your creativity guise.
"The Khaara creatures themselves did not start from bacteria, various alien creatures were "infected" by this alien infestation, which evolves and mutates the creatures into what is referred to as the Khaara. It evolved them to be better fighters, builders, and lovers (you should see the amount of women the gorge gets). So, spike claws to walk on walls, or slash through armor, or spikes that can shoot from tubes on the side of the head.
Evolving armor is a natural step in the mutation, especially after years of encounters with the marines. This starts as small bone bits that break through the surface of the skin and form into little bone clusters. In specific areas of vulnerability these continue to spread and grow and build up to form into larger bone plates that serve as armor."
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/index.php/Aliens" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/index.php/Aliens</a>
Please also let MACs repair Marines armor, instead of medpack doing it!
Then I Googled the definition for "encroach"
And now I LOVE the word "Croach", such a witty pun/play of words.
Medpacks no longer heal armor.
I hope welders come soon, early rushes force marines to buy robotics factories early on for macs.
Whether it's copyrighted is irrelevant, it's still clearly stealing from starcraft.
Starcraft makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Unless nobody at UWE has ever heard of stacraft, that's fairly obviously stealing ideas from starcraft.
Which is exactly what everyone who reviews the game will say, along with 'these guys clearly have no talent' and similar criticisms levied against people who blatantly steal crap from other games.
- Consider changing med and ammo back to team resources (but this will give aliens waay too many team resources). I don’t like this one bit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why not make some tweaks to the "energy" resource and use that as the basis for dropping medpacks and ammo?
Also, while on the topic of energy. I think it would be great if energy pools could be combined among the different hives or command chairs to allow the commander to use his energy based actions without having to click on the individual hive or cc.
I hope welders come soon, early rushes force marines to buy robotics factories early on for macs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They still do actually, as long as your health is less than 100.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's called infestation in NS2, not creep. Also, Starcraft was not the first to come up with an alien race that expands via living bio-goo.
As for how gorge infestation should interact with pustules/com growth.... create it so pustules (along with hives), have a radius around them that will eventually fill up with their own infestation. On top of that, they have a second longer radius that allows gorge/(and comm?) infestation to become permanent once its connected to the permanent infestation within the smaller radius. Gorge still can spread infestation the same way they currently do, but if they do it within range of the pustule, it can become permanent..but again only up to a certain range from the pustule.
Picture below: black dots are pustule, brown is what the pustule grows itself, and orange is where gorges and comm infestation can expand on
<img src="http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/zz40/OutlawD1/pustule-infestation-1.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
1. To solve problem of comms swapping when one runs out of personal res, you could zero out a player's personal res when they become comm. Or to be less harsh, 'bank' it, so they drop to zero upon entering the comm chair, but when they leave they get back what they had when they entered. On the other hand, is swapping comms to make more efficient use of resources a bad thing? Why does it need to be prevented?
2. I think it would be awesome if the 'pheromone' system for alien comm gave benefits to the alien players, in similar veins to med/ammo/catpacks from the marine comm (and would cost personal res accordingly, and since they'd affect a largish area and multiple units for some period of time, would cost probably 5-10 pres). Aside from signaling an area to the alien players you could do things like:
- Attack: faster attack speed
- Defend: some damage negation
- Caution: Marine units in area become tagged on hivesight even if not visible/parasited/on infestation
- Gather: if at least 3 aliens in area, all gain extra HP and/or armor which slowly decays once they leave/effect expires (overheal)
That doesn't connect at all. It's like saying "We're adding in Hydras, so we need to increase personal res flow for both sides."
The only thing that changes is the opportunity cost of med/ammo. Instead of sacrificing a MAC or ARC (things that <i>should</i> cost team resources as well), you're sacrificing tech/structures.
As long as med/ammo can compete with the other options for spending team resources (structures, upgrades, etc) it's fine.
Read the entire conversation.
Starcraft makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Then NS2 comes along and makes this weird alien stuff that grows over the floor and calls it creep.
Unless nobody at UWE has ever heard of stacraft, that's fairly obviously stealing ideas from starcraft.
Which is exactly what everyone who reviews the game will say, along with 'these guys clearly have no talent' and similar criticisms levied against people who blatantly steal crap from other games.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unkown Worlds is stealing more than just the idea of creep from Starcraft. Starcraft also has guns and aliens, Natural Selection has these too. coincidence? I think not.