<!--QuoteBegin--Brave Ulysses+May 28 2003, 07:34 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Brave Ulysses @ May 28 2003, 07:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> [IMAGE] The Family Tree Image[/IMAGE] <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's odd. Merovech (447-458) and Childeric I (458-481) are missing. Wonder why?
<!--QuoteBegin--Hawkeye+--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Hawkeye)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> How could they be a descendant of Jesus? Jesus never had kids.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what the legend of Jesus states in the bible. This ought to be taken with a grain of salt as the church-approved (what does one call the books of Matthew, Mark Luke and John in english? Evangelions? Dunno, they are called "Evankeliumi" in finnish) contain various oddities and inconsistencies. The legend I was referring to is based on the view that Jesus did not die on the cross and that instead he and his wife, Mary Magdalen, whom the bible rather unkindly calls a ****, were transported by his followers to southern France.
I'm not saying that I believe this stuff. I merely brought it up because I accidentally stumbled across it a few years back and actually smiled when I heard the Merovingian's name in the movie. The writers I read back then did manage to back up their rather unconventional theories pretty well. They pointed, for example, to the rather strong cult of Mary Magdalen in southern France and to the Cathars, whose beliefs echoed those of the jewish sect Jesus is believed to have born into.
Well we don't even know if Jesus existed, actually. We have no evidence. There is the famous cloth that was used to drape over Jesus's body after he died on the cross in Turin, Italy, but that has been carbon tested to show it has only been around during medieval times. They also said that the church was on fire at one point in time, and this might have also effected the carbon testing. So who knows?
If the french dude is supposedly a descendant of Jesus, and it was used in the matrix, and Neo is supposed to be the "Jesus" savior figure, then what does this mean? Maybe I'm just looking into it too much, I don't know.
Someone brought something to my attention recently though. I can't believe I didn't notice before, but Neo rearranged is "One." Anybody else only realize that now?
<!--QuoteBegin--Hawkeye+May 28 2003, 09:37 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Hawkeye @ May 28 2003, 09:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Well we don't even know if Jesus existed, actually. We have no evidence. There is the famous cloth that was used to drape over Jesus's body after he died on the cross in Turin, Italy, but that has been carbon tested to show it has only been around during medieval times. They also said that the church was on fire at one point in time, and this might have also effected the carbon testing. So who knows?
If the french dude is supposedly a descendant of Jesus, and it was used in the matrix, and Neo is supposed to be the "Jesus" savior figure, then what does this mean? Maybe I'm just looking into it too much, I don't know.
Someone brought something to my attention recently though. I can't believe I didn't notice before, but Neo rearranged is "One." Anybody else only realize that now? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Lies. There have been Jewish documents recovered from the time period that speak of a man named Jesus.
On another note, Neo is a prefix meaning new or...something. So he is the new "one." Which would explain the anamoly dealie.
<!--QuoteBegin-- Scinet+ May 28 2003, 09:04 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ( Scinet @ May 28 2003, 09:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> (what does one call the books of Matthew, Mark Luke and John in english? Evangelions? Dunno, they are called "Evankeliumi" in finnish) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They're called the Gospels over here in the states.
NarfwakJoin Date: 2002-11-02Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer
Denying the fact that Jesus existed is pure ignorance. The amount of literature, historical text (much of which is not Jewish but Roman) and the profound societal, political and religious effect that the man spurred is too great in volume and complexity to be wholy conspiratorial. You can argue the man's divinity (I'd be the first to join you there), but you can't argue the man.
Unfortunatly, I don't have any Matrix-related material to present at this time. I will have a fairly large volume of information that I am currently writing that I will post as a singular entity as soon as I'm finished with it.
In a desperate attempt to bring things at least somewhat back on topic, I give you this - did anyone else pay attention to the scene in which Trinity hacks the backup electrical grid for the Building? It's all in UNIX. Not only that, but she's using SSH to hack the deal. That made me crack a smile.
<!--QuoteBegin--404NotFound+May 28 2003, 08:11 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (404NotFound @ May 28 2003, 08:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think the oracle might take a backseat in the 3rd movie..
Didn't the actress that played the oracle die? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I doubt it, but even if she did they already filmed the movie. They're not gonna cancel it just because she died, either. Alliyah was in one after she died...
Me and my friends have been speculating a lot about a second matrix, and that would explain Zion resetting and Neo blocking the squiddies. But don't you think the real world is a bit too perfect to be coded by something? The Matrix is full of bugs and glitches...
SSH ROCKS! For you 3733t h4x0rz, use unix and ssh! Trinity does! Why shouldn't you? lol
Not to turn this debate into a religious one, but really the only evidence that Jesus existed up until now is the Bible. The bible also mentions Adam and Eve, and it is pretty inconceivable to believe Adam and Eve were really the only existing people on the planet during creation. It is much more feasible to believe in the evolution theory, however I believe there is a close tie between Adam and Eve and early evolution, metaphorically speaking. Anyway, unless you are willing to accept that the bible is correct word for word, then you must accept that the Bible isn't sufficient evidence to support the fact that he existed, because it could be wrong.
I'm not saying he didn't exist, don't get me wrong. We just don't have the evidence to support it. Most people during his time that were killed by the Romans had written records as a part of a logging of those crucified. No such record exists for Jesus.
NarfwakJoin Date: 2002-11-02Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer
Hawkeye, you have clearly never taken a contextual scripture course, nor do you have any idea what you're talking about. Please, for the sake of the kittens, stop.
I'm dry for Matrix stuff now, so I'll stop this whole "Jesus Discussion" by starting to shut up. I hope you all follow in stead.
You can insult me all you want Narf, but until you support evidence, there is no reason why I shouldn't just ignore you. Please, enlighten me. Give me a link or something. I'd like to be disproved.
i got it! neo didnt do anything to the sentinels.... they died because . .. ... .. . the were running on... . .. ... .... ... .. . WINDOWS... muhahaha gg
PulseTo create, to create and escape.Join Date: 2002-08-29Member: 1248Members, Constellation
edited May 2003
It all makes so much sense now! This could also mean that the "Accidental" EMP was really due to the fact that they used Microsoft "EZ-EMP" technology.
<!--QuoteBegin--Hawkeye+May 28 2003, 10:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Hawkeye @ May 28 2003, 10:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You can insult me all you want Narf, but until you support evidence, there is no reason why I shouldn't just ignore you. Please, enlighten me. Give me a link or something. I'd like to be disproved. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Sorry I didn't try Google before coming here (my net connection gets a bit tricky when eDonkey2000 is left on overnight - I get a lot of "connection refused" warnings when I try to go to different pages), but a good search word might be <b>Nag Hammad</b> or possibly Nag Hammadi. Nag Hammad is a place in Egypt where apocryphal scrolls older and more accurate than the ones called the Dead Sea scrolls were discovered. The apocryphas contain among them (IIRC) more accurate reproductions of the original gospels, some letters and atleast one uncanonised gospel, the gospel of Peter.
At this point I'd like to point out that it isn't any wonder that the gospel of Peter was never canonised. There's a part in it where Jesus appears to him after the crucifixion and warns him of men who seek to build structures to be used as churches of the christian faith, men who wish to be called priests.
I'm sorry I'm a bit off on this, but it's been a few years since I last approached the matter. If you wish, I can waltz into the local library again and come out with better proof for the historical existence of Jesus and more information on the Merovingians as well. Be minded, though, that Jesus was not the only man calling himself the Messiah back then. There were atleast five others, and atleast one of them was crucified along with his followers because they organized an armed rebellion against the romans.
<!--QuoteBegin--Jefe+May 28 2003, 09:50 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jefe @ May 28 2003, 09:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--404NotFound+May 28 2003, 08:11 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (404NotFound @ May 28 2003, 08:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I think the oracle might take a backseat in the 3rd movie..
Didn't the actress that played the oracle die? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I doubt it, but even if she did they already filmed the movie. They're not gonna cancel it just because she died, either. Alliyah was in one after she died...
Me and my friends have been speculating a lot about a second matrix, and that would explain Zion resetting and Neo blocking the squiddies. But don't you think the real world is a bit too perfect to be coded by something? The Matrix is full of bugs and glitches... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> if you read the first few pages of the thread, you will see that she died during filming and so couldn't complete some of her scenes.
RIP
As for the whole thing about if the oracle is on their side or not, i think she is as, in the first movie, if she hadn't said neo wasn't the one, morpheus would be dead (tank would have pulled the plug) because neo would have felt that it would have been too great a risk to try to save him. evidently the machines want morpheus out of the way, and if the oracle is such a good judge of character, she would have told neo that he was the one, knowing that he would not risk his life to save morpheus
What happened to Tank in this film? You see Lynx talking to his wife and hear about him and dozer being killed, but we dont know what happened to him...
Remember the scene where Merovingian programs a piece of cake to trigger a 'peak' in the woman in the restaurant ...well, if it's possible to alter and control people in the matrix through 'food', it might explain the numerous references to food in the first and second movies.
<ul>The Oracle offers Neo a cookie in the first movie.</ul>
<ul>The guy who betrays Neo in the first movie is eating a steak in a restaurant with agent Smith.</ul>
<ul>The Oracle offers Neo a sweet (that looks exactly like the red pill from the first movie)</ul>
I wonder if the Oracle giving Neo the cookie, has anything to do with him becoming the One. Whether it has altered his code in some way.
It's possible that Neo might originally have been a program. If you think that it's possible for Smith to 'possess' a real world body, it's possible that Neo could too. I think the relationship between them, is that they are brothers. The Architect said that him and the Oracle were like the mother and father of the Matrix, it only seems reasonable that Neo and Smith are their sons.
<b>Persephone's Kiss with Neo</b>, this must have been a significant scene since it lasted a long time, and seemed important to the plot. I think Persephone may have been Neo's lover in the previous Matrix.
<!--QuoteBegin--Error404:+May 29 2003, 08:36 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Error404: @ May 29 2003, 08:36 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>Persephone's Kiss with Neo</b>, this must have been a significant scene since it lasted a long time, and seemed important to the plot. I think Persephone may have been Neo's lover in the previous Matrix. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I don't agree - I tend to go for the theory that Persphone mothered the matrix - she seems like that intuitive, emotional program that could cause people to accept the matrix. Plus her name and its greek associations with the underworld - which, of course, could represent the matrix. Ergo, apropos concordantly Colonel Sanders.
And neo isn't a program he's human, he wasn't created to serve a purpose he got to where he is through chance and choice, don't you people pay attention? He only existed in the current matrix, the movie is about him because he was different from the previous One's because he didn't choose to rebuild Zion. This was going to be the last Reload of the Matrix where free will would be fixed and choice would no longer exist within the Matrix. Persophone and Frenchie are both programs they were never human they were never Ones neither one fathered or mothered the Matrix. The Oracle, Morpheus, Trinity arn't evil programs to make Neo do what the Matrix wants. Everything happened through choice and coencidence wrapped in a web of Fate.
<!--QuoteBegin--dr.d+May 29 2003, 07:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (dr.d @ May 29 2003, 07:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> And neo isn't a program he's human, he wasn't created to serve a purpose he got to where he is through chance and choice, don't you people pay attention? He only existed in the current matrix, the movie is about him because he was different from the previous One's because he didn't choose to rebuild Zion. This was going to be the last Reload of the Matrix where free will would be fixed and choice would no longer exist within the Matrix. Persophone and Frenchie are both programs they were never human they were never Ones neither one fathered or mothered the Matrix. The Oracle, Morpheus, Trinity arn't evil programs to make Neo do what the Matrix wants. Everything happened through choice and coencidence wrapped in a web of Fate. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> HOW YOU KNOW THAT?
<!--QuoteBegin--Error404:+May 29 2003, 08:36 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Error404: @ May 29 2003, 08:36 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> . The Architect said that him and the Oracle were like the mother and father of the Matrix, <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> he didnt say the oracle was the mother of the matrix, it was neo, and the arch seemed opposed to the idea
PulseTo create, to create and escape.Join Date: 2002-08-29Member: 1248Members, Constellation
the arc sighed because Neo called her "The oracle". And, well, Dr. D, no offense, but this was <i>not</i> supposed to be the last reload, watch the movie again or read one of the transcripts.
<!--QuoteBegin--dr.d+May 29 2003, 08:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (dr.d @ May 29 2003, 08:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Stop resurrecting threads. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Comments like these make me dislike contradictory standards in a forum like this. As soon as someone makes a thread he gets bombarded with pointless cries of "Use search! USE SEARCH YOU PFAFFING N00B!" yet when he does search, finds an appropriate topic and replies to it, he gets bombarded with fulminations like: "Stop resurrecting threads!", "Go home Herbert West!" and so on.
Necro<insert non-birthday-related title here>Join Date: 2002-08-09Member: 1118Members
my theory is that there IS a second matrix, but 99.9% of the people of zion believed that they were "free" thus didn't have to try to "free" they're mind.
but, neo didn't buy it. thus he felt a 'disturbance' (he said somethings different) so because he didn't buy the architect's stuff he believed that it's not a loop and thus could get out :\
The only way I can explain all those strange events that happened is that "Zion" is inside the matrix. The machines created zion in order to have a place to put those who rejected the program. This way, they think they are free and don't cause trouble. Everytmie you "hack" into the matrix, you are really transporting yourself to the other part of the matrix. This would mean bane IS smith, and Neo CAN stop sentinels like he can stop bullets. Neo in the interview said there wouldn't be any double matrices or anything, so this is the only other way I can explain it.
Yeah that makes sense, that there isn't a 'double matrix' but a single 'matrix', which Zion is also a part off. Agent Smith said that he wanted to be free of the Matrix, yet when he becomes Bane, he is still not happy, so that means he is still in the Matrix.
The matrix is basically a virtual prison, so is it not possible that it is also a prison for the programs that inhabit it. Outside of the Matrix is the 'construct' which has no limits.
Possibly, like many have said already, Agent Smith is a virus, and nobody inside the Matrix is real, even the people in Zion. Every person is a program, and they all live in a giant computer simulation, yet they share there machine with a virus which threatens everybody.
I theorize that some disaster happened in the real world, and everyone 'uploaded' themselves inside the computer, Agent Smith is the virus inside the computer that wants to enslave all the uploaded avatars and destroy the whole system.
If Zion is in the matrix, Ill be annoyed <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
As for this quote: Persephone's Kiss with Neo, this must have been a significant scene since it lasted a long time, and seemed important to the plot. I think Persephone may have been Neo's lover in the previous Matrix.
I know that can't be right, since anyone who has played "Enter the Matrix", she insists on a kiss from someone who isn't Neo there also.
If there is a second matrix and neo can stop sentinels then why did he fall over in a coma? He can manipulate the matrix very easily, I would think bullets travel faster than the sentinels, and being smaller would be harder to keep an eye on in the coding, especially when traveling that fast. I doubt Neo would fall over in a coma from something clearly visible, and moving quite a bit slower than bullets. And if Zion is still part of the matrix, why doesn't neo see code? He isn't actually 'trying' to see code inside the Matrix, he just does, thats part of being the One.
Really wild theroy here: What if the Matrix wasn't built by the machines? Supose there was really a war between humans and the machines and the humans ultmitly prevailed but left with nothing but a peice of crap world that they destoyied. So they built the Matix so they could go back to being happy again, the machines are there just to keep it running.
There is no Matrix, the matrix was just the name of it, it was a way of lightspeed transport, you move so fast that your body stays behind in acoma and your mind creates a new body for you in the place you are visiting...
Neo has an acoma because he entered the matrixand went in acoma..
Comments
Neo just needs to hit the start menu button and shutdown.
[IMAGE] The Family Tree Image[/IMAGE] <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's odd. Merovech (447-458) and Childeric I (458-481) are missing. Wonder why?
<!--QuoteBegin--Hawkeye+--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Hawkeye)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> How could they be a descendant of Jesus? Jesus never had kids.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's what the legend of Jesus states in the bible. This ought to be taken with a grain of salt as the church-approved (what does one call the books of Matthew, Mark Luke and John in english? Evangelions? Dunno, they are called "Evankeliumi" in finnish) contain various oddities and inconsistencies. The legend I was referring to is based on the view that Jesus did not die on the cross and that instead he and his wife, Mary Magdalen, whom the bible rather unkindly calls a ****, were transported by his followers to southern France.
I'm not saying that I believe this stuff. I merely brought it up because I accidentally stumbled across it a few years back and actually smiled when I heard the Merovingian's name in the movie. The writers I read back then did manage to back up their rather unconventional theories pretty well. They pointed, for example, to the rather strong cult of Mary Magdalen in southern France and to the Cathars, whose beliefs echoed those of the jewish sect Jesus is believed to have born into.
If the french dude is supposedly a descendant of Jesus, and it was used in the matrix, and Neo is supposed to be the "Jesus" savior figure, then what does this mean? Maybe I'm just looking into it too much, I don't know.
Someone brought something to my attention recently though. I can't believe I didn't notice before, but Neo rearranged is "One." Anybody else only realize that now?
If the french dude is supposedly a descendant of Jesus, and it was used in the matrix, and Neo is supposed to be the "Jesus" savior figure, then what does this mean? Maybe I'm just looking into it too much, I don't know.
Someone brought something to my attention recently though. I can't believe I didn't notice before, but Neo rearranged is "One." Anybody else only realize that now? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lies. There have been Jewish documents recovered from the time period that speak of a man named Jesus.
On another note, Neo is a prefix meaning new or...something. So he is the new "one." Which would explain the anamoly dealie.
<!--QuoteBegin-- Scinet+ May 28 2003, 09:04 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ( Scinet @ May 28 2003, 09:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> (what does one call the books of Matthew, Mark Luke and John in english? Evangelions? Dunno, they are called "Evankeliumi" in finnish) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They're called the Gospels over here in the states.
Unfortunatly, I don't have any Matrix-related material to present at this time. I will have a fairly large volume of information that I am currently writing that I will post as a singular entity as soon as I'm finished with it.
In a desperate attempt to bring things at least somewhat back on topic, I give you this - did anyone else pay attention to the scene in which Trinity hacks the backup electrical grid for the Building? It's all in UNIX. Not only that, but she's using SSH to hack the deal. That made me crack a smile.
Didn't the actress that played the oracle die? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I doubt it, but even if she did they already filmed the movie. They're not gonna cancel it just because she died, either. Alliyah was in one after she died...
Me and my friends have been speculating a lot about a second matrix, and that would explain Zion resetting and Neo blocking the squiddies. But don't you think the real world is a bit too perfect to be coded by something? The Matrix is full of bugs and glitches...
Not to turn this debate into a religious one, but really the only evidence that Jesus existed up until now is the Bible. The bible also mentions Adam and Eve, and it is pretty inconceivable to believe Adam and Eve were really the only existing people on the planet during creation. It is much more feasible to believe in the evolution theory, however I believe there is a close tie between Adam and Eve and early evolution, metaphorically speaking. Anyway, unless you are willing to accept that the bible is correct word for word, then you must accept that the Bible isn't sufficient evidence to support the fact that he existed, because it could be wrong.
I'm not saying he didn't exist, don't get me wrong. We just don't have the evidence to support it. Most people during his time that were killed by the Romans had written records as a part of a logging of those crucified. No such record exists for Jesus.
I'm dry for Matrix stuff now, so I'll stop this whole "Jesus Discussion" by starting to shut up. I hope you all follow in stead.
neo didnt do anything to the sentinels....
they died because
.
..
...
..
.
the were running on...
.
..
...
....
...
..
.
WINDOWS...
muhahaha gg
EDIT:typo:(
Sorry I didn't try Google before coming here (my net connection gets a bit tricky when eDonkey2000 is left on overnight - I get a lot of "connection refused" warnings when I try to go to different pages), but a good search word might be <b>Nag Hammad</b> or possibly Nag Hammadi. Nag Hammad is a place in Egypt where apocryphal scrolls older and more accurate than the ones called the Dead Sea scrolls were discovered. The apocryphas contain among them (IIRC) more accurate reproductions of the original gospels, some letters and atleast one uncanonised gospel, the gospel of Peter.
At this point I'd like to point out that it isn't any wonder that the gospel of Peter was never canonised. There's a part in it where Jesus appears to him after the crucifixion and warns him of men who seek to build structures to be used as churches of the christian faith, men who wish to be called priests.
I'm sorry I'm a bit off on this, but it's been a few years since I last approached the matter. If you wish, I can waltz into the local library again and come out with better proof for the historical existence of Jesus and more information on the Merovingians as well. Be minded, though, that Jesus was not the only man calling himself the Messiah back then. There were atleast five others, and atleast one of them was crucified along with his followers because they organized an armed rebellion against the romans.
Didn't the actress that played the oracle die? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I doubt it, but even if she did they already filmed the movie. They're not gonna cancel it just because she died, either. Alliyah was in one after she died...
Me and my friends have been speculating a lot about a second matrix, and that would explain Zion resetting and Neo blocking the squiddies. But don't you think the real world is a bit too perfect to be coded by something? The Matrix is full of bugs and glitches... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
if you read the first few pages of the thread, you will see that she died during filming and so couldn't complete some of her scenes.
RIP
As for the whole thing about if the oracle is on their side or not, i think she is as, in the first movie, if she hadn't said neo wasn't the one, morpheus would be dead (tank would have pulled the plug) because neo would have felt that it would have been too great a risk to try to save him. evidently the machines want morpheus out of the way, and if the oracle is such a good judge of character, she would have told neo that he was the one, knowing that he would not risk his life to save morpheus
(perhaps)
<ul>The Oracle offers Neo a cookie in the first movie.</ul>
<ul>The guy who betrays Neo in the first movie is eating a steak in a restaurant with agent Smith.</ul>
<ul>The Oracle offers Neo a sweet (that looks exactly like the red pill from the first movie)</ul>
I wonder if the Oracle giving Neo the cookie, has anything to do with him becoming the One. Whether it has altered his code in some way.
It's possible that Neo might originally have been a program. If you think that it's possible for Smith to 'possess' a real world body, it's possible that Neo could too. I think the relationship between them, is that they are brothers. The Architect said that him and the Oracle were like the mother and father of the Matrix, it only seems reasonable that Neo and Smith are their sons.
<b>Persephone's Kiss with Neo</b>, this must have been a significant scene since it lasted a long time, and seemed important to the plot. I think Persephone may have been Neo's lover in the previous Matrix.
I don't agree - I tend to go for the theory that Persphone mothered the matrix - she seems like that intuitive, emotional program that could cause people to accept the matrix. Plus her name and its greek associations with the underworld - which, of course, could represent the matrix. Ergo, apropos concordantly Colonel Sanders.
And neo isn't a program he's human, he wasn't created to serve a purpose he got to where he is through chance and choice, don't you people pay attention? He only existed in the current matrix, the movie is about him because he was different from the previous One's because he didn't choose to rebuild Zion. This was going to be the last Reload of the Matrix where free will would be fixed and choice would no longer exist within the Matrix. Persophone and Frenchie are both programs they were never human they were never Ones neither one fathered or mothered the Matrix. The Oracle, Morpheus, Trinity arn't evil programs to make Neo do what the Matrix wants. Everything happened through choice and coencidence wrapped in a web of Fate.
Now stop posting.
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HOW YOU KNOW THAT?
he didnt say the oracle was the mother of the matrix, it was neo, and the arch seemed opposed to the idea
Comments like these make me dislike contradictory standards in a forum like this. As soon as someone makes a thread he gets bombarded with pointless cries of "Use search! USE SEARCH YOU PFAFFING N00B!" yet when he does search, finds an appropriate topic and replies to it, he gets bombarded with fulminations like: "Stop resurrecting threads!", "Go home Herbert West!" and so on.
but, neo didn't buy it. thus he felt a 'disturbance' (he said somethings different) so because he didn't buy the architect's stuff he believed that it's not a loop and thus could get out :\
The matrix is basically a virtual prison, so is it not possible that it is also a prison for the programs that inhabit it. Outside of the Matrix is the 'construct' which has no limits.
Possibly, like many have said already, Agent Smith is a virus, and nobody inside the Matrix is real, even the people in Zion. Every person is a program, and they all live in a giant computer simulation, yet they share there machine with a virus which threatens everybody.
I theorize that some disaster happened in the real world, and everyone 'uploaded' themselves inside the computer, Agent Smith is the virus inside the computer that wants to enslave all the uploaded avatars and destroy the whole system.
As for this quote: Persephone's Kiss with Neo, this must have been a significant scene since it lasted a long time, and seemed important to the plot. I think Persephone may have been Neo's lover in the previous Matrix.
I know that can't be right, since anyone who has played "Enter the Matrix", she insists on a kiss from someone who isn't Neo there also.
Neo has an acoma because he entered the matrixand went in acoma..