<!--quoteo(post=1844771:date=May 8 2011, 01:52 AM:name=l3lessed)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (l3lessed @ May 8 2011, 01:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844771"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My thought on this is to allow aliens on the floor to also activate the umbra ability by attacking or using the structure.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> This was how I thought it was going to work when I heard of structures having a "triggerable" effect, and I would love to see it added in.
a) Does anyone else think the activatable abilitys (Umbra etc) are pretty useless - especially because this structures need a lot protection and the effect is only around the structure as center point? b) With the idea linking them to the tech as requirement to unlock other lifeforms, doesnt itmake themt even more useless since you want them save... => at your hive.
You cant use these structures offensive, all you can do is exploit that the effect goes trough some walls, but most of the time you just spam your hive room with them.
PS: Whips are a joke(no range no dmg and as i said activatable abilitys suck), hydras and crags are the only structures ppl really use. (1 whip for the upgrades, then let your guys spamm hydras everywhere and keep them alive with crags)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually I put them wherever they're needed. Put some in the hive first sure, but put them elsewhere as well. The hive fairly quikcly becomes saturated with them.
Whips could use a buff but crags are pretty good. I would change activated abilities so that they trigger automatically, if someone is attacking in range of a whip, the whip should trigger fury, if a crag or a structure near it gets shot it, the crag should trigger umbra.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Whips could use a buff but crags are pretty good. I would change activated abilities so that they trigger automatically, if someone is attacking in range of a whip, the whip should trigger fury, if a crag or a structure near it gets shot it, the crag should trigger umbra.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This would be a good alternative too. It would make the buildings feel like they're alive and part of the kharaa. It would also force marines to make critical decisions if he wants to solo a building, trigger an ability, and hopefully not die from it or if he wants to call for backup.
the only thing I would worry about is marine abuse. Shooting the structure with one bullet to trigger the ability and just waiting the 10 seconds or so then repeating until the structure is out of energy or abilities triggering when not needed like a crag using umbra when he is hit by a seige cannon through the wall. By the way, I would prefer getting rid of energy on alien structures and switching to just a standard cool down alternative. This is what the majority of other games have switched to or atleast some hybrid version.
<!--quoteo(post=1844788:date=May 8 2011, 12:26 AM:name=l3lessed)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (l3lessed @ May 8 2011, 12:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844788"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would prefer getting rid of energy on alien structures and switching to just a standard cool down alternative. This is what the majority of other games have switched to or atleast some hybrid version.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Players want things to do, and competitive players also want their abilities challenged. For units that have multiple abilities, a cooldown-management system works great because the skill-based mechanic is then managing cooldowns. However, if you're only ever actively using one ability, you're essentially waiting around to push the same button, and that's hardly fun, and there's no room for player skill to make any difference. In this case a Mana-management system better facilitates skill, allowing smarter players to pace themselves or go all in when the opportunities arise.
<!--quoteo(post=1844773:date=May 7 2011, 09:02 PM:name=PsiWarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsiWarp @ May 7 2011, 09:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844773"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I just hope they beef up the Whip's range and damage as they are currently negligible as defenses. Bombard will be nice to have, but will require extensive attention from the comm due to being a target ability and we all know how slow Whips crawl :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Now that you mention it, it does seem sort of backwards. Relying on Lash's short range makes it a defenseless structure against any Marine, save for the first time a Marine stumbles upon it and gets hit once, but then knows better than to get hit again. It doesn't feel like a very offensive (or useful) structure. Seems like it would be more useful/dangerous if Bombard was the passive attack and Lash was the researchable, activated ability. This gives me an <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=113384" target="_blank">idea</a>
<!--quoteo(post=1844788:date=May 8 2011, 05:26 AM:name=l3lessed)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (l3lessed @ May 8 2011, 05:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844788"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This would be a good alternative too. It would make the buildings feel like they're alive and part of the kharaa. It would also force marines to make critical decisions if he wants to solo a building, trigger an ability, and hopefully not die from it or if he wants to call for backup.
the only thing I would worry about is marine abuse. Shooting the structure with one bullet to trigger the ability and just waiting the 10 seconds or so then repeating until the structure is out of energy or abilities triggering when not needed like a crag using umbra when he is hit by a seige cannon through the wall. By the way, I would prefer getting rid of energy on alien structures and switching to just a standard cool down alternative. This is what the majority of other games have switched to or atleast some hybrid version.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Make it activate if <structure> within <range> of the crag takes <x> points of bullet damage within <y> seconds.
Essentially exactly as a commander would do it, the general rule for comms is trigger the umbra when marines are shooting the place up, and happily, 'shooting the place up' can be defined quite easily in code.
<!--quoteo(post=1844785:date=May 8 2011, 05:26 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ May 8 2011, 05:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844785"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Actually I put them wherever they're needed. Put some in the hive first sure, but put them elsewhere as well. The hive fairly quikcly becomes saturated with them.
Whips could use a buff but crags are pretty good. I would change activated abilities so that they trigger automatically, if someone is attacking in range of a whip, the whip should trigger fury, if a crag or a structure near it gets shot it, the crag should trigger umbra.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This just works because the current di system is overpowered.(+ ft to destroy it sucks) => you cant fight it. So aliens got map control more or less all the time.
I agree there should be the possibility to set umbra etc on autotrigger like you know it from wc3 etc. (I wonder how cloak will work - since i heard it will be a trigger ability too. >_>)
<!--quoteo(post=1844788:date=May 8 2011, 05:26 AM:name=l3lessed)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (l3lessed @ May 8 2011, 05:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844788"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->the only thing I would worry about is marine abuse. Shooting the structure with one bullet to trigger the ability and just waiting the 10 seconds or so then repeating until the structure is out of energy or abilities triggering when not needed like a crag using umbra when he is hit by a seige cannon through the wall.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The "shoot once, wait 10 seconds" part sounds like acceptable abuse of game mechanics, since all structural defences can ultimately only delay the enemy until real players arrive to defend properly. Detecting if damage was taken by bullets as opposed to explosions or siege blasts shouldn't be too hard for them to handle since the game is already smart enough to block bullets and only bullets when umbra is active.
i had the same idea. Just give those structures some range and let the ability be triggered there. A template with the current effect range just that it can be placed in a larger area around the structure. Requirement to do this is infestation - the structure sends bacteria trough the infestation to the desired position. Or something like that.
<!--quoteo(post=1844636:date=May 7 2011, 04:38 PM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ May 7 2011, 04:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844636"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Except you can't.
So your choices are, One CC, in one room, with one group of spawns and set of defences and resource income, or more than one room/set of spawns/defences/resources.
Which makes the more than one substantially more secure. At some point it becomes far more valuable to spread out and give your marines the option of not being spawn camped or forcing the alien team to split up, than it does to box yourself in.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> So what you're saying is, you support such an arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element.
"Except you can't." Really, buddy. "If it were possible" covers that in a nutshell. That's what this discussion is for: that arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element should change.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Decreasing energy cost for heal spray to have less waiting/frustration when repairing hives, etc.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds good, but any chance Gorge self-heal will return for testing purposes? I know you'd want players to fall back to Crags and Hives for health, but maybe with self-heal you can keep Gorges on the field longer, and thus give the other lifeforms medics closer to the action.
<!--quoteo(post=1845028:date=May 9 2011, 02:13 PM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ May 9 2011, 02:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845028"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So what you're saying is, you support such an arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element.
"Except you can't." Really, buddy. "If it were possible" covers that in a nutshell. That's what this discussion is for: that arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element should change.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So you complain that tech points/forward bases are useless, I point out that they aren't, and you say they WOULD be useless if the game was different.
It kinda seems like you're moving the goalposts here, if your hypothetical game changes break other parts of the game that isn't my problem, or a problem with the game.
Actually, if it were up to me, my hypothetical game change is: tie tech level to number of tech nodes held. That's it. I don't know what you're talking about. With the given implementation, capturing new tech nodes is useless (well that's an exaggeration - very unattractive) - they would be <b>less</b> useless (rather, more attractive) if you didn't have to build a CC or a hive on a tech node, because then you'd place your backups in some place where they're more valuable and easily protected. The given implementation encourages more static play, and maybe turtling, since there is not very much incentive to capture or hold tech points; and the MAPPER dictates where exactly YOUR forward bases should be - the creator is the one playing the game, rather than the player. It's more static. Now, if you give tech points value (i.e. require them for increasing your technology, as their name suggests) then the mapper would still dictate where the main points of interest and activity should be, but it's more in line with a resource node - it's something you fight over.
I guess the biggest issue is: <b>Make the tech points more valuable</b> (or remove them, I guess).
One person came up with the idea of specialised structures that can only be built on a tech point, which is interesting - but it's hard to come up with some decent ideas for this. Another came up with the idea of research-tied structures that can only be built on a tech point (and therefore support the notion of a "tech" point), which I quite like, really. Along with it was the idea that you remove the concept of "tech tiers" and instead have your available technology dependent on which structures you have, not how upgraded your base is.
<!--quoteo(post=1845208:date=May 10 2011, 05:36 AM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ May 10 2011, 05:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Make the tech points more valuable<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> They are valuable. Wait and see.
My major complaint is that now the whole control point lacks any kind of strategical character. It's a mix of too many nice little things: It's a bit of map control (forward position on the map), a bit of tech (another research queue) , a bit of brute low tech strength (the extra spawn), extra comm spells (whatever they end up being) and probably a bit of econ if there's RT or tech point res flow involved.
If you for example remove any connections between spawn points and tech points, you suddenly have an option to choose between the instant low tech strength (building extra IPs) and more late game oriented plan (Capping tech point).
This way you've got more strategical contrast: one team might decide invest on extra spawns and try to deny the enemy expansion and so on.
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1845185:date=May 10 2011, 12:24 AM:name=PsiWarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsiWarp @ May 10 2011, 12:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845185"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Sounds good, but any chance Gorge self-heal will return for testing purposes? I know you'd want players to fall back to Crags and Hives for health, but maybe with self-heal you can keep Gorges on the field longer, and thus give the other lifeforms medics closer to the action.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, please bring back gorge self-heal. Gorges lack any real offensive ability and making the very slow alien go all the way back to the hive doesn't seem right. It worked fine in NS1, so why the change? It just makes people not want to play Gorge even more.
Completely with Harimau here. Tech points need more value to provide greater incentive for expansion. With phase gates coming back in it makes the most sense for tech to be tied to the # of tech points owned. I mean, they are called <b>tech</b> points, and with PGs they become much more defendable. Given PGs, if tech points where the key to higher tech, it would make significantly more sense to expand and hold your territory.
<!--quoteo(post=1845208:date=May 10 2011, 05:36 AM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ May 10 2011, 05:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I guess the biggest issue is: <b>Make the tech points more valuable</b> (or remove them, I guess).
Another came up with the idea of research-tied structures that can only be built on a tech point (and therefore support the notion of a "tech" point), which I quite like, really. Along with it was the idea that you remove the concept of "tech tiers" and instead have your available technology dependent on which structures you have, not how upgraded your base is.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=113412&view=findpost&p=1845296" target="_blank">New and Improved!</a>
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->- Possibly make MACs available at T2, to make sure we reinforce the Commander/player relationship at the start of the game.
- Should get MACs/Drifters able to attack again soon<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's an interesting way to promote teamwork. Since Command Station can be upgraded to Facility at the beginning, MACs won't be far behind. This also limits the number of MACs per expansion as the game progresses.
I never did get to see how MACs and Drifters attacked, this will be good to have.
Not A big fan of making MACs and Drifters attacking, unless it's not automatic. I need them to build in the front lines so my marines and skulks can focus on fighting.
Although I love drifter flares and I think Macs are gonna get mines (according to teh unfinished com menu).
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Allowing Gorge to heal him/herself in NS2<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Does this mean the Gorge is Pyro-gender?
QuovatisTeam InversionJoin Date: 2010-01-26Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Strange thing is that the Gorge could heal itself in early beta builds, but it was later removed. I assumed it was intentional. Anyway, I think it's good to have Gorges be able to heal themselves again. Gorge rush!
<!--quoteo(post=1845588:date=May 12 2011, 12:41 PM:name=KuBaN)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KuBaN @ May 12 2011, 12:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845588"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm a fan of the implementation where you only heal yourself if/when you heal a friendly unit (or structure).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> By this, do you mean that an injured gorge surrounded full-health players & structures should not be able to heal itself?
<!--quoteo(post=1845619:date=May 12 2011, 01:01 AM:name=Rokiyo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rokiyo @ May 12 2011, 01:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845619"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->By this, do you mean that an injured gorge surrounded full-health players & structures should not be able to heal itself?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yup. That's what the way TF2 Medics work, IIRC
I don't personally understand the removal of self heal. Gorges in NS1 were never a huge threat, unless gorge rushed properly but this barely ever took place. Usually it just turned into a suicide mission.
Right now gorges are a complete joke. They can't handle a single decent marine player. If I'm facing a good marine, I even have problems with hydras backing me up. Also not allowing them to self heal discourages them from moving out and supporting teammates. Everyone knows the gorge is the first target to take out or at least damage so they retreat.
Give them back self heal, but at a reduced amount compared to healing their teammates then just tweak the numbers until it is balanced.
<!--quoteo(post=1845624:date=May 12 2011, 04:12 PM:name=KuBaN)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KuBaN @ May 12 2011, 04:12 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845624"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yup. That's what the way TF2 Medics work, IIRC<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Fair enough, just wanted to be sure that's what you meant. Not really sure how I feel about that, considering the shorter range and slower movement of the gorge. There are also plenty of medkits and the like laying around and available to TF2 medics, where Gorges don't always have nearby crags or hives to complement their healing abilities.
Sorry if this has been brought up before, but I was just wondering with marine guns, how you use to be able to see the bullets fly past your head in NS1, I don't seem to get these on NS2, unless it's my graphics or they have not been put in the game yet? Are they planning on putting these in? Cheers.
Comments
This was how I thought it was going to work when I heard of structures having a "triggerable" effect, and I would love to see it added in.
Crag, Whip etc.
a) Does anyone else think the activatable abilitys (Umbra etc) are pretty useless - especially because this structures need a lot protection and the effect is only around the structure as center point?
b) With the idea linking them to the tech as requirement to unlock other lifeforms, doesnt itmake themt even more useless since you want them save... => at your hive.
You cant use these structures offensive, all you can do is exploit that the effect goes trough some walls, but most of the time you just spam your hive room with them.
PS: Whips are a joke(no range no dmg and as i said activatable abilitys suck), hydras and crags are the only structures ppl really use.
(1 whip for the upgrades, then let your guys spamm hydras everywhere and keep them alive with crags)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually I put them wherever they're needed. Put some in the hive first sure, but put them elsewhere as well. The hive fairly quikcly becomes saturated with them.
Whips could use a buff but crags are pretty good. I would change activated abilities so that they trigger automatically, if someone is attacking in range of a whip, the whip should trigger fury, if a crag or a structure near it gets shot it, the crag should trigger umbra.
This would be a good alternative too. It would make the buildings feel like they're alive and part of the kharaa. It would also force marines to make critical decisions if he wants to solo a building, trigger an ability, and hopefully not die from it or if he wants to call for backup.
the only thing I would worry about is marine abuse. Shooting the structure with one bullet to trigger the ability and just waiting the 10 seconds or so then repeating until the structure is out of energy or abilities triggering when not needed like a crag using umbra when he is hit by a seige cannon through the wall. By the way, I would prefer getting rid of energy on alien structures and switching to just a standard cool down alternative. This is what the majority of other games have switched to or atleast some hybrid version.
Players want things to do, and competitive players also want their abilities challenged. For units that have multiple abilities, a cooldown-management system works great because the skill-based mechanic is then managing cooldowns. However, if you're only ever actively using one ability, you're essentially waiting around to push the same button, and that's hardly fun, and there's no room for player skill to make any difference. In this case a Mana-management system better facilitates skill, allowing smarter players to pace themselves or go all in when the opportunities arise.
<!--quoteo(post=1844773:date=May 7 2011, 09:02 PM:name=PsiWarp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PsiWarp @ May 7 2011, 09:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1844773"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I just hope they beef up the Whip's range and damage as they are currently negligible as defenses. Bombard will be nice to have, but will require extensive attention from the comm due to being a target ability and we all know how slow Whips crawl :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Now that you mention it, it does seem sort of backwards. Relying on Lash's short range makes it a defenseless structure against any Marine, save for the first time a Marine stumbles upon it and gets hit once, but then knows better than to get hit again. It doesn't feel like a very offensive (or useful) structure. Seems like it would be more useful/dangerous if Bombard was the passive attack and Lash was the researchable, activated ability. This gives me an <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=113384" target="_blank">idea</a>
the only thing I would worry about is marine abuse. Shooting the structure with one bullet to trigger the ability and just waiting the 10 seconds or so then repeating until the structure is out of energy or abilities triggering when not needed like a crag using umbra when he is hit by a seige cannon through the wall. By the way, I would prefer getting rid of energy on alien structures and switching to just a standard cool down alternative. This is what the majority of other games have switched to or atleast some hybrid version.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Make it activate if <structure> within <range> of the crag takes <x> points of bullet damage within <y> seconds.
Essentially exactly as a commander would do it, the general rule for comms is trigger the umbra when marines are shooting the place up, and happily, 'shooting the place up' can be defined quite easily in code.
Whips could use a buff but crags are pretty good. I would change activated abilities so that they trigger automatically, if someone is attacking in range of a whip, the whip should trigger fury, if a crag or a structure near it gets shot it, the crag should trigger umbra.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This just works because the current di system is overpowered.(+ ft to destroy it sucks) => you cant fight it. So aliens got map control more or less all the time.
I agree there should be the possibility to set umbra etc on autotrigger like you know it from wc3 etc.
(I wonder how cloak will work - since i heard it will be a trigger ability too. >_>)
The "shoot once, wait 10 seconds" part sounds like acceptable abuse of game mechanics, since all structural defences can ultimately only delay the enemy until real players arrive to defend properly.
Detecting if damage was taken by bullets as opposed to explosions or siege blasts shouldn't be too hard for them to handle since the game is already smart enough to block bullets and only bullets when umbra is active.
So your choices are, One CC, in one room, with one group of spawns and set of defences and resource income, or more than one room/set of spawns/defences/resources.
Which makes the more than one substantially more secure. At some point it becomes far more valuable to spread out and give your marines the option of not being spawn camped or forcing the alien team to split up, than it does to box yourself in.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So what you're saying is, you support such an arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element.
"Except you can't." Really, buddy. "If it were possible" covers that in a nutshell. That's what this discussion is for: that arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element should change.
Sounds good, but any chance Gorge self-heal will return for testing purposes? I know you'd want players to fall back to Crags and Hives for health, but maybe with self-heal you can keep Gorges on the field longer, and thus give the other lifeforms medics closer to the action.
"Except you can't." Really, buddy. "If it were possible" covers that in a nutshell. That's what this discussion is for: that arbitrary, static, inflexible gameplay element should change.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So you complain that tech points/forward bases are useless, I point out that they aren't, and you say they WOULD be useless if the game was different.
It kinda seems like you're moving the goalposts here, if your hypothetical game changes break other parts of the game that isn't my problem, or a problem with the game.
With the given implementation, capturing new tech nodes is useless (well that's an exaggeration - very unattractive) - they would be <b>less</b> useless (rather, more attractive) if you didn't have to build a CC or a hive on a tech node, because then you'd place your backups in some place where they're more valuable and easily protected. The given implementation encourages more static play, and maybe turtling, since there is not very much incentive to capture or hold tech points; and the MAPPER dictates where exactly YOUR forward bases should be - the creator is the one playing the game, rather than the player. It's more static.
Now, if you give tech points value (i.e. require them for increasing your technology, as their name suggests) then the mapper would still dictate where the main points of interest and activity should be, but it's more in line with a resource node - it's something you fight over.
I guess the biggest issue is: <b>Make the tech points more valuable</b> (or remove them, I guess).
One person came up with the idea of specialised structures that can only be built on a tech point, which is interesting - but it's hard to come up with some decent ideas for this.
Another came up with the idea of research-tied structures that can only be built on a tech point (and therefore support the notion of a "tech" point), which I quite like, really. Along with it was the idea that you remove the concept of "tech tiers" and instead have your available technology dependent on which structures you have, not how upgraded your base is.
They are valuable. Wait and see.
If you for example remove any connections between spawn points and tech points, you suddenly have an option to choose between the instant low tech strength (building extra IPs) and more late game oriented plan (Capping tech point).
This way you've got more strategical contrast: one team might decide invest on extra spawns and try to deny the enemy expansion and so on.
They are not valuable enough.
<!--quoteo(post=1845208:date=May 10 2011, 05:36 PM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ May 10 2011, 05:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1845208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Make the tech points more valuable<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, please bring back gorge self-heal. Gorges lack any real offensive ability and making the very slow alien go all the way back to the hive doesn't seem right. It worked fine in NS1, so why the change? It just makes people not want to play Gorge even more.
Another came up with the idea of research-tied structures that can only be built on a tech point (and therefore support the notion of a "tech" point), which I quite like, really. Along with it was the idea that you remove the concept of "tech tiers" and instead have your available technology dependent on which structures you have, not how upgraded your base is.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=113412&view=findpost&p=1845296" target="_blank">New and Improved!</a>
- Should get MACs/Drifters able to attack again soon<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's an interesting way to promote teamwork. Since Command Station can be upgraded to Facility at the beginning, MACs won't be far behind. This also limits the number of MACs per expansion as the game progresses.
I never did get to see how MACs and Drifters attacked, this will be good to have.
Although I love drifter flares and I think Macs are gonna get mines (according to teh unfinished com menu).
Does this mean the Gorge is Pyro-gender?
Self-heal amount might need tweaking depending on how often the Gorge can exhale heal spray~
By this, do you mean that an injured gorge surrounded full-health players & structures should not be able to heal itself?
Yup. That's what the way TF2 Medics work, IIRC
Right now gorges are a complete joke. They can't handle a single decent marine player. If I'm facing a good marine, I even have problems with hydras backing me up. Also not allowing them to self heal discourages them from moving out and supporting teammates. Everyone knows the gorge is the first target to take out or at least damage so they retreat.
Give them back self heal, but at a reduced amount compared to healing their teammates then just tweak the numbers until it is balanced.
Cheers.